Buying ammo in Northern Ireland

Seamus357

I'm heading up to Newry this weekend. I was thinking of buying some rifle ammunition while I was up there. Can anyone tell me the legal situation? Will they sell me ammo if I produce my Southern licence? Is ammo cheaper up North?

foxhunter

Afaik Seamus you will need to apply for an import licence from DOJ
with the make and quantity of ammo and the headstamp thats printed on it.
All the forms you need are on the DOJ website .
GOOD LUCK :D

cantona

No import documents are required.
You must have a PSNI cert covering the calibre and amount of ammo you wish to buy.
The PSNI cert is based on the particulars of your Irish FAC and Euro Pass.

alan123

Is it cheaper??

V Bull

To buy ammo in Northern Ireland you must first apply for a visitors permit through a citizen of Northern Ireland, a sponser, cost £12.00.

Cantana is correct, no import docs etc required.......... You have already paid Vat in a EU member country ( Northern Ireland, UK) ect bla bla

You must give that sponser a copy of your firearms cert together with your original European Firearms Pass and complete the appropiate PSNI form (NI FAC form 30-38).http://www.psni.police.uk/index/advice_centre/firearms.htm under section "Visiting and Leaving Northern Ireland".

Once your rifle or firearm are noted on the Visitors Permit and your European Firearms Pass with your ammo allowance, you can go into any firearms dealer in Northern Ireland and purchase up to that allowance.

And yes, it is cheaper.

Our man in Havana

Are they hard to obtain? The visitors pass that is.

V Bull

No, Mr Bond, a visitors permit is not hard to get, once you have a sponser living in Northern Ireland, that is, a person who permanently resides in the North. Complete form 30-38 (as mentioned in the above post) with your details and give that form to your sponser for them to complete their section. The rest is explained in the post above.

Hope this helps...............

Seamus357

You can get the gun shop to sponsor you. I asked Tannyoky Guns & Ammo (of Poyntzpass, Co. Down) about buying ammo up North. They sent me the following letter.

Seamus

mildot

cantona wrote: »

No import documents are required.

V Bull wrote: »

Cantana is correct, no import docs etc required.......... You have already paid Vat in a EU member country ( Northern Ireland, UK) ect bla bla

Hi Folks
While reading this thread I felt that perhaps incorrect information was being quoted about the importing of ammo from a member EU state, I rang the DOJ and asked if an import lic is required to bring ammo into the state from a member EU state and the answer was "yes" an import lic is required along with the N.I visitors permit and your own lic , Its nothing to do with VAT or where its paid, and there is no recent local arrangement between N.I. and Ireland to change this.
Sometimes ppl should be very careful when giving advise to others, the best thing to do if in doubt is to ring the DOJ yourself, after all that is what they are there for

V Bull

Mildot, some years ago, after applying for my fifth or sixth import lic in quick succession from the DOJ I was asked howcome I was applying for so many import licences.

I told them that I take part in quite a lot of target shooting in Northern Ireland through my club and go through a lot of ammo between practice and competitions.

I was informed that I did not require an import licience on that basis, so I havent applyed for a import licence in over 8 years and yes I buy the majority of my ammo in NI.

mildot

V Bull
Thats very dogy if you are stopped by customs or the Gardi and tell them that someone in the DOJ told me it was ok !! unless you get it in writing you could be in trouble , Perhaps V Bull you should ring the DOJ and clarify the situation. I would be delighted if you are right it would save a lot of paperwork but I rekon not.

BTW here is the Irish stick that can be used to beat you with


Firearms Act 1925
Restrictions on the import of firearms, prohibited weapons and ammunition. 17.—(1) No person shall import into Saorstát Eireann any firearm, ammunition, or prohibited weapon unless such import is authorised by a continuing licence granted under this section and in force at the time, or by an occasional licence granted under this section and relating to the specific firearm, ammunition or prohibited weapon so imported.

[GA] (2) An occasional licence to import a prohibited weapon may be granted by the Minister for Defence to such person, upon such terms, and subject to such conditions as he shall think fit, and every such occasional licence shall operate and be expressed to authorise the importation into Saorstát Eireann of the prohibited weapon specified in such licence through the port, by the person, within the time, and subject to the conditions named in such licence.

[GA] (3) A continuing licence to import firearms or ammunition may on application in the prescribed manner be granted by the Minister if he thinks fit so to do to any registered firearms dealer, and every such continuing licence shall operate and be expressed to authorise the importation into Saorstát Eireann of firearms and ammunition generally or of any specified class or classes of firearms and ammunition through the port, by the registered dealer, during the period (not exceeding six months), and subject to the conditions named in such licence.

[GA] (4) An occasional licence to import into Saorstát Eireann a firearm, with or without ammunition therefor, may, on application in the prescribed manner be granted by the Minister to any person who holds or could be granted a firearm certificate for the firearm and ammunition (if any) in respect of which the occasional licence is sought or is a registered firearms dealer and every such occasional licence shall operate and be expressed to authorise the importation into Saorstát Eireann of the firearm and the quantity of ammunition (if any) specified in such licence through the port, by the, person, within the time (not being more than one month), and subject to the conditions named in such licence.

[GA] (5) Every continuing licence granted by the Minister under this section may be varied or revoked by the Minister at any time before its expiration.

