Best Central Midfielder In The World?

An Citeog

jank wrote:

IMO Cesc will become one of the greatest midfielders of this generation, maybe even all time.

Sure his form is good now, but he was always a good player but his goals are are after putting him in the spotlight now. Alot of his work aswell goes unnoticed.

I agree with you here. He'll definitely become one of the greatest midfielders of his generation. He's got the ability, the mentality and the class for that. I just don't think greatness can be judged over a season or 2. He's probably the form midfielder at the moment but he's still got a lot to do to be up there with the likes of Xavi and Pirlo.

Vokes

Xavi6 wrote:

To be fair Elano would be in the 'attacking midfielder' category along with Kaka, Ronaldinho etc so I can see why he's not on the list.

But sure, Elano has played nearly every position (defence / defensive midfield / wing / attack) bar GK for his previous team, i think.

Would definitely stick him ahead of Diarra but there's other CMs who could be on the list as others have said.

Xavi6

SofaKing wrote:

But sure, Elano has played nearly every position (defence / defensive midfield / wing / attack) bar GK for his previous team, i think.

Ah well sure if we're going for versatility then I'll vote for John O'Sh1te. And he's even played in goal!

LuckyLloyd

cson wrote:

So by your rationale LuckyLloyd Djimi Traore could be considered a 'great' player because of his 2005 champions laegue medal?:eek:

Not even a little bit. Think a little harder.

cson

The point I'm trying to make to you is that mediocre players can amass a large collection of medals and trophies while great players can sometimes have a distinguised career yet win very little.

Over the past 12 months Fabregas has consistently turned in excellent often motm performances hence why imo he is the best central midfielder in the world today. He has many dimensions to his game, the fact that he hasn't won anything yet doesn't mean he isn't the best at this moment in time. Perhaps if I was looking for the best central midfielder of this generation then the trophies would come into it. But I'm not.

herbieflowers

yeah the medals...Fabregas'll leave the Arsenal soon enough to rectify that!

MrJoeSoap

cson wrote:

The point I'm trying to make to you is that mediocre players can amass a large collection of medals and trophies while great players can sometimes have a distinguised career yet win very little.

Over the past 12 months Fabregas has consistently turned in excellent often motm performances hence why imo he is the best central midfielder in the world today. He has many dimensions to his game, the fact that he hasn't won anything yet doesn't mean he isn't the best at this moment in time. Perhaps if I was looking for the best central midfielder of this generation then the trophies would come into it. But I'm not.

He's won an FA Cup!

LuckyLloyd

cson wrote:

The point I'm trying to make to you is that mediocre players can amass a large collection of medals and trophies while great players can sometimes have a distinguised career yet win very little.

Over the past 12 months Fabregas has consistently turned in excellent often motm performances hence why imo he is the best central midfielder in the world today. He has many dimensions to his game, the fact that he hasn't won anything yet doesn't mean he isn't the best at this moment in time. Perhaps if I was looking for the best central midfielder of this generation then the trophies would come into it. But I'm not.

Ok, I disagree. I think it is hard to find truly "great" players with little or no medals to their name; and vice - versa. There will be exceptions of course - but generally great players play for great teams.


Now, as to your second point, I appreciate that you think that Fabregas is the best in the world right now. Fine. I disagree and, as such, I have taken Gatusso. I believe I have already explained why that is.

MrJoeSoap

LuckyLloyd wrote:

Ok, I disagree. I think it is hard to find truly "great" players with little or no medals to their name

Matt Le Tissier, I win.

Pighead

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Matt Le Tissier, I win.

Georgie Kinkladze. I win too.
Alan Shearer only had one medal to speak of I think throughout his whole career.

kinaldo

LuckyLloyd wrote:

"pick one player in the world to play for your team at central midfield away from home in a champions league semi final?". I take Gatusso.

Reigning Champions away to Deportivio, 4-1 up from the 1st leg, Gattuso in the team, what could possibly go wrong?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/champions_league/3609737.stm

The most spineless performance ever. Granted it was only a quarter final.

