What parts to test first?

dclifford

I am having a problem with games crashing in the middle of play within minutes of starting up. It is happening with MOH, COD 4 and World in conflict.
I have been troubleshooting for a couple of weeks and nothing has worked. It looks like the next step is to start swapping out parts. What is the best and most cost efficient way of doing this?
I can supply a list of current part if it helps.

po0k

Post specs.

I've been having intermittent stability issues with my DFI NF4/X2 3800/1900XTX.
Can't play portal, SupComm etc. for too long without crashes. Have reinstalled Windows, changed chipset HSF, still haven't tracked it down.

Sucks
Get a utility that lets you log system temperatures. Log to a network share on another drive (so you don't kill yours during a crash).
Should help diagnose any possible thermal issues you're having.

Vikings

Had a similar problem an age back, turned out to be a dodgy sound card driver, forced my PC to reboot every time a nade went off in one of the games I played.

Only brought this up to point out it could be anything.

dclifford

MSI P865 Platinum
Gainward Geforce 8600GTS 512MB
E6800 core 2 duo
thermaltake 560W PSU
reatek onboard audio. Have also tested USB creative sound card and USB headset.
Windows XP and Vista 32.

It is not temperature related. I am able to ALT+TAB to check the temps during gameplay. The temps are CPU ~40c and GPU ~45c

PogMoThoin

Run memtest to test your memory @ boot time. Set your bios to boot from cd.

Run orthos to stress your cpu & monitor temps with core temp.

If none of these give you fails your down to a driver problem, which will be hard to find.

Archytas

I had the exact same issue - Different components but worth a shot - Chipset Driver and Graphics drivers were conflicting with each other... The way I found out was when I was running the Directx test and it stuttered like crazy...

But try changing around the drivers.

Anti

It really could be 100 different things. Best and quickest thing to do is backup everything you need and wipe your C drive. Reinstall windows, drivers, apps etc etc.

Archytas

Actually - Just looked at your spec there - Does it happen in both Xp and Vista? If so its nearly definitely hardware related. Look at things that only really get used heavily in Games - GFX card, etc. as you don't say that these crashes come at any other time...

dclifford

It happens on both Vista and XP. The crash only happens during games.
I have used all combination of the 4 sticks of ram, so I don't believe it is memory related.
I have completed several clean installs of XP and tried different combinations of drivers. Direct X test and 3dmark05 run with no problems.

I had to update to the 8600GTS to play the 3 games mentioned. I never had a problem with the old X850T when I played games like halflife 2 and Battlefield 2. So I think the Graphics card is the first to check. I had to RMA the first 8600GTS that I got as it kept crashing at any time, not only games.

gamer

You could try switch off windows sound service in acessorys, tools services,or set sound volume to zero,if no crashes its a sound card problem ,or conflict.try running some games in lower res from a pci graphics card.Have you disapled onboard video, disable all mobo ports/devices you dont need ,eg firewire,floppy,com port .try just using onboard sound ,take out soundcard,try borrowing another graphics card from some1.MAKE SURE ,you have at least 2,3gig free space on drive,go to control panel,system,hardware,performance/advanced , set pc for best performance knocks off windows,effects,sliding windows etc.Defrag your hardrive.Download privacy mantra, gets rid of all crap,remnants old prog,temporary files.Its possible you had a power surge to pc which damaged some component ,check mobo temp after loading a game.Set display to 16bit.INSTALL old graphics driver ,original driver cd, 06 driver.Maybe graphics card overheating,try unreal 2004 demo,ut2004,older games,does it still crash.PUT in the old card ,if no crashes ,then new card may be overheating,or faulty .Can you try new card in another pc.Run full scan for virus,s ,or spyware .DOWNLOAD avg antispyware.try trend micro online spyware scan.

dclifford

Thanks gamer for all the suggestions.
Here are the suggestions I have not done yet:
Try card in another PC.
Try an old game, but I don't think it is an overheating problem. I have seen the temps a couple of seconds before it crashes and they were low.
Try old PCI card.

dclifford

Update:
I loaded up and played BF2. It crashed. I never tried it before on the 8600 card.
It worked with no probs on the old X850XT card, so I installed the old card. Played BF2 for over an hour with no problems.

