FE1 Exam Thread (Mod Warning: NO ADS)

JCJCJC

trixabelle86 wrote: »

I think this is the best letter I have ever read... I can't wait to see if in October they say we can't wear uggs... halarious. Rock up in a pair of slippers instead

You could always ring Alan Keyes and ask him just to be on the safe side....;-)

Hogzy

Exams arent even over a week and my access to moodle has been taken away. feck sake like :mad::mad::mad:

Miss_F

Hogzy wrote: »

Exams arent even over a week and my access to moodle has been taken away. feck sake like :mad::mad::mad:

I noticed it was gone the Saturday after contract if not before that, Knew it would be taken down quick but wasn't expecting it to be that quick.

Hogzy

Miss_F wrote: »

I noticed it was gone the Saturday after contract if not before that, Knew it would be taken down quick but wasn't expecting it to be that quick.

I think its a disgrace how much we pay for it and then we cant discuss the paper with the lecturers. Shows you once the exams are sat you're on your own.
Fairly unimpressed to be honest.

Charlie D

I completely agree, I really wanted to look through the material after the exams and it was too late by Saturday, disgraceful! I have generally been very dissatisfied with Griffith in any personal dealings I have had with them. The secretary in the office is plain rude. I know the course is good and all that but it is such a money racket.

colonel1

"On foot of those representations, an assurance has been given that no construction work or heavy machinery will be used at this location in the vicinity of the examination hall during any future sittings of examinations"

So it looks the red cow is going to be the FE1 venue for the forseeable future! I was in the main hotel part, near the library bar (block D and E) , and I thought it was a nice venue. Definately no odours or noises here.

colonel1

Thirdfox wrote: »

It's over!

All 8 done... now to see how many actually passed.

I'm off to bed - happy april fool's

Thanks for the explanation Brian - I knew that the those questions would concentrate mainly on the unilateral mistake side but it just bugged me that I couldn't point to a case and say for certain "this is the law" - but then maybe that's what real legal practitioning is (I'm too tired to be getting philosophical now...)


As for a contract exam issue - did anyone spot the fact that the cloakroom ticket has no effect on the proceedings in Q2? No consideration/no new contract and thus it doesn't matter if Frank looked at it or not, the sneaky question was on whether when he purchased the train ticket was there an exemption clause...sneaky! Red hand rule Denning

I thought the red hand rule meant that if an onerous exemption clause was contained in a ticket or whatever that it had to be brought to the attention of the purchaser. Hence the reference to the red hand. Mind you I made a dogs dinner of this question alas, as I couldn't recall those ticket cases perfectly. I would love if Brian Foley would put up an outline sketch of how one should have approached this question. From the wording in bold I got the impression that the examiner wanted us to discuss, incorporation by notice, exclusion clauses and capacity of a minor to contract in the answer.

dynamokev

Hi JC

Do you mind outlining the complaints you made to the Law Society regarding the venue. I could probably scroll back through the thread, but I'm really paranoid about reading something that I missed in the exams. (I have never been one for post mortems after exams and generally get straigh out of the exam hall and if I have to chat to someone, its strictly on an "Exams are off topic" basis.)

My main gripe with the venue was the fact that there was only one toilet for lads and that you could waste as much as 10 minutes queueing for the jacks. What an absolute joke. I would love to ask whoever was in charge of the logistics, how on earth did they think it would be exceptable to have only one lads toilet when there could be as many as 200 lads sitting an exam. I can't speak for the ladies but I'd say it was equally as poorly thought.

The Law Society. Profit before people.

tony28

just wondering did anyone find out about them emails from the law society regarding on line results

Dylan123

colonel1 wrote: »

"On foot of those representations, an assurance has been given that no construction work or heavy machinery will be used at this location in the vicinity of the examination hall during any future sittings of examinations"

So it looks the red cow is going to be the FE1 venue for the forseeable future! I was in the main hotel part, near the library bar (block D and E) , and I thought it was a nice venue. Definately no odours or noises here.

It has to be said some people were harping on (during property exam) outside the double doors ... i mentioned it to the invigilator stating i was sorry but i could not concentrate with them talking.. Fair play she was brilliant and resolved the issue... however from what i could see it was actually the invigilators talking... but i was just thinking..... should i really have to ask them to tell people to be quiet.... after all it costs a certain amount of money and a massive amount of time and dedication to to sit these exams... and the pass rate is higher than any other exam i have done in a diploma and degree which was 38%.. and i know a good Solicitor needs to know more than 38%..saying that most people who sat those exams will never work a day in a solicitors office in this country...there is simply not enough jobs at the moment and people go on to do different things....

I have sat about 50 exams in the last 5 years and never had to do that...
....No smells or noise apart from that small bit of talking for about 5 mins.... typical to hear that when u are reading the succession problem question...

