Album of the Week #2 - Slayer - Reign In Blood

The Bollox

JIZZLORD wrote:

God hates us all, that's a dodgy album

WHAT!? God Hates Us All has the best opening two tracks of any album I have ever heard. I always pray, when I go to a Slayer gig, that they will open with them. after those two it's not great, but the album is deffinitly not dodgy!

John

The Bollox wrote:

but the album is deffinitly not dodgy!

You're right, it's beyond dodgy! Compare the sheer power and amazingness of Reign in Blood or Seasons in the Abyss to God Hates Us All and it's like a completely different band. Not in the sense of Slayer evolving over their career but losing all the elements that made them worth listening to. It is the sound of a band getting lazy, going through the motions and not giving a damn anymore.

Hector Gilbert

This is a wonderful album. Great songs, great production, a classic in thrash metal. I have to admit I still haven't heard the two albums they subsequently released, though, which are preferred by some fans.

Shiminay

Hector, here's the full Slayer Discography:
Studio albums
1983: Show No Mercy
1985: Hell Awaits
1986: Reign in Blood
1988: South of Heaven
1990: Seasons in the Abyss
1994: Divine Intervention
1996: Undisputed Attitude
1998: Diabolus in Musica
2001: God Hates Us All
2006: Christ Illusion

South of Heaven was a good album. Seasons is phenominal (War Ensemble is the opener and it's non-stop brutality from there ), but the highlight for me has to be Divine Intervention. Defo my favourite album. Paul Bostaph was the drummer with them for a while around then and it was a noticable (and imo, refreshing) difference. Not to take anything away from Dave Lombardo, he's a very good drummer, but I felt Bostaph just added a little more to the mix. Interestingly, as I read the above link, I see that Divine Intervention was his own least favourite album

But I do recommend picking up their back catalog, or at the very least the Sound Track To The Apocalypse for a "best of" smattering (+ some rarities).

Tar.Aldarion

Great album, not as good as seasons which is probably my favourite album.


I love GHUA. It's good fun.

Gonzo

I found Slayer hard to get into at first when i was a young teen all those years ago but now after 15 years of listening to them I still think they are amazing to this day and propably nearly the only early 80s metal band who still play great to this day and produce great stuff unlike Metallica and a few other bands from that period who are now nothing more than a joke.

senordingdong

Ph3n0m wrote:

Thats the problem with assumptions - I never said your name, did i?

I guess you didn't, but anyway, I'd be more than happy to properly discuss the albums merits and failings in a proper discussion.

Ph3n0m

senordingdong wrote:

I guess you didn't, but anyway, I'd be more than happy to properly discuss the albums merits and failings in a proper discussion.

Then discuss, as you said "it being an awful pointless album" - explain?

buck65

I wouldn't mind hearing this too

senordingdong

Ph3n0m wrote:

Then discuss, as you said "it being an awful pointless album" - explain?

Well for a start, that's a typo, I meant to type 'awfully'...the album has some good songs on it but I find that most of the songs are just rushed and poorly produced. Like they were just thrown together at the last minute.
Even some of the riffs in some of te songs don't sound right to me....take Postmortem for example...after the second chorous and a completely different riff kicks in. The riff is off a different style then the rest of the song and sound completely out of place.
Then there is the outro to Raining Blood which sounds like it was slapped on because the album was too short.

Like I sais, in my opinion, Seasons is Slayer at their best and Reign in Blood sounds like it's polar opposite.

Ph3n0m

senordingdong wrote:

Well for a start, that's a typo, I meant to type 'awfully'...the album has some good songs on it but I find that most of the songs are just rushed and poorly produced. Like they were just thrown together at the last minute.
Even some of the riffs in some of te songs don't sound right to me....take Postmortem for example...after the second chorous and a completely different riff kicks in. The riff is off a different style then the rest of the song and sound completely out of place.
Then there is the outro to Raining Blood which sounds like it was slapped on because the album was too short.

