Traffic Corp Gardai Behaviour

_Kaiser_

PeakOutput wrote:

anyone who is of the opinion the gardai should give ticekts without explaining the reason for the ticket is a moron tbh

Why I wouldn't quite have put it that way myself, I fully agree

Aside from helping to improve the thing that is most lacking on our roads - driver education - surely everyone has the right to know in advance what they're being accused of/charged with, and be presented with written evidence (in this case a ticket) of this?

Think about it.. that Garda could in theory charge the OP with anything (speeding, dangerous driving etc), and seeing as all they need to do in court is give their "word" (shouldn't be admissible without actual evidence in my opinion - in this instance, footage of the OP driving in the bus lane) to back it up, that's a lot of faith your placing in the integrity and professionalism of a force that has all too often proven itself unworthy of same.

barryfitz

Was comnig from Crumlin Hospital the other day heading for the N7 (I think thats the long mile road) anyway there was a set of traffic lights with a lane dedicated for cars turning right. The Garda Traffic Corps jeep infront of me in the lane going straight, drove up to the lights, slapped on his indicator and cut across all the cars in the lane that was dedicated for cars turning right. No blue lights, no siren just normal slow driving. Is this acceptable?, i wouldnt think so!

_Kaiser_

barryfitz wrote:

Was comnig from Crumlin Hospital the other day heading for the N7 (I think thats the long mile road) anyway there was a set of traffic lights with a lane dedicated for cars turning right. The Garda Traffic Corps jeep infront of me in the lane going straight, drove up to the lights, slapped on his indicator and cut across all the cars in the lane that was dedicated for cars turning right. No blue lights, no siren just normal slow driving. Is this acceptable?, i wouldnt think so!

No it's not, but it's an example of how a lot of them regularly abuse their position. I see it all the time in my area - they break the lights and cut across the junction diagonally to then mount the kerb and park in front of the station doors, illegally park while one of them is in the chipper etc

Turner

barryfitz wrote:

Was comnig from Crumlin Hospital the other day heading for the N7 (I think thats the long mile road) anyway there was a set of traffic lights with a lane dedicated for cars turning right. The Garda Traffic Corps jeep infront of me in the lane going straight, drove up to the lights, slapped on his indicator and cut across all the cars in the lane that was dedicated for cars turning right. No blue lights, no siren just normal slow driving. Is this acceptable?, i wouldnt think so!

If they were after getting a call or looking for a specific car.. Definitely acceptable..

The thing is you dont know so you obviously assume they are doing it purely because they can.

jhegarty

Chief--- wrote:

If they were after getting a call or looking for a specific car.. Definitely acceptable..

The thing is you dont know so you obviously assume they are doing it purely because they can.

Sounds to me like they did something that was unsafe (as least they would consider it to be if I or you did it) .... even if we assume a murder is taking place around the corner, would the flashing lights not have been a good idea ?

yayamark

jhegarty wrote:

Sounds to me like they did something that was unsafe (as least they would consider it to be if I or you did it) .... even if we assume a murder is taking place around the corner, would the flashing lights not have been a good idea ?

I think putting on flashing lights is one of the last things youd do there. the murderer would see the flashing and run off god :rolleyes:

Tazzle

McSpud wrote:

Thats the one. I was originally in the outside lane but was fairly sure that changed to right turn only. There was already about 10 cars in the 'bus lane' ahead of me. It was a stupid mistake as I wasn't paying enough attention & not saying its an excuse just explaining that its an easy mistake.

If a guard is unable to make his point without raising his voice then surely he is in the wrong job? He did seemed stressed as indicated by his body language & pointing & waving at people to either stay in the bus lane or move out of the bus lane.

Was this in the evening around 5.30? If so you were on 96fm :P Someone on the traffic fleet yoke they have was talking about some individual(s) getting pulled in the buslane and saying "well it's about time!!111oneoneone"

But in fairness it is a fairly **** junction, you know you have to be in the left lane to turn left or straight on, and EVERYONE and their granny jumps into it early, because if you don't you're stuck trying to pull into it later when the buslane ends by the church, and good luck to you if you are because nobody is going to let you in. and this is followed somewhat understandably by the lads trying to turn right beeping the f*ck out of you. can't win really.

TheNog

jhegarty wrote:

Sounds to me like they did something that was unsafe (as least they would consider it to be if I or you did it)

OMG.... what the hell are u talking about???? Were you there?? did u witness the incident?? probably not.

They probably made a mistake and switched lanes when traffic was moving and did it safely. Most drivers make these types of mistakes. Other drivers who make the mistake of being in the wrong lane try to move into a lane that is not moving therefore blocking up a moving lane.

