Should cage fighting be banned?.

T-Boner

Do you see it as barbaric, two men enter an octagon wire mesh cage, one leave's a winner after beating the other dude senseless.

Or do you see it as a display of martial arts with a mix of boxing, wrestling & Karate?.

biko

It's not gay if you don't make eye contact while "wrestling" your opponent

Mellor

T-Boner wrote:

Do you see it as barbaric, two men enter an octagon wire mesh cage, one leave's a winner after beating the other dude senseless.

Or do you see it as a display of martial arts with a mix of boxing, wrestling & Karate?.

They are rarely beaten senseless.
Tap-outs are common, as is the ref stopping the fight,
knock outs are less common.

Its no worse than comps in the individual disciplines, ie Ju jitsu/Thai boxing/karate

Dave!

Why don't you post it in the Martial Arts forum?

No, I don't think it should be banned. They're both highly trained professional fighters who know what they're getting themselves in for. There's a referee, doctor, paramedics, etc., there to make sure it doesn't get too dangerous. Nobody has ever died from fighting in the UFC.

It is a display of martial arts with a mix of boxing, wrestling, karate, jiu jitsu, judo, etc., and all of the fighters spend years training day-in-day-out before they reach the standard that they're signed up by the UFC.

It's not some big drunk guy bashing a skinny c*nt for fun..............

What's your problem with it?

Smellyirishman

No, I don't think it should. I see it as a sport with two willing competitors who usually show great humility and compassion ( and no, I am not reffering to the wrestling ) for each other post-fight.

T-Boner

Mellor wrote:

They are rarely beaten senseless.
Tap-outs are common, as is the ref stopping the fight,
knock outs are less common.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8sTSz8BjGE

A bit of everything here.

T-Boner

DaveMcG wrote:

Why don't you post it in the Martial Arts forum?

No, I don't think it should be banned. They're both highly trained professional fighters who know what they're getting themselves in for. There's a referee, doctor, paramedics, etc., there to make sure it doesn't get too dangerous. Nobody has ever died from fighting in the UFC.

It is a display of martial arts with a mix of boxing, wrestling, karate, jiu jitsu, judo, etc., and all of the fighters spend years training day-in-day-out before they reach the standard that they're signed up by the UFC.

It's not some big drunk guy bashing a skinny c*nt for fun..............

What's your problem with it?

Whats the agression for?.

Are all cage fighting exponents this agressive?. Is that the attraction for you?.

And btw, I haven't stated that I have a problem with it, just posted a question for discussion.

Dave!

T-Boner wrote:

Whats the agression for?.

I haven't even stated my view's on it yet for crying out loud!.

That wasn't aggression, lol.

Sorry if I came across that way!

Please, go ahead

Naos

OP: I think you should do more research on a subject before taking a closed minded and incorrect approach.

And for the record, no it should not be banned.

Zapp Brannigan

T-Boner wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8sTSz8BjGE

A bit of everything here.

Gah you fail. Not a single Crocrop knockout...

MooseJam

no to banning, it's very entertaining moreso than boxing usually

rossie1977

ufc is far safer than boxing.

Find out how many people have died/badly injured as result of mma/ufc in the last 10-15 years

Now compare that figure to boxing or even a non-contact sport such as football

Debate over

Fremen

The stare-downs are kinda gay though

Pinker

rossie1977 wrote:

ufc is far safer than boxing.

Find out how many people have died/badly injured as result of mma/ufc in the last 10-15 years

Now compare that figure to boxing or even a non-contact sport such as football

Debate over

Amm unless I'm missing the sarcastic tone you should be comparing percentages not numbers, I havent seen too many kids doing UFC on my street so I'll guess its marginally less popular than football, hence less deaths, or even boxing for that matter,

Getting back on topic- its barbaric, its for losers, but hey let them, its a free world. kinda...

impr0v

Two men enter, one man leave. It's exactly how things have been done since the time of Tina Turner.

nesf

Why ban it? If two guys are willing to accept money for fighting each other let them at it tbh. It's good entertainment.

nesf

Zapp Brannigan wrote:

Gah you fail. Not a single Crocrop knockout...

