The DAW Poll 07/08

ICN

empirix wrote: »

personally i disagree, i have heard a lot of good stuff done with Reason using no loops - "a guy called gerald", i use loops a lot now but i make em myself - nothing wrong with it in my book, i am still a long way off getting things right but anything can be done with these programs these days, its in the users hands - talent is the key.

The prodigys last album was done using Reason 3, although it was muck in my book, it still shows what can be done if you know your stuff!

Interview with L Howlett from Keyboardmag.

"After his night sessions in his bedroom (Laptop & Reason), he’d bring the fresh tracks to the studio and say, “This is what I did last night. Bang! The tracks would explode out of the speakers.” Things had to be tweaked, but once he had the basic demo, he could export it to Pro Tools, then do overdubs with his analog gear and lay down vocals. As he progressed, Howlett found some of the sounds from the Reason soft synths less satisfactory. “I might have used the soft synths from Reason on the demo tracks, but I would never have used them on the finished track. They don’t have the warmth that the analog s**t’s got.”

Even Liam Howlett has his doubts.. There is no denying that Reason / Live are great sketchpads.. However, you need to have have them feeding into something eventually.

Luke Viberts Kerrier District album and last Wagon Christ LP were made totally on Reason. Have to say that I thought they were really bad at the time.

When I found out that he did them only using Reason, I said to myself "Ahh haa.." He was great using the Atari - Reason just doesnt have the depth on its own.

Luke still brings the tracks off to be mastered.. Obviously he isnt satisfied with the Mclass!!

empirix

yeah i somewhat agree there but i think the new synth Thor thats in Reason 4 kicks ass big time, it sounds great, Reason 4 has taken a big leap with this synth, i wasn't very impressed with the Subtractor and Malstom synths in it before, i actually nearly have a few tracks finished using the Thor synth, i'll post em up soon, just to give an idea of its power

Actuyally started to use Renoise, its a tracker production program, liking it so far but is a bit complicated, generating some nice sounds with it too, check it out, only costs $50 - its kinda an open source thing, pretty cool

Saccadianjay

Pro-tools LE 6.4 all the way baby!

Helix

software: cubase sx3
hardware: akai mpc4000

Helix

also, sorry to be anal, but reason's not really a daw is it

Helix

Helix wrote: »

Luke still brings the tracks off to be mastered.. Obviously he isnt satisfied with the Mclass!!

nobody should master their own stuff anyway

Helix

womoma wrote: »

Tell that to the countless producers who have dance/house tracks produced wholly in Live, flying off the digital shelves on Beatport.

but ableton is an absolute dog compared to logic or cubase for midi based stuff

yes you can get results, but you can get results in notepad too

the thing is, why put yourself through hardships having to do tonnes more work just to get things sounding acceptable. its a waste of creative time

the likes of ableton and reason are grand when theyre rewired, but when theyre not they can be a bit touch and go unless youre an extremely set in your ways power user, and even then you have issues

empirix

Helix wrote: »

but ableton is an absolute dog compared to logic or cubase for midi based stuff

yes you can get results, but you can get results in notepad too

the thing is, why put yourself through hardships having to do tonnes more work just to get things sounding acceptable. its a waste of creative time

the likes of ableton and reason are grand when theyre rewired, but when theyre not they can be a bit touch and go unless youre an extremely set in your ways power user, and even then you have issues

Guess i am anal

Software: Reason 4, Renoise(only getting to grips with this baby, but impressed)

Audacity, Recycle

Thats everything i use - am i a loser, tried Ableton but didn't like it at all, are Logic and Cubase really that good! Personally i am considering going with Renoise in the long run if i don't get the sounds i'm after in reason.

jimi_t

Helix wrote: »

but ableton is an absolute dog compared to logic or cubase for midi based stuff

Why so?

I'm using the stepsequencer from an Electribe ER-1 to program my drums using Impulse, recording takes doing my group mutes in realtime. My Tascam US-428 is used as my control surface, while ableton sequences outboard gear and routes it back in through the Tascam. Minimal hassle, minimal latency (and minimal techno ).

