TM VSR-10 'Pro Sniper' discussion

EyesOnly

Nice to see you got your gun
nice review too, mine was posted today from fire-support hopefully some
time next week xx(crosses fingers :P), gonna have to wait to fire mine no iron sights or scope

P.S got a link to the scope you gonna use?
also them bb's you got from ebay, was it 100 or the full bottle ?

SpitfireIV

Yep, I got it, I was like a five year old on Christmas morning

The scope I got is a Tasco 3-9X40. I got it off E-Bay, linkey:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/3-9x40-Scope-mildot-High-Weaver-Mount_W0QQitemZ200022753921QQihZ010QQcategoryZ7307QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem

Its a 'But it Now' item, I wasnt expecting it for 10-14 days, but it arrived in 6 , now I have to wait for the scope rail . That scope comes with a set of high weaver (20mm) mounts, so it should fit right onto your G-Spec without a problem it cost me I think about €40 total. I got some bb's off E-bay, 500 Walther .20g for €7 (inc. postage from Germany).

EyesOnly

cool thanks for link, might get the 1 with laser on it :P
customs get you on scope ?

SpitfireIV

No, no problems with customs, they had the value down as under $40 and ticked as 'gift', so it got through ok.

[--SC(+)PE--]

Just recieved my 2nd hand vsr 10 2day . i only had 2 bb's left lol and i dont have a scope yet nor did it have iron sights so i cant realy say anything bout performance.
It looks nice the bolt action is nice, but i do find it extremely light [the only rifle im used 2 is my diana 34 air gun which is the other extreme.
The lightness is probably a good thing given how many guns i intend 2 carry 2 a skirmish

Dave!

Dunno if anyone else does this, but when I was shooting targets, I used to get a shoe-box, and take the lid off, and sellotape the target across where the lid should go. So when you shoot the target the BBs collect in the shoe-box

If the gun's too powerful then put a towel or somethin inside.

[--SC(+)PE--]

ya dave when i got me tm shoty i just shot at a pizza box and collected the bb's lodged inside and reused the 1s that looked good after carefully checking and cleaning them but apparantly it realy isnt good 4 your gun no matter what kind of condition the bb's are ,so ive stopped doing that for fear of damaging the hop up system on 1 of the barrels . I now have 2 guns and no BB's

Shigsy

are you saying you should never fire a BB more than once? I can understand this if you hit a wall or something solid because its going to weaken the BB, but i cant see a problem at all if you are catching the BB's in a cardboard box or something soft like that. :cool:

[--SC(+)PE--]

Well tbh i tought it would be fine but from what ive been told you should never fire a bb more than once [except in a cheap springer]
ive no idea how dangerous it is [if at all] to the interiors but i aint riskin it anymore just incase.

EyesOnly

well i got my 6k BB's, battery , norm Mag for my glock in 1 and a half days from Fire-Support BUT.... Interlink never Shipped my G-Spec and is still in their sorting Hub in the UK got in contact with fire-support and they're great guys there sorting it all out .

I was like a 5 year old at christmas when the interlink van pulled up. BIG LET DOWN when he handed me a 12" x 6" box, I quizzed him, asking him
ME: " erm isnt there a second package "
Driver : "NO"
ME: are you sure
Driver: look (hands me they signing sheet)

Sure enough 1 of 1 , signed for it he left. 30mins later i see 1 of 2 in biro at the top in small writing

SpitfireIV

Jaysus , how unlucky are you, a VSR and only 2 bb's.....torture . Is it the Pro Sniper that the last owner removed the sights to fit a scope, or a G-Spec minus the scope?

I've been using an old wine box, similar to what DaveMcG described, with an A4 target taped to the front and some thin spong on the back to absorb the impact, did me for about a year or so. But I got fed up of it and threw this thing together today....


The opening at the front is the size of an A4 sheet, with some extra to allow the sheet to be taped on:



And what makes it better again is that it fold down neatly



The material on the back is left slack so as to absorb an impact, and the angle throws the BB's downward to a spong lining on the bottom, so they dont get damaged at all and are easily scooped up then.


You can buy these things online, but making them is more adventurous


RealEyesOnly, that was a pretty good shipping time from the UK, just a pity that the VSR wasnt part of the package eh, wonder why that was left behind? Maybe they wanted to have a closer look at it before sending it on.

[--SC(+)PE--]

lol croppy it is torture m8 i went a bit mad with my benelli when i got it first and even reusing some bb's i eventually ran out.

Its a black stock vsr 10 real shock apparantly. o yea and has a spring upgrade [i say apparantly cos well their doesnt seem 2 be much of a shock just a quite "sproing" when fired]

O yea Croppyboy thats a neat little target ya got their hows your rifle performing?