Like I sais, in my opinion, Seasons is Slayer at their best and Reign in Blood sounds like it's polar opposite.

The songs are rushed? How so - multiple times have the band said, in interviews, that they wanted to make the fastest, angriest, heaviest, etc album they could. Its meant to be about ferocity, pace, and brutal power

Poorly produced? Well I dont think you should say that to Rick Rubin - he might get offended, given that he has produced most of Slayer's albums, including Season in the Abyss.

As for the outro to Raining Blood - that is just a matter of taste and personal opinion

I asked before - how is it pointless?

buck65

I think the riffing in Post Mortem is great, certainly one of the standout tracks. This debate is a bit pointless really just admit it's a great album dingdong and we'll move on...

cournioni

senordingdong wrote:

Well for a start, that's a typo, I meant to type 'awfully'...the album has some good songs on it but I find that most of the songs are just rushed and poorly produced. Like they were just thrown together at the last minute.
Even some of the riffs in some of te songs don't sound right to me....take Postmortem for example...after the second chorous and a completely different riff kicks in. The riff is off a different style then the rest of the song and sound completely out of place.
Then there is the outro to Raining Blood which sounds like it was slapped on because the album was too short.

Like I sais, in my opinion, Seasons is Slayer at their best and Reign in Blood sounds like it's polar opposite.

Thats it, keep digging...

I love Reign In Blood, absolute masterpiece from start to finish. Personal favourites are Angel of Death, Piece by Piece, Epidemic, Postmortem and Raining Blood with Angel of Death head and shoulders above them all. Awesome song. Loved all of the songs apart from Criminally Insane, just couldn't get into that one.

senordingdong

Ph3n0m wrote:

The songs are rushed? How so - multiple times have the band said, in interviews, that they wanted to make the fastest, angriest, heaviest, etc album they could. Its meant to be about ferocity, pace, and brutal power

Poorly produced? Well I dont think you should say that to Rick Rubin - he might get offended, given that he has produced most of Slayer's albums, including Season in the Abyss.

As for the outro to Raining Blood - that is just a matter of taste and personal opinion

I asked before - how is it pointless?

Pointless as in it was slapped out for the sake of making an album. It feels like some of the songs were made fast just for the sake of having them fast, instead of written to sound good.
For example, I would imagine when bands go into studios, the target they aim for is to write as good a sounding song as possible. But with RIB it feels like the target was speed and that they were just trying to write as fast a song as possible and they might have sacrificed superior content for fast content during the sessions.
Pointless as in, nothing would be different if it hadn't been made.

I get the personal opinion thing in regards to the Raining Blood outro...but look at the album sleeve, instead of crediting a 'solo' to one of the players, they credit 'NOIZE!'

I get that it's fast and they wanted that, and I do like some of the songs, I just think the album is a far cry from a masterpiece, especially since Slayer also have Seasons under their belt. And on that note, I think having Rick Rubin on both albums helps make my point...kinda.

buck65

"nothing would be different if it hadn't been made"


now I realise that this is a wind-up

I'm gonna say the world is flat ok?

senordingdong

Maybe not the best way to word it.

Ph3n0m

Pointless as in, nothing would be different if it hadn't been made.

How can you make such a statement, when scores of metal-related bands have cited Slayer, and specifically Reign in Blood as a huge influence on them?

I get the personal opinion thing in regards to the Raining Blood outro...but look at the album sleeve, instead of crediting a 'solo' to one of the players, they credit 'NOIZE!'

so?

Pointless as in it was slapped out for the sake of making an album. It feels like some of the songs were made fast just for the sake of having them fast, instead of written to sound good. For example, I would imagine when bands go into studios, the target they aim for is to write as good a sounding song as possible. But with RIB it feels like the target was speed and that they were just trying to write as fast a song as possible and they might have sacrificed superior content for fast content during the sessions.