I found Crocop getting knocked out better. The ironing was delicious.

Smellyirishman

Zapp Brannigan wrote:

Gah you fail. Not a single Crocrop knockout...

Will this do? (You know what's coming; nesf does )


(I won't embed so people actually have to click the link to watch, in case you don't like fighting. It's nothing too bad though)

arybvtcw0eolkf

Mear wrote:

OP: I think you should do more research on a subject before taking a closed minded and incorrect approach.

And for the record, no it should not be banned.

Thats a good one.

The OP asked two questions, and from his questions you think he has a closed mind. Then in post #7 the OP states;

t-boner wrote:

And btw, I haven't stated that I have a problem with it, just posted a question for discussion. .

So who's got a closed mind?.


OP, no I personally don't think it should be banned. But I do think that even here in Ireland where its mostly an amateur post that fighters considering moving into the professional arena should employ a manager/agent who'll look after their financial welfare etc.

I think 'cage fighting', I prefer the term Mix Martial Arts (MMA) is the way ahead and is leaving boxing behind in terms of a both a professional & spectator sport.

Btw, anyone interested in this sport should look over on the Martial Arts & Self Defence forum. There's now a few full time MMA gyms dotted accross the country.

Dragan

Banning it would be futile and unjustified in my mind.

What justifies the banning of the sport? or even the attitude to want to ban it? I would suggest anyone with an image that these fighters are thugs look up the likes of Randy Couture, Dan Henderson, Quinton Jackson, Fedor Emelianenko, Rich Franklin, Geroge St Pierre etc. All great athletes, great fighers and perfect gentlemen ( even Page is these days! ).

Personally i would have more issues with gymnastics as a sport than i would with MMA.

HammerHeadGym

Pinker wrote:

...you should be comparing percentages not numbers...

Percantage of people to die in the ring = zero

Pinker wrote:

...its barbaric, its for losers...

What aspects of it strike you as barbaric? Would you consider it more barbaric than say boxing, or hurling for example.

And why is it for losers, have you ever tried a class? What makes competetive athletes losers exactly? Just curious

Dyr

I think they should be banned from calling it cage fighting unless they bring back the no time limits rule and allow groin shots again. Keith hackney vs Joe son ftw

HammerHeadGym

An intresting statistic for those who consider mma barbaric 'Since 1900 their have been over 1000 documented deaths in boxing. There has been 1 in MMA in 70 years. That was in Russia at an unsanctioned event'

Dyr

dude you're gonna get dizzy from all that spinning, chillax

HammerHeadGym

And I imagine you are going to need a heavier coat, what with spending all your time being so damn cool:cool:

Seriously though, there is no spin, those are the facts. There has never been a fatality in a sanctioned MMA event. If you'd rather do your own research instead of criticising mine you should check out the Manuel Vasquez Boxing Fatality Collection. The Vasquez Collection is a documentation of all reported deaths in the sport of boxing since 1900. It contains over 1100 names. Or maybe you could just remain aloof and throw a few painfully trendy quips into the argument.

Dave!

People might be interested to know that some of the fighters are actually extremely educated. Rich Franklin has a degree in maths and a masters in education. He used to actually teach high school "math". And Tank Abbott (this guy!) has a degree in history.

Vince135792003

As a relatively new fan, I defy anyone to watch a UFC show today or any organisation really and not be impressed and excited with what they see. I watch guys like Couture, St. Pierre, Fedor, Henderson, Penn etc... and marvel at them for their skill and athleticism.

I don't like the term cage fighting either. It has negative connotations to it that in 2007, it does not deserve. It is mixed martial arts.

Dave!

Indeed... It's irrelevent where it's played really. The fact that it's in an octagon with wire mesh around it is mainly for show, and to feed the image of it being almost like the colosseum in ancient rome. Bruce Buffer calls the fighters "WAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRIIIIIIOOOOOOOOOOOOOORRRRRRRRRSSSSSS" for the same reason. The other major competition is Pride, in Japan (now owned by the UFC mind you), and the bouts are fight in a ring just like a boxing ring. Works just as good.

