Is my child too young for primary school?

abi2007

My daughter is four at the start of july next year and i'm not sure if i should send her to primary school in september. She's in montessori now and is doing very well, she is also in crech after. Both cost me over 200 euro a week. If i send her to school next year i would be much better off finacially. money isn't everything though and i want to do whats best for her. I'd like to hear other peoples opinions on this as my mam is dead set againts her going to school next year.

Nevyn

Is she ready ?
My daughter was the same age when she started and she was ready and rearing to go.
The school did argue with me about it to make sure I was sure, I myself was 4 when i started school having had my birthday at the end of the june before.

Ideally this should not be a finacialy issue but a matter of can your daughter cope with school and the other children, the routine, the sitting at the desk and only having 1 adult supervising the whole class, the rough and tumble of the school yard and the learning demands of junior infants.

Dizzyblonde

Both my daughters were born in June and I was all set to send the eldest to school the year she turned 4. There was a problem with numbers however and they couldn't take her and at first I was gutted, but it was for the best. She was academically ready but when she did start the next year I realised that that doesn't matter. In my opinion a child who's just turned 4 isn't ready for the pressure of school and the shoolyard and it very often impacts on them later.
For instance being the youngest in a class by almost a year can stop a child participating and ruin their confidence. Very often such a child is kept back a year and this works well, but why not avoid it if you can? I didn't even consider sending my younger daughter to school until she was 5.
They're both grown up now and one loved school, the other hated it, they're like chalk and cheese. But they both benefitted by being amongst the oldest in the class. They were able to cope with whatever arose.
The other thing to remember is the pressure of the Leaving Cert at the other end. Your child might not want or be offered Transition Year and they'd be very young for the pressure and the decisions that have to be made in 6th year.
I know lots of people started school very young and had no problems but it's different for everyone and it's up to you, but I'm with your mam.

yom 1

I think nowadays the school will make the decision for you and have a cut off point. My son started this year and is 5 in December. when we went to the welcome to the school meeting for the parents we were told that the cutoff day for this year was April 5th 2003. Any children born after that date were not accepted. I'd say that most schools would use that system or somethig similar and as such your child may not be accepted. Try to get her into a montessori instead.

Nevyn

Some schools do and some schools don't and if they are 4 they can't be refused by the school unless the school amends it's enrollment policy.

abi2007

Financially is does come in because if i has all the money in the world and had a doubt about her not being ready i just wouldn't send her, keep in montessori for another year. I'm doubting her being ready probally on my own experience, i went to school when i was four and i ended up staying back a year... one of the worst experiences of my life. I don't want that to happen to her. yet she is totally a different personality to me and i never even went to playschool. she's been in crech since a baby and really loves it, so part of me thinks she's ready and part of me is unsure.

kashi

There is ususally an open day for Junior Infants after Easter..........I would suggest either attending that, or try and make an appointment with the Junior Infants teacher in the school you intend to enroll your daughter in. S/he will be much more able to give you an idea if your daughter is ready or not.

It varies from child to child, but generally the children who are barely 4 have more problems socially than the slightly older ones. They can either be very shy or be a little too rough. Although there are others that would buy and sell you!!!;)

Ring the school.......ask to see if you can make an appointment. The teachers are the ones who will be able to give you a better idea.

littlebug

I was in exactly the same position last year (except for the creche bit). I really couldn't decide and in fact I put her name down for school and on the last possible day for sending in the forms (June) I ended up ringing the headmaster and saying I'd changed my mind. I'm so glad now that I did. Academically she would have been ok (if academic is an appropriate word at that age ) but socially it would have been like throwing her to the lions. She's very quiet and sensitive and to be honest even now at 5 struggles a bit with the social side of it. It might be different if your little one is more extroverted though. Bear in mind though that she will more than likely be the youngest in the class and probably the smallest. There will be some kids there who are a year and a half older than her.... their abilities in terms of dexterity etc change a lot in that year (in my experience) and what comes easy now would have been more of a struggle a year ago. If you think your little one can handle all that and the pressure that comes with it then maybe she'd be ok but otherwise I'd be on your mam's side.

Interestingly... the youngest in my daughters class is a little boy who turned 4 in January and his mother is considering keeping him back a year because she thinks he's not able for the schoolwork.

2Scoops

Definitely keep her back for another year. Starting too early will be more likely to result in struggling with the work and the potential development of low self-esteem. The difference between 4 and 5 is pretty big.