No - I would go even further and say bands write an album first and foremost that they are personally happy with (how else do you explain such crap like St Anger). And for such a "slapped together" album it has been a defining moment for Slayer, and has cause so much contraversy for its lyrical content alone.

Plus (taken from the wiki) "the album received virtually no radio airplay, it became the band's first to enter the Billboard 200, debuting at #94,[16] and the band's first album certified gold in the United States" - so I think that sums up, to me, how impressive this album is.

To me, this album is Slayer at its rawest, a massive aural assault. Yes Seasons is a great album (in fact its a tie with Seasons and RIB for my favourite Slayer album).

But for me, personally, RIB defined who Slayer were, are and always will be.

It wasn't me!

I'll agree with that. It's Slayer in a microcosm. 28 minutes of sheer fury and speed. Fan-funking-tastic.

Ancient1

SLAYEEEEEERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!

Sorry guys, someone had to say it after 49 posts.

demanufactured

****ing amazing album , anyone who says slayer are a bit of a joke or dodgy needs to go see them live , you will then be put in your place.

It wasn't me!

Funnily enough, I would say the one place they don't quite cut it is live. I've seen them a couple of times now and I can't help feeling there's a certain predictability and sterility there. Shame. Their discography speaks for their ability though.

Ph3n0m

Ancient1 wrote:

SLAYEEEEEERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!

Sorry guys, someone had to say it after 49 posts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWMugncGo00

gah how do you embed videos here?

Shiminay

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWMugncGo00

Ph3n0m

Kharn wrote:

oh look what Kharn can do

I hate you so much

senordingdong

Ph3n0m wrote:

How can you make such a statement, when scores of metal-related bands have cited Slayer, and specifically Reign in Blood as a huge influence on them?

But if that album never happened, these bands could still site Slayer as an influence (like I said, I don't have a problem with Slayer) and all their other great albums too.
I guess I just think the album could have done with alot more work, and cuold have been something muhc greater.

so?

What I mean with the 'NOIZE!' thing is that it doesn't sound like that part of the song was written with forsight or planning etc...just random on the spot noise making, which made it onto the album so that would leave me to wonder what other parts of the album were made in the same way.

No - I would go even further and say bands write an album first and foremost that they are personally happy with (how else do you explain such crap like St Anger).

Yeah I agree with you on that point, but I think Slayer were happy with the album for all the wrong reasons.

And for such a "slapped together" album it has been a defining moment for Slayer, and has cause so much contraversy for its lyrical content alone.

I don't think these reasons are ample justification for its succuess and popularity, but that's just me.

Plus (taken from the wiki) "the album received virtually no radio airplay, it became the band's first to enter the Billboard 200, debuting at #94,[16] and the band's first album certified gold in the United States" - so I think that sums up, to me, how impressive this album is.

The 'no radio airplay' thing is impressive but for all I know, that could be how all metal bands operated back then and likewise, I really don't think album sales are a good indication of wether an album is good or bad.

To me, this album is Slayer at its rawest,

At their rawest...that I can understand but I don't think raw is always best.

buck65

what does one say???

Ph3n0m

senordingdong wrote:

I guess I just think the album could have done with alot more work, and cuold have been something muhc greater.

Much greater? Sorry, but the sarcasm meter is on overload here - do you somehow think you can improve on what is world-renowned as the "speed metal defining album"? (slayer's words, and many many other bands words)

What I mean with the 'NOIZE!' thing is that it doesn't sound like that part of the song was written with forsight or planning etc...just random on the spot noise making, which made it onto the album so that would leave me to wonder what other parts of the album were made in the same way.

You are talking about the end of Reiging Blood, where the song has been built up starting with the rise of a storm, the song then tears your heart out, and ends with the "storm" passing ...oh dear you have missed the obvious point, havent you.

Yeah I agree with you on that point, but I think Slayer were happy with the album for all the wrong reasons.

And what "wrong reasons" were they?

I don't think these reasons are ample justification for its succuess and popularity, but that's just me.

