Slovakia vs Ireland

Anto McC · 09-09-2007 12:54pm

The "Irish" international team ceased being Irish when Jack Charlton became manager. Yeah we weren't great but at least we could be proud and never have to question the commitment of the people wearing the jersey. We sold our soul (or nationality) for success that has never came.
In recent times under Stan it has almost come full circle, a good portion of our team is made up of players who weren't good enough to play for their home nation and we're still sh*t.

How can anyone feel a team that contains Clinton Morrison, Sean St Ledger, Aiden McGeady and such is representitive of Ireland is beyond me.
Was it Sean St Ledger or Jay Tabb who had to get a quick fix Iriah passport, signed off by the Minister for Foreign Affairs, in order to play for us when he was first called up?

Guy:Incognito · 09-09-2007 1:05pm

Anto McC wrote:

The "Irish" international team ceased being Irish when Jack Charlton became manager. Yeah we weren't great but at least we could be proud and never have to question the commitment of the people wearing the jersey. We sold our soul (or nationality) for success that has never came.
In recent times under Stan it has almost come full circle, a good portion of our team is made up of players who weren't good enough to play for their home nation and we're still sh*t.

Thats rubbish. International football on a whole has been on a downward spiral of importance for a long time. Club football is where its at and players know that. It may be on a sub concious level and not for all players but at the end of the day the club that pays you £100,000 a week (or any wage thats putting food on you and your families table) is what rules.

On the McGeady issue, he hardly chose Ireland because his "home nation" was a top ranked team he hadnt a hope of getting capped in, pushing to win tournaments . Theres **** all difference between Ireland and Scotland (current form is just that) so hemost likely would have gotten as many caps for Scotland.It was obviously a heart decision.

Brian Capture · 09-09-2007 1:06pm

Four points gained from last night's draw and a win over the Czech Repubic is better than a win last night and a draw against the Czechs - because of the head-to-head record with the Czechs that could be important if we finish up level on points.

Anto McC · 09-09-2007 1:14pm

Stekelly wrote:

On the McGeady issue, he hardly chose Ireland because his "home nation" was a top ranked team he hadnt a hope of getting capped in, pushing to win tournaments . Theres **** all difference between Ireland and Scotland (current form is just that) so hemost likely would have gotten as many caps for Scotland.It was obviously a heart decision.

McGeady is the exception to the rule but my post was already long enough and i didn't really want to go into detail on it. I will do now however. At the time of his decision to declare internationally, Ireland were a much stronger team than Scotland, i believe Bertie Vogts was Scottish manager at the time. I believe he choose Ireland over Scotland because Ireland were better. He said he loved Ireland because he spent a few summers here, it's hardly a good reason to declare for Ireland. I mean he lived his whole life in Scotland and is after all Scottish.

_blank_ · 09-09-2007 1:19pm

Brian Capture wrote:

Four points gained from last night's draw and a win over the Czech Repubic is better than a win last night and a draw against the Czechs - because of the head-to-head record with the Czechs that could be important if we finish up level on points.

Only thing is, Ireland will not beat the Czechs.

What has the manager shown you to make you believe they will?

Bizarre team selection has not stopped.

The players being picked aren't up to it, show no heart or desire to wear the jersey.

What makes people think Stan will have some miracle vision in the next couple of days?

Seriously?

PauloMN wrote:

What are "jersies" anyway? I know what jerseys are, never come across those jersies though.

You know, picking people up on their spelling is the lowest of the low. You know exactly what was meant, yet still go off on some petty pedantic rant?

Really, what was the point?

A Dub in Glasgo · 09-09-2007 1:21pm

Anto McC wrote:

McGeady is the exception to the rule but my post was already long enough and i didn't really want to go into detail on it. I will do now however. At the time of his decision to declare internationally, Ireland were a much stronger team than Scotland, i believe Bertie Vogts was Scottish manager at the time. I believe he choose Ireland over Scotland because Ireland were better. He said he loved Ireland because he spent a few summers here, it's hardly a good reason to declare for Ireland. I mean he lived his whole life in Scotland and is after all Scottish.

