......Who changes the light bulbs??........

timmywex

The HSE has suspended around 20 electricians at a number of acute hospitals in the south of the country in a dispute over work practice changes.

Another 20 electricians are expected to be removed from the pay-roll later today if they continue to refuse to answer pagers or take instructions in writing and by phone.

Hospitals in Cork, Kerry, Waterford, South Tipperary, Carlow, Kilkenny and Wexford are affected by the dispute.

This dispute, which dates back to 2001, centres on work practice changes that the HSE wants to implement.

The dispute has become deadlocked over who would be allowed change light bulbs in the hospitals and care facilities.

Electricians argued that this was exclusively their work, while the HSE argued that this would considerably add to its costs.

Two weeks ago the HSE stopped paying on-call allowances to the electricians involved in the dispute.

Yesterday the electricians responded by insisting that they would only take instruction from their immediate maintenance supervisors.

The HSE also claims that electricians at Kerry General Hospital in Tralee and at Mallow General Hospital have refused to provide emergency, 'life and death' cover.

The HSE says its services have not been affected but it is warning that services will be compromised if the dispute continues.

The electricians' union, the TEEU, has condemned the suspension of its members and says it is available for talks.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/1031/hospital.html?rss


are the hse just looking for ways to be in a constant argument, this has to be the stupitest thing ever to strike about

Jesus Wept

How many electricians does it take to change a lightbulb?

one

WindSock

How many nurses does it take to change a lightbulb?

None, let the nurses aids do it, they do everything else anyway.

Sleepy

We really need a benevolant dictator. This is nothing 40 bullets wouldn't solve.

_blank_

I fúcking hate Unions.

Bastards.

machiavellianme

Why do they need electricians when they have maintenance men? To hell with them and their unions. Fire 20 who can pick up jobs easily enough elsewhere and add even one "bed" as a result and I'm all in favour.

Jesus Wept

They should get those long life bulbs, would delay the problems.

timmywex wrote:

Electricians argued that this was exclusively their work, while the HSE argued that this would considerably add to its costs.

In fairness though, this is their work.

Reminds me that I must call my local electrician because a bulb went just the other day, needs changing.

leninbenjamin

that is one of the daftest things i've heard in a good while.

membership of the TEEU should be outlawed.

cjt156

This is the public sector for you. That's where your tax money is going - try pulling that shite in the private sector.

Hail 2 Da Chimp

So basically if a light bulb goes out in the middle of the night, the hospital needs to call an electrician, who will have to come in and get paid overtime, to change the bulb? Rather then have one of the maintenance people do it?

Sounds reasonable...

Pherekydes

Had the same shíte in my place:

Hey slow coach* what are you doing?

Me: Changing the fcuking bulb! What does it look like?

You can't. It's the electricians' job.

Me: I am an electrician!!

But you're an aircraft electrician!

Me [finishing job, badly]: Are you sure you're not supposed to screw in this type?


*may not be my real name.

Toto Wolfcastle

One of my light bulbs went last week, so I can offer one of those electricians a job. I am female and have no intention of ever changing the scary light bulb!!!

biko

DesF wrote: »

I fúcking hate Unions.

Bastards.

There is power in a factory, power in the land
Power in the hands of a worker
But it all amounts to nothing if together we don't stand
There is power in a Union

Now the lessons of the past were all learned with workers' blood
The mistakes of the bosses we must pay for
From the cities and the farmlands to trenches full of mud
War has always been the bosses' way, sir

Now I long for the morning that they realise
Brutality and unjust laws can not defeat us
But who'll defend the workers who cannot organise
When the bosses send their lackies out to cheat us?

Red Hand

Screw them!

Zzippy

DesF wrote: »

I fúcking hate Unions.

Bastards.

I fúcking hate employers who exploit workers and get away with it cos they're not represented by a union.

Bastards.

_blank_

Hang on.

In 21st Century Ireland, today, last week and last year Unions have been holding the government to ransom.

I'm pissed off with it, and this latest kerfuffle just goes to prove my point.

Someone needs to explain to me why a normal, non-electrician, shouldn't be allowed to change a bulb.

Who exactly is being exploited?

It's a freaking lightbulb for jaysis sake.

The poxy Gardaí went on strike because they wouldn't work with a new system. WTF was that about? Give us more money because you want to change the computer system, to a more up to date, more usable, make our jobs easier one? Clowns.

Teachers, who get three months in the summer, every Xmas, Paddy's week, Easter and god knows how many other days off. Only work til half two anyway, go on strike because they have patrol the breaktimes for twenty minutes a day? WTF. Clowns.

Who is behind all of this greed?

