Serious but not serious

Extranjero

Is anyone very into cycling and pushing themselves but not really into competing in the sense of competitions? I like to try and work hard and improve but I feel a bit in the way riding with people who are really goal orientated towards races. I get a kick out of just being able to keep up with them.

I find it's a bit of a downer because physically I want to take it very seriously but psychologically I don't. Maybe I want to have my cake and eat it too.

Does anyone else get this?

Ghost Rider

I would have thought there were quite a lot of cyclists out there who feel the same way as you do i.e. they like to cycle and want to push themselves but don't particularly want to race. I think you could probably describe that as a type of competitiveness but it's competing with oneself rather than with others.

Maybe you just need to find people to cycle with who share that attitude...?

Extranjero wrote: »

Is anyone very into cycling and pushing themselves but not really into competing in the sense of competitions? I like to try and work hard and improve but I feel a bit in the way riding with people who are really goal orientated towards races. I get a kick out of just being able to keep up with them.

I find it's a bit of a downer because physically I want to take it very seriously but psychologically I don't. Maybe I want to have my cake and eat it too.

Does anyone else get this?

Extranjero

That's probably true. Ireland isn't exactly a cyclist's paradise (in that you always see far more people out cycling on the continent) but at the saem time you meet a variety of people. I do a good bit of MTB-ing and you meet plenty of those who don't seem to like cycling at all! They want to do the MTB-ing bu they 're not into getting there on their bikes. I mean that's fine. But I feel a bit stuck between very serious people and total fun riders.

RedPlanet

I'd say i fit the bill there.
Last summer i joined up with a local cycling club and could keep up with them most the time.
I could take almost everyone of them on the climbs.
But they'd leave in their wake everytime they started sprinting.
Overall though, i found it not very enjoyable as they were all training for racing and i wasn't. So i found myself pushing things harder than what i wanted to which actually caused me to not be able to sleep at night after the spin.
Not sure what was going on there but something physiological.
Also, some of them were a bit narky and always shouting at everybody to call out potholes and tidy up the group and things.
I go cycling on weekends for fitness and my enjoyment, not for military training.

Extranjero

I went on a fairly intense one recently and I couldn't sleep after either. I was too hepped up I think.

I find people can be a bit narky too, which is fine if they want to take it very seriously but I don't. I'll have to start my own club.

zorkmundsson

went out with a club, whose name i won't mention, for the first time ever last weekend and was very surprised at the atmosphere. narkiness, cliqueishness and just general bad vibes, as well as some serious organisational problems. don't think i'll be heading back.
on that note, can anyone recommend a well-organised, easy-going group that goes for spins weekends? absolute novice at this game but surprised myself with how far i went when i did go out. much appreciated.

doozerie

zorkmundsson wrote: »

went out with a club, whose name i won't mention, for the first time ever last weekend and was very surprised at the atmosphere. narkiness, cliqueishness and just general bad vibes, as well as some serious organisational problems. don't think i'll be heading back.
on that note, can anyone recommend a well-organised, easy-going group that goes for spins weekends? absolute novice at this game but surprised myself with how far i went when i did go out. much appreciated.

I think that Dundrum Wheelers have a touring section, although I'm not certain. They also have a racing section - that used to be a bit elitist but might have changed since my experience with them. If Dundrum is in your area of the world then you could ring Joe Daly Cycles, or drop into them, for info on the club.

More generally, there still seems to be a lot of elitism in cycling, just as in many other sports, but I think it is better (i.e. less) these days than before. No doubt there are still people who consider themselves "serious racers" though, who will always look down on people they see as beginners (and being a beginner in their eyes often simply means that your name isn't known in the Irish racing community, so it really has little to do with your level of fitness or skill). At the most stupid level, this includes people looking down on you because your bike isn't as expensive as theirs, but I have encountered this more in mountain biking than in road riding.

At the same time though, there should be a certain level of seriousness given to riding with a club 'cos a silly mistake by any one person could bring down several people around them. This shouldn't translate into people being narky mind you, but you should be aware of what you are doing and if someone is being genuinely unreasonable towards you then either tell them or ignore them. If they are real muppets, then you can get a lot of satisfaction from getting yourself fitter and out-riding them (usually the best/strongest cyclists are not the idiots as they don't really have anything to prove - the idiots tend to be people who think they are better than they really are, so out-riding them is a feasible challenge).

Sean02

I think it's the same in most sports. Its a kind of initiation process and cycling is probaly one of the worst for facilitating newcomers. Problem is club training/leisure run are generaly not flexible enough in terms of distance / speed which can be a sickner for lots of newcomers. However there are lots of groups around who don't show off and are prepared to encourage riders building up to club run distances. Talk to your local bike shop.

Hungrycol

zorkmundsson wrote: »

went out with a club, whose name i won't mention, for the first time ever last weekend and was very surprised at the atmosphere. narkiness, cliqueishness and just general bad vibes, as well as some serious organisational problems. don't think i'll be heading back.
on that note, can anyone recommend a well-organised, easy-going group that goes for spins weekends? absolute novice at this game but surprised myself with how far i went when i did go out. much appreciated.