Staying in the ibis in Dublin is a little depressing!!! nice view of the busiest interchange in the country.... lets go for a walk along the motorway...
Could they not locate the exams perhaps half way between Cork and Dublin??? Big expense for the Cork contingency..

However on a positive note, the invigilator i spoke to was brilliant..... and at least the exams were on the outskirts of Dublin....

skeenan89

Hogzy wrote: »

Exams arent even over a week and my access to moodle has been taken away. feck sake like :mad::mad::mad:

it was gone by half 3 on friday after contract! absolutely mental, couldnt even double check my answers!:mad:

Miss_F

Hogzy wrote: »

I think its a disgrace how much we pay for it and then we cant discuss the paper with the lecturers. Shows you once the exams are sat you're on your own.
Fairly unimpressed to be honest.

Agreed it would have been nice to be able to discuss the papers after the exams before been left out in the cold in the case of a repeat, which i fully intend to be doing. . .

Miss_F

Dylan123 wrote: »

It has to be said some people were harping on (during property exam) outside the double doors ... i mentioned it to the invigilator stating i was sorry but i could not concentrate with them talking.. Fair play she was brilliant and resolved the issue... however from what i could see it was actually the invigilators talking... but i was just thinking..... should i really have to ask them to tell people to be quiet.... after all it costs a certain amount of money and a massive amount of time and dedication to to sit these exams... and the pass rate is higher than any other exam i have done in a diploma and degree which was 38%.. and i know a good Solicitor needs to know more than 38%..saying that most people who sat those exams will never work a day in a solicitors office in this country...there is simply not enough jobs at the moment and people go on to do different things....

I have sat about 50 exams in the last 5 years and never had to do that...
....No smells or noise apart from that small bit of talking for about 5 mins.... typical to hear that when u are reading the succession problem question...

Staying in the ibis in Dublin is a little depressing!!! nice view of the busiest interchange in the country.... lets go for a walk along the motorway...
Could they not locate the exams perhaps half way between Cork and Dublin??? Big expense for the Cork contingency..

However on a positive note, the invigilator i spoke to was brilliant..... and at least the exams were on the outskirts of Dublin....

As it was my first time doing the exam dont no what the exam situation was like i the RDS, however I did find the new venue cold and a bit noisy , I was in the separate building with the bar, didn't get a smell thought.

Getting to the venue seemed to be a bit of hassle it you were staying elsewhere, I drove but seemed a bit of a trek if you had to walk. I was also staying in the Ibis found it a tad gloomy to say the least, was a bit noisy for study purposes. I do think the exams should be in a more central location as not everyone talking the exams live in Dublin. Why not have it in location central to the whole country? would be easier to access and cheaper regards accommodation etc

Hogzy

Miss_F wrote: »

Why not have it in location central to the whole country? would be easier to access and cheaper regards accommodation etc

I think that would be a terrible idea. The majority doing the exams are probably from Dublin. Why require EVERYONE to travel when you could reduce the amount by a huge proportion by having it in Dublin.

I cant see why they cannot host exams in all the major areas. The body in charge of accounting can do it so why not the law society? Its not that expensive to rent a conference center for two weeks if there is a demand. Cork has over 150 people doing the exams. You could easily rent two or three conference rooms in a local hotel. Having to travel to Dublin added nearly €500 to an already expensive course (griffith and the cost of doing the exams)

Charlie D

I don't think 500 would cover the cost of two weeks especially if you have exams at the start and end, if you live far away you can't just go home in between the exams or even for the weekend. I think I spent at least 700, money I really could do without spending. What about the people who just couldn't come up with that money? The FE1s are by no means a cheap affair.

sin0city

tony28 wrote: »

just wondering did anyone find out about them emails from the law society regarding on line results

I rang and they confirmed that Peter Maxwell works for the law society but they didn't know about the mail. It's from @lawsociety.ie so I think it's okay.

colonel1

sin0city wrote: »

I rang and they confirmed that Peter Maxwell works for the law society but they didn't know about the mail. It's from @lawsociety.ie so I think it's okay.

What emails? I didn't receive any email from the law society about results. I assume they will be posted as usual. I think we may get them in May this time as the application forms for the october sitting are out in May and the results usually appear before the forms!

Miss_F

Hogzy wrote: »

I think that would be a terrible idea. The majority doing the exams are probably from Dublin. Why require EVERYONE to travel when you could reduce the amount by a huge proportion by having it in Dublin.

