Gun Slinger

slugster

Does my pistol licence entitle me to carry the firearm in a holster on my person? without getting special branch excited:)

Rew

In what context?

In a shooting bay on the range yes, else where no.

slugster

use and carry is stated on the licence??

fishdog

Does my pistol licence entitle me to carry the firearm in a holster on my person? without getting special branch excited

Outside of a range, now what do you think????

What possible reason could you give the a cop for carrying a pistol in a holster apart from when you are in a place that you are allowed to shoot a pistol???

Sparks

slugster wrote:

use and carry is stated on the licence??

I keep hearing that question more and more often for some bizzare reason, given that the most sensible answer is "If you think that the words on a form drafted on a friday evening by some random nobody in the civil service seventy-odd years ago outweighs the legislation passed by the Dail in the Firearms and Offensive Weapons Act 1990, you didn't deserve to have the certificate before they took it off you and dragged you in front of the bench".

In short, no. You can't carry a firearm in a public place without good reason and "my cert sounds like a US carry permit if you squint" isn't good reason.

BryanL

if you find yourself in OK coral Dodge city, you might get away with it.Ask Wyatt Earp

CLADA

slugster wrote:

Does my pistol licence entitle me to carry the firearm in a holster on my person? without getting special branch excited:)

mmmm! I feel a period of detention under Sec. 30 of the offences against the state act coming for slugster.

rrpc

Why the *** would you want to go around with a gun in a holster outside of a range????

I'll leave the question about the holster on the range out of this

E. Fudd

This is the very thing that gives the shooting fraternity a bad name, regardless of this being (hopefully) a hypothetical question or not.
Jesus, you get funny looks walking down a country road with a shotgun and a dog on a winters afternoon, let alone walking around with a holstered pistol!
I would think that a lot of the general public wouldn't even realise that pistols are legal in Ireland, can you even imagine the reaction you'd get.
If you are just asking the question hypothetically, fine, but if your actually serious, I've one word for you......... TOOL!!!

slugster

Thanks Lads for the answer, But remember theres no such thing as a silly question from someone who asks!. Save the sarcasim in futhure replies to fellow shooters as they may alienate those who need your knowledge.

Mr. Gun

Hey Slugster,

Dont mind the arseholes that posted above, with responses like that they dont deserve to even hold a ****ing gun.

And as I have already stated the Garda have publicly stated that there is NOTHING they can do if licensed pistol holders want to carry their firearms on their person. Yes it is implied through common sense that you will only carry it going to and from the range but it doesnt state anywhere that you can only carry it going to and from the range. And forget the offensive weapons crap Sparks will you. All you seem to do here is cut and paste sections of the law big ****ing deal. If the law is so clear then why the **** do we have solicitors and barristers, hang on maybe its their job to interpret the law not yours.

Rew

Mr. Gun wrote:

Hey Slugster,

Dont mind the arseholes that posted above, with responses like that they dont deserve to even hold a ****ing gun.

And as I have already stated the Garda have publicly stated that there is NOTHING they can do if licensed pistol holders want to carry their firearms on their person. Yes it is implied through common sense that you will only carry it going to and from the range but it doesnt state anywhere that you can only carry it going to and from the range. And forget the offensive weapons crap Sparks will you. All you seem to do here is cut and paste sections of the law big ****ing deal. If the law is so clear then why the **** do we have solicitors and barristers, hang on maybe its their job to interpret the law not yours.

Banned from shooting section. When you can take a grown up attitude to posting PM me and you can come back. There are ways to make a valid point without that tone and language.

Rew

rrpc wrote:

Why the *** would you want to go around with a gun in a holster outside of a range????

I'll leave the question about the holster on the range out of this

Banned for 1 week for circumventing the bad language filters. PM me in a week to be allowed back in.

Rew

pampers wrote:

This is the very thing that gives the shooting fraternity a bad name, regardless of this being (hopefully) a hypothetical question or not.
Jesus, you get funny looks walking down a country road with a shotgun and a dog on a winters afternoon, let alone walking around with a holstered pistol!
I would think that a lot of the general public wouldn't even realise that pistols are legal in Ireland, can you even imagine the reaction you'd get.
If you are just asking the question hypothetically, fine, but if your actually serious, I've one word for you......... TOOL!!!

Border line pampers I understand the sentiment but everyone deserves the benifit of doubt so lets keep it to answering the questions.

