Learner drivers, Would you feel safe in their car ?..

Potential-Monke

You answered a question relating to L drivers, not boy racers (unless you're taking for granted that all boy racers are L drivers, which they're obviously not)...

Night!

jimmycrackcorm

Paddy20 wrote: »

Listen Lads & Lassies,

Would you get onto a Jumbo airplane with a learner pilot. I do do not think so. If you are not qualified to drive a car then you should be banned from driving even accepting a passenger.

Anyone who is not in ageement with me, please post your reply and remember yet we are talking about human lives :eek:

P. :cool:

I hear they put Jumbo learner pilots into the microwave for three minutes and they come out fully fledged captains. Anyway the comparison between a jumbo pilot and a car driver is a bad example especially when a pilot has an autopilot facility.

The basic truth is that passing the test doesn't make boy racers grow up or drink drivers dirve safely. Another anomoly is that if you look at the fatal accident statistics over the last 5 years it completely doesn't take into account the huge increase in car registrations and traffic, otherwise we now have less fatalities even with a substantial increase in provisional licences.

http://www.garda.ie/angarda/statistics98/nroadstats.html

Paddy20

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Would you also agree then that in order to stop the boy racers from killing themselves and others that anyone under the age of 25 b restriced to, say, a 1litre car?

NO one who has not passed a driving test should be allowed to drive any vehicle'unaccompanied' by a quallified driver' on Public roads, the litre power of the vehicle simply is not part of the equation. .

P. :cool:

Paddy20

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I hear they put Jumbo learner pilots into the microwave for three minutes and they come out fully fledged captains. Anyway the comparison between a jumbo pilot and a car driver is a bad example especially when a pilot has an autopilot facility.

The basic truth is that passing the test doesn't make boy racers grow up or drink drivers dirve safely. Another anomoly is that if you look at the fatal accident statistics over the last 5 years it completely doesn't take into account the huge increase in car registrations and traffic, otherwise we now have less fatalities even with a substantial increase in provisional licences.

http://www.garda.ie/angarda/statistics98/nroadstats.html

JC,

What the hell would I do without my contributions being constantly being put down by you, I think you must qualify as the most anti Paddy20 poster on boards.ie and the N.W. Forum,

Good luck to you

P. :cool:

jimmycrackcorm

You are hardly suggesting that everyone should automatically agree with you?

Good luck to yourself too, I hope we both share the Euromillions - there's enough there.

Paddy20

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

You are hardly suggesting that everyone should automatically agree with you?

Good luck to yourself too, I hope we both share the Euromillions - there's enough there.

Agreed, can you bring my share around to me ?.:)

P. :cool:

Potential-Monke

Paddy20 wrote: »

NO one who has not passed a driving test should be allowed to drive any vehicle'unaccompanied' by a quallified driver' on Public roads, the litre power of the vehicle simply is not part of the equation. .

P. :cool:

It was a seperate question, which you obviously can't read properly. Not all boy racers are L drivers. Alot of them have full licences which need need in order to be able to insure their new 6million Horsepower Type R Intergra or whatever they're unable to drive nowadays.

As i said in my last post, you're taking for granted that all boy racers are L drivers. Read the posts before commenting on them. We know your point, L driver should not (and legally cannot) driver unaccompanied. We've that point cleared up, you don't have to keep repeating yourself! And to be honest, being stuubborn in your ways is not an indication that you're right.

Take this example, a single mother in her thirties, on her 3rd provisional license. She uses the car to drop her 3 children to school, then she has a part time job which she needs to travel to. After that, she has to do the shopping for the week, which is a substantial ammount considering it involves herself and 3 kids. Now, if she was stopped by a Garda, would you agree that she should have the car taken off her and be prosecuted for not having a fully licensed driver with her? (Pleasea, don't reply by saying that "i have already answered that question" or something simular, i'm asking for an honest reply which you've put some thought into after reading the whole post...)

smashey

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Take this example, a single mother in her thirties, on her 3rd provisional license. She uses the car to drop her 3 children to school, then she has a part time job which she needs to travel to. After that, she has to do the shopping for the week, which is a substantial ammount considering it involves herself and 3 kids. Now, if she was stopped by a Garda, would you agree that she should have the car taken off her and be prosecuted for not having a fully licensed driver with her? (Pleasea, don't reply by saying that "i have already answered that question" or something simular, i'm asking for an honest reply which you've put some thought into after reading the whole post...)

