Advice Please

mallet head

hi all


I am lucky enough to be in a position to buy a new car in January and dont know what to buy.


I will have about 22.000 euros and an 01 octavia for trade.


I am looking at

new mondeo

Avensis

Quahqai.


Is there any other decent cars out there in this price bracket? If not which one of the above would you recommend? I know nothing about cars so any advice would be welcome.

antodeco

What are looking for in a car?

Im not a fan of the new mondeo, and the qashqui will be VERY difficult to get. They are two very different "cars". Avensis is a good car, but again im not a huge fan. If Im being honest, get yourself a higher class '06 car. The depreciation will be off them, so you can get a much better deal. IN reality you have around 28k to spend (dependant on the octavia). Based on your mentioned cars, why not something like an 06 accord, 06 focus st or even a hyundai tucson, based on your desire for a bigger car.

mallet head

antodeco wrote:

What are looking for in a car?

Im not a fan of the new mondeo, and the qashqui will be VERY difficult to get. They are two very different "cars". Avensis is a good car, but again im not a huge fan. If Im being honest, get yourself a higher class '06 car. The depreciation will be off them, so you can get a much better deal. IN reality you have around 28k to spend (dependant on the octavia). Based on your mentioned cars, why not something like an 06 accord, 06 focus st or even a hyundai tucson, based on your desire for a bigger car.

thanks for the reply.


I am hoping to get somthing that will give a bit of room as i have two kids 8 and 4. I am more than happy with the size of the octavia but want a change. I bought the octavia new and dont want another because in 6 years time it will feel like I have been driving the same car for 12 years. What ever i buy will have to do me for 6 or so years so i dont really want to go second hand.

Why do you say the quahqui will be VERY hard to get? Is there huge advanced orders?

antodeco

mallet head wrote:

thanks for the reply.


I am hoping to get somthing that will give a bit of room as i have two kids 8 and 4. I am more than happy with the size of the octavia but want a change. I bought the octavia new and dont want another because in 6 years time it will feel like I have been driving the same car for 12 years. What ever i buy will have to do me for 6 or so years so i dont really want to go second hand.

Why do you say the quahqui will be VERY hard to get? Is there huge advanced orders?

Quashqui isint meant to be back in until next year, with something like 6 months worth of pre-ordering already for the new year! The accord is a nice big car. Have a look at an ex demo model even. Did you think about the passat or even a hyundai sonata?

mallet head

antodeco wrote:

The accord is a nice big car. Have a look at an ex demo model even. Did you think about the passat or even a hyundai sonata?

I haven't looked at anything to be honest. I posted here to find out what the pros think before i start looking. If I was to go ex-demo what type of saving am i looking at and are they easy to come by?

antodeco

mallet head wrote:

I haven't looked at anything to be honest. I posted here to find out what the pros think before i start looking. If I was to go ex-demo what type of saving am i looking at and are they easy to come by?

Ex demo are rare enough, but if you enquire theres no harm. You should save urself around 5-10% of the usual price. More importantly, demo models are generally higher spec.

bazz26

I would hold off from buying a 2008 model Honda Accord and Toyota Avensis. Both models have been around since 2003 and due to be replaced by a new model sometime next year. This will have a major impact on depreciation.

Unless you absolutley have to have a 2008 car you pick yourself up a nice low mileage 2007 model which someone else will have already suffered the initial depreciation.

Eg: http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=776757
http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=775638

OP, you don't mention engine size but seeing as you are considering an Accord I presume you are looking at anything up to 2.0 litre. To be honest I would hold off for the time being if looking at 2.0 litre or greater cars as there looks like there going to be a shake up of the VRT and motor tax system at the end of year. This more than likely may have a negative impact on larger engined cars.

mallet head

bazz26 wrote:

I would hold off from buying a 2008 model Honda Accord and Toyota Avensis. Both models have been around since 2003 and due to be replaced by a new model sometime next year. This will have a major impact on depreciation.

Unless you absolutley have to have a 2008 car you pick yourself up a nice low mileage 2007 model which someone else will have already suffered the initial depreciation.