Is it safe to assume the 8600 is bust?
I am thinking about buying a new ATI card.

kleefarr

What are your PSU stats?

gamer

have you got 2 gig ram, maybe theres a bios setting conflict with new card,or mobo,device conflict,or a driver directx file missing.RUN SFC. SYSTEM FILE CHECKER ,CHECKS 4 missing files.run DXDIAG ,FROM START programs,run.
KNOCK OFF ,com,printer,firewire ,sata, all mobo devices you do not need .WRITE down all the settings,irq , settings.mem settings,4 all devices.
RUN cod4 ,new games,world in conflict on the old card ,does it crash,leave on pc 3 hours cod4 at high settings.
I INSTALLED, WINXP, then installed latest nvidia drivers.my pc would not play ANY games,i had 2 uninstall new drivers,and reboot now it plays cod4 ,all games fine.
i think its running winxp sp2,native inbuilt drivers.i,m running pci-e 7300nvidia card.
go to control panel, uninstall all nvidia drivers, from REMOVE/ADD PROGRAMS.
Reboot see can you play cod4 or bf2 or any games.
I,VE cod4 running medium detail ,textures low ,aa off, 30fps approx.
SWitch off aa, vsync , set textures to low,relections /shadows low,water detail,off,bullets off,model detail low, then try 2 play cod4 .Does it crash.
AS last resort ,go to bios, reset BIOS TO DEFAULT SETTING.

dclifford

PSU = thermaltake 560W

I have 4 GB ram, I have tried all combinations of it installed.
DXDIAG does not show any problems.
The new games will not run on the old card, it does not meet the minimum requirements on install of the games.
i have tried all combinations of original and latest drivers for sound and videp card.
Turning on basic game settings will make no difference.

Need to try:
looking for conflicts.
Can reset the bios.

The game pc will only freeze during actual gameply. It will load up, go through menus and cutscenes with no problems. But once it starts the playable part of the game then it goes.

gamer

if you have winxp .take out 1gig ram,dimm4, as winxp can only adress 3gig max.WRITE DOWN ALL ,bios settings,advanced be4 u reset to default, can you make your cpu run abit slower in bios, download free everest pc diagnostic ,from majorgeeks.run winxp in safe mode.
DISABLE,sata,onboard sound,agp,video,com ports,printer ports ,that you dont need to run games.Run cod4 ,medium settings,shadows/reflections,water/bullets off,aa,vsync off,models low,textures low,bileanear graphics, special effects medium or low, you need at least 4000+dual core to run cod4 in my experience .Run it in 800x600 ,display settings 16bit,does it still crash.

[DF]Lenny

sounds more like a temprature problem to me on the gfx card,if it fails running high intensity games after approx same periods of time .Have you overclocked this card previously?

another (stupid) suggestion is to remove the card and take a hoover to it to make sure the fan is operating correctly - excessive dust inside the card turned out to be my prob after trying almost everthing prior to this.

dclifford

I don't believe it is a temp issue. On Vista COD4 will crash within seconds once the gameplay section starts. I can also run 3dmark05 with no probs.

TerrorFirmer

You've plugged in the pci-e connector to your card, right? It'd be strange for both 8600GTS to be faulty...

dclifford

@havoc. The first card had a completely different problem. The bios screen even had artifacts.


I ran the everest PC diagnostics. It is telling me that the +12v is running at 10.2v. However I have tested it physically on the main line and on the PCI connector at it is reading 12.2v on idle. When the game is running it drops to 12.6v

everest PC diagnostics also tells me that the GPU was running at ~56degC at time of crash. I was using the ALT+TAB to flick back and forward. All other temps are running less than 46degC

gamer

Sounds like you need more cooling on graphics card,could you put in temporary fan aim it at card, taken off case,on side near graphics card, even open window,knock off heating in pc room, if cod4 last longer be4 crashing it points towards card overheating .Download belarc adviser free ,to get more info on possible system problem.Lower temp in room ,try cod4 again.
I know you have 500watt psu, you cud download cod4 demo ,disconnect power from cdroms, dvd drives ,may allow more power to the card .IS airflow thru pc,around card ok.
One reason i can think of,there may be faulty comonent on mobo,like onboard graphics chip or soundchip,which you dont know about cos you use pci sound,that part may be causing grahics card to crash when under stress ,or hi temps.A power surge to pc can damage 1 component without you knowing.
Is there a cod4 patch you could download.TRY cod4 at low res low grahics settings.MY soundcard on an athlon 2.oghz died 4months ago,i just put in a sblive card in pci to replace it.
You could try getting a SURGE protector, ,this will protect pc from surges to psu, smooth out esb supply going into pc.PC world do nice 1,s with 5 sockets on/off switch .DO you shut down windows, and then knock off main power at the rear of the pc, otherwise your pc has power going thru it ,vunerable to esb power surges,voltage fluctuations thru motherboard .Thats not good for the mobo,or the graphics card.