Unless she gets her full license by next June, she will will lose the car.

muffler

Potential-Monke wrote: »

It was a seperate question, which you obviously can't read properly.

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Read the posts before commenting on them.

Potential-Monke wrote: »

you don't have to keep repeating yourself! And to be honest, being stuubborn in your ways is not an indication that you're right.

Potential-Monke wrote: »

(Pleasea, don't reply by saying that "i have already answered that question" or something simular, i'm asking for an honest reply which you've put some thought into after reading the whole post...)

Woaaahhh. Dont go posting things like that. You are new here so I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt. Attack the post if you want but not the poster. Take a few minutes and read the charter and familiarise yourself with it.

Im tempted to give you a yellow card but I wont but drop the back seat modding attitude and you will get along fine with everyone here.

Potential-Monke

Wasn;t trying to, but point taken. Cushty.

donegalman1

Listen, the whole thing is a red herring, bringing in this is the govt been seen to do something. I'd love to see full stats on road crashes and deaths and see where learner drivers, drink, engine size and the like can be fully attributal.

I still everyday see dangerous slow vehicles causing a huge backup of traffic and then other drivers chancing their arm to pass or speeding up later to make up for lost time.

There was a time it was legal for someone who was driving slowly to drive on the hard shoulder tio let others pass.... this is now illegal and a farce. On the Lifford to Letterkenny Road the council put in pull in points for tractors etc... I only ever saw one used once. There cannot be any excuse for someone hogging the road say in Barnes Gap at 40mph in good conditions. If they are that nervous they should not be on the road full stop, regardless of license type. Everyone in this country feels they have a right to drive, and drive as they like - thats the attitude that needs changing.

And posters are right to point out that many 'boy racers' have full licenses. They are given the name for their car types and driving style. Other young and learner drivers are penalised for their behaviour.

doonothing

learner drivers, from my experience, are not any more dangerous than any of the licensed drivers on the road, let alone the lunatic drivers who managed to pretend to be safe for the 30 minutes of a driving test.

acting like a sensible driver for 30 minutes does not make them any more or less qualified to be on the road than most learner drivers.

as ive been saying on repeat for the past 3 weeks, learner drivers are not the problem, bad drivers are the problem.

smashey

donegalman1 wrote: »

On the Lifford to Letterkenny Road the council put in pull in points for tractors etc... I only ever saw one used once.

They were an exercise in futility. I saw them used once as well.

Gillie

donegalman1 wrote: »

There was a time it was legal for someone who was driving slowly to drive on the hard shoulder tio let others pass.... this is now illegal and a farce.

*shouts*

This is NOT illegal ppl!! It is NOT!

Only a Solid white line on a motorway!

You can pull in on DC's and Natioal roads where there is:
-A hard shoulder
-A broken yellow line running along that hard shoulder

This has been a misconception for a long time!

muffler

smashey wrote: »

They were an exercise in futility. I saw them used once as well.

You seen this once as did donegalman1. Now what I would like to know is which one of you was driving the tractor?

Potential-Monke

Gillie wrote: »

*shouts*

This is NOT illegal ppl!! It is NOT!

Only a Solid white line on a motorway!

You can pull in on DC's and Natioal roads where there is:
-A hard shoulder
-A broken yellow line running along that hard shoulder

This has been a misconception for a long time!

You can pull in in the hard shoulder on a dual carraigeway in cases of emergency (car breaking down - NOT answering the mobile) and a slow driver can pull into the hard shoulder on both DC and national roads to let others by buy CANNOT driver there all the time. Hard shoulders are for pedestrians and cyclists.

See the new red RSA Rules of the Road, Page 60, bottom of page.

Gillie

Potential-Monke wrote: »

You can pull in in the hard shoulder on a dual carraigeway in cases of emergency (car breaking down - NOT answering the mobile) and a slow driver can pull into the hard shoulder on both DC and national roads to let others by buy CANNOT driver there all the time. Hard shoulders are for pedestrians and cyclists.

See the new red RSA Rules of the Road, Page 60, bottom of page.

Good man! I was waiting for someone to ask me to back it up!

It's amazing the amount of ppl who don't know this!:eek:

muffler

Gillie wrote: »

Good man! I was waiting for someone to ask me to back it up!

It's amazing the amount of ppl who don't know this!:eek:

I knew it :rolleyes:

donegalman1

Well last year there was an announcement that would lead anyone to believe driving on the hard shoulder was illegal.