Rew

Mr. Gun wrote:

And as I have already stated the Garda have publicly stated that there is NOTHING they can do if licensed pistol holders want to carry their firearms on their person. Yes it is implied through common sense that you will only carry it going to and from the range but it doesnt state anywhere that you can only carry it going to and from the range. And forget the offensive weapons crap Sparks will you. All you seem to do here is cut and paste sections of the law big ****ing deal. If the law is so clear then why the **** do we have solicitors and barristers, hang on maybe its their job to interpret the law not yours.

"publicly" where, when, what? Dont quote empty space when other people at least bother to quote the law.

Rew

Touchy subject so lets keep it clean and to the point. I take you point Slugster but when you come one and post one liners like you did your asking for these kind of responses. Flesh out your question with more context and you will get better answers.

rrpc

Mr. Gun wrote:

Hey Slugster,

Dont mind the arseholes that posted above, with responses like that they dont deserve to even hold a ****ing gun.

The arseholes above, including me were giving advice that wouldn't get the OP into trouble.

And as I have already stated the Garda have publicly stated that there is NOTHING they can do if licensed pistol holders want to carry their firearms on their person.

And you don't think that statement wasn't made for political reasons? Not something I would want to test and not something you should be advising others to test either. This apart from what possible need you would have for carrying a firearm in a holster off range.

Yes it is implied through common sense that you will only carry it going to and from the range but it doesnt state anywhere that you can only carry it going to and from the range.

It is stated on your licence that the firearm is to be used for target shooting purposes only. Anything else and you are in breach of your licence.

And forget the offensive weapons crap Sparks will you. All you seem to do here is cut and paste sections of the law big ****ing deal. If the law is so clear then why the **** do we have solicitors and barristers, hang on maybe its their job to interpret the law not yours.

I wouldn't trust my freedom or my licence to your interpretation of the law either. But why don't you make a test case of it if you're so sure?

rrpc

Rew wrote:

Banned for 1 week for circumventing the bad language filters. PM me in a week to be allowed back in.

Sorry Rew, thought that was allowed

Sparks

Mr. Gun wrote:

And as I have already stated the Garda have publicly stated that there is NOTHING they can do if licensed pistol holders want to carry their firearms on their person.

Except shoot them.
Frankly, I'd rather not have someone shot because some anonymous yahoo on this forum said that it was perfectly fine to carry a firearm in public like this was the american west in the 1800s.

Yes it is implied through common sense that you will only carry it going to and from the range but it doesnt state anywhere that you can only carry it going to and from the range.

Not on a form written by some anonymous civil servant in the 1920s it doesn't, but it does in the 1990 Firearms and Offensive Weapons Act, which you might forget easily, but which the Gardai and the Department of Justice are somewhat fond of.

If the law is so clear then why <expletive deleted> do we have solicitors and barristers, hang on maybe its their job to interpret the law not yours.

Actually, it's not their job to interpret the law, it's the job of the judges and juries. The barristers and soliciters are there to advise you and argue on your behalf.

However, when the law says "you may not do carry an offensive weapon in a public place", there's not much to interpret or argue about. And frankly, you walk down the high street with a sidearm strapped to your hip, you're not getting any support from any legitimate firearms holder - all of us will want you arrested and thrown in jail, because frankly, if you think doing that in this country is acceptable, all of us would be happier to see you barred from ever holding a certificate again.

Sparks

Rew wrote:

Banned from shooting section. When you can take a grown up attitude to posting PM me and you can come back. There are ways to make a valid point without that tone and language.

Frankly, I'd rather see the ban made permanent. I'm yet to be convinced that there's enough room in here for some yahoo to be telling people they can do something so blatently illegal and unsafe. And reading over his posting history doesn't exactly bolster his case any - telling people they can bring firearms on public transport because noone will ever check, keeping involvement with target shooting hidden away like a dirty little secret, advising against having gun safes and other stuff that was just basicly daft.

Rovi

rrpc wrote:

Rew wrote:

Banned for 1 week for circumventing the bad language filters.

Sorry Rew, thought that was allowed

Doesn't seem to be working anyhow.

rrpc

Rovi wrote:

Doesn't seem to be working anyhow.

Oh, I'm sure these things take time (like licences ). In my defence (while I can still make one) I would like to point to this thread in the feedback forum.

Rew

rrpc wrote:

Oh, I'm sure these things take time (like licences ). In my defence (while I can still make one) I would like to point to this thread in the feedback forum.