LuckyLloyd

Pighead wrote:

Georgie Kinkladze. I win too.
Alan Shearer only had one medal to speak of I think throughout his whole career.

Kinkladze and Le Tessier weren't "great" players. lol. Shearer is an exception that helps to prove the rule.

Mr. Presentable

Another nonsense thread. Six of your top ten from EPL clubs - not seen anything else?

Pighead

LuckyLloyd wrote:

Kinkladze and Le Tessier weren't "great" players. lol. Shearer is an exception that helps to prove the rule.

Whats so funny? Both Tiss and Kinkladze were great players. For a couple of seasons in the mid 90's Kinkladze was untouchable. Most of the biggest clubs in Europe wanted to sign him.

I'm guessing you're in your late teens-early 20's Lloyd, would I be correct?

_blank_

nipplenuts wrote:

Six of your top ten from EPL clubs - not seen anything else?

Nothing else exists.

Where are the South American based central midfielders?

Peyton Manning

It was a joy watching Kinkladze. Signed him in Championship Manager all the time. Bit of a legend that chap is.

CivilServant

Vote for viera. Great passing, great tackling, very hard to get past and commands the centre of the pitch like no one else.

Peyton Manning

CivilServant wrote:

Vote for viera. Great passing, great tackling, very hard to get past and commands the centre of the pitch like no one else.

Except when he came up against Roy Keane

cson

nipplenuts wrote:

Another nonsense thread. Six of your top ten from EPL clubs - not seen anything else?

I've already admitted as much as that there are players that should be on the list that aren't, De Rossi and Iniesta and possibly Mikel Arteta are the ones I'd put on it in place of maybe Diarra and Lampard. But on the whole the premiership is now the leading league in Europe imo and I'm fully justified in picking 5/6 players from it. If you consider this a nonsense thread then don't post in it, simple as.

kinaldo

Archimedes wrote:

Except when he came up against Roy Keane

Another selective memory which I'd say is based solely on the 4-2 result at Highbury

cson

I miss those matches, some fantastic matches over those 8 or so years. Great rivalry Keane V Vieira, theres nothing really like it nowadays imo.

Smegball

Would you's classify Diego as a central midfielder? He's top class I think.

Smegball

kinaldo wrote:

Another selective memory which I'd say is based solely on the 4-2 result at Highbury

I thought Keane always outperformed Vieira in those tussles, maybe I'm just biased though

KdjaCL

cson wrote:

I'm after watching the highlights of the champions league tonight and in anaylsing the Arsenal game Ronnie Whelan on RTÉ said he considers Cesc Fabregas to be the best central midfielder in the world. Quite a claim. However, having thought about it I'd have to agree with him. Maybe I have the blinkers on but I think he's got a terrific all round game, especially so far this season. Unbelievable for a player so. Nevertheless I'll let this season pan out before I make any definitive judgment on him. If he starts as he means to continue....then wow.

What does everyone else think?

Edit: I'm not including attacking midfielders such as Kaka and Ronaldinho

Central Midfielder = a player who can defend, who can create, who can pass and who can score, who can dictate the pace of a game.

Cesc winning ti for me none of the others can do all of the above consistently ie 1 Essien thunderbolt a season does not make him a scorer.

Altho is Essien added goals and better passing to his game he be a close 2nd.

kdjac

iloveireland

He wasnt mentioned in the polls and I havnt looked through the whole thread but i dont think anyone has mentioned him at all. He Won the World cup and the champions league last year and was probably the most influential player on his team both times.

eirebhoy

iloveireland wrote:

He wasnt mentioned in the polls and I havnt looked through the whole thread but i dont think anyone has mentioned him at all. He Won the World cup and the champions league last year and was probably the most influentiol player on his team both times.

Yeah he has been mentioned. Kaka is Milan's best player but Pirlo is their most important player imo. If he's on form, Milan are on form.