The best course of action when posting on a forum is to educate yourself as much as possible on a subject before posting ****e. At least is can be informed ****e rather than ignorant ****e.

Anto McC · 09-09-2007 1:22pm

So inform me then?

LuckyLloyd · 09-09-2007 1:25pm

DesF wrote:

Glasgow, Manchester, Liverpool, London, Birmingham.

All in Britain. All as Irish as Aran Jumpers, Foster and Allen and a pint o' plain,

You're missing my point. No - one has a monopoly on what true Irishness is or how it is correct to express one's Irishness. I wouldn't wear a Celtic jersey, but that's just me!! If someone travels to Slovakia to see Ireland play and screams them on like a madman they can wear whatever the fcuk they want. It's just a jersey!!

Let them wear what they want. It shouldn't bother anyone.

Anto McC · 09-09-2007 1:28pm

Would you go to support lets say, Chelsea while wearing a Liverpool jersey?

PauloMN · 09-09-2007 1:28pm

Anto McC wrote:

So inform me then?

Read this.

Celtic took Aiden on their books when he was 14, training three nights a week and playing at weekends while he continued to attend school. Like several top Premiership clubs, Celtic insisted that their trainees didn’t play schools football and the seeds of McGeady’s involvement with Ireland were then sown. The Scottish Schools FA insisted that players representing their under-age sides play schools football and McGeady fell through the net as a result.

“When I was 15 I wanted to play for Scotland but I couldn’t,” McGeady says. “Then Packie Bonner phoned and asked me to go over training with Ireland and I thought, ‘What’s the harm in that?’ I did quite well and got asked back and got to know the system really well and the boys. When I broke into the first team at Celtic there was all the drama about why I had picked Ireland rather than Scotland, but I already knew the set-up and wasn’t going to change my mind.” This despite the fact that Scotland once named him in a squad for an under-17s match against Northern Ireland and Berti Vogts, then the Scotland manager, invited Aiden and his father into a meeting at his office in Hampden Park.

“I felt we should attend out of courtesy,” John says. “He said, ‘Play for Scotland, stay at home, don’t play for a foreign nation,’ which I found somewhat ironic coming from a German in charge of the Scottish international team. Don’t get me wrong, he was a nice guy, but Aiden was always going to play for Ireland.”

Others in Scotland weren’t quite so nice about it. While the Celtic captain Neil Lennon has received far worse abuse, McGeady has been routinely booed at several away grounds since he made his Celtic debut. And sections of the Scottish media refuse to let the issue lie.

Taken from here:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/article650086.ece?token=null&offset=0

_blank_ · 09-09-2007 1:29pm

LuckyLloyd wrote:

No - one has a monopoly on what true Irishness is

But people claiming a team from Glasgow is somehow Irish is bizarre, no?

PauloMN · 09-09-2007 1:31pm

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

The best course of action when posting on a forum is to educate yourself as much as possible on a subject before posting ****e. At least is can be informed ****e rather than ignorant ****e.

Oh and well said to that. Celtic fans not only have to put up with ignorance from some deluded Rangers fans and the media, but also Irish fans who have a problem (for some reason) with Celtic FC and its fanbase. It's so friggin' boring at this stage.

_blank_ · 09-09-2007 1:32pm

Aidan McGeady wrote:

“When I was 15 I wanted to play for Scotland but I couldn’t,” McGeady says.

His father wrote:

Aiden was always going to play for Ireland

Which is it?

Anto McC · 09-09-2007 1:32pm

So i'm wrong on McGeady and i hold my hands up. He is Scottish but i can quite understand how he ended up playing for Ireland. Anyone want to inform me on Morrison, Sean St Ledger, Jay Tabb, John Alridge, Ray Hougtan, Tony Cascarino etc?

_blank_ · 09-09-2007 1:33pm

Anto McC wrote:

Tony Casarino

rofl

PauloMN · 09-09-2007 1:38pm

DesF wrote:

Which is it?

