Liverpool Rumours And General Discussion 2007/2008

Mental Mickey

el rabitos wrote: »

well if andy gray says so...

no doubt he's made a couple of mistakes this season, notably not playing torres against birmingham....but, the players that are "rotated" are players that are not good enough to hold down regular spots in the team, they are players good against certain teams, inaffective against others and its rafa who knows who fits best against various opposition. thats his job.

arbeloa is maybe a contradiction to that, but his consistant involvement is more due to his versatility and riises patchy form.

if rafa was rotating players like reina, carra, agger, finnan, alonso, gerrard, torres (appart from birmingham) on a consistant basis then ok he's a useless yoyo manager that doesnt get english football. but the truth is, he does NOT rotate these players unless forced to.

if people want to force benitez out then by all means keep on listening to sky sports and mark lawenson and the rest, its way easier to wait for half or full time to know what u just saw on the pitch than actually watch yourself and use your brain.

just dont start moaning when rafa is gone, but you can be guaranteed if/when he does leave, he'll leave a team and a club in far better condition than his past several predecesors left it after their time was up.

True. I think the malaise at Liverpool stems back to when Graeme Souness managed the club. He sold a lot of good players in their prime - including one Stephen Staunton to Aston Villa - who was past it when he came back to us.

ButcherOfNog

Mental Mickey wrote: »

[/B]

True. I think the malaise at Liverpool stems back to when Graeme Souness managed the club. He sold a lot of good players in their prime - including one Stephen Staunton to Aston Villa - who was past it when he came back to us.

Brilliant reasoning, the reason pool lost on Wednesday nite? All Souness's fault

Mental Mickey

ButcherOfNog wrote: »

Brilliant reasoning, the reason pool lost on Wednesday nite? All Souness's fault

LOL. Okay - maybe a bit extreme, but I am pretty sure I heard an ex-player saying something along those lines the other day.....?

Kanney

So is Torres fit for tomorrow?
Pennant gone, will slot Benayoun in. I think Masch should sit it out, must be tiring. If he doesnt and play well all the better tho. How did Kewell do last night?

shotamoose

Yesterday Alonso and Torres were '90% sure' of being fit for Sunday, apparently. And there's six minutes of pure Harry Kewell reserves action from the other night here since you asked for it!

d22ontour

I have to laugh at any Pool fan who has or even considers Kewell for the 1st 11.Even mentioning his name i fear he might get injured.

Mental Mickey

d22ontour wrote: »

I have to laugh at any Pool fan who has or even considers Kewell for the 1st 11.Even mentioning his name i fear he might get injured.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL. Yeah, me too. Ever since he joined us, he has done f**k all.

Zapp Brannigan

I really hope Gerrard is pushed out to the right, might do a bit better there! Masche is 23, he's well capable of playing a few games in a row!

Mental Mickey

Zapp Brannigan wrote: »

I really hope Gerrard is pushed out to the right, might do a bit better there! Masche is 23, he's well capable of playing a few games in a row!

Yeah, I agree. I don't think Gerrard n Xabi work well in midfield together. I prefer to see Masch in there instead.....?

mike65

Xabi Alonso will need to get his finger out if so, he's so deep these days its silly.

Mike.

Jesus Wept

Paul Tomkins articles are good, but I don't think I've ever read any criticism from him.

He made some good points about rotation, but it still doesn't explain some of the baffling substitutions Rafa has made of late.

Bringing on Crouch on 87 mins.

And the champions league final debacle.

Mental Mickey

Zapp Brannigan wrote: »

I really hope Gerrard is pushed out to the right, might do a bit better there! Masche is 23, he's well capable of playing a few games in a row!

The way players are "minded" by their clubs these days, you'd swear that they were on Disability Allowance!!!??

You're right about Mascherano - he's well capable of playing quite a few games in succession. Along with a host of other players on the Pool team!!

mike65

In this fixture last season Crouch started and scored the 'perfect' hat trick, what chance of him starting tomorrow then?

Mike.

Melion

I think Crouchy will definitely start tomorrow, thats why he didnt play against Besiktas

d22ontour

Crouch scored a hat-trick last season ? Wow , that is a sure basis to include him in any match so .

