Will the unthinkable (to them) happen England this weekend?

Keano

McClaren is gone and Jose is in. I wouldnt be surprised if it was a done deal already

jameshayes

I think the team selection did have alot to do with it. Why did he put that plonker in goal when he had a half decent keeper on the bench.

Yes Hargreaves wasn't fully match fit - but he should have came on in the 2nd half. He is the only player on that team who can slow a ball down and kill the game - play for the draw

It was a good choice to bring on Beckham but why take off Wright-Phillips

Joe Cole done very little in the 1st half and I didn't think he made a vital contribution - but he wasn't subbed till the 80th min , he made an immediate impact but it was way to late.

Unearthly

Mourinho is too clever than to get involved into the England setup

jameshayes

kitbag.com have 10 pound off the England 2007-09 jersey!!

event

Mclaren is gone

Fratton Fred

An Citeog wrote: »

England simply didn't deserve anything out of that game and as such didn't deserve to qualify. The only player I saw showing a bit of heart and trying to get the team going and up the tempo was Beckham. Incidentally, I watched the match with a Swiss guy who was nearly in tears afterwards () and an Argentinian girl who laughed he ass off from the moment Carson let the first goal in!

For anyone that's interested, this documentary shows some of the English "fans" in Germany and what they were like: Hooligans The Untold Story.

Have you dug out the one about the Italians, or the Germans, or the Dutch?

What about the evel of racism in Spanish football?

No? thought not.

Have you seen the levels of violence at Russian games, how many Police were there protecting the England fans?

Still, why give a balanced view when all you really want to do is have a pop t England.

I love the way there are dozens of people on here who very rarely post in this forum but decided to turn up just to gloat at England going out.

The accusation made towards the English is that they treat the Irish like their little brother, maybe that is true, but there are a lot of Irish who behave like jealous younger siblings.

jameshayes

event wrote: »

Mclaren is gone

For real or hope?

kryogen

scott carson is a very good goalkeeper, one game will not change that..... joe cole is a very good player, again, one game will not change that.... for the record, it wasnt just one player or two that were ineffectual in the first half, it was 11....and i actually reckon it was pure shock that they were 2-0 down within 15 minutes, i dont think they ever got a chance to settle and play in the system they were sent out in, chasing a game after 6 minutes isnt an easy thing to do....then to go 2 down so quickly after the first they must have all thought they were having nightmares and they couldnt deal with the pressure.... its typical england lads.

That_Guy

I loved when they went into the studio at half time and full time last night. The facial expressions were just priceless.

jameshayes

That_Guy wrote: »

I loved when they went into the studio at half time and full time last night. The facial expressions were just priceless.

the 4 lads looked like they had lumps in there throats! And i'm sure I seen Garys ears wobbling with fear

Unearthly

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,12016_2896125,00.html

Im shocked

event

jameshayes wrote: »

For real or hope?

for real

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11095_2896125,00.html

jameshayes

England international football manager Steve McClaren has been sacked, following a meeting of the FA board this morning, according to reports.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/sport/mhmhqleyqlcw/

Fratton Fred

kryogen wrote: »

scott carson is a very good goalkeeper, one game will not change that..... joe cole is a very good player, again, one game will not change that.... for the record, it wasnt just one player or two that were ineffectual in the first half, it was 11....and i actually reckon it was pure shock that they were 2-0 down within 15 minutes, i dont think they ever got a chance to settle and play in the system they were sent out in, chasing a game after 6 minutes isnt an easy thing to do....then to go 2 down so quickly after the first they must have all thought they were having nightmares and they couldnt deal with the pressure.... its typical england lads.

Peter Shilton had a nightmare in his first game for England, if Scott Cason turns out to be as good as him I will be happy.

Croatia were good and they looked like scoring every time they went forward, but they have some class in that team. Avram Grant was at their last game watching Modric apparantly, although he claimed he was there to watch Kranjcar, who he should know pretty well.

jameshayes

kryogen wrote: »

scott carson is a very good goalkeeper, one game will not change that.....

I understand that, but why gamble when you have a good GK on the bench??

I'm not saying James is fantastic but at least you know what your getting

DSB

PHB wrote: »

I thought England were very good going forward tonight. Defensive injuries cost them. Why the **** he played barry ahead of Hargreaves I don't know

Think it might be cause Barry is better.

Mitch Connor

i'm sure he is just gutted with his 2.5million golden handshake.

May be tough for him to get back into football though - i can't see him taking a post like Birmingham, and none of the top 4 would have him, or need him. I reckon a mid-table club, like Everton, Villa or Spurs would be the level he would be aiming at, but none of them need him.

