Liverpool Rumours And General Discussion 2007/2008

Mr Alan

Gerrard didnt dive. FACT

raven136

end piece in the sunday times match report says it all"liverpool were due a bit of luck.They remain unbeaten in the league and have won four out of five away from home.Talk of Benitez being under pressure is ridiculous"

Also we were without our best striker and our most creative midfielder.I dont care how the result came we still won in a place we lost 3 nil last time

event

Mr Alan wrote: »

Gerrard didnt dive. FACT

wow, well done

saying FACT makes it true, does it?

I didnt say he dived, but if anyone says he didnt go down easily, they are liars.
Christ, there was a whole thread a few weeks ago when saha went down, and at least he was kicked (even though he too went down easy)

Mr Alan

event wrote: »

But because its good old stevie g, its ok, cos we know english players dont dive, right?

that sounds to me like you are strongly suggesting he dived.
He had run 70 yards full pelt, having his jersey tugged off him and one of Hibberts legs banged into his leg, I really would be shocked if most footballers were able to stay on their feet after that.
He didnt dive or "go down particularly easy", its real easy at home sitting on a couch to say , ahh he should have stayed on his feet. Phantom tackles are another thing altogether, when a player goes down, zero contact having been made a la Drogba,Robben,Ronaldo

PiE

Personally I'm delighted he dived. If he had taken the shot, he woulda skied it.

event

Mr Alan wrote: »

that sounds to me like you are strongly suggesting he dived.
He had run 70 yards full pelt, having his jersey tugged off him and one of Hibberts legs banged into his leg, I really would be shocked if most footballers were able to stay on their feet after that.
He didnt dive or "go down particularly easy", its real easy at home sitting on a couch to say , ahh he should have stayed on his feet. Phantom tackles are another thing altogether, when a player goes down, zero contact having been made a la Drogba,Robben,Ronaldo

jesus

some fans are just blinkered no matter what i suppose.
there is not point continuing this though, so [dragons den] I'm Out! [/dragons den]

Mr Alan

event wrote: »

so [dragons den] I'm Out! [/dragons den]

lol

Mr Magnolia

LMAO @ PiE

Dub13

I think its great that Rafa is not afraid to substituted any player at any time,a lot of lesser managers would not have even remotely considered making such a move.

event

Dub13 wrote: »

I think its great that Rafa is not afraid to substituted any player at any time,a lot of lesser managers would not have even remotely considered making such a move.

perhaps it will send a message to gerrard, that he can be subbed.
he hasnt been at his best lately, maybe this will be the kick that he needs.

Mr Alan

Just read Andy Grays piece in the Star, wat a pack of ******* bollixy ****e.

Giving Rafa stick for substituting Gerrard without mentioning that the player that replaced Gerrard was centre of all the chances created in the last 20 minutes, or that Lucas had a shot saved on the line by Neville resulting in the penalty.

Going on about rotation despite the fact that Liverpools strongest team started at the weekend.

Saying you cant win the PL by resting players against teams you expect to beat (Torres/Birmingham) without mentioning the fact the Utd have done this for years (even Ronaldo/Villa) while winning the league.

Talking about other teams building up a head of steam without mentioning that Liverpool remain unbeaten.

Seriously, i hate this man.

The media are gonna run Rafa out of a job, i have a bad feeling about it. If Jose/Wenger/Mourinho made the call Rafa made at the weekend, the world and its mother would be praising their tactical ingenuity, with Rafa? no chance, he ****ed up according to most.

Anyone else notice at the weekend when Gerrard came off, gray was going on how it was a ridiculous decision, but said that Peter Reid back in the studio would know about it and be able to give a better opinion being an ex manager??........Ehhhhh Andy, Maybe Rafa Benitezs opinion, being a League/Champions League/Cup Winning manager is
more expert than any of the ****e you or reid spout?!

Sorry, just had to get that off my chest

spockety

I don't reckon Rafa will be hounded out by the media. I suspect that he's the type of person who would be more sensitive to what people close to him are saying, and as long as he has the support of the board, the players, the staff, and the supporters (which he does), I don't think it will matter what any of the papers or pundits say.

My only concern would be that supporters would start to not only believe the rubbish that gets printed in the papers, but would propagate it themselves until it reaches a critical mass, the point coming when Rafa will think he has lost the supporters, and it will be THAT that would drive him out.