:rolleyes:

He is nothing but an average/above average player who's performances match my opinion of him strangely enough.Crouchs internet personna would equate to /phail tbh.

whatawaster

Mental Mickey wrote: »

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL. Yeah, me too. Ever since he joined us, he has done f**k all.

that is bo***cks. The season we got 82 points he was great and is in my opinion and i think in rafa's too, first choice when he's fit.

RE*AC*TOR

I'd like to see

Gerrard - Leiva - Alonso - Kewell

---

Torres----Babel

---

Though I doubt Rafa would start a match like this without either Masch or Sissoko.
Having seen Babel play a few times on the wing, I think he would be more effective as a striker. The pace of Torres and Babel upfront would cause havok. I think some of the comment on Kewell is a little unfair. When he's been fit he has had very good periods for Liverpool. In the absence of Pennant, I think Gerrard should start on the right. The other option of course is Yossi, but I think he would leave our right side a bit unprotected.

jesus_thats_gre

RE*AC*TOR wrote: »

I'd like to see

Gerrard - Leiva - Alonso - Kewell

---

Torres----Babel

---

Though I doubt Rafa would start a match like this without either Masch or Sissoko.
Having seen Babel play a few times on the wing, I think he would be more effective as a striker. The pace of Torres and Babel upfront would cause havok. I think some of the comment on Kewell is a little unfair. When he's been fit he has had very good periods for Liverpool. In the absence of Pennant, I think Gerrard should start on the right. The other option of course is Yossi, but I think he would leave our right side a bit unprotected.

Hoping to see:

Gerrard - Masch - Alonso - Babel

---

Torres----Crouch

---

Wouldn't object to Lucas being thrown into the mix but I doubt it will happen. There is no hope in hell that he will give both Alonso and Kewell starts considering both will be lacking match fitness. More than anything though, I would love to see Agger back. It is very possible that Sami is going to be majorly exposed today.

I am still somewhat disappointed by what seems to be the poor treatment that Crouch is receiving from Rafa. To be dropped in the fashion that he has been after a decent last season, I can only assume that Crouch has said or done something to upset Rafa.

I am quite nervous about this game. As I said previously, I wouldn't be if we put in a stellar performance and get a win. Saying that, it also won't surprise me if we get whopped due initially to defensive errors.

jesus_thats_gre

d22ontour wrote: »

Crouch scored a hat-trick last season ? Wow , that is a sure basis to include him in any match so .

:rolleyes:

Well, considering that Rafa seems to be a fan of picking players that can best exploite the oppositions weaknesses as oppossed to picking his best players, it would make sense to assume that he would pick a player who caused Arsenal a stupid amount of the trouble and scored a hat-trick in the last competitive fixture between the two clubs. No?

I think it is a hilarious assumption too :rolleyes:

PHB

I'd be really shocking if Rafa went 4-4-2 with Gerrard in the middle. If that happens, the amount of possession you'd give up would be suicidal with Hyypia at the back.
I think either Gerrard will start on the right, or else maybe you'll play a 4-5-1 with Gerrard behind the front man.

I think

---

Mascherano----Alonso

---

---

Lucas

---

---Gerrard

---

Babel--

---

Torres

---

Could win ya the game, either way, I'm excited, it's gona be great.

jesus_thats_gre

PHB wrote: »

---

Mascherano----Alonso

---

---

Lucas

---

---Gerrard

---

Babel--

---

Torres

---

Could win ya the game, either way, I'm excited, it's gona be great.

Would certainly be satisfied with this.

Kanney

Anyone else expecting a really messed up starting line up. Like Kuyt/ Crouch, Yossi and SIssoko or something.. I'm fearing. Altho Yossi should.

machiavellianme

Whats the story with the new owners plunging us 500m into debt? The BBC rumours page makes the claim. Did I miss something? I thought they came in to save us from debt?