SpitfireIV

The difference between the Pro Sniper and the Real Shock, is that the Real Shock has two weights added to the piston, so when you pull the trigger, the weight of them going forward and stopping abruptly creates the 'shock', I've read a few places though that it slows down the piston a bit too, they are easily removed thus adding a few more fps to the weapon, but of course losing that 'realistic' feel.

Its shooting grand at the moment, just messing about with the sights and the hop up, I'm not very fond of the hop up, I've noticed that even with .2g bb's at 10M that it tends to throw them a bit sloppy. I have the hop up barely set on mine, I thing about 8 clicks at 10m and 4 clicks at 20m. At 20m I'm averaging about 3"-4" groupings, which isnt too bad I guess seen as I have no scope set up yet. Unfortunately the longest, clearest stretch in my garden is 20m, so I cant try beyond that

EyesOnly

TBH croppy you should make a step by step guide to making the thing , its very good

how hard is it to cock the bolt on this? im thinking of upgrading mine with a 1J spring when i get it.

I've got a 50m+ garden and plenty of fields around me so no problems their.

SpitfireIV

TheRealEyesOnly wrote:

TBH croppy you should make a step by step guide to making the thing , its very good

If you, or anyone else are interested I could do up a few rough sketches and measurements etc for this particular one.

Its not hard to cock, you feel a sling pressure as you pull it back and once it clicks it then slides shut again with no resistance. I've found a couple of times though when firing off quick shots that I'd lose grip of the bolt handle, especially when lying down (this happened about 4-5 times out of roughly 300+ shots), thus the bolt would spring forward stripping a bb from the mag, but the main spring would not be compressed yet.

[--SC(+)PE--]

lol croppyboy believe me the "shock effect" is lol. if it wern't for the box id sware i got a basic vsr 10.
ive got around a 1 joule spring Realeyes and its easy 2 cock it [nothing compared 2 me M3]

cant wait till i get some ammo and a scope 2 realy test me rifle

jimi_t

That looks really amazing - how powerful is it though? I understand that airsoft legislation limits it to a certain velocity and all, but would it break skin at close range? I'd love to get one for shooting at paper targets, but in a (semi) built up area I'd always be afraid of injuring someone or breaking a window if it misfired...

SpitfireIV

jimi_t wrote:

That looks really amazing - how powerful is it though? I understand that airsoft legislation limits it to a certain velocity and all, but would it break skin at close range? I'd love to get one for shooting at paper targets, but in a (semi) built up area I'd always be afraid of injuring someone or breaking a window if it misfired...

I havent got a chronograph jimi, so I cant tell you exactly how powerful it is, from what I understand its anywhere between 280-300fps. Currently once an airsoft gun is under 328fps, then it falls outside of the law.

As for breaking skin at close range, I have no idea and I wont be trying either , I imagine it would hurt....a lot! At about 2 inches from a coke can it will pierce the can and almost come through the other side with a .2g bb.

The only reason I got my one was for plinking in the back garden, I doubth I'll be ever skirmishing, just recreational for me, I have gardens either side of me too. If you were getting one you'd want a minimum of at least 20m straight stretch, and chose the area well, ie dont fire in the direction of a house or window, try firing down the garden away from any houses. Hang a blanket behind your target, that will stop any stray shots. And above all, safety safety and safety! If you treat it like a real firearm, use the safety and get comfortable with it then there shouldnt be any accidents.

ViperGTS

Hi all.
Really interested in this rifle. I've seen it on the site and it looks nice. If I were to buy it today, what would I need to get with it to be able to head out to the garden and start practicing? Any amount/type of BB's u would reccommend? Do I need gas? Any more "top-ups" I might need, do I have to order them from the uk on-line?
Thanks a lot for the help

[--SC(+)PE--]

all ya realy need is BB's. Its spring powered so ya dont need 2 worry about gas and stuff. silicon oil would be a good idea to clean it and look after it as it is an expensive piece. 0.25 gram B's are probably the best bet as their less effected by the wind then the lighter 0.2 grams.

Sparks

CroppyBoy1798 wrote:

Currently once an airsoft gun is under 328fps, then it falls outside of the law.

No, currently once the Muzzle Energy of the pellet is under 1 Joule, then it falls outside the law. Muzzle energy = 1/2 * mass * velocity squared.
So, for a .2g pellet, the legal limit for your rifle is 328fps; but for a .25g pellet, it's 293 fps and for a .1g pellet it would be 462 fps.