MrJoeSoap

LuckyLloyd wrote:

Kinkladze and Le Tessier weren't "great" players.

Theres a scale from 1-100 you see.

1 Absolutely God awful
2 Woeful
3 Crap
4 Poor
5 Mediocre
6 Average
7 Above Average
8 Good
9 Very Good
10 Great
11 Exceptional
100 Le Tissier

Pighead

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Theres a scale from 1-100 you see.

1 Absolutely God awful
2 Woeful
3 Crap
4 Poor
5 Mediocre
6 Average
7 Above Average
8 Good
9 Very Good
10 Great
11 Exceptional
100 Le Tissier

Excellent!

cson

iloveireland wrote:

He wasnt mentioned in the polls and I havnt looked through the whole thread but i dont think anyone has mentioned him at all. He Won the World cup and the champions league last year and was probably the most influential player on his team both times.

I didn't add Kaka and I mentioned why in my OP. KdjaCL summed up well what a centre mid is.

MrJoeSoap

Pighead wrote:

Excellent!

Chris Marsden and Francis Benali come in somewhere around 72 on the scale as well.

cson

Claaus Lundekvam?

Pighead

KdjaCL wrote:

Central Midfielder = a player who can defend, who can create, who can pass and who can score, who can dictate the pace of a game.

Sorry but thats bollox. Most of the great midfielders of the last 20 years couldn't do all of those things. Zidane couldn't defend, Riquelme sure as hell couldn't. Keane didn't score too many, nor did Viera. There are very very few midfielders who can do all of the above.

KdjaCL

eirebhoy wrote:

Yeah he has been mentioned. Kaka is Milan's best player but Pirlo is their most important player imo. If he's on form, Milan are on form.

No one does backwards DMF and the other does forwards AMF, they are not a complete CMF.

Tbh there isnt many complete CMFs ever in the world, a CMF is a complete footballer someone who does everything perfectly, without the need for another to hide their weaknesses.

kdjac

KdjaCL

Pighead wrote:

Sorry but thats bollox. Most of the great midfielders of the last 20 years couldn't do all of those things. Zidane couldn't defend, Riquelme sure as hell couldn't. Keane didn't score too many, nor did Viera. There are very very few midfielders who can do all of the above.

^^^ see above post.

There are very few players who are CMFs and good ones at that, redonda of Real/Ac would be one who spring to mind.

Zidane doesnt to defending, keane couldnt shoot, Viera also couldnt shoot, riquelme is a player you afford with a DMF behind them.


kdjac

Pepe LeFrits

Zidane and Riquelme aren't central midfielders. They play(ed) in the hole or out wide, with central midfielders behind them in the engine room.

Pighead

Pepe LeFrits wrote:

Zidane and Riquelme aren't central midfielders. They play(ed) in the hole or out wide, with central midfielders behind them in the engine room.

Zidane has played centre midfield plenty of times buddy.

~Rebel~

cson wrote:

I didn't add Kaka and I mentioned why in my OP. KdjaCL summed up well what a centre mid is.

he was talking about Pirlo judging by the won the world cup last year comment. Awesome player, and while he doesn't do as much tackling as most in the, still possibly deserves a spot.

KdjaCL

Pighead wrote:

Zidane has played centre midfield plenty of times buddy.

Yes for real madrid oh he defended to the death for them and how they reaped the rewards of him in midfield seems when they let Makele go it didnt go to well, and for Juve he had 1 DMF behind him and an excellent back 4.


kdjac

Vokes

Not sure about Juve.

But for Real didn't Zidane need 2 CMs behind him. Same with France with Deschamps / Petit / Viera.

_blank_

Central Midfield is a two man job.

One player to do the dirty work, break up play and be a general nuisance to the opposition. One player to get on the breaking ball, go forward and be a playmaker/create and score goals.

If you can get a pairing that can do both, cover each other's position and allow each other to go on the offensive while sitting back themselves, you'd have a pretty solid midfield imo.