Also, the same page says Big Sam is prepared to bid for Crouch in Jan. I'd rather a swap for Martins but it would be nice to offload Crouch for decent money before he's completely worthless next summer (unless he signs a new contract).

jesus_thats_gre

They borrowed the money to the buy the club against their own assets. I read something about them apparently transfering the debt back on to the club once the new stadium etc has been built. 500m seems somewhat excessive though and would be on par with the value of the club.

machiavellianme

Interesting. So essentially we have until the stadium is built to put a world class team together because after that we're broke?

jesus_thats_gre

machiavellianme wrote: »

Interesting. So essentially we have until the stadium is built to put a world class team together because after that we're broke?

Slightly over simplified, no?

The financing package is over 25 to 30 years and possibly involves something in the region of 30 million a year in repayments (picking the figure out of my head). The club have obviously factored in the extra revenue that will be generated due to the added capacity of the new stadium (match day revenue will tripple at the very least) and from other sources as the worldwide profile of the club increases and likely feel that they can easily afford it. The finer details of this will probably never be known but it lumping the debt on to the club may not be bad. It might not be ideal but it is not automatically a bad thing.

Chardee MacDennis

Call_me_al wrote: »

my team for arse:

Reina
Finnan - Arbeloa - Carra - Aurielio
Pennant - Gerrard - Alonso - Riise
Crouch - Torres

are all these players fit?

Still sticking with this team but with Yossi in for injured pennant - i would be very surprised if Crouch doesnt start after the time he gave their defence last year. Also it would be crazy to play Hyypia as they aren't anything special in the air but his pace would leave him behind.

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Slightly over simplified, no?

The financing package is over 25 to 30 years and possibly involves something in the region of 30 million a year in repayments (picking the figure out of my head). The club have obviously factored in the extra revenue that will be generated due to the added capacity of the new stadium (match day revenue will tripple at the very least) and from other sources as the worldwide profile of the club increases and likely feel that they can easily afford it. The finer details of this will probably never be known but it lumping the debt on to the club may not be bad. It might not be ideal but it is not automatically a bad thing.

Since the stadium is costing around 500m i would say the repayments would be in the region of 25m a year for 30 years - quite manageable for a club of our stature, also considering the extra gate receipts we should still be able to keep up a decent amount of spending.

An Citeog

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Slightly over simplified, no?

The financing package is over 25 to 30 years and possibly involves something in the region of 30 million a year in repayments (picking the figure out of my head). The club have obviously factored in the extra revenue that will be generated due to the added capacity of the new stadium (match day revenue will tripple at the very least) and from other sources as the worldwide profile of the club increases and likely feel that they can easily afford it. The finer details of this will probably never be known but it lumping the debt on to the club may not be bad. It might not be ideal but it is not automatically a bad thing.

Very few investors actually have £250 million actually lying around and so they need to borrow or bring other investors on board. The reason why a lot of investors choose to borrow is because it's far cheaper than equity capital and can be written off against tax. The new stadium could put a bit of financial strain on the club but on the whole, Liverpool have nothing to worry about (financially at least! ).

Chardee MacDennis

also pretty sure it's the Bank of Ireland who are giving us the loan as with the Emirates, so it's improving the Irish economy too

machiavellianme

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Slightly over simplified, no?

The financing package is over 25 to 30 years and possibly involves something in the region of 30 million a year in repayments (picking the figure out of my head). The club have obviously factored in the extra revenue that will be generated due to the added capacity of the new stadium (match day revenue will tripple at the very least) and from other sources as the worldwide profile of the club increases and likely feel that they can easily afford it. The finer details of this will probably never be known but it lumping the debt on to the club may not be bad. It might not be ideal but it is not automatically a bad thing.

Fair enough. I was just looking at it as a worst case scenario. It wouldnt be a bad thing if we were self-consistent as regards transfers before that just in case some of the investment money used to buy players dries up a little. Still, its nice to get the stadium built

Melion

Ill take a stab at the starting XI today:

Reina
Finnan
Riise
Carra
Hobbs
Gerrard
Yossi
Masch
Sissoko
Crouch
Kuyt

machiavellianme

Melion wrote: »

Ill take a stab at the starting XI today:

Reina
Finnan
Riise
Carra
Hobbs
Gerrard
Yossi
Masch
Sissoko
Crouch
Kuyt

I really hope not. Playing both Masch and Sissoko today is like playing Russian Roulette. We need a playmaker, not play breakers. Replace one of them with Alonso and it may be a goer.
Also, I'd rather see anyone other than Kuyt today. He's our least-likely-to score striker lately (apart from two penaltys the last day he's done nothing of note this PL season)

jesus_thats_gre

Call_me_al wrote: »

Since the stadium is costing around 500m i would say the repayments would be in the region of 25m a year for 30 years - quite manageable for a club of our stature, also considering the extra gate receipts we should still be able to keep up a decent amount of spending.