Eg: http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=776757
http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=775638

OP, you don't mention engine size but seeing as you are considering an Accord I presume you are looking at anything up to 2.0 litre. To be honest I would hold off for the time being if looking at 2.0 litre or greater cars as there looks like there going to be a shake up of the VRT and motor tax system at the end of year. This more than likely may have a negative impact on larger engined cars.

I may have an angle on getting a passat 08 at reduced rate but I will be looking for a 1.6 will that be hit with the tax changes? i.e if the larger motors are going to be hit will the Dealers price gouge on the models just under any tax rise?

colm_mcm

Haven't heard anything on a new model Avensis for next year, it should have a minimum 6 year cycle.

Henry Ford III

antodeco wrote:

...Im not a fan of the new mondeo...

Rather sweeping statement that. Any justification or backup?

BostonB

Henry Ford III wrote:

Rather sweeping statement that. Any justification or backup?

IMO it looks very bland.

Henry Ford III

Can't satisfy everyone I guess.

BostonB

So I hear. Its just not a looker. IMO. At least not the ones I've seen thus far. Preferred the look old one, which while conservative, was at least well proportioned. The Passat for all its faults is a nicer looking car, and I prefer the look of the Passats interior. I'm not in the market for either myself. But if was buying I don't think you could decide till you had a good drive in any of them. Sometimes you find something you just can't live with.

bazz26

colm_mcm wrote:

Haven't heard anything on a new model Avensis for next year, it should have a minimum 6 year cycle.

Most Toyota models have a 5 year life cycle don't they? The current one is 5 years old next March. I cannot see them getting 6 years out of it to be honest unless they start kitting it out with lots of toys as standard which is doubtful.

Also one of the Toyota Owners Club forum members who apparently works for Mr T hinted at an Autumn 2008 launch and alledged spy shots have been doing the rounds. With most competitors having newer fresher models on the market between now and then it is going to find it tough going. New car is apparently not that smaller in size to the now dead Camry.

colm_mcm

6 years is usually the norm. usually 3 years, then a facelift, then another 3 years.

Carina E launched in 1991, finished up in 1997.
Avensis started in 1997 and finished in 2003.
Rav4 started in 2000 and ended in 2006.
Yaris launched in 1999 and finished up in 2005

Exception being last 2 Corollas which weren't launched as early in Europe.


This from good old Auto Express!

Our spies caught this latest prototype undergoing testing in Germany - and beneath the disguise lurks a much better looking machine than the current model.

Disappointed with the sales of that car, Toyota bosses have replaced its bland body with a sleeker shape. The nose is low and the tail high, producing an athletic stance, while detailing such as the faired-in headlights, wide grille and sweeping profile endows it with much more road presence.

The new Avensis is facing a tough fight in the family car class, with new*comers such as the Ford Mondeo, Vauxhall's forthcoming Vectra replace- ment and the next Honda Accord, so Toyota has given it an all-new front-wheel-drive chassis.

This fresh platform will see an increase in wheelbase and overall dimensions, ensuring that more space is freed up inside for occupants and their luggage. Cabin quality will also be significantly improved.

Hatchback, saloon and estate models will all be available, while petrol and diesel engines from the existing car's line-up will be used. Six-speed manual and automatic gearboxes will be available. There is also the possibility of a hybrid unit, using a 1.8-litre 'lean-burn' petrol engine. The car hits UK showrooms next year, with prices starting from just under £16,000.

this was their "spy shot"



Or the Corolla, as we call it.


It may be a test mule for a new model Avensis, but I doubt it.

mallet head

LIGHTNING wrote:

if your not a badge snob I recommend a look.

Certainly not. When I bought my octavia in 01 my mates slagged, now 3 of them drive a skoda.


Thanks for all the advice lads.

bazz26

I'd agree the new Mondeo is no oil painting but a major improvement on the previous design. Interior is nice (on the Zetec up models anyway) but the manual heater dials on the basic LX model look out of place and suggest a budget restriction after thought. Not gone on the black exterior door handles either and the 16" wheels look lost under the large wheel arches. Also a small bit of chrome trim on the side strips or bumpers would give the car a bit more upmarket look too imo.