Just how confused are you? His father said that AFTER he had gotten to know the Ireland setup and AFTER he couldn't play for Scotland youths.

Jeez, it's like a ****ing nursery in here at times. :rolleyes:

_blank_ · 09-09-2007 1:39pm

PauloMN wrote:

Just how confused are you? His father said that AFTER he had gotten to know the Ireland setup and AFTER he couldn't play for Scotland youths.

It doesn't say that in the piece you posted actually.

His father said ALWAYS. Does that word have some new meaning of which I am unaware?

PauloMN wrote:

Jeez, it's like a ****ing nursery in here at times. :rolleyes:

You'd want to cool it with the abuse pal.

PauloMN · 09-09-2007 1:44pm

DesF wrote:

It doesn't say that in the piece you posted actually.

His father said ALWAYS. Does that word have some new meaning of which I am unaware?

You'd want to cool it with the abuse pal.

He visited Bertie V after they had agreed he'd play for Ireland. It couldn't be any clearer.

Abuse? Pal? LOL

Relax FFS, you've obviously never been at a football ground if you think that's abuse.

Anto McC · 09-09-2007 1:45pm

PauloMN wrote:

you've obviously never been at a football ground if you think that's abuse.

I bet he's seen his team live more than you've seen yours?

_blank_ · 09-09-2007 1:47pm

PauloMN wrote:

you've obviously never been at a football ground if you think that's abuse.

I am at a real live football game every second week on average. Sometimes more, sometimes less.

I'd say I've been to about four hundred games in my life.

I'm deadly, how many have you been to?

PauloMN · 09-09-2007 1:49pm

Anto McC wrote:

I bet he's seen his team live more than you've seen yours?

Live? Does TV count?

Yes, maybe he has, unfortunately seeing mine involves planes trains and automobiles

.

_blank_ · 09-09-2007 1:54pm

Live? Does TV count?

Nope

Yes, maybe he has, unfortunately seeing mine involves planes trains and automobiles .

Mine involves planes, trains and automobiles too funnily enough.

I've flown to Cork, caught a train to Kilkenny, and bus it to Drumcondra for every home game.

Sometimes I get a lift too.

LuckyLloyd · 09-09-2007 1:56pm

DesF wrote:

But people claiming a team from Glasgow is somehow Irish is bizarre, no?

If the argument is that the team has a tradition that is strongly catholic and hospitable to those from Ireland then I think it is quite difficult to argue is it not? A Scottish team with some links to, and a fondness for, Ireland.

Obviously, if the argument is that Glasgcow Celtic is an Irish team that we should all adopt and fiercely support as a second to the Irish national side; then I would have to disagree.

Either way, I still fail to see how the wearing of Celtic jersies at an Ireland game should be a cause for concern.

The people in south bend, Ohio go on with a lot of paddywackery aswell. But then Notre Dame was founded by Catholic priests from Ireland; and the majority of early attendees were from first or second generation Irish families. To say that neither Celtic nor Notre Dame are in anyway Irish seems slightly disingenious to me. And at the end of the day, what people wear is very, very unimportant in the grander scheme of things.

PauloMN · 09-09-2007 2:08pm

Anyway, can we qualify?

DesF, I actually have to agree with you :eek: - I think the Czechs at home will be too tall an order, and we'll get beaten or draw at best. I think we missed out on our opportunity last night, but more importantly against Cyprus.

Edit: I hope I'm wrong though!

luckylucky · 09-09-2007 2:19pm

Anto McC wrote:

So inform me then?

I've lived in England until recently for over 4 years. I've found that people of recent Irish descent have varying degrees of identification with being Irish. Most would consider themselves English but with a close affiliation to being Irish. There is a largish minority who would however consider themselves to be Irish. One Londoner whose parents were Irish considered himself to be Irish and had a very apt phrase that 'it was a cheap shirt that ran in the first wash'.