Dragan

To be honest a cage is safer for the fighters. Do you really want Sean Sherk or Matt Hughes shooting in on people with just ropes there to keep them in the cage?

Go back to the days of Pancreas and you see people falling out of the ring, it happens a bit in smaller local shows as well.

Dyr

HammerHeadGym wrote:

And I imagine you are going to need a heavier coat, what with spending all your time being so damn cool:cool:

Seriously though, there is no spin, those are the facts. There has never been a fatality in a sanctioned MMA event. If you'd rather do your own research instead of criticising mine you should check out the Manuel Vasquez Boxing Fatality Collection. The Vasquez Collection is a documentation of all reported deaths in the sport of boxing since 1900. It contains over 1100 names. Or maybe you could just remain aloof and throw a few painfully trendy quips into the argument.

I have a fan on my desk, it keeps me a nicely aloof temperature :cool:

anywhoo the whole 70 years of MMA is somewhat spinny, lumping the gracies et al knocking the pish out of ppls in brazil at random points prior to UFC1/SHOOTO in the 80's isnt really valid IMO. At that rate ye might as well claim that pankration is your year zero and say that no ones been killed in a MMA match since the roman empire went to the wall.

so to sum up:

MMA is safer than boxing.
MMA isnt 70 years old.
Boxing has been around a lot longer and is still a far more popular sport thus making comparisons of numbers misleading.
groin shots are the way forward

*insert painful quip here*

skywalker

T-Boner wrote:

Do you see it as barbaric, two men enter an octagon wire mesh cage, one leave's a winner after beating the other dude senseless.

Or do you see it as a display of martial arts with a mix of boxing, wrestling & Karate?.

Its usually custom for the person who starts the debate to give some input on their opinion isnt it?

There was a similar piece on sky news yesterday evening, which Im presuming is why the op made the thread, there was a doctor on from the bmi saying how terrible it was, and why wasnt it banned, he then went on to point out that the bmi had been trying for 20 years to get boxing banned. Kinda shot his credibility.

Ive yet to see anyone make a credible, reasoned arguement for it being banned. A lot of people seem to have some resentment towards it for some reason though, Id hazard a guess that the folk shouting the loudest for it to be banned, have never actually sat down & watched an event.

cance

its legally run with high safety standards.

If it was banned it would go underground, be run without a care about the fighters safety and would probably fund the gang/drug scene.

personally i dont like UFC, or boxing for that matter. But people do like to watch professionals fight. Better its run by a legitimate board than ruthless criminals.

my 2c

Canis Lupus

I simply love watching UFC. It's one of the very very very few things I'd actually turn a tv on to watch. The skill and athleticism is simply awe inspiring in some of the fighters.

I have to admit though, if there is one thing I don't like is that if the fighters are only doing ground work and not throwing punches the crowd invariably boos. That just ****s me right off because if nothing else it's showing that a large percentage are there to see someone have their head kicked in rather than enjoying and appreciating two guys battling out in terms of wits as well as brawn.

Should this sport be banned? Good god no. No one is forcing them to fight and no one is forcing a viewer to watch.

Cuddlesworth

From taking part in MMA here for a while I would say no.

It's safer, better organized and seems to attract a smarter and more dedicated individual unlike boxing which seems to be full of thugs and managers akin to pimps.

Nothingcompares

if you're even going to consider banning MMA due to danger you have to ban:

Horse riding and other equestrian sports
Motor sports
Alcohol
Cigarettes
Terrestrial Vehicles that can travel faster than 20 km per hour
Boxing
Kickboxing
Thai Boxing

And then to a less extent rugby, soccer and other ball sports due to the number of leg and knee injuries.

Mossy Monk

T-Boner wrote:

Do you see it as barbaric, two men enter an octagon wire mesh cage, one leave's a winner after beating the other dude senseless.

Or do you see it as a display of martial arts with a mix of boxing, wrestling & Karate?.

Why don't you try watching it and then making a thread. Beating each other senseless?

T-Boner

Mossy Monk wrote:

Why don't you try watching it and then making a thread. Beating each other senseless?

What makes you think I haven't watched it, or even trained MMA?.