Granted, criticism about the mixing capabilities of Ableton are valid, I find no problem with the MIDI integration.

Helix

jimi_t wrote: »

Why so?

its just horrible

now thats me coming from years of cubase, but its just nowhere near as flexible and doesnt me offer what i need anywhere near as immediately as it should, therefore is a workflow drain

making software like ableton simple and user friendly is great, but it buries any of the more advanced stuff miles away in the background

Helix

empirix wrote: »

Guess i am anal

Software: Reason 4, Renoise(only getting to grips with this baby, but impressed)

Audacity, Recycle

Thats everything i use - am i a loser, tried Ableton but didn't like it at all, are Logic and Cubase really that good! Personally i am considering going with Renoise in the long run if i don't get the sounds i'm after in reason.

logic and cubase are professional tools, reason is to an extent, but really only rewired so you can lose the reason sound

now granted theyve done great work with the audio engine in the last 2 versions, but its still a bit... well... reason sounding

Moojuice

Pro-Tools Mpowered (Project Mix) is my main program. I also use reason 4 for a few things and abelton lite (the time stretch function is its best feature). You can get some good sounds out of both and I have a few really good refills. But whatever I use I ALWAYS bring it into Pro-tools to mix, master and edit as the Pro-tools audio engine kicks the ass off anything else out there. I have also moved up to 24bit 96Khz as my basic recording bit rate and sample rate. But yeah PRO-TOOLS all the way!!!! I will be getting a mac soon so I might look into Logic though the last time I used it I found it horrible to use.

Ardent

Cubase SX 3. Yer only man.

empirix

Cubase any good for DnB production - fresh sounds?

Helix

no sounds in cubase

thats what vsts are for

squibs

Cubase any good for DnB production - fresh sounds?

I think at this stage most DAWs can do any style well. The clunkiest of them is probably FL Studio as it uses a kooky interface, but there are still people using it as their primary choice of DAW for orchestral scoring.

edit: How come FL Studio isn't listed in the poll?

JimiTime

Pro-Tools LE

ICN

squibs wrote: »

edit: How come FL Studio isn't listed in the poll?

Why should it be listed in the poll?

FL is something which people begin on.. Its just a phase, or right of passage!!!

cornbb

ICN wrote: »

Why should it be listed in the poll?

FL is something which people begin on.. Its just a phase, or right of passage!!!

Not necessarily, I know a guy who's been making lots of great tunes with FL as his main DAW software, teamed with some good VSTs and unusual stuff like Csound. Haven't used it myself but he swears by it as a cheap and functional solution.

AFAIK it wasn't included in the poll as the maximum number of options is already taken and it didn't make the cut

Woohoo, I see Cubase has overtaken Pro Tools

condra

There werent enough options, but yeah it probably should have been there instead of MOTU DP, which doesnt seem to be popular here in Oirelind.

squibs

Why should it be listed in the poll?

FL is something which people begin on.. Its just a phase, or right of passage!!!

I don't think I've ever said this on a discussion forum anywhere before:

You are wrong.

I'll wager I've been using software sequencers/DAWs longer than you. I even wrote one for a Z80 powered Sharp home computer. I still use FL Studio for the parts Sonar can't reach. I often use it as a VSTi within Sonar. Try that in your Cube Tools!

Most people who dismiss it have often either never used it or played with a pirated copy and not given it the time they would have invested if they had paid for it.

cornbb/womoma - I'm actually surprised my baby (Sonar) made it into the polls. Historically the yanks used Sonar and the Europeans used Cubase. Wonder if that's changing?

Helix

out of curiosity, what can fruity do that sonar cant?

squibs

For a start, it can load as a VSTi in other DAWs

Off the top of my head - and I'm probably missing the big stuff:

The piano roll support for chords, splitting, strumming, arpeggiation, and lots more. Although I don't like the FL piano roll, it gives better options for midi mangling.