Unions.

Fúck sake, if I told my boss I wanted more money because he was introducing a new computer system, I'd be out on my ear, and rightly so.

I'd be trained up on it, and told to use it.

Fratton Fred

do the Electricians insist on plugging and unplugging all electrical equipment as well? That is about as difficult as changing a light bulb and it is electrical.

remind me again, how many hospitals are short of money because of overspending?

Zzippy

DesF wrote: »

Hang on.

In 21st Century Ireland, today, last week and last year Unions have been holding the government to ransom.

I'm pissed off with it, and this latest kerfuffle just goes to prove my point.

Someone needs to explain to me why a normal, non-electrician, shouldn't be allowed to change a bulb.

Who exactly is being exploited?

It's a freaking lightbulb for jaysis sake.

The poxy Gardaí went on strike because they wouldn't work with a new system. WTF was that about? Give us more money because you want to change the computer system, to a more up to date, more usable, make our jobs easier one? Clowns.

Teachers, who get three months in the summer, every Xmas, Paddy's week, Easter and god knows how many other days off. Only work til half two anyway, go on strike because they have patrol the breaktimes for twenty minutes a day? WTF. Clowns.

Who is behind all of this greed?

Unions.

Fúck sake, if I told my boss I wanted more money because he was introducing a new computer system, I'd be out on my ear, and rightly so.

I'd be trained up on it, and told to use it.

No problem with the examples you mention, sometimes unions are way over the top in what they are looking for. The lightbulb one takes the biscuit. But those are extreme examples. Same as the ESB contractor fiasco last week was an extreme example of employers exploiting workers - not paying them for 6 weeks then pulling out of the project and leaving them with nothing.

Without unions workers in this country would be much more exploited, have shorter holidays, work longer hours, get fewer benefits. Maybe that's the kind of country you want to live in. If so, I suggest you try America....

Nevyn

People die bacause of this crap.
My grand mother was in A&E on oxgyen and the bottle ran out and she told the nurse who had to get a porter to change the bottle and the porter brought an empty on and then wandered off looking for a full one.
My mother alerted another nurse as my grandmother was turning grey and the nurse went to look for another porter, my mother freaked at watching her mother dying as they were flapping about went and got a bottle herself and hooked it up and then they tried to get security to remover her from the hopital for tampering with equipment.

Bastards the lot of them.

_blank_

Galwayguy99 wrote: »

No problem with the examples you mention, sometimes unions are way over the top in what they are looking for. The lightbulb one takes the biscuit. But those are extreme examples. Same as the ESB contractor fiasco last week was an extreme example of employers exploiting workers - not paying them for 6 weeks then pulling out of the project and leaving them with nothing.

Without unions workers in this country would be much more exploited, have shorter holidays, work longer hours, get fewer benefits. Maybe that's the kind of country you want to live in. If so, I suggest you try America....

Look, I can see that side of it too, no problem.

I reckon the nurses are the most exploited people in this country, but by going on strike they are highlighting this, fair enough.

Same as those Polish lads last week, yep, all out in support, I admire that.

But it seems that for every "acceptable" strike/union involvement, there is a ridiculous nonsensical issue.

Look at the Aer Lingus Union. What they are doing is a scandal imo.

And I absolutely hate them for it, the TEEU this week, who next week? Bin Men on strike because the councils try to introduce new High Hygiene Gloves?

Dragan

I love "work to rule" it's the lazy pricks way of doing **** all.

It's a lightbulb, you total ****. Change the ****ing thing and shut.....the ****......up!

_blank_

Dragan wrote: »

It's a lightbulb, you total ****. Change the ****ing thing and shut.....the ****......up!

This is the thing

The Sparkies want to be the ONLY ones allowed to change bulbs.

It means that if a bulb goes in a HSE office at midnight, there has to be a Qualified Sparks on hand to change it. Probably on extortionate OT rates. It's greed, pure and simple.

Dragan

Of course they do, because it's easy money.

You see, this is why the HSE is ****ed, people on the inside taking advantage.

Hmmmm.....maybe i should don a mask, become "Bulb Man" and walk around the hospitals with a bag full of 60 Watters just in case.

Wertz

I've worked maintenance in hospitals under the regime of the HSE....petty stuff like this is par for the course. Blame the idiot manager who signed up to that particular maintenance contract...I'm sure he got a nice dinner and a round of golf out of it.
I agree the TEEU is being greedy here but to be fair we don't know precisely what type of bulbs we're talking about here...I mean in the case of some of those specialised surgery lights or other such specialist equipment, surely a qualified electrician is required for insurance purposes and to maintain proper maintenance records. However if it's 60 watt incandescents or a neon-strip then the TEEU should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves for exploitative work practices....but again, IMO the fault lies with a management decision to sign off on the practice.