The last away game I went to was the France - Ireland game in the 2006 World Cup Qualifier. I met a bunch of London guys whose parents or grandparents were Irish supporting Ireland. These people have not forgot where they came from and I was p1ssed off when some of them told me that some Irish guys said what the hell are they doing supporting Ireland. It shoudln't be forgotten that these people are our brethren. Blood is thicker than water 'n all that. I'm not exactly a fan of Northern Ireland Unionism but after 400 years being in Ireland at least they haven't forgotten where they came from, likewise our kindred over the seas shouldn't be so readily dismissed.

Anyway while you are undoubtedly correct that many of those born in England would have chosen to play for England if they had the choice, I don't think it's totally true, some would simply identify with being Irish. Even those that would have chosen England first it doesn't mean that they don't have strong affection for playing for Ireland.

Would you not want anybody not born in the Republic to be allowed play at all for us then. Even if they clearly thought of themselves as being 100% Irish. :rolleyes:
There was also English born playing for Ireland before Charlton arrived on the scene though it did take off more under his management.

DesF wrote:

But people claiming a team from Glasgow is somehow Irish is bizarre, no?

No one said Glascow Celtic are Irish. The affiliation with Ireland is clear though. Again I don't think people should be so ready to dismiss things of 'Irish' identify as not being Irish just because they are located outside of Ireland. I live in Portugal now but it's never going to make me Portuguese and I'm no less Irish because I don't live in Ireland anymore.

LuckyLloyd · 09-09-2007 2:21pm

luckylucky wrote:

I've lived in England until recently for over 4 years. I've found that people of recent Irish descent have varying degrees of identification with being Irish. Most would consider themselves English but with a close affiliation to being Irish. There is a largish minority who would however consider themselves to be Irish. One Londoner whose parents were Irish considered himself to be Irish and had a very apt phrase that 'it was a cheap shirt that ran in the first wash'.

The last away game I went to was the France - Ireland game in the 2006 World Cup Qualifier. I met a bunch of London guys whose parents or grandparents were Irish supporting Ireland. These people have not forgot where they came from and I was p1ssed off when some of them told me that some Irish guys said what the hell are they doing supporting Ireland. It shoudln't be forgotten that these people are our brethren. Blood is thicker than water 'n all that. I'm not exactly a fan of Northern Ireland Unionism but after 400 years being in Ireland at least they haven't forgotten where they came from, likewise our kindred over the seas shouldn't be so readily dismissed.

Anyway while you are undoubtedly correct that many of those born in England would have chosen to play for England if they had the choice, I don't think it's totally true, some would simply identify with being Irish. Even those that would have chosen England first it doesn't mean that they don't have strong affection for playing for Ireland.

Would you not want anybody not born in the Republic to be allowed play at all for us then. Even if they clearly thought of themselves as being 100% Irish. :rolleyes:
There was also English born playing for Ireland before Charlton arrived on the scene though it did take off more under his management.

No one said Glascow Celtic are Irish. The affiliation with Ireland is clear though. Again I don't think people should be so ready to dismiss things of 'Irish' identify as not being Irish just because they are located outside of Ireland. I live in Portugal now but it's never going to make me Portuguese and I'm no less Irish because I don't live in Ireland anymore.

Good post Barry. Fair play.

Galvasean · 09-09-2007 2:25pm

Ireland just can't sit on a lead. When will they realize this?

_blank_ · 09-09-2007 2:35pm

PauloMN wrote:

DesF, I actually have to agree with you :eek:

That's alright, it's taken you a shorter time, but everyone eventually does.

~Rebel~ · 09-09-2007 2:42pm

Anto McC wrote:

Would you go to support lets say, Chelsea while wearing a Liverpool jersey?

Oh for gods sake thats a really silly comparison. irelands kit is green and white, celtics jersey is green and white. Of course one wouldnt wear a liverpool jersey to a chelsea match, but i would have no problem wearing my cork jersey to a liverpool match just to add to the sea of red, if i didnt own a multitude of pool jerseys anwyay. My gf wore her cork t-shirt to anfield for instance, cause its red.

Guy:Incognito · 09-09-2007 3:11pm

~Rebel~ wrote:

but i would have no problem wearing my cork jersey to a liverpool match .

