Special Needs Assistant

TheDriver

Long time since we had some action on this thread! Talking of which, our snas were in all last week twiddling their thumbs coz it says so in their contracts and the Principal made them come in. Is this true?

okgirl

OMG, that is awful. I can't believe they were brought in during the mid term to do nothing. I am not aware of that in the contract or terms of employment but I will check it out. I do know that when the school finish up at the end of JUne the SNA is contracted to the end of June ie. same as national schools. So schools bring the SNA's in during this time to do 'odd jobs' or help with exams but most schools do not as they would view it to be a bit unfair to the SNA. Although it is in the contract I would imagine it would cause bad feeling if the SNA did not wish to do 'odd job's' etc. I am lucky that it is not expected.

So the SNA's in your school did not get their mid term break? Very disappointing I have to say. A good Sna can be hard to get and mis treating them could end up with them seeking employment elsewhere.

spurious

TheDriver wrote: »

Long time since we had some action on this thread! Talking of which, our snas were in all last week twiddling their thumbs coz it says so in their contracts and the Principal made them come in. Is this true?

That is ludicrous. Does your Principal have some sort of mental disorder?

The end of year generally has a lot of work needing to be done - updating materials, ordering stuff etc., but to drag people in during a week when neither the kids nor the teachers are there is very strange indeed.

okgirl

Just checked the Dept of Ed contract for post primary school....

2.12. Holiday periods will normally be those which apply to the schools to which the Special Needs Assistants have been assigned. In addition you are required to be available for a couple of days at the start and finish of each school term. These days (12 in total) may be combined at the discretion of school management to be utilised flexibly throughout the year for work appropriate to the grade including training. These days will not exceed five consecutive days and will immediately follow or precede school terms or occur within a couple of days thereof.
2.13 You will also be required to work the month of June on examinations or other work appropriate to the grade including training.


Clearly the contract is leaving it at the discretion of the Principal. I am glad I do not work in that school!

TheDriver

you probably wouldn't be the first! On asking the sna about it, she indeed confirmed what you said regarding extra days that must be made up though they admitted they got some work done after all as I am unsure if ours come in during June and hence benefit from a longer summer holiday overall.

angry sna

ok im an sna and i cover books clean spills off d floor tidy presses ect every day!!i do d teachers dirty work basically!!with little interaction with d children!! i hav qualifications and this is just not a job 2 me this is my career i feel like im soo worthless!! i did more things on my work exp wen i was 16!! ther shud b a course for teachers about the role of an sna
oh is ther ne1 else out there who feels like their bn takn advantage of??? i dnt mind helpn out n doin odd jobs as PART of my job(and if d teachers do them 2) just dnt appreciate it AS my job!!!

angry sna

oh n yes i had 2 go in2 school 2 days at xmas n 1 at easter to clean up d classrooms n tidy up d mess d teachers left bhind bcoz they knew we wud b in ovr d hols!!

Tom Dunne

angry sna wrote: »

ok im an sna and i cover books clean spills off d floor tidy presses ect every day!!i do d teachers dirty work basically!!with little interaction with d children!! i hav qualifications and this is just not a job 2 me this is my career i feel like im soo worthless!! i did more things on my work exp wen i was 16!! ther shud b a course for teachers about the role of an sna

Ok, a few pointers:

1: Ranting here will get you no respect. Honest, informed, adult discussion will. If you want to discuss job conditions and get other opinions, start a thread for yourself.

2: Text speak will get you even less respect, so please refrain from using it.

okgirl

angry sna, you should join Impact if you feel you are being unfairly treated. Failing that a possible change of employer, as in school. They are not all that unfair to work for.

However, I do fully agree with Tom Dunne. You really should re-read your post and reflect.

I hope you get some job satisfaction soon, as I have found it can be a very rewarding and challanging job.

TheDriver

On what angry SNA says, she is correct on one aspect regarding teachers learning on what to do with an SNA but thats no excuse for a rant. I personally would feel reflection on the ability to write a fair composed and non text speak proposal of what she would like to see changed.
OK Girl, think you need a prize for most resurrected thread on boards!!

angry sna

Just to let people know, it was not my intention to come accross as ranting I was simply filling everybody in on what my job entails each day!! I am new to this and didnt realise text speaking was not acceptable here!!so I apolagise!I am not online for long so it is quicker for me!!
I know the job is rewarding its not the job i have a problem with its the fact that some schools take advantage of having an extra pair of hands around and also dont know what to do with a sna!!
Also its not the easiest of jobs to find at the moment so I am keeping an eye out!!
I am looking into joining impact with some other sna's.

Tom Dunne

There is no need to apologise. We all need to let off steam every now and then. I felt I had to point out to you txt speak is much frowned upon. For what it's worth, that last post is a hell of a lot easier to read.