Thaedydal, that's a shocking story, that type of thing makes me see red...

arybvtcw0eolkf

I was in Government buildings a few years ago when one of the services officers (messengers) was going up stairs and decided to take a painting which had been left at reception with him.

The painting was just waiting for an OPW worker to bring it up.

One of the lads piped up.. "Oi, Davy thats not your job, its the OPW's to bring that up stairs"... Davy decided to cut out the bullsh*t and take it up...

He dropped it on the stairs, it broke, it was worth €10k and I pissed myself laughing. Poor ol' Davy was hauled over the coals for that one, moral of the story ... one man, one job.

wil

Its just been announced* that in response to the health crisis, to reduce waiting times, generally free up the backlog, and streamline the health system will revert to that laudible system as existed for drivers.
Wannabe doctors will no longer be required to have to pay huge sums of money to medical colleges to train or waste years of their lives without earning a penny.
Training will become effectively optional.
In future all trainee medical personnel will be issued a yearly Provisional medical licence (PML) on completion of a 40 question multiple choice biology theory test.
This will allow them to practice on sick but not very sick people for one year.
They will be required to wear a red D plate, for Learner Doctor.
For their first PML they will need to be supervised at all times by a qualified medical practitioner or registered faith healer (with certificate) of more than 2 years.
After one year they must apply to do some exams and provide proof of application.
On production of said proof they will receive a second PML.
A 2nd PML holder will be allowed to carry out routine surgical procedures without adult supervision.
If they are unable to complete any procedure, they may call on either parent to complete the procedure for them.
If at the end of the 2nd year if they fail to provide a specimen or examination pass result, they will be required to apply for a third PML.
At this point they have to be supervised by a fully qualified matron and required to carry out routine heart surgery.
They may remove the D plates so as not to alarm the patients unnecessarily.
PML holders who pass one exam will then be issued with a Full medical practitioners licence which will entitle them to practice brain surgery in Harley St, or transplant surgery in EC countries.
They will be allowed to use MD plates instead of D plates.
MD plate holders who have more than 3 medical lawsuits in one year will have their licence suspended and required to undergo a full rectal examination.
Consideration will be given to candiates who can provide notarised (in Type O negative) evidence of operations in progress in order to avoid a ban from practicing.
Pacemakers will now be fitted by fully paid up card holding electricians. MDs or PML will no longer be authorised to carry out procedures involving any electrical apparatus.
To avoid excessive expenditure, patients can elect to have either an anaesthesist or electrician present at surgical procedures, Patients will have to prioritise between anaesthetic vs heart monitors and any machine that goes ping.
Medical college places now freed up will commence intensive electrician training course to cater for the increased demand.

On completion of the advanced lightbulb replacement certificate, they will be awarded the letters ME for medical electrician.
Further advanced courses will also carry this ME certification, thus a well qualified electrician will be easily recognised with the letters MEMEME after their name.

These new regulations will correct the existing anomaly where persons wishing to pursue a medical career have to qualify before they can practice.
As this is obviously ridiculous, they will now be allowed to practice in order to qualify.
*This has not actually happened.

cjt156

wil wrote: »

Its just been announced* that in response to the health crisis, to reduce waiting times, generally free up the backlog, and streamline the health system will revert to that laudible system as existed for drivers.
Wannabe doctors will no longer be required to have to pay huge sums of money to medical colleges to train or waste years of their lives without earning a penny.
Training will become effectively optional.
In future all trainee medical personnel will be issued a yearly Provisional medical licence (PML) on completion of a 40 question multiple choice biology theory test.
This will allow them to practice on sick but not very sick people for one year.
They will be required to wear a red D plate, for Learner Doctor.
For their first PML they will need to be supervised at all times by a qualified medical practitioner or registered faith healer (with certificate) of more than 2 years.
After one year they must apply to do some exams and provide proof of application.
On production of said proof they will receive a second PML.
A 2nd PML holder will be allowed to carry out routine surgical procedures without adult supervision.
If they are unable to complete any procedure, they may call on either parent to complete the procedure for them.
If at the end of the 2nd year if they fail to provide a specimen or examination pass result, they will be required to apply for a third PML.
At this point they have to be supervised by a fully qualified matron and required to carry out routine heart surgery.
They may remove the D plates so as not to alarm the patients unnecessarily.
PML holders who pass one exam will then be issued with a Full medical practitioners licence which will entitle them to practice brain surgery in Harley St, or transplant surgery in EC countries.
They will be allowed to use MD plates instead of D plates.
MD plate holders who have more than 3 medical lawsuits in one year will have their licence suspended and required to undergo a full rectal examination.
Consideration will be given to candiates who can provide notarised (in Type O negative) evidence of operations in progress in order to avoid a ban from practicing.
Pacemakers will now be fitted by fully paid up card holding electricians. MDs or PML will no longer be authorised to carry out procedures involving any electrical apparatus.
To avoid excessive expenditure, patients can elect to have either an anaesthesist or electrician present at surgical procedures, Patients will have to prioritise between anaesthetic vs heart monitors and any machine that goes ping.
Medical college places now freed up will commence intensive electrician training course to cater for the increased demand.