Regarding the performance of the 1.6 litre while it may be acceptable it is the fuel consumption where the difference will be seen. The 1.6 will need to work hard to push the heavy body around and as such fuel consumption will suffer. A 1.8 litre petrol engine is offered would probably consume the same amount of fuel as it doesn't have to work as hard. Of course Ireland been what it is the 1.6 litre will sell by the bucket load.

To the OP would you consider the Mazda 6? The all new model is due early next year and photos so far suggest it is going to be a pretty good car by all accounts. Should definately be a contender.

mallet head

bazz26 wrote:

To the OP would you consider the Mazda 6? The all new model is due early next year and photos so far suggest it is going to be a pretty good car by all accounts. Should definately be a contender.

Mazda never even crossed my mind. I'll check it out, thanks.

Henry Ford III

I'm amazed by people who will make a judgement call on a new vehicles overall abilities purely on looks.

Each to their own I guess.

bazz26

Henry Ford III wrote:

I'm amazed by people who will make a judgement call on a new vehicles overall abilities purely on looks.

Each to their own I guess.

About the same as judging a car by reading an article on the internet. Or is judging a book by it's cover only reserved for Toyotas?

bazz26

LIGHTNING wrote:

I had a look at the Mazda 6, it only comes in a 1.8 petrol or above. Its spec list isn't great you have to go for the executive model to get the good stuff like cruise etc. However the interior is quite nice as is the car itself.

Current Mazda 6 is around since 2002. There is an all new Mazda 6 on sale early next year. The OP is looking at buying a brand new 2008 car so that would rule the current model out in any case.

bazz26

LIGHTNING wrote:

I hadn't realized it has been out since 2002 it still looks quite a modern design. I was recommending it to my folks but my dad has a problem with any engine over a 1.6 like a lot of Irish people!

Indeed the exterior has aged well but I'm not so sure about the interior, the photos of the new one so far are quite impressive. The front has a similar profile to the RX-8.

Yep 1.6 litre will always sell well in Ireland but imo cars of this size with 1.6 litre engines which are growing bigger and gaining weight with every new generation, are a false economy as the engine has to work harder to achieve the performance. A 1.8 litre will have less hard work to and hence be just as economical as a 1.6 litre yet only costs an extra €70 or €80 more in tax over 12 months. But I can understand that for alot of people 1.6 litre is sufficent enough for them.

Henry Ford III

bazz26 wrote:

About the same as judging a car by reading an article on the internet...

What is your seemingly encylcopaediac knowledge of the car market, and pros and cons of all makes and marques based of bazz? You seem to have something to say on everything :rolleyes:

E92

LIGHTNING wrote:

I hadn't realized it has been out since 2002 it still looks quite a modern design. I was recommending it to my folks but my dad has a problem with any engine over a 1.6 like a lot of Irish people!

Hopefully with the VRT changes due to come in, the 'anything bigger than the smallest and least powerful possible petrol engine' phobia that exists presently will vanish.

prospect

OP,

The Qashqai is significantly smaller than the octavia, the boot is smaller than your average hatchback.

bazz26

Henry Ford III wrote:

What is your seemingly encylcopaediac knowledge of the car market, and pros and cons of all makes and marques based of bazz? You seem to have something to say on everything :rolleyes:

Henry I'm not going to get into argument on a public forum as it really spoils the thread and it's not worth it. But lets be fair here, you have a little dig at some people for judging the new Mondeo on looks alone rather than the whole package. I'm not gone on the looks of the new Mondeo (as I already posted) but I have recommended the car to people on here on more than one occasion as I still know that the Mondeo is a good car. But in another thread you disgarde the Auris based on an article in a UK tabloid car magazine despite probably never even sitting in one. So the argument is the same in my book, judge the car on the whole package not just one thing.

I think we will leave it at that.

mallet head

prospect wrote:

OP,

The Qashqai is significantly smaller than the octavia, the boot is smaller than your average hatchback.