Swords CC meet at the Lord Mayors Pub on the street in Swords every Sunday morning at 9 or 9.30 (see their website). It's a fast enough "leisure" group and they'll only go as fast as the slowest person and will ask you (politely) to slow down if you're stretching the pace in consideration of the other riders. They are welcoming to new faces and don't care if you have a €10k bike or a €500 bike. To keep everyone together they'll stop if you want to take a leak or if you get a puncture or just need to put more air in your tyre. You'll be really surprised how quickly you can go in a bunch without feeling it. Use common sense and hand signals and before you know it you'll be shouting "HOLE" like the rest of them. It's really really enjoyable without being really competitive and you get to learn group cycling and group cornering etc which makes you feel great, swoooosh...

zorkmundsson

thanks all.
i take the point about not taking things seriously when riding in a group, horrible things could happen. reassuring to hear that i could take some of the mouthy ones with a bit of training, too!

supertramp

I would consider myself a good cyclist.
I cycle fast, and distances of usually 100km.
this year I cycled 1,730km in two weeks.
I have never competed in a race although I do get a high feeling passing another cyclist.
I push myself, kind of with my own inner battles. i used to have a bit of depression, and cycling was a way i could 'punish' myself.

My view on racing is I think there is no point racing when I'm not going to reach the ultimate height, le tour. I either give all, or give nothing.

niceonetom

supertramp wrote: »

I would consider myself a good cyclist.
I cycle fast, and distances of usually 100km.
this year I cycled 1,730km in two weeks.
I have never competed in a race although I do get a high feeling passing another cyclist.
I push myself, kind of with my own inner battles. i used to have a bit of depression, and cycling was a way i could 'punish' myself.

My view on racing is I think there is no point racing when I'm not going to reach the ultimate height, le tour. I either give all, or give nothing.

i identify with this (though i've never put in those kind of miles!). i like cycling alone, with myself and against myself.

have you seen the film "The Flying Scotsman"? sounds like it'd be right up your alley.

Ghost Rider

Speaking of such films, check out the Bicycle Film Festival:

http://bicyclefilmfestival.com/2007_site/index.php

niceonetom wrote: »

i identify with this (though i've never put in those kind of miles!). i like cycling alone, with myself and against myself.

have you seen the film "The Flying Scotsman"? sounds like it'd be right up your alley.

beans

Supertramp, sounds like Audax-type long-distance events would be right up your alley; and if you like 'punishing' yourself and would like an 'ultimate' to reach for, how about this!

Morgan

supertramp wrote: »

My view on racing is I think there is no point racing when I'm not going to reach the ultimate height, le tour. I either give all, or give nothing.

Kind of like, there's no point in playing soccer if you're not going to get to the World Cup?

blorg

Extranjero wrote: »

Is anyone very into cycling and pushing themselves but not really into competing in the sense of competitions?

Yes, I'd fit into this category myself, over 10k/year but don't race. Mostly by myself, occasionally with my girlfriend (she is not quite as enthusiastic.) You probably want to look into audax; I've only done the Wicklow 200 so far but found the atmosphere there very positive indeed, even when riding with guys in a bunch for the first time.

Extranjero

I get that you need to be careful when riding in a group but if you are a super strong cyclist you still will have your first ride with a group. So, you won't have the group skills there automatically. That's where you need some accomodation but understandbly if people are out seriously training for races they are not interested in accomodating you.

supertramp

niceonetom wrote: »

i identify with this (though i've never put in those kind of miles!). i like cycling alone, with myself and against myself.

have you seen the film "The Flying Scotsman"? sounds like it'd be right up your alley.

I went to see it, absolutely brilliant.

supertramp

beans wrote: »

Supertramp, sounds like Audax-type long-distance events would be right up your alley; and if you like 'punishing' yourself and would like an 'ultimate' to reach for, how about this!

Thanks for that link. Now that sounds great! will think about that!

supertramp

Morgan wrote: »

Kind of like, there's no point in playing soccer if you're not going to get to the World Cup?

Yes, like that.

doozerie

The following calendar lists a lot of the various events around the country, both racing and leisure events:

http://www.irishcycling.com/events/calendar/

There are quite a few "leisure" events on throughout the year. The name doesn't really accurately describe them though as many of them are far from leisurely, such as the Wicklow 200, but you can take them at your own pace if you don't want to stick with a group.

If you do opt to stick with a group during an event though, then it is very useful having some experience of riding in a group already. At a very basic level it can be initimidating having other bikes all round you and the wrong time to find that out is when you are surrounded by other people that you don't know (and therefore you don't know how much to trust the wheel in front of you). Also there are the less immediately obvious things that you learn when riding in a bunch such as not to haul on the brakes all of a sudden when there is a bike right behind you - logical stuff really, but not all of it comes naturally. Having decent bike handling skills helps a lot, which you can obviously build up from riding on your own, but that doesn't cover everything so it pays to ride in a bunch when you can if you plan to take part in well attended events.

Raam

My first time riding in a group was at the Sean Kelly event this year. I had already done the Wicklow 200 but started very early and was ahead of all the groups.
At the Sean Kelly Tour, the experienced riders were very accommodating and were very happy to give tips and answer any questions. They seemed to err on the side of caution when encountering obstacles or hazard points, as everything of note had a loud shout called for it. I was worried about it at first, but quickly got into the swing of it. I found that you really need your wits about you and you have to pay attention to what the rider in front is doing, and the riders in front of him and hope that the rider behind is doing the same. Anticipation seems to be the name of the game, with plenty of communication. We were only on a leisure cycle, so I can imagine that a race group has more of an edge to it

doozerie

Raam wrote:

I found that you really need your wits about you and you have to pay attention to what the rider in front is doing, and the riders in front of him and hope that the rider behind is doing the same.

Exactly. One of the best pieces of advice that I was given early on was to watch the rider two riders ahead, not the rider immediately in front of me. That way you have time to react if you see something happening further ahead - by the time you notice the rider immediately in front of you react it is probably too late to avoid colliding with him/her if you weren't prepared for them to brake/swerve/whatever.

There is a lot of trust involved in a group, and you will find that people who are persistently erratic will become very unpopular very quickly. Haven't seen that happen much though as most people learn pretty fast not to be unpredictable.