Start a year later and she will be among the oldest in the class, smartest too probably and will probably do much better in school in the long run.

Ickle Magoo

I'd always opt for older too...children often seem able to cope with the start of school at 4 or even younger but there is also the issues of being the youngest & least mature in the class & the effect that is going to have on confidence. I think you also have to think further down the line. How will they cope with the pressures of exam time? How will they cope being at university, etc, etc? An extra yr or 18 months can make all the difference & it's never going to hinder them.

The countries with the eldest compulsory school age do the best in the school leavers & third level education stats & for that reason I think kids are best not going to school for those extra couple of years. I understand that sadly in the world today, finance does come into it so older school starts is not always possible but I'd opt for another yr in Montessori. hth

muckety

I also read studies on countries such as the scandinavian ones where children start formal school at 7 (until 20) and these countries are usually the top 4 in the academic lists for developed countries.

I have a child with a birthday in early July - as the 3rd child in the family and having been to Montessori everyone seemed to think she should start school in the Sept. she was 4 years old. Including the school (but they had their own reasons to do with getting numbers up due to the risk of losing a teacher). However, I waited until the following year and am very glad as she is very happy, settled and confident now. My main reasons were that she would have the advantage of the extra year's maturity when starting secondary school, doing key exams and going to college (or whatever she chooses). Best of luck with your decision!

abi2007

yeterday when i posted the thread i was more for her starting next september and wanted some reassurance i was doing the right thing. Now after reading all the comments i think i'll wait till the following year, she'd probally be fine starting next year but i don't want to take the risk of her staying back, and i think i'd rather her be the oldest rather than the youngest. When your in your teens a year makes a big difference socially and hopefully she'll be mature enough around her peers to make the right decisions.

littlebug

abi2007 wrote: »

yeterday when i posted the thread i was more for her starting next september and wanted some reassurance i was doing the right thing. Now after reading all the comments i think i'll wait till the following year, she'd probally be fine starting next year but i don't want to take the risk of her staying back, and i think i'd rather her be the oldest rather than the youngest. When your in your teens a year makes a big difference socially and hopefully she'll be mature enough around her peers to make the right decisions.

I think that's the right decision. The fact that you're not sure is also telling you something. Thaedydal was 100% sure that her child was ready. I wasn't and changed my mind on a daily basis. I think that if you're in doubt at all then leaving her for another year is the way to go. You're not likely to regret leaving her another year whereas you could regret sending her too soon at many points over her educational career.

Nevyn

My daugther is the youngest in her year; is now in 2nd class and thriving but she is not your child and you have to weigh up what is best for family yourself.

BoozyBabe

I think 4 is MORE than old enough.
My bf has a niece & I have a nephew.
My nephew was 4 at the end of June, his niece at the end of October.
She would buy & sell my nephew any day of the week, but becuase she wasn't 4 in September, she had to stay back while my nephew went to school.
He absolutely thrived at school. She just started in September gone past & although she loves it, she would defo have been able for it last year too.

When I started school, my cousin started 2 weeks later because she wasn't 4 until the middle of September.
It also never did her any harm whatsoever. She thrived as well as anyone. In fact there were boys in our class who were well over 5 when we started, & the struggled with school throughout the years actually.

You're the mother, you know whether or not your child is bright.
If they are, then send them to school. Holding them back a year will make no difference.

abi2007

its not how bright she is that i worried about i know she'd be well able that way, its more the social aspect

Raytown Rocks

My Daughter started school when she was 4. She was the youngest in her class. We asked a lot of question's to the teachers and principal at the time and they were all of the opinion that although she was slightly younger than some as long as she was capable of doing the work etc there should be no problems.
That was nearly 4 yeras ago and to to be honest she has never had any problems with school either academically or personally.

I suppose obviously the decision is yours, and is also dependant on how well you think your child would cope.

Chef

coffee_cake

I think 4 is more than old enough, I never had any problems with the social aspect

oh well

whatever about being the youngest in the class, there is also the problem of a child being the eldest in the class. found over the years that when some kids are over a year old than others they actually lose their confidence as well - there is never an ideal age. can be a bit of bullying too sometimes ("how come you aren't in older class" type of thing) You can only do what you think is best at that particular point and time and thereafter, offer the child whatever reassurance he/she might need on the social side of things. this doesn't answer your question but just gives another point of view. I started one child at 4 yrs 2months, others being winter babies were 4½ yrs.