Jazzy

http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,8652_2817602,00.html

wtf is that bs?
stfu G-G-G-Unit, there is no need to come out and say stuff like that, especially when pool have been underperforming as they have and the press hasnt been too positive in the past few weeks. Stevie Me indeed I reckon, he should just keep his trap shut and play football. having a winge about not playing 20 minutes of football is pathetic when u are the captain, local lad or not. back the team and the manager steven, its not a 1 man show, especially with his current form.

Mr Alan

can someone paste that up plllleeeease

StickyMcGinty

here ye are

GERRARD `HURT` TO BE SUBBED
Posted 22/10/07 12:24
EmailPrintSave


Steven Gerrard was 'hurt and disappointed' to be substituted in the Merseyside derby on Saturday.

Gerrard was taken off with 20 minutes to go of Liverpool's 2-1 win at Goodison Park, and was clearly baffled at Rafa Benitez's decision.

However, Benitez explained that he took Gerrard off because he wanted more control in midfield: "In this game, sometimes you need to play with the brain and we were playing with heart. We needed to keep the ball and pass the ball."

Gerrard told The Liverpool Echo: "I'm a local lad so the derby is really important to me and I would have liked nothing better than to play the full game and to be on the pitch when we got the winner.

"But as it turned out I was taken off and Lucas Leiva who replaced me played a crucial role in us getting the winning goal.

"I was hurt and disappointed at being taken off because, like I said, I'm a local lad and the derby means everything to me."

The Liverpool skipper went on to say that he will ask Benitez to explain his decision, but isn't getting too worked up about it:

"I'll be speaking to the manager about it just to find out why I was substituted, but I won't be banging on his door or anything like that.

"We'll just have a chat and whatever is said will remain between us. But I've been in the game long enough to know that no-one is going to play every minute of every game and there will be times when I'm taken off like everyone else."

Gerrard went on to admit that he has been in poor form in recent weeks, but promised to work his way back with the help of the club's fans:

"I know I haven't been at my best lately but I'm doing everything I can to get back there and having that kind of backing really does make a difference.

"I'm working back towards my best and knowing the fans are behind me will definitely help me get there much quicker."

Joke if you ask me, Gerrard has been a too mouthy and backstabbing Rafa a little too much this season

raven136

Gerrard is possibly the most needy player in the history of football."I'll ask Rafa to explain his decision".Eh sonny thats not your job,your job uis doing what lucas did when he came on.

he is really starting to bug me:mad:

spockety

Serious over reaction here to that article methinks.. I haven't seen anything outrageous in what he's said..

Tusky

To his defence he does say this ""But as it turned out I was taken off and Lucas Leiva who replaced me played a crucial role in us getting the winning goal.
"

gucci

Dub13 wrote: »

I think its great that Rafa is not afraid to substituted any player at any time,a lot of lesser managers would not have even remotely considered making such a move.

yeah in fairness it shows he has bottle taking off stevie, the easy option would have been leave him on ( we know he can do great things when he looks out of the game -FA cup final etc) had lucas blared that ball over the bar and everton got the penalty at the other end he and rafa would have been getting slated, but he pulled a trump card out in this game and it worked, he should be commended for it and hopefully theres plenty more of them in the bag for similar tight games over the season.

raven136

spockety wrote: »

Serious over reaction here to that article methinks.. I haven't seen anything outrageous in what he's said..

its not just this article,its all the other quotes he gives,bitching about rafa not playing torres,about not being played in the middle.he must know that both those things are bug bears used to beat rafa and as captain should be firmly behind his manager.Also as one of english footballs most high profile players he knows everything he says is national news.Surely he would be better off just privately chatting to rafa

kryogen

spockety wrote: »

Serious over reaction here to that article methinks.. I haven't seen anything outrageous in what he's said..

the fact that he spoke about it negatively with the media is whats outrageous

PHB

What the **** is Gerrard doing? How can that possibly help anybody but himself?

Mr Alan

think its a bit of an over-reaction too, him saying he was disappointed to be taken off was kind of stating the obvious?! He acknowledged that Lucas was instrumental in us winning the game. Nothing wrong with wat he said i dont think.