Mitch Connor

jameshayes wrote: »

I understand that, but why gamble when you have a good GK on the bench??

I'm not saying James is fantastic but at least you know what your getting

Because James has dropped clangers in the past for England too - he's no Peter Schmeichel! The one thing in James favour, and the reason I would have picked him, is he plays with Campbel week in week out at Pompey - surely the understanding they would haev as a result of that would have been a help to a back 4 that has hardly played together.

jameshayes

Tauren wrote: »

like Everton, Villa or Spurs would be the level he would be aiming at, but none of them need him.

Middlesbrough will be looking for someone new this christmas me thinks

Mitch Connor

I'm sure they will, but i can't see him going back; and i don't think Middlesbrough should ask him to. I just can't see him having the impact there that would be required. It wouild be a step backwards for McClaren, and admitance that he made a mistake in leaving boro for the england job. It would be true; but i don't think it is something he should openly acknowledge.

Maybe he can take a couple of years out like Sven did, then hope some billionaire with a need for good press comes along.

mchurl

PHB wrote: »

I thought England were very good going forward tonight.

Would have to disagree there. I can't remember them creating many clear cut chances if any at all other than Darren bents chance late on. They were very one dimesional, i.e. hoof it up to crouch, and were void of idea's. The Croats created way more chances than England did.

PHB

DSB wrote: »

Think it might be cause Barry is better.

Yeh, cause the proteciton has gave the back four for those 2 goals from distance was top class.

For the rest 30 minutes, they created a lot going forward. When they went 2-0 down, Croatia tightened up alot.

flanzer

Wow McLaren sacked, well it was inevitable I suppose.

Imagine, a half hour meeting within the English FA to come to the conclusion that he should go and a half a day in the FAI :rolleyes:

mike65

Thats the easy bit! Press conference in a few mins

/everyone over to SSN

Mike.

redspider

Well, England being knocked out is a surprise given the great chance they were given. They also had an easier group than the likes of Scotland and Ireland

All the 'local' nations are out, so for those that think Ireland under-performed by finishing 3rd behind Germany (ranked 3rd in UEFA) and Czech Republic (ranked 7th), perhaps think again. On 'paper' we werent expected to qualify and doing so would have been a performance way above our means and probably would have required a) a good deal of luck, and b) major errors on the parts of other teams. Neither happened. England (ranked 9th) were knocked out by Croatia (8th) and Russia (13th).

So what now? Well, at least we are saved from the 'local' English media onslaught that would have no doubt occurred and would have placed England as favourites for winning the tournament. England probably would do better than most teams, and would probably have done better than Russia and Croatia will. But such is football.

Btw, I think Healy should be given some sort of medal for his exploits for "Norn Iron". We could certainly use him as a free transfer to the Ireland team. And definitely his commitment and resolve and his wanting to play for his 'national' team is something that more of our players need to exhibit.

I wish UEFA would change the qualification system though into a two-tier system. Maybe Platini could be persuaded. That would give the likes of Wales perhaps a tournament to aim for and a trophy in a 'B' Cup. We may also get a chance to be in it when we are bad enough. Not this time as we are in the top 21.

Lets hope its a good tournament, and for once, we can be totally neutral.

Redspider

PHB

I think they had a very very very tough group. Russia Israel and Macedoniaas the 3rd 4th and 5th seeds is pretty tough. Our group and Scotlands group were much easier.

That_Guy

McClaren's dismissal was inevitable really. Even if they had made it to Euro 2008 he would have still been under pressure.

Fwaggle

PHB wrote: »

Scotlands group were much easier.

LOL, I hope you are taking the piss.

mike65

Roffle! PHB is on something illegal.

The Press Conference is just the usual guff of expression of dissapointment, a review, no regrets about hiring MacClaren, Barwick asked about his position - some other 'suit' rides to his rescue by saying it was a collective descision, the next appointment will be done differently,

Q Are you embarrassed?
A yes we all are, we appologise for the failure we understand we have let the fans down.

Q Do you accept the Premier League is not working in the best interests of the England team
A Prem can't shoulder responsibility for the national side.

Q After Sven went you were under pressure to hire and English manager, all the main candidates are foreign will you hire an Englishman?
A I don't think nationality will decide the next manager.

Mike.