This is, of course, in a 4-4-2.

In the current game teams are deploying two DMFs, and an in-the-hole player with a lead-the-line striker beyond him.

Vokes

So you reckon its safe to say that at the top level the traditional 2 CM setup with both able to attack and defend has died out in the past 5 / 10 years?

Although it would interesting to see if Essien / Cesc paired up could pull it off. Both taking it in turns to attack and defend in equal measure the middle of a tradional 4-4-2.

Bounty Hunter

DesF wrote:

Central Midfield is a two man job.

One player to do the dirty work, break up play and be a general nuisance to the opposition. One player to get on the breaking ball, go forward and be a playmaker/create and score goals.

If you can get a pairing that can do both, cover each other's position and allow each other to go on the offensive while sitting back themselves, you'd have a pretty solid midfield imo.

thats why Riquelme who dosent really defend is argueably a CM as that is were he often plays paired with a Mascherano etc type player

cson

Petit and Vieira were a good example also Keane and Scholes were good.

_blank_

cson wrote:

Keane and Scholes were good.

Understatement of the century.

Pepe LeFrits

SofaKing wrote:

So you reckon its safe to say that at the top level the traditional 2 CM setup with both able to attack and defend has died out in the past 5 / 10 years?

Although it would interesting to see if Essien / Cesc paired up could pull it off. Both taking it in turns to attack and defend in equal measure the middle of a tradional 4-4-2.

No, I don't think so. Those type of pairings are still very common, but you never get two players who share defensive and offensive responsibilities entirely equally. Fabregas and Flamini is a good example - both are basically box-to-box midfielders capable of defending and attacking but Fabregas is more capable offensively, while Flamini is more capable defensively.

I think the distinction between purely defensive midfielders and 'luxury' attacking midfield players is more of a continental thing really. Neither type are particularly effective in a 4-4-2 prevalent in the PL.

_blank_

Take Chelsea for example.

Essien/Lampard.

Franko is devoid of any defensive capabilities whatsoever, so Essien sits back and protects the defence.

I'll give the Boards Team as another example.

I have a player who just sits in front of the defence and does all the donkey work (sorry Shay) and we're into our third campaign and he's never scored. If he does score he'll get a bollocking, because he has no business being that far up the field.

I also have another player who I allow to get forward and push on into the oppo box, he doesn't have as many defensive duties, because once he gets on the ball he creates, which is wasted in the part of the field (imo).

KdjaCL

Bounty Hunter wrote:

thats why Riquelme who dosent really defend is argueably a CM as that is were he often plays paired with a Mascherano etc type player

Mascherano and Cambiasso for ARG.

I think the distinction between purely defensive midfielders and 'luxury' attacking midfield players is more of a continental thing really. Neither type are particularly effective in a 4-4-2 prevalent in the PL.

Altho Scholes is god and i bow before him he couldnt tackle for ****, him and cesc would be like for like cept cesc can tackle.

Seriously there are not many complete CMFs cesc is on of them, Redonda is another , most pairings in the PL are a like for like WITH wingers to do the attacking so Petit and Viera got away with lack of creativity as they had overmars, keane and scholes also with Giggs and fact their CBs could play a ball out to them help a lot with decent attacking RB and LB.


kdjac

KdjaCL

DesF wrote:

Take Chelsea for example.

Essien/Lampard.

Franko is devoid of any defensive capabilities whatsoever, so Essien sits back and protects the defence.

bad example chelsea play 3 in midfield to allow lampard to be **** and score a deflected shot every now and again.

Essien makele/Mikel lampard


kdjac

tdv

Pirlo & Seedorf arent really central midfielders tho.

_blank_

KdjaCL wrote:

bad example chelsea play 3 in midfield to allow lampard to be **** and score a deflected shot every now and again.

Essien makele/Mikel lampard


kdjac

Dammit. I should watch more premiership I suppose.

My other example was good though

You know.