Peyton Manning

Gerrard needs to realise that the sun doesnt shine out of his arse at Anfield anymore. He's no longer their number 1 player, and hasnt been for some time. The sooner he realises this, the better for Liverpool.

raven136

PHB wrote: »

What the **** is Gerrard doing? How can that possibly help anybody but himself?

totally agree,he doesnt seem to think of the team more himself,kind of the way he plays

kryogen

you dont think theres anything wrong in publicly questioning your managers decision? take off the blinkers please, when a player says he'll be asking his manager to explain his decision there is a problem. its not steven gerrard fc, its liverpool fc, gerrard is a player, he is the captain, he is supposed to get behind his manager 110% and make sure everybody stays together as a unit, do you really think publicly indicating he disagrees with his manager is good for the team as a whole? its not his job to check the managers decisions. its his job to show support for his manager, his team mates, and his job to do the best he can do for the benefit of his team, not himself

mike65

Gerrard said in his "autobiography" that he takes being subbed as a personal snub/insult. And thats without it being a derby. Its silly but he's a bit like that at times.

As for Rafa, I fear he is too busy throwing dice and seeing how clever he is. Making a sub was'nt the stupid thing it was leaving Momo on that was madness. If any player was likely to loose a ball and allow Everton a decent chance it was him. Not Gerrard (I wont mention the decent peno shout against Carra :eek: ).

Mike.

Mr Alan

kryogen wrote: »

you dont think theres anything wrong in publicly questioning your managers decision? take off the blinkers please, when a player says he'll be asking his manager to explain his decision there is a problem. its not steven gerrard fc, its liverpool fc, gerrard is a player, he is the captain, he is supposed to get behind his manager 110% and make sure everybody stays together as a unit, do you really think publicly indicating he disagrees with his manager is good for the team as a whole? its not his job to check the managers decisions. its his job to show support for his manager, his team mates, and his job to do the best he can do for the benefit of his team, not himself

I've been very critical of Gerrard in the past in relation to his Stevie Me antics, i just dont think this is an instance of them.

He pretty much concedes that Rafa was right in taking him off by saying Lucas was the game winner.

As for asking Rafa why he was taken off? i read that as he wants to know how he was letting the team down so he can recify it in future. He doesnt say rafa was wrong in taking him off.

As i said at the start, he has done some ****e things in the pasteg.his best position to play etc etc but this is not one of them.

_blank_

:rolleyes:

Liverpool fans.

Get a grip.

Rafa wasn't stupid, he made a managerial decision, Liverpool won the local derby, what's the problem?

Steven Gerrard coming out and publically stating that he's going to ask the manager for an explaination? What the blue hell is that about?

Who, exactly, is Steven Gerrard to be demanding explainations from his manager?

He's gotten too big for his boots tbh.

If I was the manager of liverpool I'd drop him sharpish.

kryogen

mike everton had two, "decent shouts" clear cut tbh penalty chances v liverpool and received none, and i wont even talk about kuyt trying to cut phil neville in half here

Mr Alan

Mike agrees with you Kryogen. He wanted Rafa to be "punished" for taking Gerrard off if i remember correctly.

PHB

Mr Alan, can you tell me how Gerrards interview in any way helps Liverpool?

mike65

Kuyt was lucky that Neville saw it coming. Otherwise it would have been red.

Mike.

kryogen

?? how is that agreeing with me?? i have no opinion on the substitution. it seems that rafa was right to take him off as the guy who came on in his place did a good job when he came on? i dont ever think a manager should be "punished" for an individual action,im sure if you guys only drew the game the ones who said rafa was right would be singing a different tune but hey, thats football fans

Mr Alan

Players dont give interviews to help their team. They give them for the fans. A lot of fans wanted to know Gerrards feelings on being subbed, he answered them. He knows he is not above being subbed and recognises rafa made the right decision. Also mentions that he knows he is not playing well but says the fans getting behind him is helping him.

kryogen

mike65 wrote: »

Kuyt was lucky that Neville saw it coming. Otherwise it would have been red.

Mike.

lol ive seen people arrested for less tbh

PiE

The article isn't as bad as some people are making out. He's talking to the local paper - of course he's gonna appeal the public's hearts by saying he was desperate to play on.

However I do think he should be pulled aside and told to ease up on the number of interviews he gives. The journo's appear to have his number when trying to get him to say something - anything - mildly controversial.

Jazzy

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/9374/gunitfinaljpgxd1.jpg

G-G-G-G UNIT!!!!!!


(if anyone knows how to get this working on the forum please do tell )

PHB

"I'll be speaking to the manager about it just to find out why I was substituted, but I won't be banging on his door or anything like that.

lol, come on millersangel, why does saying that help in anyway? What does that do for the team? All it does is undermine him more in the press when he's taking lots of flak anyway.