Everyone makes mistakes on the road. Its the idiots who make the serious ones that gets ppl injured or killed.

ArphaRima

You get muppets in each and every job. Vast majority are fine. The gardaí should be no exception.

I must meet the minority every single time I have dealings with them then. :rolleyes:
Accountability.

MrPudding

fluffer wrote:

I must meet the minority every single time I have dealings with them then. :rolleyes:
Accountability.

TBH that says more about you than it does the traffic corp.

MrP

ArphaRima

TBH that says more about you than it does the traffic corp.

Care to explain yourself?
Let me get this straight. I must have a problem because the gardai were rude to me?! Ha!

I havent a single point, parking ticket or even a caution. I am no angel, but I'm saying that (pre traffic corps mind you) every dealing I have had with the Gardai in my car as been a prime example of institutional rude behaviour.
I've been pulled over twice. No reason other than a lone man in a car at night. (car in perfect condition, driving not abnormal etc) Outright rude both times.

That garda was unprofessional. End of. That isn't part of the job description.

Apt quote for what I think. I happen to believe it applies to more gardai than the garda association believe.

Someone brought up Thames Valley Police as an example of a professional force

I agree with that someone.

MrPudding

fluffer wrote:

Care to explain yourself?
Let me get this straight. I must have a problem because the gardai were rude to me?! Ha!

Using the phrase "I must meet the minority every single time I have dealings with them then." does give the impression that you have quite a bit of experience.

If I have experienced something twice I, like most people I would think, would say something like " the couple of times...., " or even, as the number is so low and I know exactly what it is, "on the two occasions..."

If you use the phrase "every single time...." the implication is that there are a large number of times and perhaps you can't remember how many there was.

You are saying now it was 2 occasions, why did you not just say on the 2 occasions? Did you think 2 incidents in your life out of hundreds of incidents every day are not enough to form an opinion of an entire force? You would be right on that.

MrP

MrPudding

Terrontress wrote:

I have watched those English "Motorway Police" shows on Bravo.

The traffic cops there seem to take people into the back seat of their cars and say something along the lines "You know what you were doing, I know what you were doing. No sense in trying to justify it. Here's your ticket".

This professionalism isn't in abundance amongst the gardai.

Do you think there is any chance at all that they might, just possibly, perhaps, maybe, just a little bit, behave slighty differently when there is a fcuking film crew following them around? Just a thought.

MrP

ArphaRima

Well what I said was that on two occasions I was pulled over. I could have gone on to say that in the 3 times my tax was checked, the 3 times they have checked my license when parked outside my own house, in the 8 times I've been in a garda station's reception, in the xx many times I've seen them go about their work on the streets, etc. I have had positive contact too. I'm just saying the uncourteous manner is prevalent.
I'm no scumbag, and I dont live in a "bad" area.

Maybe you are a garda.. Maybe a good one, a courteous professional one, or maybe you know some. What I'm saying is that my opinion has been formed by my experience with them which has been mostly unflattering.

MrPudding

fluffer wrote:

Well what I said was that on two occasions I was pulled over. I could have gone on to say that in the 3 times my tax was checked, the 3 times they have checked my license when parked outside my own house, in the 8 times I've been in a garda station's reception, in the xx many times I've seen them go about their work on the streets, etc. I have had positive contact too. I'm just saying the uncourteous manner is prevalent.
I'm no scumbag, and I dont live in a "bad" area.

Maybe you are a garda.. Maybe a good one, a courteous professional one, or maybe you know some. What I'm saying is that my opinion has been formed by my experience with them which has been mostly unflattering.

I am not a garda. Just a person that has had a number of experiences of the police in Dublin, northern Ireland and the UK. Unlike you I never seem to exerience the "minority" of either force that is uncourteous. Go figure... Maybe I am just lucky like that?

MrP

bauderline

That would lead me onto a thought I had when I read through this thread. All Garda vehicles should be fitted with appropriate AV equipment so that the picture and sound of the Garda interaction with the member of the public can be documented.

The technology isn't difficult to implement nor is it expensive, as we can see from those American police chase vidoes it has been around for quite some time.

That is a heck of an incentive for both sides to act in a calm and professional manner. For the record I believe the vast majority of Garda do their job well, however some do appear to add a personal dimension to their job. Not Welcome.

my humble thoughts... b.

ArphaRima

Considering I have lived abroad for half of my adult working life I also have a valid point of reference. I will admit gardai are much better than 85% of the worlds police forces.
But the bar is set imho by the UK police. They are far superior in customer service. Northern europe(not western -french, portugese and spanish police are notorious), UK, Ireland, certain select asian countries (Japan, Hong Kong, Singapore) and certain US states, are the only ones to aspire to.
But the gardai have an awful attitude. It's us and them according to their basic training. We are only civilians. Only focused relations courses will reduce this prevailing attitude. It will have to happen soon.