I simply asked two questions and people here jump to the conclusion that I'm somehow ignorant of MMA. I never even hinted at what my view's were because I'm interested in generating a discussion amongest the guys here on AH rather than posting on the M.A. forum where the discussion would all be one sided and biased.


My view's on MMA are pretty similar to those expressed by the vast majority here, I love it. But I'm aware of the debate surrounding it also, and people calling for its banning so I thought I'd throw up a thread on AH to get the 'lay persons' views.

Tbh I thought there would have been alot more opposition to MMA here. So I'm delighted to see how MMA has been promoted here through the UFC and smaller local events like R.o.T. CageRage (contenders) and to a lesser extent the MMA league.

biko

biko wrote:

It's not gay if you don't make eye contact while "wrestling" your opponent

No balls touch so it's not gay.

shane86

It should be banned.

Not because its barbaric but because it has about as much style and class as a playground brawl between two 12 year olds. Its an awful lookin sport. Ill stick with the boxing thanks.

arybvtcw0eolkf

shane86 wrote:

It should be banned.

Not because its barbaric but because it has about as much style and class as a playground brawl between two 12 year olds. Its an awful lookin sport. Ill stick with the boxing thanks.

Oh, it should be banned because you personally don't like it, or understand it and thats it?.

And should we ban every sport you personally don't like or understand or is it just MMA?.

HammerHeadGym

shane86 wrote:

...it has about as much style and class as a playground brawl between two 12 year olds...

I hear this sort of thing from people who don't really know what the're looking at, all the time. If you took the time to learn what the sport was about you would have a far richer experience. Don't let your ignorance spoil your enjoyment.

Tar.Aldarion

Ban it? they should be making Unreal Tournament imo, if people would enter.

Fozzy

MMA is incredible entertainment and one of the most technical sports around. I've never heard a decent argument for why it should be banned as the people who argue against it invariably come across as ignorant or pushing their own agenda. Can someone prove me wrong here?!

nice1franko

I think we should ban everything where there is a chance someone could get hurt.

Golf, cycling, motorsports, jogging, etc.

dj_quinn

No, it shouldn't be banned, but give me some travelers in a bare-knuckle fight over cage fighting any day.

Varkov

They wanna fight for money, let em.

Their decision. At least its not going down in someone's basement.

Caliden

No.

Mossy Monk

T-Boner wrote:

What makes you think I haven't watched it

Your beating each other senseless comment makes me think that.

chopperbyrne

No it shouldn't be banned. It's as safe as any other full on contact sport.

Should boxing, karate, muay-thai, judo etc, be banned? No.

Most of these are olympic sports. MMA will be in the olympics one day, be it cage or ring.

skywalker

T-Boner wrote:

What makes you think I haven't watched it, or even trained MMA?.

I simply asked two questions and people here jump to the conclusion that I'm somehow ignorant of MMA.

Id imagine peoples reactions were to do with the phrasing of the questions, they were pretty leading in fairness, "Beating each other senseless".

dublinario

I think the original poster's entitling of "cage fighting" instantly establishes that he doesn't know anything about the sport, and prejudices the debate slightly. As I'm sure somebody has already mentioned (I didn't have time to read every single posting) the sport is called Mixed Martial Arts.

I love the sport. When I first started watching it a few years ago, I had no idea that it would usurp Boxing in my combat sport favour. I understand why people find the violence unpalatable, particularly when a downed man is set upon. But that is a tiny facet of a great sport, and understandable - not lawless and callous, as it can seem - within the context of the rules. As the great Chuck Liddell explained on Letterman, whilst the audience gasped at a clip of him being punched on the ground by Rampage Jackson, "if he didn't do that, I'd have been ready to go again in a second or two".

I think MMA is a lot safer than boxing because of the absence of career-long head trauma, brought about from sustained 12 round wars of attrition. MMA is a new sport, but even still, you don't see veterans like Ken Shamrock walking around with slurred speech, ala boxing heavyweights.

I tend to believe that both boxing and MMA will eventually be banned (hopefully not in my lifetime), but I've always held pessimistic, Orwellian fears about state nanny-ism.