Just today I found that out.So I have now ruled the Qashqai out. My favourite at the minute is look for an early 08 ex-demo 1.6 mondeo. tho that will change no doubt.

Just on the 1.8 debate that was going on earlier its hardly a false economy to buy the 1.6 when you factor in the fact that a 1.8 mondeo is over two and a half grand dearer in the zetec model. that a lot of fuel burn.

Thanks for all the debate lads I know a hell of a lot more now than I did sunday.

E92

mallet head wrote:

Just today I found that out.So I have now ruled the Qashqai out. My favourite at the minute is look for an early 08 ex-demo 1.6 mondeo. tho that will change no doubt.

Just on the 1.8 debate that was going on earlier its hardly a false economy to buy the 1.6 when you factor in the fact that a 1.8 mondeo is over two and a half grand dearer in the zetec model. that a lot of fuel burn.

The 1.8 is Diesel, it does 49 mpg average, the 1.6 averages 39 mpg. OP I think you would be a lot better off to wait and see what they do with VRT.

LIGHTNING wrote:

I have heard a few rumours about this, has anybody got any ideas on whats going to change?

The diesel will quite likely be cheaper, as it is meant to be exclusively on CO2 emissions(though knowing the Government there will be surprises), and chances are that Petrols, including the 1.6 will become dearer. They are also going to change motor tax to CO2 emissions, so the additional cost at present lumped onto the diesel because of its engine size should be gone.

colm_mcm

I've driven the 1.8 diesel, and it's quite good for it's size. I reckon you should get at least 1/2 of the cost of the diesel engine back on a trade in after 3 years. LX spec is yucky though, heating controls in particular (as stated above) they look as out of place as the ones on my old 00 146 did. (obviously a cost cutting afterthought alternative to climate control)

what_car

mallet head wrote:

hi all


I am lucky enough to be in a position to buy a new car in January and dont know what to buy.


I will have about 22.000 euros and an 01 octavia for trade.


I am looking at

new mondeo

Avensis

Quahqai.


Is there any other decent cars out there in this price bracket? If not which one of the above would you recommend? I know nothing about cars so any advice would be welcome.

hi there, since I see that you wish to hold onto the car for 6 years, firstly i would go japanese (built) for reliability, and build quality.

most jap cars have a 3 year warranty, and roadside assistance. i have owned lots of new toyotas and never had really any problems, the avensis is a good car and the new diesel with the 6 speed box is nice and economical.
however as people have said, they are reliable but horribly boring...

anyways i changed to honda and got a new accord, and the build quality is much better than the avensis. i doubt that what bazz26 says re the depreciation, on the current accord model... the new accord release is a good bit away yet and even then for the first while supplies will be tight..

you can get a nice demo accord with low mileage and good spec , the accord holds its value well and is well known for its reliability... the accord drives much better than the avensis,, and looks way better...:D

either way, if i was buying a car to hold on to for 6 years , i would get
1. accord:cool: built in Japan ( and you can really notice the difference compared to a toyota)
2. avensis 2.0d4d
3. mazda...

what_car

:eek:

bazz26 wrote:

I would hold off from buying a 2008 model Honda Accord and Toyota Avensis. Both models have been around since 2003 and due to be replaced by a new model sometime next year. This will have a major impact on depreciation.

Unless you absolutley have to have a 2008 car you pick yourself up a nice low mileage 2007 model which someone else will have already suffered the initial depreciation.

Eg: http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=776757
http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=775638

OP, you don't mention engine size but seeing as you are considering an Accord I presume you are looking at anything up to 2.0 litre. To be honest I would hold off for the time being if looking at 2.0 litre or greater cars as there looks like there going to be a shake up of the VRT and motor tax system at the end of year. This more than likely may have a negative impact on larger engined cars.

bazz the introduction of the new accord wont affect the value of the current accord that much.. it will take a while for supplies of the new accord to arrive and for second hand models to appear for sale...


second hand accords sell well.. there are 45 accords from 06-07 on carzone.

there are 211 avensis on carzone from 06-07 ! erm more choice, so lower prices more depreciation.