That_Guy

They did damn well I think, Scotland. Bit unlucky not to go through.

whiskeyman

redspider wrote: »

All the 'local' nations are out, so for those that think Ireland under-performed by finishing 3rd behind Germany (ranked 3rd in UEFA) and Czech Republic (ranked 7th), perhaps think again. On 'paper' we werent expected to qualify and doing so would have been a performance way above our means and probably would have required a) a good deal of luck, and b) major errors on the parts of other teams. Neither happened. England (ranked 9th) were knocked out by Croatia (8th) and Russia (13th).

To understand if Ireland (or England) underperformed, you have to know our standard. Before the qualifiers begans, both teams were vastly over estimated.
For Ireland, finishing 3rd might look good 'on paper', but analysing each result and the quality of play is a shocking wake up call.
For England, you have to look at how Croatia and Russia saw the group. Did they see England as the threat they used to be? I very much doubt it, and I'm sure they couldn't wait to test them.
However, both England and Ireland eye'd the rest of the teams up and thought we'd a very good chance.
It's time we got real, and with both teams out, it's happened.
It's no good 'on paper'... it's gotta be good on the pitch. Nowhere else matters.

Vokes

Jewell for the England Job



....but seriously, don't think Mourinho will take it. Lippi might be tempted though?

redspider

whiskeyman wrote: »

To understand if Ireland (or England) underperformed, you have to know our standard. Before the qualifiers begans, both teams were vastly over estimated. For Ireland, finishing 3rd might look good 'on paper', but analysing each result and the quality of play is a shocking wake up call. However, both England and Ireland eye'd the rest of the teams up and thought we'd a very good chance. It's time we got real, and with both teams out, it's happened. It's no good 'on paper'... it's gotta be good on the pitch. Nowhere else matters.

Maybe we are saying the same thing and agreeing with each other. I said:
> On 'paper' we werent expected to qualify

Ireland was expected to be 3rd (or even 4th with our seeding) and we ended up 3rd. What happened on the pitch was what was expected on 'paper' before hand. No shocks there. The Germans aren't surprised we finished 3rd, nor the Czech's nor would 99.9% of neutral fans across the world from Armenia to New Zeland. Yet, 99% of Irish fans are dissapointed that we didnt qualify and were demanding that heads should roll even though we finished 3rd.

I agree with your sentiments .....

Redspider

eirebhoy

How many English playmakers are there? Scholes is about all I can think of atm. Italy and Spain must both have at least 10 quality playmakers.

Keano

SofaKing wrote: »

Jewell for the England Job



....but seriously, don't think Mourinho will take it. Lippi might be tempted though?

Either of those 2 two will get it... But my money is on Mourinho

On a different note look how quick and professional the FA were. Not even 12 hours after they failed to qualify had the called a meeting and called a press conference. No running around hotels and playing games.

Meeting went like so... Steve your sacked. Here is £2 million. Thank you

BaZmO*

eirebhoy wrote: »

How many English playmakers are there? Scholes is about all I can think of atm. Italy and Spain must both have at least 10 quality playmakers.

Forget about playmakers, how many players have they got that can hold onto the ball? By the looks of last night none. Hell, their keeper couldn't even hold onto the ball!!!

I think it's one of the biggest differences between home nation sides and most other nations. The ability to actually hold onto the ball comfortably just doesn't seem to be there.

PHB

Indeed. Lampard and Gerrard were atrocious at giving away the ball. Barry was shocking. There's not enough quality in every position for England.
They have two world class AMCs in a three man midfield. Those players can't play anywhere else.
They have one top class defensive midfielder.
They have one world class striker.
They have one world class left sided attacking midfield, and one aging world class right sided midfielder.
They have a world class back line, no doubt about that. They have average keepers.

The 2 top class wingers (Cole and Beckham) can't play in a 4-3-3 as they don't have the pace.
The 2 top class midfielders can't play in a 4-4-2 cause they are both too wasteful and don't have the discipline.
The world class striker doesn't work well as a lone front man.

A system which might work would be Hargreaves-Carrick-Lampard/Gerrard in midfield, with Rooney and SWP on the wings, and Heskey/Crouch up front. However that would never happen I think.

Fratton Fred

redspider wrote: »

Maybe we are saying the same thing and agreeing with each other. I said:
> On 'paper' we werent expected to qualify

Ireland was expected to be 3rd (or even 4th with our seeding) and we ended up 3rd. What happened on the pitch was what was expected on 'paper' before hand. No shocks there. The Germans aren't surprised we finished 3rd, nor the Czech's nor would 99.9% of neutral fans across the world from Armenia to New Zeland. Yet, 99% of Irish fans are dissapointed that we didnt qualify and were demanding that heads should roll even though we finished 3rd.

I agree with your sentiments .....