The native plugins Edison ( a wave editor in an effexts slot ), equo, love philter, flangus, vocoder (in conjunction with speech synth ir really rocks)

The formula controller - bye bye lfos!

I know that some of the above can be bolted on as fx or VSTis but you'll need to go payware for stuff of similar quality. And I'm not aware of anything like EQUO or Love Philter on the market.

Helix

jesus, sonar sounds pretty limited

squibs

It's not - feature spec is about equivalent with cubase. Cakewalk wouldn't survive otherwise.

It seems to me that you are just trolling. You've come in and said what you used without coherently explaining what makes it better. You've then p***ed on ableton, reason and sonar with justifications like "its just horrible".

I'm done with this thread. Thanks.

Helix

i use reason and ableton, i pissed on neither. theyre both great tools at what they do well, but poor at what they dont do well so are very limited as stand alone systems

the fact that sonar cant do the things you mentioned would have it down as pretty limited in my books

no arp? no chords on piano roll?

wtf like?

im not trolling or anything like it, why would anyone troll about bloody DAWs ffs

empirix

Helix out of curiosity are you using Reason 4, theres a patch that james Bernard has made for production purposes, its available on the website for free - "Multiband toolbox, check it out

condra

I included Sonar because the amount of Sonar cracks out there are only rivalled by the likes of Photoshop. Thought it would be more popular though.

CornB, Feel free to replace MOTU with FL studio, but I still doubt either will be represented by more than a couple of people.

So far, Im surprised that Live and Reason are not more popular, but then again, this is not a dance music recording forum.

Regardless, the point of the poll, for me at least, was just to see a representation of what is used, rather than to dispute which software is better.

I thought by now most people would agree that we've living in an age of super-computers and very powerfull audio software, and it is best to use the software which suits your style, workflow, budget etc.

cornbb

womoma wrote: »

CornB, Feel free to replace MOTU with FL studio, but I still doubt either will be represented by more than a couple of people.

There's not much point in replacing anything, we would need 50 poll options to cover everything out there. energyXT, Adobe Audition, Garageband, Ardour, Traktion, Reaper and Rosegarden are a few more that didn't make the cut. Plus I doubt anyone here uses only one DAW for everything they do.

So far, Im surprised that Live and Reason are not more popular, but then again, this is not a dance music recording forum.

True, I imagine they'd dominate a similar poll in the Electronic & DJing forum.

Regardless, the point of the poll, for me at least, was just to see a representation of what is used, rather than to dispute which software is better.

I thought by now most people would agree that we've living in an age of super-computers and very powerfull audio software, and it is best to use the software which suits your style, workflow, budget etc.

Discussions of DAW preferences always seem to get a bit passionate here for some reason! Its interesting to see what people are into anyway.

ICN

squibs wrote: »

I don't think I've ever said this on a discussion forum anywhere before:

You are wrong.

I'll wager I've been using software sequencers/DAWs longer than you.

I even wrote one for a Z80 powered Sharp home computer. (ZZZZZZzzzzz..... Yawn!!)

I still use FL Studio for the parts Sonar can't reach. I often use it as a VSTi within Sonar. Try that in your Cube Tools!

Most people who dismiss it have often either never used it or played with a pirated copy and not given it the time they would have invested if they had paid for it.

cornbb/womoma - I'm actually surprised my baby (Sonar) made it into the polls. Historically the yanks used Sonar and the Europeans used Cubase. Wonder if that's changing?

We'll agree to disagree Squid - We're right & you're wrong.

I will have you know that I have been using sequencers since the year Nineteen hundred and forty three.

I was based in Bletchley Park in Great Britain (during WWII..), where along with a team of Boffins - I was involved in the construction of a top secret super-sequencer, which was hooked up to a Nazi Enigma machine to make what you young 'un's would now call "tunes".

... or am I just a waffler?

I'm done with this thread.. Oh no!