DarkJager

I was stopped for talking to someone on the phone on loudspeaker in the car last night. Phone was sitting in its holder on the dashboard, but I was still advised "this is not an adequate handsfree kit". Wtf???

ArphaRima

Perfect example of an average Garda's inability to say sorry. He blatantly thought you were using a phone illegally. Then decided to invent laws to backup his own bogus position.

If he just said "Sorry Sir, I thought......." then there would be no "wtf?" resentment. Agreed?

-I always find it interesting that the few gardai I've managed to spot here on boards keep quiet when any discussions on professionality are taking place. They only like to jump in on calling people idiots when they get caught for speeding and complain.-

Henry Ford III

Was it a proper handsfree kit, or just a holder?

mickey mac

As a friend of mine says, if they stopped prostitutes having babies there would be no traffic corp!

Darragh29

Alun wrote:

Re-read the post, and you'll see that the issue the OP is having is not with the offence itself, for which he put his hand up and admitted his guilt, but with the attitude of the Garda involved. It's this whole condescending, 'lecturing' thing and talking down to people as if they were still at school that he (and others in similar threads here) are complaining about. Maybe you find that acceptable treatment, I and many others don't, thank you.

Couldn't agree more. You see live footage of cops in the US giving tickets and dealing with people who are off their heads but they still manage to be professional and courteous, not like Craggy Island over here.

DarkJager

It's a phone holder, but the phone is set to automatic answer and loudspeaker when a call comes in.

Henry Ford III

No offense but I'm not sure that's good enough to comply with the law. At least you weren't holding it to your ear I guess.

MrPudding

Darragh29 wrote:

Couldn't agree more. You see live footage of cops in the US giving tickets and dealing with people who are off their heads but they still manage to be professional and courteous, not like Craggy Island over here.

I have seen plenty of footage of them losing it as well.

MrP

craichoe

Henry Ford III wrote:

No offense but I'm not sure that's good enough to comply with the law. At least you weren't holding it to your ear I guess.

Not permitted while driving

* Portable hands free kits (i.e. earpiece connected by wire to handheld phone). The position of wireless Bluetooth headsets is unclear.
* Having a phone switched on in your pocket.
* Use of other radio devices - eg CB, other 2 way radio systems, etc.

So loudspeaker should be fine, however untethered bluetooth headset is unclear.

Marcus.Aurelius

fluffer wrote:

Considering I have lived abroad for half of my adult working life I also have a valid point of reference. I will admit gardai are much better than 85% of the worlds police forces.
But the bar is set imho by the UK police. They are far superior in customer service. Northern europe(not western -french, portugese and spanish police are notorious), UK, Ireland, certain select asian countries (Japan, Hong Kong, Singapore) and certain US states, are the only ones to aspire to.
But the gardai have an awful attitude. It's us and them according to their basic training. We are only civilians. Only focused relations courses will reduce this prevailing attitude. It will have to happen soon.

The UK police force is crippling itself with PC nonsense. They're completely confused and have that terrible procrastination issue that almost all of our Brit counterparts have. Bloody useless. Nauseatingly self righteous and pompous. And I've met hundreds of them at IPA meetings over the years.

seamus

Darragh29 wrote:

Couldn't agree more. You see live footage of cops in the US giving tickets and dealing with people who are off their heads but they still manage to be professional and courteous, not like Craggy Island over here.

I've seen plenty of pieces of footage of a US cop pulling a gun on someone who just got a little too worked up (i.e. wasn't physically violent). Not to mention people getting viciously tazered purely because they peacefully refused to comply with instructions*. Give me a rude, unarmed force over any armed one, any day.

It's a phone holder, but the phone is set to automatic answer and loudspeaker when a call comes in.

In fairness, did you explain that to him? I'm pretty sure they see hundreds of cases a week of people doing everything with their phone, then putting it on loudspeaker. I would consider the initial act of looking at your phone to answer/dial to be more dangerous than holding it to your ear.


* The irony being that even if they decided to comply after the initial attack, they will probably be unable to move due to muscle spasm. Many "enforcement" officials don't know this, and continue to tazer people becuase they think they're still refusing to comply

Seth Brundle

Give it time and the TC will be like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fa2TW6b6HrE

(if in work maybe turn down the volume in case people think its something else!!!)

seamus

That's exactly the video I was thinking of kbannon. A british cop show, showed that clip as a demonstration of US professionalism. It's a blatant abuse of power and needless use of force. Further proof that the US is a police state.