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The DAW Poll 07/08
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11-10-2007 7:24pm#1
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I'm a Live user of 2 years, and I love Ableton Live. But since events of the last month, Logic is looking more and more tempting.
Quite astonishingly, within the same month, Apple release Logic Studio, a full recording solution with tons of sample content, various great synths and samplers... then a couple of weeks later, Ableton announce Live 7, with few improvements on the core software, and a bundle of expensive new extras.
It would obviously be a big step to move to Logic Pro, but it might be wise to accept the enevitable sooner rather than later. Wether I sell my Live licence or not is something I'd have to decide much later
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Cubase for me.
Seems to be massive movement within "dance circles" towars Reason as the all in one solution but I guess Im just kinda auld and set in me ways.
Iv messed around with Reason before and its cool but I think I'll be sticking with old reliable or unreliables as it is during some updates!
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Not much love for Reason here - i just upgraded to 4 and have to say i like the new editions - especially Thor. Might look into Ableton though, got Lite with some hardware i bought, might give it a whirl - a lot of the big names in Electronic circles seem to be using it
The guy who engineered/produced the first album on our label used Ableton. I was quiet shocked at first as Id always thought of it more of a fun toy than a serious recording tool, just shows what I know!
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I've a Mac Pro and bought Ableton 6 as I could never get my head around Cubase when I had a PC..
I didnt consider Logic 7 as I could not afford it at the time.
The last 6 months with Ableton has taught me exactaly what cannot be done with the program and has made me realise that I need to move on.
When it comes out, Live 7 is going to have sidechaining.. and thats the only big thing about it really as far as I can see.
Reason 4 is out now, and has one new synth and an appegiator.. No new FX.
Its time people see these programs for what they are.. great for quick idea's / good for a hobby.
Both companies are holding back the features that their users want as they can keep leeching upgrade money out of the likes of you and me forever. You will always be upgrading unless you step outside of the ring.
Logic Express 8 is €199!! Lots of serious synths and amazing effects. I've had it a week now.. getting to grips with it fine and it will definitely be the last bit of kit that I will need to buy for a long time to come. It also has lots of intuitive menus for every single task that you could think of..
People use Live for "Beat-repeat" - and thats it. The reat of the bundled effects in Live are rubbish - they wont be good enough for a long time yet.. Its still a long long way off something like Cubase or Logic.
Its good for DJ'ing alright and having a laugh with.
Your software should compliment your ideas..help you get them out fast and effectively.
Ableton, and to some extent Reason are so basic, stripped down and featureless, that if you try to do anything which is not an immediate or inbuilt feature you will begin such a wasteful convoluted procedure, that its hardly worth your while to bother completing it. Thats the f*cking killer everytime. You should only be worried about making the tune.
F*ck Ableton and F*ck Propellerheads.
If you have a PC - Get a couple of VST's - keep your old version of Reason and get Cubase
If you have a Mac - same - but get Logic Express 8. You wont regret it.
Apologies for the rant.. its late and I'm tired.
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I've a Mac Pro and bought Ableton 6 as I could never get my head around Cubase when I had a PC..
I didnt consider Logic 7 as I could not afford it at the time.
The last 6 months with Ableton has taught me exactaly what cannot be done with the program and has made me realise that I need to move on.
When it comes out, Live 7 is going to have sidechaining.. and thats the only big thing about it really as far as I can see.
Reason 4 is out now, and has one new synth and an appegiator.. No new FX.
Its time people see these programs for what they are.. great for quick idea's / good for a hobby.
Both companies are holding back the features that their users want as they can keep leeching upgrade money out of the likes of you and me forever. You will always be upgrading unless you step outside of the ring.
Logic Express 8 is €199!! Lots of serious synths and amazing effects. I've had it a week now.. getting to grips with it fine and it will definitely be the last bit of kit that I will need to buy for a long time to come. It also has lots of intuitive menus for every single task that you could think of..
People use Live for "Beat-repeat" - and thats it. The reat of the bundled effects in Live are rubbish - they wont be good enough for a long time yet.. Its still a long long way off something like Cubase or Logic.
Its good for DJ'ing alright and having a laugh with.
Your software should compliment your ideas..help you get them out fast and effectively.
Ableton, and to some extent Reason are so basic, stripped down and featureless, that if you try to do anything which is not an immediate or inbuilt feature you will begin such a wasteful convoluted procedure, that its hardly worth your while to bother completing it. Thats the f*cking killer everytime. You should only be worried about making the tune.
F*ck Ableton and F*ck Propellerheads.
If you have a PC - Get a couple of VST's - keep your old version of Reason and get Cubase
If you have a Mac - same - but get Logic Express 8. You wont regret it.
Apologies for the rant.. its late and I'm tired.
Jeepers what a coincidence. I got fed up of ableton last week and got logic pro 8. I don't think i could use ableton seriously as a production tool anymore. They were really going in the right direction over the past few years, but they just have not caught up with the likes of logic.
Still good for djing, messing around etc.0 -
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Tell that to the countless producers who have dance/house tracks produced wholly in Live, flying off the digital shelves on Beatport.
Hello Womoma.. Absoutely - Thats a fact.. They are doing it and we (certainally I..) are not.
I no longer buy vinyl and use Beatport at least once a week. There is no doubt that there are a lot tracks that you hear and think "Wow!" - but at the same time too, there is a lot of rubbish on it too.
If I had a € for every p*ss poor average track with that 1-2-3 1-2-3 (triplet?) bassline, with Beat repeat over the drumloop instead of actually programming the drums then I'd be rich.
There is a lot of amazing jaw droppingly great stuff on Beatport. Fantastic for getting new idea's and working out structures etc.. Its so cheap and you have 2 minutes-ish to preview.. you dont even have to buy!
But there are a huge amount of tunes that cannot compete with the sound of the more established producers. A giveaway - sometimes - is that certain tracks are not available as .wav, so they end up a smaller and more compressed .mp3 only download. Dont get me wrong - I've bought these tunes too.. but I personally would not be happy with that.
Top this with a load of crunchy 16bit drum samples from the likes of Vengance - and the end sound quality IMO suffers.
Compare some tracks and you will hear it. Some stuff is obviously overloading and distorting. Sometimes Beatport is more about quantity, not quality.. but that's ike any Music store that you will go to, isnt it?
Ableton is a tool.. same as Reason. Some great features - but certainily not the whole package. Money is always an influencing factor. You will actually find that majority of succesful acts who are using Live are only using it as a production tool.. and actually have everything going into Logic or Cubase. Not everyone of course, but the majority would rewire Live into something a bit more grown up.
People are using it from start to finish.. and that is fine too. Its amazing how humans can triumph in the face of adversity!! lol
With Logic 8 being such good value all of a sudden, I believe that we will now see another "jump" in many Musicians personal evolution. Hopefully its similar to the effect which Ableton has had on Dance Music up to now.0 -
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