I cant see why they cannot host exams in all the major areas. The body in charge of accounting can do it so why not the law society? Its not that expensive to rent a conference center for two weeks if there is a demand. Cork has over 150 people doing the exams. You could easily rent two or three conference rooms in a local hotel. Having to travel to Dublin added nearly €500 to an already expensive course (griffith and the cost of doing the exams)

Key word " probably" i know a large number of people not from Dublin doing the exams. An you say you spent over 500, do you not think it would only be fair if everyone incurred the same expense, cost me a lot more than that excluding griffith costs.

littlemac1980

Maybe the Maldron Hotel in Portlaoise would be better. It's central to the entire country and is just off the Motor-way.

colonel1

littlemac1980 wrote: »

Maybe the Maldron Hotel in Portlaoise would be better. It's central to the entire country and is just off the Motor-way.

How are people who are totally reliant on public transport supposed to get there? The red cow isn't the most convenient place in the world granted, but it is better than Portlaoise! By the way anyone who didn't live in the Luas Red Line area or in Dublin City centre had a tough enough time getting to the venue as well, usually involving two buses and a luas. How many people actually sat the exams in the Cork venue as a matter of interest? If the exam venue was to be moved at all, why not go back to the RDS or a city centre hotel?

littlemac1980

colonel1 wrote: »

How are people who are totally reliant on public transport supposed to get there? The red cow isn't the most convenient place in the world granted, but it is better than Portlaoise! By the way anyone who didn't live in the Luas Red Line area or in Dublin City centre had a tough enough time getting to the venue as well, usually involving two buses and a luas. How many people actually sat the exams in the Cork venue as a matter of interest? If the exam venue was to be moved at all, why not go back to the RDS or a city centre hotel?

1. I did the exams in cork. I've finished. There seemed to be 250 - 300 (approx) attending over the course of the sittings, while I was there.

2. The Maldron was presented as an example of a venue located in the centre of the country. I didn't claim it would suit people in Dublin more, that would be non-sense. I hoped I wouldn't have to explain that.

3. Bus Eireann have an hourly service from Dublin and Limerick. I'm not bothered to research the rest of the timetables, we all know that public transport is not ideal in this country, though perhaps that's more apparent to those of us not living in Dublin city and it's suburbs.

The point being made throughout the recent posts, as I understood it, was that if there is only one venue in the country, and that venue is to be in Dublin, it unfairly prejudices those applicants who don't live in Dublin, by causing them to incur significant costs for hotels and/or travel expenses, with the additional stress/worry that carries with it.

I suspect your first line :

How are people who are totally reliant on public transport supposed to get there?

echoed the concerns of many Munster & Cork-based applicants when they discovered there was to be no Cork venue.

Clearly proposing that the venue be moved from the Red Cow to the RDS or city centre fails to address that issue.

All I'm saying is that a Centrally located venue would level the playing field for all applicants by removing the advantage Dublin applicants appear to have at present. I'm not saying its a perfect solution. I'm simply adding to the discussion.

dynamokev

littlemac1980 wrote: »

1.

Clearly proposing that the venue be moved from the Red Cow to the RDS or city centre fails to address that issue.

All I'm saying is that a Centrally located venue would level the playing field for all applicants by removing the advantage Dublin applicants appear to have at present. I'm not saying its a perfect solution. I'm simply adding to the discussion.

---

In all fairness the FE1s have to be held somewhere and if there is only going to be one location, then it makes absolutely no sense to hold it anywhere but Dublin.

The vast majority of people doing these exams will be from Dublin or the commuter areas. It seems that people only want it held in Offaly or Laois or somewhere like that so that the Dublin based people incur similar expense and a similar handicap to those from Cork, Limerick, Galway etc. Why, if you come from one of those areas and would have to relocate anyway in the first place would you want to discommode and burden a far greater number of people?

The Law Society only having one venue is far from equitable, but how would changing the venue to somewhere in the midlands make things equitable. If there is only going to be one venue in Ireland, it simply has to be in Dublin. As regards its precise venue in Dublin, thats another matter altogether.

JCJCJC

I think the withdrawal of the professional practise courses from Cork is a much bigger blow for those of us in the south of the country who had a legitimate expectation of eventually becoming solicitors by studying in Cork, and on that basis embarked on degrees and the FE1s. The inconvenience of sitting exams in Dublin over a two-week period instead of Cork is minor compared to the issue of having to live in Dublin for the duration of the professional practise courses eventually, and cost and expense is one part of that inconvenience.

Just my two cents.

Miss_F

littlemac1980 wrote: »

All I'm saying is that a Centrally located venue would level the playing field for all applicants by removing the advantage Dublin applicants appear to have at present. I'm not saying its a perfect solution. I'm simply adding to the discussion.

Agreed an you echo my point and in relation to the point made about public transport as to how people would get to a central location, ah how bout the same way as we non Dub's get to Dublin!