Welcome to the forum.

angry sna

thanks !!Im still finding my way around on here and im not to sure if im replying correctly yet so I have a lot of learning to do

TheDriver

We're hearing you loud and clear! One thing you need to know is most teachers feel they are being used by the system and minister too and have lots of gripes so don't feel its just snas that have gripes in schools. SNAs were suddenly bestowed upon us in my school and we don't know what to do with them to be honest and one is a fair cow who puts all our backs up by telling us how to teach people so we are somewhat sceptical at the moment but culture change takes time in Ireland.
We look forward to your contributions in this forum, its good to have decent debates here!

lou-cooney

I feel there is a lot of confusion as to what exactly is the role of the SNA, this is not the fault of teachers or the SNA's themselves, i feel the department is at fault for not propperly defining the job. Not in all cases, but definitly in the majority, SNA's lack a lot of respect from the goverment/Department and this is Transfered onto the Teaching staff.

angry sna

I totally agree with you,we have no definate job description so therfore teachers dont no what to do with us and i fully understand this!I also dont know my role!! Its a very random day for me!!It can be quiet uncomfortable!!My main concern is that I am employed to assist with children with special needs ie. adhd and kids with learning difficulties ect but I do not spend time doing this and I am interestd to know if any other sna's are in a simillar situation!!The kids that need help are loosing out because I am not there to assist!!This worries me!! Oh and i fully understand that some snas are out to change th world but I am not one of them,I would just like to have a productive day!!

gaeilgegrinds

Is it this particular S.N.A. or just in general? If it is the particular S.N.A. perhaps the teachers has a reason but otherwise I can't imagine why this scenario would arise. I've an S.N.A. in almost half my classes, works fantastically well & the students benefit immensely.

angry sna

No its not just me in particular!!I get on well with the teachers and children in the school!!
I have friends who are snas in other schools and cant believe the type of days I have!!Its a very boring day when it has no flow and has no aim!! I really dont know where I stand in this situation it is very awkward

angry sna

gaeilgegrinds wrote: »

Is it this particular S.N.A. or just in general? If it is the particular S.N.A. perhaps the teachers has a reason but otherwise I can't imagine why this scenario would arise. I've an S.N.A. in almost half my classes, works fantastically well & the students benefit immensely.

Can I ask you does your sna work with the children in your class??what is your sna's main role in your classes

J.R.

angry sna wrote: »

Can I ask you does your sna work with the children in your class??what is your sna's main role in your classes

SNA contract of employment

2.8. The nature of the work to be performed by you at the direction of the Principal or other senior person acting on behalf of the Employer is as set out in Appendix 1 attached hereto.


This was attached to the contract to be signed.

APPENDIX 1

Special Needs Assistants are recruited specifically to assist schools in providing the necessary non–teaching services to pupils with assessed educational needs. Their duties are assigned by the Principal acting on behalf of the Board of Management. Their work is supervised either by the Principal or another teacher as determined by the Principal. Those duties involve tasks of a non-teaching nature such as:

1. Preparation and tidying up of classrooms.
2. Assisting school children to board and alight from school buses. Where necessary travel as escort during school hours on school buses may be required.
3. Special assistance as necessary for children with particular difficulties e.g. helping special needs pupils with typing or writing or computers or other use of equipment.
4. Assistance with clothing, feeding, toileting and general hygiene and being mindful of health and safety needs of the pupil.
5. Assisting on out-of-school visits, walks, examinations and similar activities.
6. Assisting the teachers in the supervision of pupils during assembly, recreation and dispersal from the classroom for one reason or another.
7. Accompanying individuals or small groups who may have to be withdrawn temporarily from the classroom for one reason or another.
8. General assistance to the class teachers, under the direction of the Principal, with duties of a non-teaching nature. (Special Needs Assistants may not act as either substitute or temporary teachers. In no circumstances may they be left in sole charge of a class or group of children).
9. Participation with school development planning, where appropriate, and co-operation with any such changes with policies and practices arising from the school development process.
10. Engagement with parents of special needs pupils in both formal and informal structures as required and directed by school management.
11. Other duties appropriate to the grade as may be determined by the needs of the pupils and the school from time to time. Special Needs Assistants may be re-assigned to other work appropriate to the grade when special needs pupils are absent or when particular urgent work demands arise.

angry sna

Yes that is in my contract allright as it is the contract from the department but as it says above the duties are set out by the principal and teachers and im not sure they fully read that contract or if they did they are not using it as a guideline.Now dont get me wrong I do not mind setting up the classrooms for activities or tidying up after them but I am not too happy about cleaning all day long!Its very very boring!I feel like I am very stuck,I dont feel like I can say NO to certain things I am asked to do because I would not like to "disturb the peace" because sna's in my experince dont have a valuable opinon and i would fear loosing my job for questioning them!would you have any advice?? That is why I feel that I am just an extra pair of hands.

gaeilgegrinds

Cleaning?! Eh...you're there to assist the student or students you've been assigned to...something up here in my opinion.

angry sna

I no!!There is something very wrong with the situation alltogether!!

harlley

Hi All
It has been 10 years since this topic started.
How would you answer this question today.

okgirl wrote: »

Hi there,
Can any one tell me if a secondary school teacher can refuse an SNA in their class room, even if a specific child has been granted the sna?

How SNA is seen today as a unnecessary "item" in the class or as a value added help for the teacher.