If its not then people should be made aware its not and be made aware that courtesy can prevent accidents.

In any case I ain't falling for no banana in my tailpipe.

Gillie

donegalman1 wrote: »

Well last year there was an announcement that would lead anyone to believe driving on the hard shoulder was illegal.

If its not then people should be made aware its not and be made aware that courtesy can prevent accidents.

In any case I ain't falling for no banana in my tailpipe.

Your absolutely right! They should have made ppl aware that this was the case.

Potential-Monke

It's Eire, they're not going to tell anyone.

sesswhat

Gillie wrote: »

*shouts*

This is NOT illegal ppl!! It is NOT!

Only a Solid white line on a motorway!

You can pull in on DC's and Natioal roads where there is:
-A hard shoulder
-A broken yellow line running along that hard shoulder

This has been a misconception for a long time!

Not only can you pull in, you can set up a shop or a take-away.

Gillie

sesswhat wrote: »

Not only can you pull in, you can set up a shop or a take-away.

For selling Strawberries or Spuds from Wexford!:D

muffler

Gillie wrote: »

For selling Strawberries or Spuds from Wexford!:D

By a Polish guy

chasm

Paddy20 wrote: »

I believe that anyone getting into a car driven by a learner driver must be crazy.

What do you think ?..:mad:

P. :cool:

For me it would depend on the individual driver. I know some provisional license holders who are very competent,confident and safe drivers yet i know some full license holders who scare the life out of me.
I think i would be more worried about getting in a car with someone who got one of those freebie licenses tbh. Anybody who applied for a provisional since 2001 has at least sat a theory test, which is more than the freebie license holders did. Having said that some of those freebie ones may well be extremely good drivers.

The last edition of the Irish Mail on Sunday had an article title "Exposed the myth of the dangerous learner drivers". Here are a few snippets from that article:

Road Safety Authority accident figures covering the period from 2001 to 2005 show that the link between learner drivers and road accidents-fatal or otherwise-is a myth.
Of the 1,470 recorded road accident fatalities, only 178 involved drivers with provisional licenses. That is 12.5%
In the serious accident category, where people have been hospitalised, again only 12.5% held provisional licenses.
In minor accidents just 11% held provisional licenses.

As my Brother once said to me "Having a fully licensed driver beside me wont stop my car any quicker!"

muffler

chasm wrote: »

As my Brother once said to me "Having a fully licensed driver beside me wont stop my car any quicker!"

But maybe he could be told when to stop.

Or with some drivers maybe be told to keep their eyes above the level of the steering wheel and not just their eyebrows

sesswhat

chasm wrote: »

The last edition of the Irish Mail on Sunday had an article title "Exposed the myth of the dangerous learner drivers". Here are a few snippets from that article:

Road Safety Authority accident figures covering the period from 2001 to 2005 show that the link between learner drivers and road accidents-fatal or otherwise-is a myth.
Of the 1,470 recorded road accident fatalities, only 178 involved drivers with provisional licenses. That is 12.5%
In the serious accident category, where people have been hospitalised, again only 12.5% held provisional licenses.
In minor accidents just 11% held provisional licenses.

These figures on their own tell us exactly nothing. Without knowing the miles driven by provisional licence holders expressed as a percentage of the total miles driven by all drivers there is nothing to compare the 12.5% figure with.

I think i would be more worried about getting in a car with someone who got one of those freebie licenses tbh.

You won't be relieved to know that a large number of drivers of articulated lorries and private coaches will never have sat a test for such a vehicle either. When the new European categories came in, anyone who had a basic HGV licence for a rigid lorry was given a new 'lucky bag' licence with the full Articulated Lorry and Coach entitlements. This meant that my mother could have driven a 40 ton lorry or a 60 seater bus without ever having done a driving test of any description in her life.

I know that Bus Eireann still carried out their own tests on anyone who got a licence this way, but I don't know if the same is true of private operators.

Gillie

I think it's still pretty obvious that there are ppl out there WITH full licenses who can't drive though!

sesswhat

chasm wrote: »

As my Brother once said to me "Having a fully licensed driver beside me wont stop my car any quicker!"

It will if they pull the handbrake for you:)

jimmycrackcorm

sesswhat wrote: »

It will if they pull the handbrake for you:)

Or pull the steering wheel, another wonderful way of putting a car out of control.