On completion of the advanced lightbulb replacement certificate, they will be awarded the letters ME for medical electrician.
Further advanced courses will also carry this ME certification, thus a well qualified electrician will be easily recognised with the letters MEMEME after their name.

These new regulations will correct the existing anomaly where persons wishing to pursue a medical career have to qualify before they can practice.
As this is obviously ridiculous, they will now be allowed to practice in order to qualify.
*This has not actually happened.

This has not actually been read.

wil

cjt156 wrote: »

This has not actually been read.

Best comment so far:D

grahamo

Galwayguy99 wrote: »

I fúcking hate employers who exploit workers and get away with it cos they're not represented by a union.

Bastards.

Well Said! We wouldn't have the workers rights and conditions we have today if it wasn't for unions and their members.

Stephen

The point is that unions pulling stupid, greedy stunts like this are damaging all unions by their actions. They make people lose respect for them and think that we'd be better off without them.

Nevyn

Well we are in danger of having two teir work forces those that are in a union and those that are not.

gyppo

Thaedydal wrote: »

Well we are in danger of having two teir work forces those that are in a union and those that are not.

I know which one I'd prefer..

justsomebloke

Thaedydal wrote: »

Well we are in danger of having two teir work forces those that are in a union and those that are not.

no all those who are in teh public sector and those that are not. Even if you are in a union in the private sector you can't get away with this ****

_blank_

Stephen wrote: »

The point is that unions pulling stupid, greedy stunts like this are damaging all unions by their actions. They make people lose respect for them and think that we'd be better off without them.

This is eaxctly the thing.

Is a poxy argument about a few greedy sparkies changing bulbs what James Connolly fought and died for?

He'd be turning in his grave.

Robbo

Is it time to rehabilitate Thatcher further?

Zzippy

jsb wrote: »

no all those who are in teh public sector and those that are not. Even if you are in a union in the private sector you can't get away with this ****

Mate, I'm in the public sector, and in a union (SIPTU), however I know our union rep would tell us to cop on if we tried to pull a stunt like the electricians, and we wouldn't get very far. We all signed up to pay agreements that require flexibility and changes in work practices, I don't understand how the TEEU are forgetting that. HSE are right to play hard ball on this.
Not all public sector unions are like that, and like an earlier poster said, its a small minority doing this **** that gives the trade union movement a bad name

highlydebased

HA OMG How Rediculous. I could see something rediculous like that happening.

Apparently, when the ASTI went on strike a few years back, there was a demarcation issue about, yes, teachers changing lightbulbs.

Padraig Mor

Thaedydal wrote: »

People die bacause of this crap.
My grand mother was in A&E on oxgyen and the bottle ran out and she told the nurse who had to get a porter to change the bottle and the porter brought an empty on and then wandered off looking for a full one.
My mother alerted another nurse as my grandmother was turning grey and the nurse went to look for another porter, my mother freaked at watching her mother dying as they were flapping about went and got a bottle herself and hooked it up and then they tried to get security to remover her from the hopital for tampering with equipment.

Bastards the lot of them.

Kinda like a situation I was in when working as an operating theatre porter. Patient had to be transferred to ICU and needed portable oxygen. Went and got it from nurse in ICU. I tested it, which was lucky for the patient, as it was empty. Later on, after changing cylinder and transferring patient, I asked the nurse why the **** she had given me an empty cylinder. Her response? "Not my job to change the cylinder". Oh, and she KNEW it was empty!!!

It used to be the case that two men drilled a hole at the shipyards in the "good old days". If the hole went through wood & steel, then the man in the woodworkers union drilled till he hit metal, then another man from the steelworkers union drilled the rest of the way. There were several strikes and loads of meetings before they agreed to drill half the holes (all the way through) each.

queencakes

I work for the HSE and some time ago ordered furntiture for an office on the first floor of a large ex-state institution building.