SarahMc

Studies how that a child who starts at a young 4 tend to be socially and academically disadvantaged throughout their schooling.

Of course there are always exceptions to the rule.

Scoobydoobydoo

I would check the school policy on age but if I had the option I would wait. What's the rush, that's how I feel about it. I'd much rather start a child in school at five than four, and that's what I did.

Nevyn

SarahMc wrote: »

Studies how that a child who starts at a young 4 tend to be socially and academically disadvantaged throughout their schooling.

What studies and can you link to them, otherwise it is just hearsay.

2Scoops

The majority of studies in this area find positive relations between age on starting school and school achievement. Here are a few of the ones that do see the relation. Of course, correlation does not prove causation, but the trends are certainly there and thus cannot be called hearsay.

Age related to reading and maths ability in Hungarian children:
http://www.econ.core.hu/doc/bwp/bwp/bwp0702.pdf

Children from countries with later mandatory school-starting ages do better in multiple tests:
http://www.eric.ed.gov/ERICDocs/data/ericdocs2sql/content_storage_01/0000019b/80/13/07/42.pdf

Curiously, most of the research is from the early nineties. Here are more studies that I can't find e-copies of:

• West, A. and Varlaam, A. (1990). Does it matter when children start school? Educational Research, 32(3): 210-17.
• Cameron MB, Wilson BJ. (1990) The effects of chronological age, gender, and delay of entry on academic achievement and retention: Implications for academic redshirting. Psychology in the Schools. 27(3):260-263.
• Crosser SL. (1991) Summer birth date children: Kindergarten entrance age and academic achievement. Journal of Educational Research. 84(3):140-146.

Anyway, I would imagine the effect is quite small. Certainly, many boardsies on this thread believe starting early hasn't had any effect on them personally, although that's no evidence of the absence of a trend.

Catari Jaguar

It all depends on her maturity level. I have a now senior infant in my class who started at just 4 that summer, he was very babyish, even now seems behind the others but doesn't cry as much and is less restless, attention seeking, dreamy etc.

But you say she's in montesorri/creche, so she must be ok with separation from you, socialising and playing with other children and even structure and routine in a group. How is she academically, is she familiar with numbers, letters? I say she'll be fine, but only you know if she can cope or not.

If you keep her an extra year, she'll be over 5 when she starts and that'll be quite old as most children are 4 in junior infants...

Dev 17

I started at 4 and found it to be a great advantage. The younger you finish school the better. If she wants when she's older she can take a gap year after secondary and before college or during college. She may well take on the maturity of her peers rather that always being a year behind.

Scoobydoobydoo

Dev 17 wrote: »

I started at 4 and found it to be a great advantage. The younger you finish school the better. If she wants when she's older she can take a gap year after secondary and before college or during college. She may well take on the maturity of her peers rather that always being a year behind.

I wouldn't agree with this view. I think 5 is better. My niece finished school very young and my sister was very worried about her going to university, living away from home etc. before she was old enough. Even though she was advanced (she skipped a year, that's why she was younger than the rest) her age was still a worry.
Anyway, they're grown ups for long enough, I just don't see the rush to send them off so early!
The average age in most European countries seems to be 6, there must be a good reason for that. Of course maturity levels will vary, but why risk it? I don't see why starting a year later will prevent anyone taking a gap year in the future?

Nevyn

There are ty prgromas in most schools and even if they endup as I did being 17 on the day of my last leaving cert exam it does not mean they have to go college right away, spending some time working in retail or waiting tables can be a good way to spend a year.

EamonnKeane

I started school when I was 5 1/2 and did the Leaving aged 19, and I'd say always being one of the oldest gave me a great advantage.

The other thing to remember is the pressure of the Leaving Cert at the other end. Your child might not want or be offered Transition Year and they'd be very young for the pressure and the decisions that have to be made in 6th year.

This child is four! She'll sit the Leaving Cert around 2020, if the Leaving Cert still exists by then! There is such a thing as planning too far ahead.

nesf

Scoobydoobydoo wrote: »

The average age in most European countries seems to be 6, there must be a good reason for that.

State funded/subsidised childcare would be a factor.

Ickle Magoo

I think it has more to do with the legal minimum age...

When I was going to school the legal minimum age was 5 & there was no childcare freebies.

Nevyn

No the legal minium age has always been 4 and they must have started by the age of 6.
The school can't refuse unless they are short on places and have the mandate in thier enrollment policy to place older children first.