Redspider

I on't think it is the fact that Ireland finished third that pisses people off, it is the manner in which they finished third.

Taking just one point off Cyprus, how can you defend that?

Unearthly

Lets not forget 3rd finished 10 points behind 2nd. Shocking.

BaZmO*

And out of the running with 3 games still to play. First time that's actually happened. Stan really was a record breaker!
At least England, Scotland & Northern were in the running up until the last game.

Jazzy

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Have you dug out the one about the Italians, or the Germans, or the Dutch?

What about the evel of racism in Spanish football?

No? thought not.

Have you seen the levels of violence at Russian games, how many Police were there protecting the England fans?

Still, why give a balanced view when all you really want to do is have a pop t England.

I love the way there are dozens of people on here who very rarely post in this forum but decided to turn up just to gloat at England going out.

The accusation made towards the English is that they treat the Irish like their little brother, maybe that is true, but there are a lot of Irish who behave like jealous younger siblings.

yes to everything in this post.
i could go on, but this post says it all.

---

back on topic:
Mourinho wont go near the job.
Neither will Big Phil, Hiddick... in fact any manager with the balls to make the difference.

i :think: the FA is going through restructuring atm anyway so the whole national team set up definately has time on its side to sort itself... theres a welcome break in Summer 2008 for them sure

Jose is of course the best choice, but that does mean an extra dollop of Lampard beside Gerrard for a few more years

jameshayes

Fabio Capello put his boot in....

http://www.breakingnews.ie/sport/mhmhqleysnoj/ wrote:

Former Real Madrid boss Fabio Capello would welcome the challenge of coaching England.

Capello, sacked by Madrid despite leading the Spanish giants to the Primera Liga crown earlier this year, would be interested in succeeding Steve McClaren - who was dismissed today after England’s failure to qualify for Euro 2008.

While commentating during last night’s qualifying game between Italy and the Faroe Islands for Italian TV channel Rai, Capello said: “Me to coach England? It would be a challenge, a beautiful test to overcome and I would have the right age.”

shane86

PHB wrote: »

I think they had a very very very tough group. Russia Israel and Macedoniaas the 3rd 4th and 5th seeds is pretty tough. Our group and Scotlands group were much easier.

Wha?!!? They had the joint WC finalists and a Georgian team fast on the rise, and they were knocked out by a controversial free. The Croats were the only superb team of Englands group. Russia are nothing, 1-0 against Andorra?

Mitch Connor

shane86 wrote: »

Wha?!!? They had the joint WC finalists and a Georgian team fast on the rise, and they were knocked out by a controversial free. The Croats were the only superb team of Englands group. Russia are nothing, 1-0 against Andorra?

they were still going out before that free was given weren't they, didn't they need to win the game to qualify?

Mitch Connor

shane86 wrote: »

Wha?!!? They had the joint WC finalists and a Georgian team fast on the rise, and they were knocked out by a controversial free. The Croats were the only superb team of Englands group. Russia are nothing, 1-0 against Andorra?

Russia 1-0 against Andorra.... i'll see that and raise you a 2-0 defeat to Macedonia for the 'superb' Croatia.

_blank_

shane86 wrote: »

Russia are nothing, 1-0 against Andorra?

Tauren wrote: »

2-0 defeat to Macedonia for the 'superb' Croatia.

[thegyaffer]There are no easy games in international football[/thegyaffer]

Savman

PHB wrote: »

They have two world class AMCs in a three man midfield.

Who?

They have one top class defensive midfielder.

Who?

They have one world class striker.

Who?

They have one world class left sided attacking midfield, and one aging world class right sided midfielder.

Who?

They have a world class back line, no doubt about that.

Is this England we're talking about or have I missed something?

You've used the term "world class" at least 4 times there, yet I don't see a single player on the England team sheet who could be mentioned in the same breath as Zidane, Kaka, Ronaldinho, Maradona, Rivaldo, Romario, Stoichkov, Pele, Cryuff etc etc.

They have some "class" players, but not world class by any means.

PHB

Em,
Lampard and Gerrard
Hargreaves
Rooney
Joe Cole, and Beckham
Neville-Ferdinand-Terry-Cole

They are all world class. What I mean by that is that they are in the top 5 players in their position in the world.

Mitch Connor

PHB wrote: »

Em,
Lampard and Gerrard
Hargreaves
Rooney
Joe Cole, and Beckham
Neville-Ferdinand-Terry-Cole

They are all world class. What I mean by that is that they are in the top 5 players in their position in the world.

ignoring the fact there is no keeper, that formation would never work.:rolleyes:

Pepe LeFrits

haha.