OK so ignoring the lyrical contraversery, you are basically saying there is no justification at all for its success and popularity? Millions worldwide would seriously disagree with you

The 'no radio airplay' thing is impressive but for all I know, that could be how all metal bands operated back then and likewise, I really don't think album sales are a good indication of wether an album is good or bad.

Not really - its like any band out there (despite what they might say). If you put out a record, etc you do hope to make some sales, so obviously the more people aware of your music, the better it is for you. You also have to understand that metal back in the 80s was more underground - it was more of the rock of bands like Bon Jovi/Motley Crue, etc that got on MTV - bands like Slayer were usually reduced to appearing once on a 2 hour program, once a week called Headbangers Ball. So I seriously doubt any sensible band is going to shoot themselves in the foot and deny themselves a wider audience to make a bit of money from their latest recording - that is just idiotic.

At their rawest...that I can understand but I don't think raw is always best.

Again that is just down to your opinion. Look at this way, I quite clearly love RIB, South of Heaven is ok, and I love Seasons as much as as RIB (and despite what some people say, I have yet to hear a "dodgy" Slayer album).

And if Seasons was Album of the week and someone else was saying it shouldnt be, or similiar arguements like yours, I would be doing the exact same thing as I am right now - listening to the album, while thinking of comebacks for the discussion

and that makes me wonder - am I and senordingdong the only two going to have a discussion about this

buck65

hey I throw in a few hilarious onliners from time to time




lol
no really I just have lost patience with Senor at this stage , his argument is bollox and I really couldn't be bothered

senordingdong

Ph3n0m wrote:

Much greater? Sorry, but the sarcasm meter is on overload here - do you somehow think you can improve on what is world-renowned as the "speed metal defining album"?

Haha, come on now...I never suggested I could so better, just that they could.

You are talking about the end of Reiging Blood, where the song has been built up starting with the rise of a storm, the song then tears your heart out, and ends with the "storm" passing ...oh dear you have missed the obvious point, havent you.

I think I might have.

And what "wrong reasons" were they?

Well the wrong reasons are the still the same as I mentioned in the other post, they were happy that the songs were as fast as they could be, not that they wer as good as they could be.

OK so ignoring the lyrical contraversery, you are basically saying there is no justification at all for its success and popularity? Millions worldwide would seriously disagree with you

Hang on, some wires are getting crossed here, you said it was a defining moment for Slayer and it caused alot of controversy, I'm saying that these are not always the result of the album in question being a masterpiece.

Not really - its like any band out there (despite what they might say). If you put out a record, etc you do hope to make some sales, so obviously the more people aware of your music, the better it is for you. You also have to understand that metal back in the 80s was more underground - it was more of the rock of bands like Bon Jovi/Motley Crue, etc that got on MTV - bands like Slayer were usually reduced to appearing once on a 2 hour program, once a week called Headbangers Ball. So I seriously doubt any sensible band is going to shoot themselves in the foot and deny themselves a wider audience to make a bit of money from their latest recording - that is just idiotic.

Headbanger's Ball is still on ya know. Pretty good viewinG sometimes. But anyway, like I said, gaining that much sales from word of mouth or whatever is impressive but I'm not sure I should see that as a reason to frame my copy of RIB.

Again, I do think it's a good album but just not Slayer at their best.

Again that is just down to your opinion. Look at this way, I quite clearly love RIB, South of Heaven is ok, and I love Seasons as much as as RIB (and despite what some people say, I have yet to hear a "dodgy" Slayer album).

UA is the only Slayer album that I don't really bother with, I don't think I'm arguing with you, or hating you or your opinions or trying to change your mind or anything...I'm just trying to elaborate on what I said.

And come on.....give buck65 a pat on the back for his fantastic contributions.

DeadSkin

senordingdong wrote:

, they were happy that the songs were as fast as they could be, not that they wer as good as they could be.

Are you saying that Slayer decided, right lads, lets make an album that's fast as f*ck and release it no matter how good/bad a song maybe on the album?