You're no longer welcome at Anfield. Yourpicture will be at all the turnstiles so dont bother trying.

_blank_ · 09-09-2007 3:26pm

When I go to Ireland matches I wear all my green stuff.

Green leprechaun hat. Green Leprechaun suit. Green wig. Green inflatable hammer. Green face paint. Bring green food dye so my Guinness is green.

I'm so Irish it's unbelievable.

Roar · 09-09-2007 3:44pm

DesF wrote:

When I go to Ireland matches I wear all my green stuff.

Green leprechaun hat. Green Leprechaun suit. Green wig. Green inflatable hammer. Green face paint. Bring green food dye so my Guinness is green.

I'm so Irish it's unbelievable.

you forgot the ginger face wig and a celtic jersey for under your leprechaun suit

Guy:Incognito · 09-09-2007 3:48pm

Screw the lot of you , I'm now useing my German passport. So hahahah we're top of the table. One way or another I'll have soeone to support at the Euro's.

Lederhosen at the ready!.

~Rebel~ · 09-09-2007 3:55pm

Stekelly wrote:

Screw the lot of you , I'm now useing my German passport. So hahahah we're top of the table. One way or another I'll have soeone to support at the Euro's.

Lederhosen at the ready!.

Hah! Ill use my Canadian passport (parents lived there for years back in the day) and cheer for some hockey!...and suck at everything else...maple syrup is nice though...

eh

Guy:Incognito · 09-09-2007 3:58pm

~Rebel~ wrote:

Hah! Ill use my Canadian passport (parents lived there for years back in the day) and cheer for some hockey!...and suck at everything else...maple syrup is nice though...

eh

God damn hosers.

MrJoeSoap · 09-09-2007 3:59pm

~Rebel~ wrote:

Hah! Ill use my Canadian passport (parents lived there for years back in the day) and cheer for some hockey!...and suck at everything else...maple syrup is nice though...

eh

Ice Hockey ftw! They're the best country in the world at Canadian Football as well.

Anto McC · 09-09-2007 4:56pm

luckylucky wrote:

I've lived in England until recently for over 4 years. I've found that people of recent Irish descent have varying degrees of identification with being Irish. Most would consider themselves English but with a close affiliation to being Irish. There is a largish minority who would however consider themselves to be Irish. One Londoner whose parents were Irish considered himself to be Irish and had a very apt phrase that 'it was a cheap shirt that ran in the first wash'.

The last away game I went to was the France - Ireland game in the 2006 World Cup Qualifier. I met a bunch of London guys whose parents or grandparents were Irish supporting Ireland. These people have not forgot where they came from and I was p1ssed off when some of them told me that some Irish guys said what the hell are they doing supporting Ireland. It shoudln't be forgotten that these people are our brethren. Blood is thicker than water 'n all that. I'm not exactly a fan of Northern Ireland Unionism but after 400 years being in Ireland at least they haven't forgotten where they came from, likewise our kindred over the seas shouldn't be so readily dismissed.

Anyway while you are undoubtedly correct that many of those born in England would have chosen to play for England if they had the choice, I don't think it's totally true, some would simply identify with being Irish. Even those that would have chosen England first it doesn't mean that they don't have strong affection for playing for Ireland.

Would you not want anybody not born in the Republic to be allowed play at all for us then. Even if they clearly thought of themselves as being 100% Irish. :rolleyes:
There was also English born playing for Ireland before Charlton arrived on the scene though it did take off more under his management.

You raise some really good points, in my years of talking about how i feel about the International team, thats probably the best response i've got to my veiws. My problem is mainly commitment. I'm a proud Irishman and i although i'll never be good enough, if i ever got the chance to play for Ireland, you'd be garaunteed 100% commitment from me, if nothing else. Am i to beleive that Sean St Ledger, who didn't know he could play for Ireland until was told, could pull on the jersey and show that same commitment? I want players who since they played football from a young age, wanted to play for Ireland and Ireland only(I believe Kevin Kilbane actually falls in to that category). Not, Clinton Morrison who one day dreamed of playing for England only to realise he's not good enough and opt for Ireland instead.

