Private Health Insurance in Ireland - Why?

krinpit

I did a quick search and I can't find any existing threads on this.

I have health insurance provided free by my employer. But is there any point in holding a private health insurance policy in this country, where access to health services is free of charge.

To keep the discussion relevent, I'm a 26 year old male (so no babies or old persons' diseases )

Stark

krinpit wrote:

But is there any point in holding a private health insurance policy in this country, where access to health services is free of charge.

Yes, the waiting times for private treatments are much shorter than the public waiting times.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Nermal

Considering:

- Old people pay the same as young, i.e you're subsidising the coffin-dodgers (funny how they don't return the favour for motor eh?)

- Fees for the non-elective stuff are never going to amount to a significant fraction of your income

- If you're stuck on a waiting list you can go to the national treatment purchase fund

No, it's not worth it, unless you're dead set on going to the Blackrock clinic or don't want to share a room with the plebs or something.

But then you don't pay for it. It's obviously 'worth it' to keep it in that sense.

TheDriver

From personal experience, you seriously do walk past everyone else in the queue to get some procedures done, especially some day stuff and consultants are much more eager to see you. Thats the feeling I always got. I have it incase of serious stuff e.g. cancer because you DO get seen quicker, that national treatment fund is grand if its something your not going to deteriorate from too quickly.

Ogham

Personally I think it's not worth it . If we had more income maybe I would bother with it. We could probably afford it now - but I just don't think it is really needed. I originally lived in the UK and private health insurance was fairly rare unless you were very well paid. There are slightly more costs here than in the UK - but not too bad. Max cost per annum for hospital stay is 600 euro (60 a night up to that max) . All tests and ops are free - it's just the possible longer wait. I did read last year that for some treatments - private waiting lists were longer than the public one. Also as pointed out earlier - in theory if you are waiting over 3 months the HSE should pay for the procedure to be done privately anyway (no cost to you).

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

scargill

daveirl wrote:

This post has been deleted.

or you could contact the private hospital yourself and find out how much it costs and pay the fee ?

Stark

Oh yeah sure, because cancer treatment costs less than the price of a pint these days... The consultant visits alone will probably cost you more than a year's insurance subscription.

Nermal

Do you guys actually *know* how long waiting lists are? or are you just guessing?

cailinoBAC

Well I was very happy when, at 23, I had to have a relatively simple day patient procdeure and I saw that it would have cost me €1000, which I would have been in no way able to pay at the time, and which would have ruined my travel plans for that year. At that stage I was paying for my own health insurance. Thankfully now my company pays it for me, and it's something I always look out for changing jobs. I know a few people who have ended up with serious bills because they decided they could do without it.

Sonnenblumen

krinpit wrote:

I did a quick search and I can't find any existing threads on this.

I have health insurance provided free by my employer. But is there any point in holding a private health insurance policy in this country, where access to health services is free of charge.

To keep the discussion relevent, I'm a 26 year old male (so no babies or old persons' diseases )

26 yr old and no experience of requiring medical assistance. Congratulations.
BTW you will soon realise on your first visit why it is so necessary to have PHI. Unfortunately with PHI, it is not longer sufficient to get access to the 'make me better club'. Shameful situation and the public health care system is a dysfunctional disaster zone.

Sonnenblumen

Nermal wrote:

Considering:

- Old people pay the same as young, i.e you're subsidising the coffin-dodgers (funny how they don't return the favour for motor eh?)

- Fees for the non-elective stuff are never going to amount to a significant fraction of your income

- If you're stuck on a waiting list you can go to the national treatment purchase fund

No, it's not worth it, unless you're dead set on going to the Blackrock clinic or don't want to share a room with the plebs or something.

But then you don't pay for it. It's obviously 'worth it' to keep it in that sense.

Did the 'coffin dodgers' help pay for your education or did you go to a pleb school?

BC

Nermal wrote:

Do you guys actually *know* how long waiting lists are? or are you just guessing?