Mr Alan

ha ha ha

PHB: cause it shows he cares?! wants to know why he was taken off? (surely to prevent it happening again) but is not going banging down any doors because its not that big a deal.

mike65

Ref pays peno

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/7056562.stm

Mark Clattenburg will not referee a Premier League match this weekend after being criticised for his handling of the Merseyside derby on Saturday.

He incurred the wrath of Everton after sending off Tony Hibbert for fouling Steven Gerrard in the box.

Dirk Kuyt scored the penalty and 10 minutes later was only booked for a two-footed lunge at Phil Neville.

It meant Kuyt was still on the pitch to take the last-minute penalty that gave Liverpool a 2-1 victory.

Kuyt admitted afterwards the tackle "looks bad", adding: "Maybe I was a bit lucky."

missingtime

Have to say that he had a bad bad game. But since its Everton I don't care. HAH!

spockety

Gerrard's reaction during the game is more important in any case. He stayed on the bench instead of wandering down the tunnel like a true t*sser would, he went nuts when the winner was scored, and when the final whistle went he sprinted onto the pitch to join in the celebrations. Happy days.

I also take it that when he's talking about asking Rafa why he was substituted, he's trying to find out what he was doing wrong or what tactics change brought it about. No big deal.

But these days it is very very difficult being a 'glass have full' Liverpool supporter, because the amount of absolute rubbish that gets thrown at you from opposition supporters, or 'glass half empty' Liverpool supporters makes it not worth your while to even bother debating any more. I will judge Rafa/Stevie/Liverpool in May, personally speaking.

Guy:Incognito

event wrote: »

course it is.
At the end of the day, sugar coat it all you like, but gerrard went down easily and then said it to the ref to send him off.
Can you imagine if Drogba, robben, ronaldo etc had ever done that against liverpool? Christ, it'd be all over the papers and talked about for weeks. But because its good old stevie g, its ok, cos we know english players dont dive, right?

This weeks lip reading section in Zoo or nuts has Zat Knight iirc (not even sure which mag it is and may not be accurate but they published it so hey) doing the exact same thing, yet not a word about it anywahere. Gerrard asked for the right card to be shown , or said soemthing like "hows that not a red" etc. Evedry week there are players falling over after tackles and waving their hands around for cards to be shown wheres the uproar?

kida

Stekelly wrote: »

This weeks lip reading section in Zoo or nuts has Zat Knight iirc (not even sure which mag it is and may not be accurate but they published it so hey) doing the exact same thing, yet not a word about it anywahere. Gerrard asked for the right card to be shown , or said soemthing like "hows that not a red" etc. Evedry week there are players falling over after tackles and waving their hands around for cards to be shown wheres the uproar?

presumably because the referee appeared to change his mind after whatever he said.

Guy:Incognito

kida wrote: »

presumably because the referee appeared to change his mind after whatever he said.

So Gerrard should say " I in no way want you to change your mind, but that should be a red, keep the yellow out and give him that"?

Both players did the same thing, the referee's made the decision. Not Gerrards or Knights fault.

PHB

It's the same issue as the Saha dive imo. I don't think it's something you should do in general, I don't like the idea of it. But, in the end, it got the right result. Was he right to do it? If he hadn't, he wouldn't have been sent off, which would have been unfair on Liverpool. I know what I'd want my captain to do.

Necronomicon

As bad a performance as the ref had, I still don't buy him changing his mind over what Gerrard allegedly said. He took out his book, I don't even think he looked down as he did so. How often do you see a red card stuck in the back of a ref's book as he takes it out to give someone a yellow? Gerrard walked past the ref (without even stopping if I recall?) so it might have been a passing remark, but it couldn't have been arguementative enough for Clattenburg to change. But of course, Andy Gray & co pick up on it, sensationalise it, and it's all over the papers.

He had a stinker no doubt - wrong IMO to let Kuyt stay on the pitch, wrong not to award the Everton peno, but I don't think he had his mind changed by Gerrard.

Dont be at yourself

Gerrard's getting on my tits a little. He's off-form, not making the impact that he can, and yet he still acts cock of the walk. He's seemingly in a perpetual sulk for the last few seasons.

Considering our alternatives for the centre of the field, I don't think he should be considered an automatic starter.

Jesus Wept

True, his impact and form used to outweigh the attitude, lately it's the other way around.

More so to a decrease in form/impact, than an increase in attitude.