I've masses of respect for Kevin Nolan who decided not to play for us because he did not want to deprive an Irishman of the chance to play for the Country he loves and who also doubted he could ever give the same commitment to Ireland than he could if he ever got the chance to play for England.

Anto McC · 09-09-2007 5:03pm

~Rebel~ wrote:

Oh for gods sake thats a really silly comparison. irelands kit is green and white, celtics jersey is green and white. Of course one wouldnt wear a liverpool jersey to a chelsea match, but i would have no problem wearing my cork jersey to a liverpool match just to add to the sea of red, if i didnt own a multitude of pool jerseys anwyay. My gf wore her cork t-shirt to anfield for instance, cause its red.

Ok then, would you wear a Home Man U jersey to Anfield to support Liverpool? They're both red after all.

~Rebel~ · 09-09-2007 5:06pm

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Ice Hockey ftw! They're the best country in the world at Canadian Football as well.

Huh, and there i thought you were taking the piss!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_football

to keep this somewhat on topic Boo Delaney, Yay irelands potential future stars if nurtured under a decent management team!

Zebra3 · 09-09-2007 5:28pm

If England bring out a green jersey can I wear that to Ireland matches, or is that not as acceptable as wearing the green and white hoops of the sporting wing of the IRA?

~Rebel~ · 09-09-2007 5:28pm

Anto McC wrote:

Ok then, would you wear a Home Man U jersey to Anfield to support Liverpool? They're both red after all.

:mad: Guy, seriously, You're making this far more difficult then you need to. Its simple common sense like. Of course you obviously wouldnt wear a direct competitor's jersey to it. OK Since i obviously need to spell it out for you what i would consider to be absolute grand would be;
You're going to a match, your ireland jersey is dirty - bollocks!
Hmmm what can i find, green t shirt, grand, celtic jersey, yeah thats green and white, savage. Sporting lisbon jersey - excellent! Absolutely any league team from any country in the world thats green - Grand! Happy out!

Now for some reason you insist on bringing up clubs, which i dont understand as thats not the argument. We're talking about national jersey vs club jersey so theres no tie in, its just a colour. club V club is is a bit different as they're competitors, so in this i would be quite happy wearing any red national jersey to a liverpool match (tho theres little chance all my jerseys would be dirty!).

To Summarise; If its the right colour, just wear it unless theres a blatently obvious reason not to. You're closing down your options to Ireland jersey or nothing, im saying anything green unless theres a reason not to.

Christ whats amazing me is that it seems the people complaining about the celtic jersey are taking some hidden meaning of connotations alluding to the irish connections that probably simply arent there. They're paying money to see the match, in many cases traveling from all over the country and they're supporting the team. And they're wearing Green. I dont think they're doing all this to make a point about Celtic. They're just following Ireland. its the people here that are being appalled. Now if it was someone wearing some random Away Celtic jersey I would call them morons, but its patently being worn because its a green jersey!

Christ look how much you made me write for the worst discussion ever, ever, ever!

<Edit>

Zebra3 wrote:

If England bring out a green jersey can I wear that to Ireland matches, or is that not as acceptable as wearing the green and white hoops of the sporting wing of the IRA?

again see above points, you're dealing with wearing a competitors jersey. A fair comparison would be if Man Utd came out with a Green away jersey would I be happy wearing it to an Ireland game. now in this case because im a liverpool fan i wouldn't but id have absolutely no problem with anyone else wearing it.

Anto McC · 09-09-2007 5:35pm

~Rebel~ wrote:

To Summarise; If its the right colour, just wear it unless theres a blatently obvious reason not to. You're closing down your options to Ireland jersey or nothing, im saying anything green unless theres a reason not to.

If you stated that in the initial post you could have saved yourself typing a long post which i didn't even bother to read.

Christ look how much you made me write for the worst discussion ever, ever, ever!

I didn't ask you to. If the arguement was as redundant, as you would have us believe, you feel it was then why did you bother?