Helpful links:

Kinetic Energy Calculator

Unit Conversion

o1s1n

if anyone here is a reader of the airsoftireland forums, then they'll know that a lot of people there have high powered guns, including snipers up to 500fps. yet northern ireland has a similar 1j limit. mainland uk has a 1.37j limit yet people also have high powered weapons. a lot of sites have a 500fps limit on spring cocked weapons.
whats the deal?! i really dont understand this. are they all just flouting the law? or is it just treated leniently? afterall a "real" firearm, such as a Beretta, has a muzzle velocity of 583j

Harekin

Its because they class it as a manually loaded weapon instead of a semi/full-auto so its in a different catagory.

o1s1n

bolt action weapons still fall into the 1j (northern ireland) and 1.37k (mainland UK) catagory. anything above that is considered a firearm. its the same as here. but they do it anyway. and its not frowned upon. some sites even cater for it with +1j site limits. i just find it a little odd.

Sparks

If they're ever inspected by the Gardai, that'll stop pretty fast oisin. There are some pretty heavy penalties in the new Act for target shooting on an unauthorised range, so unless the site operators had their site inspected and licenced as a range by the DoJ, they could be potentially looking at thousands of euro in fines and jail time if anyone was caught over the 1 Joule limit on their site.

o1s1n

sorry when i said "they do it anyway" i meant in the UK and N.I. as in they seem to flout the law and no one bats an eyelid.
actually, the 1j limit is probabaly a good thing game wise. keeps everyone at the same level. must be annoying to be outgunned simply because someone elses AEG has more range on you.

Rovi

o1s1n wrote:

afterall a "real" firearm, such as a Beretta, has a muzzle velocity of 583j

If, by 'a Beretta' you mean a conventional 9mm pistol like a Model 92 or a zillion others from a multitude of manufacturers, they'll be firing bullets in the 7.5-9.5g (grams) range at muzzle velocities of around 300-400mps (meters per second). These will yield muzzle energies of 300-400j (joules), approximately.
With some exceptions, pistol ammunition fires relatively large bullets at relatively slow speeds. Most is subsonic.
Bigger/faster stuff (.40, .44, .45, 10mm, etc) hits harder, smaller/slower stuff (.25, .32, etc) hits 'softer' (relative term! ).
I wouldn't fancy standing in front of any of them.

.

Harekin

Are you not listening to me? I told you its a different legal catagory. Go onto the Airsoft UK forum and ask if you dont believe me.

EDIT: Sorry that was directed towards Oisin.

SpitfireIV

ViperGTS, as the other guys already mentioned the basic needs for this particular airsoft gun is pellets and silicon oil. Again, as already mentioned a bag/bottle of .25g bb's would probably be best, I notice that even at 20m the .2g bb's tend to wonder, so something a little heavier should do the job.

The Pro Sniper comes with iron sights (as pictured in my first post), these do the job and are sufficent, but anything past 20m and its a little hard to get a good shot, so a scope is probably the best option.

If you are thinking of getting a scope you'll have to get a weaver 20mm scope rail (only a few yoyo's off e-bay) a scope (anything from 3-9X40 would do the job) and a set of 20mm weaver scope rings to fit on the rail (again these are cheap enough on e-bay).

Hope that helps

o1s1n

different legal catagory my arse. it used to be. its not anymore.
its 1j northern ireland. 1.35j uk. simple as that. no matter what mech the gun uses, AEG, single action bolt or GBB.

read

http://www.airsoftireland.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=979

in particular

"Now, as an weapon requiring an FAC could be legally said to be "lethally barrelled" (Lethally barrelled is generally considered to be 1.35j in the UK, although rulings have been made in courts of law at a far lower level than that) then that would mean you can't ever shoot someone with it....even with their consent.
Again, I'm not sure on the NI legislature, but certainly in the UK you can't consent to assault (check out the "AEG Legal Ramifications" thread in the ASCUK Sniper Haven for exhaustive reading on this subject)."

"Also any site that is a member of the UKASGB MUST adhere to the 328 + 10% that andy stated thats why so many of the sites say 330

But even if the mainland England said "hey lads 600FPS sniper rifles no probs!!!" we'd still need to stick to 328FPS.

If you dont your commiting assult with a deadly weapon regardless if the person presses charges or not"

"10.2 The FCC fully endorse the approach which was adopted and recommends that a statutory threshold of one joule (0.7376 ft/lbs.) muzzle energy should be embodied in primary legislation on the basis that any air weapon which exceeded this limit would be deemed to be a firearm for the purposes of the Firearms Acts."

*any air weapon*. i dont see different catagories there?

o1s1n

my point Rovi was that seeing as an actual firearm, such as the pistol I happened to mention (I apologise if I wasn’t specific enough for you, it didn’t really matter) fires between 300-400j, is so much more powerful then an airsoft rifle, that firing slightly over the 1.35j limit isn’t seen as a big deal. i wasnt stating this as truth, i was just trying to figure out how some people in the UK get away with having high powered weapons. and using them on skirmish sites.