I don't know what the story is currently however I was diagnosed with diabetes 5 years ago. My GP referred me to an endocrinologist for treatment. On the public system i was told i would have to wait 7 months for an appointment and it wouldn't be with the guy recommended by my GP. I went privately and got an appointment in two months with the guy i wanted.

krinpit

Sonnenblumen wrote:

26 yr old and no experience of requiring medical assistance. Congratulations.

You better not have jinxed me now

Stark

I know someone who was told they'd have to wait 6 months for a biopsy on the public system and got it in 1 week on the public system. I know of someone else who was told 6 months for an electrocardiogram and got it in 2 weeks through VHI. You're also more likely to be seen by a consultant rather than a junior doctor if you go private.

cailinoBAC

Plus, I might be wrong here, but is it the case that private health insurance won't cover you for pre existing conditions? So if you wait until you are sick, you might find it difficult to get insurance in the future...Maybe somebody can clarify this, it was just always the impression I had.

BC

cailinoBAC wrote:

Plus, I might be wrong here, but is it the case that private health insurance won't cover you for pre existing conditions? So if you wait until you are sick, you might find it difficult to get insurance in the future...Maybe somebody can clarify this, it was just always the impression I had.

Depends on the situation AFAIK. Some of them will cover it but you can't claim on the pre-existing illness for 5 years.

lomb

Ogham wrote:

Personally I think it's not worth it . If we had more income maybe I would bother with it. We could probably afford it now - but I just don't think it is really needed. I originally lived in the UK and private health insurance was fairly rare unless you were very well paid. There are slightly more costs here than in the UK - but not too bad. Max cost per annum for hospital stay is 600 euro (60 a night up to that max) . All tests and ops are free - it's just the possible longer wait. I did read last year that for some treatments - private waiting lists were longer than the public one. Also as pointed out earlier - in theory if you are waiting over 3 months the HSE should pay for the procedure to be done privately anyway (no cost to you).

people in the uk are used to put up with horrendous waiting lists and in some cases very poor quality of care just because some sleazy politician says with pride 'national health service'
i see an horrendous quality of dentistry done on the nhs everyday. i wouldnt wish it on my worst enemy..
i would go with the private option personally regardless of age. money well spent.

UrbanFox

It probably is worth it but it is bad value. A typical irish answer to a typical irish situation.

If you or a dependant gets a serious medical problem you will want the best you can get get a.s.a.p. People have died from delays caused by going through the public system mainly due to diagnostic delays.

Most people have private health insurance because they are scared shi*less by the inconsistent and awful service that the public system may provide according to where you live. I have had good experiences of the public system too but that was probably more to do with luck than a good system.

That said, the expression "health insurance" is a bad joke because it is not insurance in the true sense given the restrictions and limitations in cover.

The Germans seem to have it right. The day that we have a properly funded public health system is the day that VHI and their likes can be shut down and not a day too soon. Some chance however given our almost inexorable slide towards the inhuman American healthcare model.

Angus MacGyver

UrbanFox wrote:

It probably is worth it but it is bad value.

Well its certainly better value than America

http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/health/2005-09-14-family-health-policy_x.htm

And this article is two years old.

People in Ireland have to realise that a health insurance policy is not an investment

Angus MacGyver

cailinoBAC wrote:

Plus, I might be wrong here, but is it the case that private health insurance won't cover you for pre existing conditions? So if you wait until you are sick, you might find it difficult to get insurance in the future...Maybe somebody can clarify this, it was just always the impression I had.

Sorry for double post

Waiting periods are standard across all health insurers in Ireland They are dependant on age. Typical wp for a person aged under 55 is 26 weeks and wp for pre-existing illness is 5 years. This means that if you have a condition when you join then it is not covered for 5 years. Any treatment for the condition after 5 years is covered.

There are also upgrade rules for pre existing illness. So if you are on a low level of cover and are diagnosed with something and decide you want a higher level of cover there is a wp of two years for pre exiting.

Comparing it to car insurance - you cant be insured as a third party, crash your car and then ring up and decide to go fully comp to cover it.

Health Insurers in Ireland cant refuse anybody Health Insurance but impose wp. Its a community rated market which means that everyone pays the same price rather than risk rated (age, smoker, drinker,). The older you are the longer you have to wait before your fuuly covered.