~Rebel~ · 09-09-2007 5:49pm

Anto McC wrote:

If you stated that in the initial post you could have saved yourself typing a long post which i didn't even bother to read.

I didn't ask you to. If the arguement was as redundant, as you would have us believe, you feel it was then why did you bother?

Its just silly comments like that that get to me, people complaining where really theres no need for it. Dont get me wrong, its not you, i just seem to find people in this country moan and complain and get outraged and find wrong in so so much, when really theres no need for it. Today i find some woman down the road has complained against my friends planning permission when it doesnt impact her in any way. She does this with everything, anytime she can get anything stopped she will. She even put a complaint against getting the road tarmaced. And i know of so many people like this. I know im becoming much the same by moaning about the moaners. Its a vicious circle. So i went on a rant.

Also thought "you could have saved yourself typing a long post which i didn't even bother to read" was a tad poor form...

Anto McC · 09-09-2007 5:52pm

~Rebel~ wrote:

Its just silly comments like that that get to me, people complaining where really theres no need for it. Dont get me wrong, its not you, i just seem to find people in this country moan and complain and get outraged and find wrong in so so much, when really theres no need for it. I know im becoming much the same by moaning about the moaners. Its a vicious circle. So i went on a rant.

Also thought "you could have saved yourself typing a long post which i didn't even bother to read" was a tad poor form...

It was poor form and i'm sorry. I agree with you about people moaning in this country, every now and again, i realise i'm one of them too

Again, my apologies, i'm just in a niggly humour

PauloMN · 09-09-2007 5:58pm

Zebra3 wrote:

If England bring out a green jersey can I wear that to Ireland matches, or is that not as acceptable as wearing the green and white hoops of the sporting wing of the IRA?

"Sporting wing of the IRA"?

Nurse... nurse... another one has escaped.

Mikeyt086 · 09-09-2007 6:20pm

Czech's are without Jan Koller for the game on wednesday, he is suspended.

That improves out chances a HELL of alot. Cant deny that. They still have Rosicky, Uzfalusy (sp?), Cech. But they are without their most prolific scorer and the only reason we didnt beat them at home.

If we are to win, the players need to ignore everything Staunton tells them and do the opposite.

Brian Capture · 09-09-2007 6:27pm

PauloMN wrote:

"Sporting wing of the IRA"?

Nurse... nurse... another one has escaped.

It's not that hard to make the connection.

I know a few people who are hardline republican sympathisers and support Celtic. The sort of people who are happy when some random English person dies in a car crash.

Then there was the guy with OMAGH 98 printed on the back of his Celtic jersey.

And the booing during the one minute's silence for the Omagh victims at a game in which Celtic were playing.

Then you have the Wolfe Tones whose fanbase at gigs consists of significant numbers of people chanting 'ooh aah up the IRA' while wearing Celtic jerseys. Also note that the Wolfe Tones have never, to the best of my knowledge, condemned the Shankill Road bombing, Enniskillen 1987, Omagh 1998 or Warrington 1993.

Obviously not all Celtic fans are IRA lovers but some of them are.

~Rebel~ · 09-09-2007 6:39pm

Brian Capture wrote:

It's not that hard to make the connection.

I know a few people who are hardline republican sympathisers and support Celtic. The sort of people who are happy when some random English person dies in a car crash.

Then there was the guy with OMAGH 98 printed on the back of his Celtic jersey.

And the booing during the one minute's silence for the Omagh victims at a game in which Celtic were playing.

Then you have the Wolfe Tones whose fanbase at gigs consists of significant numbers of people chanting 'ooh aah up the IRA' while wearing Celtic jerseys. Also note that the Wolfe Tones have never, to the best of my knowledge, condemned the Shankill Road bombing, Enniskillen 1987, Omagh 1998 or Warrington 1993.

Obviously not all Celtic fans are IRA lovers but some of them are.