gamer

I wonder is there any special settings in bios ,your mobo may need ,to enhance 8800gt stability or speed. SOUNDS like theres sumthing wrong with motherboard, or the card, or theres a hardware conflict between the 2,or bios settings wrong, winxp can only ADRESS 3gig ram max.TRY taking out the 4th dimm,last 1gigram.
I,M assuming you have all the current drivers installed, and theres no files missing,or a virus,or spyware which is taking up memory,or screwing up windows files,dlls.Disconnect from the net connection,switch off antvirus,ipod service,and various services/process you dont need to run games,press cntrl alt del ,how much is the cpu usage when you run cod4,if over90percent,you probably have 2many services running,or a virus taking up resources.
PCS are complex ,that card may work fine in other a pc 2gig ram winxp.
i,m running dual core 4000+athlon 2gig ram ,7300 pci-e card pc.IT runs COD4 ok,but i have to knock off water,shadows,aa,bullet effects,reflections,models medium, graphics at medium,textures low.
I,ll be upgrading that card in 4 weeks.The 7300 is a around 35per cent the speed of an 8800gt card.

dclifford

I am getting an old Pentium 4 to test. I will have to use my old Abit fatality mobo, so that will rule out the processor and the mobo/bios. I will need to reinstall XP so that will rule out viruses etc.

Do you think the temps I mentioned are high?

dclifford

Update:
I completed a set-up with a different processor and different motherboard.
A fresh install of windows XP.
I am using the same video card and the same PSU.

COD4 crashes in the same place as the original setup.

I think it is time to get a new graphics card.:(
I can't see how the PSU would cause the game to crash at similar places all the time on different setups.

gamer

i,m not an expert on psu,s but it might be possible thet psu ,is not supplying suffecient power to card to run cod4/ highly detailed 3d games .IF you had another psu, there,d be no harm in trying it on the card .Be careful re antistatic ,when handling cards,dimms or mobos.eg I,VE BEEN TOLD some agp cards dont work on some 400watt psu,s depending on how many hds,cdroms,dvdroms are connected to the motherboard.Ipresume you are using a high quality power unit.

TerrorFirmer

It sounds like the card isn't getting enough power from the psu. Do you have another to try? And the card is connected to the psu, right?

PogMoThoin

Sounds more like a psu issue than a gpu one to me,

gamer

Does your monitor run off the pc power unit,or its own esb socket/power cable.
NO matter what mobo you use ,that card needs x amount of power .

dclifford

The monitor is powered separately.

It looks like the general feedback is for a different PSU.
What sort of wattage should I be looking at for a minimum. I will not get the minimum but need to know where to start.

Thanks all.

gamer

on gamespot hardware forum, it says 8800gt needs 26amp+ ,at least 450 watt power unit , i think that means 26amp avaidable ,amount of current on the 12volt connector going into card.so i think you need to buy a good brand psu eg corsair 500watt SPECIFY,i need at least 1 connector for my card with 26amps rating ,at least.i think that means it can draw 26amps from psu for the card if REQUIRED ,to do so by a card running hi res 3d game like cod4.
MY advice buy from a bricks and mortar shop,keep receipt, tell em i,m buying this to run my new 8800card ,need 500watts and 26amps on 1 12volt connector into my card.
DO you have the manual /box there ,look for info re power rating.
I think you need 500watt,cos\ psu also supplys power to mobo,cpu,dvd/ hardrives, and whatever fans you r running.
DONT get apsu ,online unless its like 30percent cheaper, and you are sure it can at least run a 8800 at 1000x1000 res.EVEN if you buy a 600watt psu your card wont work at hi res ,if the psu only outputs 22amps into the grahics card.TRY cod4 at 640x480res,16bit ,does it still crash.
HOLD ON to the receipt ,you get 12months min gaurantee on any psu,component that you buy.
LIKE a good plasma tv, buy a quality psu and you,ll get years of service from it.DO not buy a no name psu ,i know corsair gets great reviews on boards.ie tech.

gamer

ON evga.com it says min spec for 8800gt psu, is 450watt power supply,22amp 12v rail/connector for pci-e card.SO, i,d advise go 4 500watt psu.TOMS hardware says at high res AOE 3 1200 RES, 8800gt uses 300watts ,thats just the card,the mobo cpu hardrive will need at least 150watts,depending how many drives you have in your pc,what cpu you have,higher resolution =more power,amps needed from psu.
sounds like your psu does not supply enough amps into your card.