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Account Suspended?

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    #32
    smemon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,467 ✭✭✭smemon


    jhegarty wrote: »
    If it's true it can't be slanderous... but I would be 99% it's a breach of data protection act to publish that someone has not paid their bill...

    But it wouldn't say 'this guy hasn't paid his bill' - it would just be 'account suspended' which imo is perfectly fair.

    Most hosting and domains are paid with paypal or a CC and relatively long term ~1 year +.

    During that time there's a good chance the CC will have expired, paypal will have closed or be empty etc...


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    #33
    jhegarty
    Registered Users Posts: 6,440 ✭✭✭jhegarty


    but kbannon said it was similar to the op which was "This account has been suspended for non-payment"


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    #34
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,893 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    jhegarty wrote: »
    If it's true it can't be slanderous... but I would be 99% it's a breach of data protection act to publish that someone has not paid their bill...
    How would it breach data protection? it doesn't name anyone - it simply states that the account was suspended for non payment.


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    #35
    jhegarty
    Registered Users Posts: 6,440 ✭✭✭jhegarty


    kbannon wrote: »
    How would it breach data protection? it doesn't name anyone - it simply states that the account was suspended for non payment.

    I presume the domain names identifies the client, or does through google cache of the site


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    #36
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,893 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    CoNfOuNd wrote: »
    Did they make payments in previous years? Did they agree to T&Cs when they signed up?
    Payment was supposedly up front but although domain was renewed, they didn't pay so eventually the a/c was altered as I already mentioned. It wasn't an automatic renewal type thing - more of a "I'll send you the invoice" type arrangement as per previous years.


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    #37
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,893 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    jhegarty wrote: »
    I presume the domain names identifies the client, or does through google cache of the site
    Yes to both


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    #38
    jhegarty
    Registered Users Posts: 6,440 ✭✭✭jhegarty


    kbannon wrote: »
    Yes to both

    Is the client a company of person ?

    I am not 100% sure on the rules for a ltd company , but for a person you would be in breach


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    #39
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,893 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Its a company


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    #40
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    jhegarty wrote: »
    If it's true it can't be slanderous... but I would be 99% it's a breach of data protection act to publish that someone has not paid their bill...

    wrong. If it's true you can still be sued for slanderous comments just not libel.


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    #41
    mneylon
    Registered Users Posts: 7,739 ✭✭✭mneylon


    Slander and Libel are pretty much the same thing:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slander_and_libel

    It has to be untrue. If it's true I don't see how it could be slander or libel

    Blog | Tweets



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    #42
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    what I meant was according to the Irish Statute book and the Defamation Act 1961 they are named seperately as in to libel someone is .... and to slander someone is ......


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    #43
    regi
    Registered Users Posts: 3,279 ✭✭✭regi


    Just because someone's embarrassed doesn't automatically mean that its libel or slander :-)


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    #44
    EKRIUQ
    Registered Users Posts: 4,386 ✭✭✭EKRIUQ


    I think on a business sense just putting the words This account has been suspended should suffice and tell them its an automated thing with your servers when they ring. Some people are just slow payers. You may of had a chance of getting your €1,200 then but now you've just incurred an angry customer who will do their best not to pay you as well as bad will and future work.

    Here's a couple of examples I've seen

    http://www.theemeraldgroup.ie/index.html

    http://gsinaturalwoodflooring.com/

    Here's a link to thread regarding PC Worlds site, if they can do it to them I sure you could do it to you client

    http://www.askaboutmoney.com/showthread.php?t=71167


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    #45
    mneylon
    Registered Users Posts: 7,739 ✭✭✭mneylon


    regi wrote: »
    Just because someone's embarrassed doesn't automatically mean that its libel or slander :-)
    Exactly

    Unfortunately a lot of Irish companies seem to think that they are the same thing

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    #46
    Sully
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 24,056 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sully


    Why do people think that hosting providers should not suspend a clients website if they dont pay their bill? If a good bit of notice has been given that a bill is due on X date, and the client doesnt pay - do you expect the host to sit around waiting for the client to pay when he feels like it?

    You wouldnt be able to get a car and not pay for it. You cant go into a shop, buy a product and pay when you feel like it. Im sure the ESB would suspend your account if you didnt pay also.


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    #47
    mneylon
    Registered Users Posts: 7,739 ✭✭✭mneylon


    miju wrote: »
    what I meant was according to the Irish Statute book and the Defamation Act 1961 they are named seperately as in to libel someone is .... and to slander someone is ......
    The difference is due to the method.
    One is written whereas the other is verbal

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    #48
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,893 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Sully wrote: »
    Why do people think that hosting providers should not suspend a clients website if they dont pay their bill? If a good bit of notice has been given that a bill is due on X date, and the client doesnt pay - do you expect the host to sit around waiting for the client to pay when he feels like it?

    You wouldnt be able to get a car and not pay for it. You cant go into a shop, buy a product and pay when you feel like it. Im sure the ESB would suspend your account if you didnt pay also.
    I suppose the difference between a website and the ESB is that the ESB just cut you off but in many ways, nobody else knows. When a site is pulled for non payment, does the host/developer/whoever have the right to display a message like the OPs/mine?