Furniture was duly delivered but left on the ground floor. So I rang maintenance to ask them would they send someone over to bring up said furniture one flight of stairs to the office. It wasnt anything major, a bookcase and a filing cabinet. I was told there weren't any maintenance men on the grounds at the present time.
Ater a few days of getting nowhere and with the help of the guy who delivered the post we managed to get the filing cabinet up the stairs. I rang Maintenance again and they ask me why the furniture company hadn't delivered it to the first floor. I said I didnt know - it was no big deal and would take two men five minutes to bring it up the stairs.
Long story short about two weeks later I had to ring the furniture company and they came back out and obliged me by spending five minutes lifting the bookcase up the stairs.
It was embarassing.

Guy:Incognito

grahamo wrote: »

Well Said! We wouldn't have the workers rights and conditions we have today if it wasn't for unions and their members.

The unions in the past did all the fighting and good deeds that created the current good system. Nowadays they exist and pull all this crap to try and justify that existance.

Mr.Micro

Is'nt that it the unions are stuck back in the 60s and 70s and dont appear to have really moved on .I think this is particularly noticeable in Ireland . Too much of not my job nonsense.

DonJose

That TEEU union are a pack of scum, we were threatened with blackouts last week because of the polish workers. Now the scumbag union have forced 11 operations to be cancelled because they consider changing lightbulb part of their job. Has anybody every gotten an electrician to change a fukking lightbulb.

Robbo

DonJose wrote: »

Has anybody every gotten an electrician to change a fukking lightbulb.

I've seen it happen countless times in the world of property management.

€45.40 it costs. Each time.

thefinalstage

This is bull crap. The bulbs are designed so anyone can change them. In my mind they are on the same level as plugs. Anyone can plug them in and out.

biko

Every single perk you have at work today, including 8 hour work day has been won by the unions.

Sleepy

queencakes wrote: »

I work for the HSE and some time ago ordered furntiture for an office on the first floor of a large ex-state institution building.

Furniture was duly delivered but left on the ground floor. So I rang maintenance to ask them would they send someone over to bring up said furniture one flight of stairs to the office. It wasnt anything major, a bookcase and a filing cabinet. I was told there weren't any maintenance men on the grounds at the present time.
Ater a few days of getting nowhere and with the help of the guy who delivered the post we managed to get the filing cabinet up the stairs. I rang Maintenance again and they ask me why the furniture company hadn't delivered it to the first floor. I said I didnt know - it was no big deal and would take two men five minutes to bring it up the stairs.
Long story short about two weeks later I had to ring the furniture company and they came back out and obliged me by spending five minutes lifting the bookcase up the stairs.
It was embarassing.

Why didn't you just get one of your co-workers to help you carry it up the stairs ffs?

Or, at the risk of sounding sexist, judging by your username, why not just ask a few of the lads in your office to move it?

It's no wonder our schools are underfunded, our hospitals short on beds and frontline staff etc. etc. etc.

And public sector workers wonder why they're considered lazy by the private sector?! :rolleyes:

ro2

A lecturer in DIT once told me that only electricians are allowed to change the light bulbs there too. It's too expensive to have them onsite just to change the odd bulb, so every few months they get them in and rip out every bulb in the building. :rolleyes:

Wertz

In queencakes' case, she and her colleagues are probably constrained by stringent health and safety guidelines (the real reason f*ck all get's done quickly in this country IMO)...they'd risk serious reprimand for doing something like heavy manual lifting when they're only supposed to lift forms and sh*t. Thats' the reason there's maintenance staff on hand (or there should be) for this type of thing....the thinking being that the maintenance guy(s) have had manual lifting courses or the like, and can't sue in the event of injury, whereas the office girls haven't and could. It's ridiculous but that's the beauracracy we've decided to live in and pay for...

This is probably the case when it comes to sparkies changing lightbulbs in public or state-owned buildings too, insurance, the HSA, and the threat of Joe public taking a case against a governemnt body in the event of an accident...

Sleepy

Who decided we want to live in and pay for that level of beauracracy though, Wertz?

I don't know anyone where I work that'd have issue with being asked to move a bookshelf ffs.

Wertz

Sleepy wrote: »

Who decided we want to live in and pay for that level of beauracracy though, Wertz?

I don't know anyone where I work that'd have issue with being asked to move a bookshelf ffs.

Fianna Fool probably....or more likely the civil servants that do their bidding.
Health and saftey like anything else, is a money racket. There's a fortune to be made in keeping people safe and well and more importantly avoiding financial loss in the litigation courts.
In reality, we all kind of made the decision when we ceased as a people to be able to take responsibilities for our own actions and started looking for someone else to blame, and more importantly pay, when things didn't work out or someone got hurt...