I got carried away banning that I actually fogot to do the ban! Done now.

We can all post here in a civil way without resorting to hurling abuse and bad language.

slugster

My original question was hypotethical, I have lockable transport cases for all my firearms.

I wanted to find out if this issue was regfarded as an Irish solution to an Irish problem!

I think the government should make their intentions clear, when it comes to wording a firearms licence.

Think about it, some people have firearms and related licence certificates and no further knowledge of the law other than whats printed on their cert.

bunny shooter

I would like to know why anyone would want to carry a holstered pistol, hopefully unloaded, on their person in public when most of us are trying to hide the fact we even have pistols in order not to educate the criminal element, which exists in every town and village, of the fact we have them. I have heard rumours of people actually carrying pistols in holsters around town and at some of the previous country fairs, a fact well known to local Gardai if I am to believe what i've heard. Why would anyone want to cary a pistol in a holster in public ? Even hypothetically ???????? I like to know what the logic is/would be ??????

Rew

slugster wrote:

My original question was hypotethical, I have lockable transport cases for all my firearms.

I wanted to find out if this issue was regfarded as an Irish solution to an Irish problem!

I think the government should make their intentions clear, when it comes to wording a firearms licence.

Think about it, some people have firearms and related licence certificates and no further knowledge of the law other than whats printed on their cert.

There seem to be a couple of camps in this debate.

1) Lock up the guns be safe, applauled by the idea of anything but too and from the range

2) Dont lock em up but wouldn't be walking down the street so whay would I care

3) I should be allowed do what i like coz im not going to shoot anyone unless they try hurt/kill me.

The certs are out of date for the current situation, McDowell should have updated them with the CJB, or directed who ever is responsible to do it. Then again it may already be in the pipeline with the 3 year licences, hard to say.

I think this idea of throwing solicitors and barristers at everything is crazy. For a start they make enough money woith us giving them more!! solicitors and barristers should be last resort when all else fails. For a example a sure who refuses despite all resonable approches to sign certs.

Thinking you can carry it around like a gun slinger and that solicitors and barristers are going to sort it all out is only going to lead to the loss of favourable public opinion, somone in court and the govenement rushing though firearms amendments that will be very heavy and in no ones interests.

Sparks

slugster wrote:

I think the government should make their intentions clear, when it comes to wording a firearms licence.
Think about it, some people have firearms and related licence certificates and no further knowledge of the law other than whats printed on their cert.

I agree with you slugster, and rrpc has said it in the past, our firearms cert is just laughable when compared with firearms licences abroad which are proper booklets with photo id (rather like the old form of the europass), while ours look like something someone printed up on an old dot-matrix printer - and as to the practise of the local garda scribbling stuff on it to change ammunition limits... well, you can imagine how that's received in, say, germany.

The thing is, even if the form is sub-par, the onus is still on the shooter to know the regulations that apply to him or her, even if the government is not making that task easy. Ignorance of the law is not accepted in court as a defence for breaking that law!

Rew

bunny shooter wrote:

I would like to know why anyone would want to carry a holstered pistol, hopefully unloaded, on their person in public when most of us are trying to hide the fact we even have pistols in order not to educate the criminal element, which exists in every town and village, of the fact we have them. I have heard rumours of people actually carrying pistols in holsters around town and at some of the previous country fairs, a fact well known to local Gardai if I am to believe what i've heard. Why would anyone want to cary a pistol in a holster in public ? Even hypothetically ???????? I like to know what the logic is/would be ??????

I'd like to know as well. After seeing some people who werent dressed up reenactors or airsofters walking around with pistols in drop leg holsters on Saturday at Salutew it has crossed my mind were they real. Wonder did they know speacial branch were wondering around as well...

slugster

Has any clubs or associations drawn up a code of conduct / guideline regarding this?

Sparks

Several that I know of have slugster, and it amounts to "the pistol stays in the box until you're on the firing point, and it goes into the box before it comes off the firing point". I know of at least one case where a shooter was told in rather direct language that he was not welcome on a range if he was carrying his pistol in a holster, and that he was to leave immediately and not return until it was cased. And rightly so, in my honest opinion.

slugster

Everyone on this forum knows that, but if shooters are concerned about the sport in all its forms, shouldnt we be making moves to get the message out to those who dont know. That includes all licence holders not just pistol owners.