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    #49
    PixelTrawler
    Registered Users Posts: 2,299 ✭✭✭PixelTrawler


    I dont think its a right or wrong issue, but is it proper conduct on your part?
    Even if you have the right, should you?
    Lets face it, the message was designed to embarrass them publicly into payment. It would have been better to put a message up such as "Site Inactive" and give no reason whats the matter (I 100% understand your frustration though)

    On the other hand, €1200 compensation per day:eek:... tell them to try, theres no way they'd get it (after all they were the ones making non-payment). Thats crazy. (Bear in mind I have zero legal expertise!)

    Either way your business relationship is now in the toilet and the best course of action now is to terminate it as prudently as possible. Agree a compromise that you will assist them to find their own hosting provider, and say you'll work with any future developer to transition code etc and offload it. You are better off without them

    Lets face it, they had no intention of paying, so why hang on to them?

    Best of luck with it.

    If need be seek legal advice...


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    #50
    jhegarty
    Registered Users Posts: 6,440 ✭✭✭jhegarty


    Sully wrote: »
    Why do people think that hosting providers should not suspend a clients website if they dont pay their bill? If a good bit of notice has been given that a bill is due on X date, and the client doesnt pay - do you expect the host to sit around waiting for the client to pay when he feels like it?

    You wouldnt be able to get a car and not pay for it. You cant go into a shop, buy a product and pay when you feel like it. Im sure the ESB would suspend your account if you didnt pay also.

    This isn't the esb cutting you off , it's the esb cutting you off and hanging a large sign on the pole outside your house telling people they cut you off for not paying the bill


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    #51
    Kila
    Registered Users Posts: 436 ✭✭Kila


    Namesco wrote: »
    Some people are just slow payers. You may of had a chance of getting your €1,200 then but now you've just incurred an angry customer who will do their best not to pay you as well as bad will and future work.

    I used to work in a small company that had problems with debt collection (i.e. people not paying us, and the company being too scared to chase the debts), and the "slow payers" argument was used then too. To be honest, I think it's a really flawed argument.

    Some people may just be "slow payers" but they have no right to be. If a bill is due, it's due. You can't just put it off a few months because you can't be bothered, or because it suits you better. The only reason people get away with being slow payers is because people just let them away with it, because in Ireland, people seem to think it's ok to owe people money for months on end, and dodge the bullet every time an invoice is sent.

    I think it's ludicrous that companies have to walk on eggshells around people who owe them money for a service they've provided, when it should really be the other way around! If someone owes you money, they owe you money, and it's a joke that you can't pursue collection of it for fear of upsetting the debtor in case they don't pay.


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    #52
    mealone42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 38 ✭mealone42


    ChicoMendez wrote: »
    i have been dealing with a client for about 3 years now - which is abotu to come to an end thank god! and i did the exact same to them 2 days ago

    why - they have repeatedly refused to pay invoices on time and are regularly 8 months late - i told them i was cutting the site on aug 15th and they did not even have the curtosy to reply - however when i have thier site down (tens of thousands of hits per week) with ' this company does not pay thier invoices '- it does not take them long to get the finger out !

    im not saying it was right for your provider to cut your services but in certain circumstances its the only way to go!
    If I was that "client" of yours, I would sue the ass off you. How dare you say that they don't pay thier (Sic) invoices. The only thing you know is that they did not pay yours. Maybe you did not give good service or some other reason? Will you please state the name of your business, so that people will not use your services? I for one would not use the services of a business with that attitude.


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    #53
    Darragh29
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,097 ✭✭✭Darragh29


    Here's someone who has had some well documented money problems not too long ago and her hosting company was a bit more diplomatic about it...

    http://www.officialjadegoody.co.uk/


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    #54
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,893 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    mealone42 wrote: »
    If I was that "client" of yours, I would sue the ass off you. How dare you say that they don't pay thier (Sic) invoices. The only thing you know is that they did not pay yours. Maybe you did not give good service or some other reason? Will you please state the name of your business, so that people will not use your services? I for one would not use the services of a business with that attitude.
    My understanding of it is quite different from yours - I read it that the client would not pay the invoices sent by ChicoMendez


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    #55
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    kbannon wrote: »
    My understanding of it is quite different from yours - I read it that the client would not pay the invoices sent by ChicoMendez

    that was my reading of it also


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    #56
    misterq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 382 ✭✭misterq


    My philosophy on clients that don't pay, and I've had a few scuffles, is that life is too short. Unless the amount involved is worth pursuing in the courts, you are only throwing good money after bad by pursuing it further.

    As for sticking a notice up on their site. I think this is just inviting more trouble for yourself. Getting into public naming and shaming contests might throw some mud on the fecker who didn't pay up, but some of the mud will stick to you too.

    Have you ever seen two people fighting in the street? Perhaps one of them is perfectly in the right and only defending them self, but the impression most people get is that it is two thugs having a scrap....

    When I was doing hosting, accounts gone over their 5 warning emails and follow up call would eventually see an "account inactive" holding page. This was fairly benign and made no mention of monies outstanding, yet I still got my ear chewed off on more than one occasion even for that!


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