Thats the other way around though, thats people with hardline, fked up tendencies and idea's supporting Celtic because they, wrongly, identify them as being pro IRA. Celtic are not associated in any way with the IRA, just because some idiots here in Ireland look at the rivalry between the 2 glaswegian teams who were traditionally set up by Catholics and Protestants respectively and think "we'll have some of that". Lets not forget in Scotland these people live side by side quite happily (with the very small exceptions), and even post happily in a friendly manner on the celtic thread here because they're actual football fans, not sectarian biggots.

Im sure Eirebhoy would be very quick to point out these guys are not Celtic fans, they're just idiots looking for anything "anti english" to jump on. The celtic jersey is more of a badge of honour of their beliefs then because they actually follow it. Now im sure some (probably very few) do watch every single game they can and travel over several times a year, but i'd be willing to bet most of them couldnt name the full squad or even the starting 11 (of even 5 members of) the Lisbon Lions team.

And i would admit some of the people wearing celtic jersey's at an irish match are of this ilk, but id say a tiny tiny minority.

<EDIT> Again, back to topic; I could see us getting the win against the czechs. so far our second performance has been much better then the first in each of these 2 game sessions. Id say nothing motivates the team more then the thought of going back to their respective clubs and having the piss taken out of ya by your buddies for pathetic performances. They're gonna be well aware of how bad they were and by the time the Czech game rolls around it'll be drummed into their heads. Even if everyone puts in 100% effort and fights for everything we could be ok. It would be just like the irish team to prolong the agony rather then let us fade away

luckylucky · 09-09-2007 9:12pm

Brian Capture wrote:

It's not that hard to make the connection.

Ok this whole line is straying well OT but I can't resist replying to this kinda stuff just one more time.

Brian Capture wrote:

Then there was the guy with OMAGH 98 printed on the back of his Celtic jersey.

You can find examples of a-holes in any situation to prove your point. This guy clearly was one of the highest order.

Brian Capture wrote:

Then you have the Wolfe Tones whose fanbase at gigs consists of significant numbers of people chanting 'ooh aah up the IRA' while wearing Celtic jerseys. Also note that the Wolfe Tones have never, to the best of my knowledge, condemned the Shankill Road bombing, Enniskillen 1987, Omagh 1998 or Warrington 1993.

I have never heard any English band apologising for the 1 million or so who died in the Irish famine. For the reduction of the irish population by 1/3rd after Cromwell was done. For the banning of education to Irish Catholics under a large part of their rule and then laughingly labeling us as thick Paddies. For the devastation inflicted on our people by them over centuries that we have only begin recovering from in the last 20 years. So why should any Irish person who were not involved in acts of violence start apologising for what an illegal organisation which are only supported in the republic by a very small minority did in their name when governmental bodies in Britain are responsible for inflicting over a thousand times more destruction on us.
It would be the equivalent of a Jew apologising for a few hundred German officers getting poisoned by Jewish resistance.

On the other hand before you go thinking I'm one of your 'IRA supporters'. I find myself in disagreement with rebel's statement.

~Rebel~ wrote:

Lets not forget in Scotland these people live side by side quite happily (with the very small exceptions)

I was under the impression that sectarianism in Scotland particularly in Glascow was rife. I do actually think that the whole Celtic v Rangers rivalry just exacerbates the whole problem there.

~Rebel~ · 09-09-2007 9:19pm

luckylucky wrote:

I was under the impression that sectarianism in Scotland particularly in Glascow was rife. I do actually think that the whole Celtic v Rangers rivalry just exacerbates the whole problem there.

I dont know for sure, and ODonnell is the one to ask for the definitive truth on this, but i was under the impression that its a situation similar to Liverpool where theres rivalry, but at the end of the day nearly every fan of either team will have mates on the other side. I know theres the hardcore groups, but as i said these would be in the minority. Im just going by what i can recall from the many times this has popped up on the celtic thread.

I still heartily stand by the bulk, and point, of my post though, that these hardline IRA men who wear celtic jerseys aren't actual celtic fans but are more jumping on the "anti english" bandwagon. Its not really fair Celtic as a club get tainted by them as if they agree with those beliefs and behavior.

Slovakia vs Ireland

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