[GA] (6) If any person imports into Saorstát Eireann a firearm or prohibited weapon or any ammunition without or otherwise than in accordance with a licence under this section authorising such importation or, in the case of ammunition, in quantities in excess of those so authorised, or fails to comply with any condition named in a licence granted to him under this section, he shall be guilty of an offence under this Act and shall be punishable accordingly.

[GA] (7) The possession of a licence granted under this section, shall not relieve front the obligation to obtain or hold any certificate, permit, or authority required by any other provision, of this Act.

[GA] (8) This section shall not apply to the importation into Saorstát Eireann of any firearms, ammunition or prohibited weapon which is so imported under the authority of the Minister for Defence for the use of the Defence Forces of Saorstát Eireann or under the authority of the Minister for the use of any lawful police force in Saorstát Eireann.

V Bull

Mildot,

If I was stoped by the Gardai / Customs, I'm sure that they would request sight of my firearms cert which states that I can have and carry etc X amount of ammo. There is absolutly no problem.

How many of you out there, referring to all shooters, keep the receipt from your firearms dealer either in the Republic or in Northern Ireland after you purchase ammo?? How many of you have ever got a receipt??????

I think in my many years of shooting, I got a receipt once and that was because I also bought a lamp and wanted a guarintee of sorts. Bye the way, the lamp still works.........

Am I authorised to have, carry, etc, X amount of ammo, .........yes I am, it says it on my firearms cert,......... thank you very much Garda, is there a problem, I don't think so..............


OOpps, Just saw your last edited post, better check this out in the morning..............Thanks a mill(dot)

cavan shooter

Only if they have reason to believe you have ammunition on board:D


Personally speaking I shop locally, when you add exchange/time travelling/petrol wear and tear, how much do you really save

mildot

Mill (Dot)

civdef

Mildot, the Firearms Act 1925 is not the most recent word on the matter.

mildot

No... it may not be.... but if you can show me where says other than what the DOJ guy told me on the Phone and the 1925 Act I will believe it

civdef

Section 56 of the Criminal Justice Act 2006.

Which amended Section 21 of the Firearms Act 1964,

Which Amended Section 17 of the Firearms Act 1925.

mildot

Civdef this is the most current I can find and it pretty much says the smae thing....and more

S.I. No. 362/1993:

EUROPEAN COMMUNITIES (ACQUISITION AND POSSESSION OF WEAPONS AND AMMUNITION) REGULATIONS, 1993.

EUROPEAN COMMUNITIES (ACQUISITION AND POSSESSION OF WEAPONS AND AMMUNITION) REGULATIONS, 1993.



Transfer of firearms and ammunition
6. (1) A person from another Member State shall not transfer or attempt to transfer a firearm or ammunition to the State except with the prior consent of the Minister and without having obtained a licence for the transfer from the competent authority of that Member State.

(2) Notwithstanding the provisions of the Control of Exports Order, 1983 ( S.I. No. 405 of 1983 ), a person in the State shall not transfer or attempt to transfer a firearm or ammunition from the State to another Member State, except in accordance with a licence issued by the Minister.

(3) The Minister may grant a registered dealer in the State a continuing licence to transfer firearms or ammunition to a registered dealer in another Member State for a specified period not exceeding three years.

(4) The licence or, in the case of a continuing licence, a document confirming the existence of that continuing licence, must accompany the firearm or ammunition until it reaches its destination and it shall be produced whenever so required by the competent authorities of the Member States.

(5) Where the firearm to be transferred is not a firearm which may, by virtue of the information supplied by Member States as provided for in Article 11.4 of the Directive be transferred to another Member State without the prior consent of that Member State, then, prior consent, from the competent authority of the Member State to which the firearm is to be transferred, for the transfer must be produced to the Minister before a licence or authorisation may be granted.

(6) A copy of the communication under Article 11.4 of the Directive certified by an official of the Minister to be a true copy shall be received without further proof in evidence as proof of the facts contained therein

V Bull

Here we go guys, just copied this from the DOJ website.

http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/Import_of_firearms_by_an_Irish_resident

Import of Firearms and Ammunition by an Irish Resident.

In all cases, before an Irish resident can import a firearm or ammunition from outside this State, the specified firearm and quantity of ammunition must be licensed by An Garda Síochána. When you receive a firearms certificate, there may be further legal requirements regarding the import, depending on the situations as listed below.

An individual importing a firearm or ammunition from a member state of the European Union:
a. Complete the application form Firearms Import/Export Application Form for Individuals (Microsoft Word – 51KB).

b. Attach to the application a copy of the valid firearms certificate for the firearm or ammunition to be imported.

c. In the case of firearms listed as category B in the EU Directive 91/477/EEC, a copy of a document entitled Article 7, which is issued by a superintendent of An Garda Síochána, must be attached to the application.

d. Forward the above to the Firearms and Explosives Unit of the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform, which will return to you a transfer document with which you can legally import the firearm or ammunition.



An individual importing a firearm or ammunition from a country which is not a member of the EU:
You should be in possession of a valid firearms certificate for a specified firearm or quantity of ammunition.

There is no legal requirement to obtain an importation licence from the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform.

Traumadoc

So does this mean I need an import license to import from Northern Ireland but not if I import from a non EU country, eg Canada. As long as I have a valid firearms license. FUBAR

mildot

Traumadoc
That is correct and right, mad and all as it may seem the only document you require from a non EU country is their permission to export ( yanks are very paranoid latley), but thats the law and I am glad te see its been cleared up, not only do you need an import lic for ammo, but for firearms as well.

Traumadoc

So much for the free movement of goods within the EU!