Is that not virtually the same as what I said. Only reason I am asking is that you are quoting me and that has left me somewhat baffled.

mike65

No Agger and Arbeloa is doubtful with thigh strain so I've gone with

---

Reina
Finnan-Carra-Hyypia-Riise
Gerrard-Alonso-Masch-Yossi

---

Torres-Crouch

Mike.

ButcherOfNog

mike65 wrote: »

No Agger and Arbeloa is doubtful with thigh strain so I've gone with

---

Reina
Finnan-Carra-Hyypia-Riise
Gerrard-Alonso-Masch-Yossi

---

Torres-Crouch

Mike.

I'd be very happy with that line up, thats bascially what I'm hoping for. Shame Agger is still out tho, we will be suspect at the back due to all the pace arsenal have. It could well end up being a game where we need to score more than them, I think with that team, both frontmen will score....fingers crossed

Noel

HashSlinging

mike65 wrote: »

No Agger and Arbeloa is doubtful with thigh strain so I've gone with

---

Reina
Finnan-Carra-Hyypia-Riise
Gerrard-Alonso-Masch-Yossi

---

Torres-Crouch

Mike.

Same here. I think Harry Kewell might make it on the bench also.

Chardee MacDennis

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Is that not virtually the same as what I said. Only reason I am asking is that you are quoting me and that has left me somewhat baffled.

just backing you up....

kaimera

On our CB issue, who can we realistically look at buying come Jan?

I'm somewhat out of the loop at the moment when it comes to potential targets.

Chardee MacDennis

i would say it depends on how we're doing, if we are still competing we could get a big enough young player. On the other hand if we are out of contention we could see Rafa using Hobbs or Arbeloa in centre back and wait till the summer to pick someone up.

Nephew

Does anyone have any streams for the match?

Chardee MacDennis

anyone else nervous about this game? i feel we may have a lot to lose here, first of all our unbeaten run and secondly i am worried about more pressure from the media on Rafa.

Also obviously this game will not make or break our season but a win would do us wonders and a loss could seriously crush our confidence.

AdrianII

i wouldnt waste me time watching those streams - its on sky sports 1

try this one

http://www.myp2p.eu/Sunday.htm

im a bit worried as a bad result today will see us 9 points off the league, struggling in europe. It would be a big ask to win anything then

Dub13

Nephew wrote: »

Does anyone have any streams for the match?

Check out this Link for a list of streams,fell free to add any you are aware of.

Link

janney5

---

Reina

Finnan---Hyypia---Carra---Riise

---Gerrard--Masch--Alonso

---

Kuyt-Torres-Voronin

whatawaster

Reina

Finnan
Riise
Hyypia
Carragher

Gerrard
Alonso
Mascherano

Voronin
Torres
Kuyt

Don't know if it's 433 or Kuyt or Voronin on one of the wings. Pretty good team though i'd have Babel in for Voronin.

Chardee MacDennis

Reina

Finnan---Hyypia---Carra---Riise

Gerrard--Masch--Alonso-Voronin

Kuyt-Torres

i guess but it could be 4-3-3

who's on the bench?

AdrianII

glad to see xabi back

shotamoose

Crouch, Babel and Benayoun must be feeling a tad miffed.

janney5

Very strong line-up, easy to change too as the game progresses. Great to see Alonso and Torres back! I can see Babel and Crouch coming on for Kuyt and Voronin if the game isn't going our way. If we get an early lead though these 2 lads will battle from the front to protect it. Very promising line up! Getting a bit more confident now, off to the pub now for KO.

copacetic

happy with that side except for lacking a bit of width and wish agger was around for this game...