And the Red Cow is not the best location in Dublin for it (my opinion) hard enough to get to esp with the large volume of traffic at that time in the morning think the RDS was a bit more suitable. Also why could the exams not start an hour later to allow people to get there and avoid traffic.

dynamokev

JCJCJC wrote: »

I think the withdrawal of the professional practise courses from Cork is a much bigger blow for those of us in the south of the country who had a legitimate expectation of eventually becoming solicitors by studying in Cork, and on that basis embarked on degrees and the FE1s. The inconvenience of sitting exams in Dublin over a two-week period instead of Cork is minor compared to the issue of having to live in Dublin for the duration of the professional practise courses eventually, and cost and expense is one part of that inconvenience.

Just my two cents.

Agreed. This is far from fair. But it is another example of the LS and their disregard for their future solicitors. I would love someone from the LS to give an actual breakdown of where our €110 per exam is spent on. I would love them to explain why it costs €120 to get a re-check, when it is merely 10 minutes work on the part of the examiner who will be re-checking the paper and no fees related to exam venues will be incurred here. I would love them to explain why it takes 2 months to correct exam scripts, whilst college lecturers (which most of the examiners are) can mark exam scripts and essays in one third of that time. Yes these examiners my be esteemed academics and busy people and correcting FE1s may be merely a handy nixer for them, but in any walk of life if you pay extortionately over the odds for a service, you can at least expect the service to be provided expediently and efficiently. Neither are the case with the law society.

I guess what I'm trying to say is in the words of Kevin Keegan: "I would LOVE IT, if we beat them!"

colonel1

Miss_F wrote: »

Agreed an you echo my point and in relation to the point made about public transport as to how people would get to a central location, ah how bout the same way as we non Dub's get to Dublin!

In fairness, I was thinking of people who were travelling by public transport (in rush hour) from say North County Dublin to Portlaoise on the day of the exam, which would be in my opinion a bit of a nightmare in terms of getting to the venue on time.

It would be great if the exams could start an hour later as you suggested, but I think the PP1 and 2 Exams are held in the same venue in the afternoon, which would scupper that idea alas.

littlemac1980

dynamokev wrote: »

---

The Law Society only having one venue is far from equitable, but how would changing the venue to somewhere in the midlands make things equitable.

You appear to be confusing what is practical with what is equitable.

I fully agree that from a practical point of view Dublin makes most sense as the chosen venue within the country. As you correctly point out, most applicants are from, or in the vicinity of Dublin. One can legitimately make that assumption based on relative densities of population.

Choosing a venue based on practical considerations would make sense for many types of activities, e.g. concerts, international sporting events etc.

However it doesn't seem right that the same considerations should apply when choosing an exam venue. Exams are by their nature intended to be objective, and therefore it is essential that everyone is treated equally.

By choosing a venue which facilitates the greatest proportion of people, you
are not making an equitable decision, you are making a practical decision. Those in the minority are not treated fairly by that decision. An equitable decision would treat all fairly.

As I've pointed out already, I have finished these exams, and did so at the Cork sittings. As such I hope mine is an objective and independent opinion, I have no vested interest in where the exams are held, but I can't help empathizing with those applicants from outside the Dublin area.

We are all, I'm sure, very much aware how difficult and stressful these exams are. Not being from Dublin myself, if I had to travel there and stay over in a hotel - without all my books, my notes, (aside from the fact I wouldn't fit them all in a suitcase and manage to carry them onto a train, I would be sure to forget something), my reliable internet, my Mother's cooking, etc. I would think that would add to my worry and stress. Being able to return home after an exam is a major benefit, considerations of additional costs etc. aside.

JCJCJC

dynamokev wrote: »

Agreed. This is far from fair. But it is another example of the LS and their disregard for their future solicitors. I would love someone from the LS to give an actual breakdown of where our €110 per exam is spent on. I would love them to explain why it costs €120 to get a re-check, when it is merely 10 minutes work on the part of the examiner who will be re-checking the paper and no fees related to exam venues will be incurred here. I would love them to explain why it takes 2 months to correct exam scripts, whilst college lecturers (which most of the examiners are) can mark exam scripts and essays in one third of that time. ,,,

On the 120 quid - our examiners are mostly barristers. Barristers don't do much for 120 yoyos these days.

Miss_F

colonel1 wrote: »

In fairness, I was thinking of people who were travelling by public transport (in rush hour) from say North County Dublin to Portlaoise on the day of the exam, which would be in my opinion a bit of a nightmare in terms of getting to the venue on time.
.

Fair enough but people from down the country have the same issue when travelling to the exams in Dublin and also have the added disadvantage of not knowing the place an trying to get around.

Dont not if the PPC1 or 2 are on in the afternoon.

frustratedTC

Just wondering if any1 knows with regards to Q1 of contract whether eoin validly revoked his offer with carrie at the auction?