Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Renting a Room Dilema - NEED ADVICE

Options
  • 20-11-2007 9:05pm
    #1
    leroy_brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭


    Hi,
    As a Landlord i am an owner occupier and have decided to rent a room using daft. Having advertised with a few pictures i received a great response and lined up a few possible tenants to view the place. Eventually settling with one guy who could move in the next day. He had a lot of question when he visited first which we agreed was great to get them out of the way. The usual was explained about to move in, one months rent, and the same as deposit should be handed over. Silly of me this guy seemd like i could trust him, so the following day he called and asked if possible to get a lift from his temporary accomodtion as he had luggage as he also just arrived to Ireland. On collecting him he didnt have the money to hand, so we drove around looking for bank machines, and out of four, only one was working. He was only able to withdraw just over one months rent. So that night he had moved in as i agreed to make a compromise as all the stuff was now in my car and let him move in with his stuff and pay the remainder the day after as he had the full day off. On coming home the first night, he started asking further questions, i gave a receipt for what he had handed over already. The questions started to get more and more demanding, including how long his girlfriend could come over for, i set a limit, to which he went on with a lot of 'what if' scenarios. In the end, what we agreed, he wanted a full lease/contract even though the room was only being let for two months as we agreed. Seemingly he needed this lease to show social welfare to get a social security number. I compromised again and said i would prepare a lease whilst at work for hime to sign, also to please have the money ready etc as i was only popping in. The following day, i had modified a lease to suit a room rental and returned at 15:30 to hand it to him then back to work. On arriving home at 18:30, he is getting ready to head off shopping, i ask about the money situation and the lease signed? to which he replies, 'talk later'. I wait until he returns and im already late for going out, he forgets to get the remainder of the deposit, it then transpires he has a lot of questions from
    the lease and would like a few more days to think it over. At this point im thinking i dont know this guy from 'Adam', when i arrive back late tonight, all my possesion could be gone. After threatening to move out and get a hotel, i explain that that would be his choice but would lose his deposit as he has wasted my time in sourcing a tenant, who now decides to move out. After a lengthy 'what if' scenario discussion like before i explain a few choices.
    1. Sign the lease and hand over the remaining deposit before i leave.
    2. Should he decide to move out (at his discretion) i would hold €250 to myself for timewasting and losing other possible tenants. This was less than half of a months rent. He agreed in the end, and to appease the situation, he handed over the keys back to me before i left. On returning home that night, i find all his possesions are gone, no notes, the food shopping he done emptied from the cupboards. On turning onn my phone he left a short text message sayin he had left and wants the money i took from him. Thanks for anyone who have read this far. It has been a learning experience, partially to easygoing on my behalf. But to make a long story short i would like to
    know:
    1. Am i entitled to hold any of the deposit at all - legally.
    2. Should i just hold the whole deposit.
    3. Should i ask him to write a receipt to me giving evidence of what money i have returned to him and take my original receipt back? And only hand over when he give this information to me.


    Appreciate any logical response

    P


Comments

  • Options
    #2
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,360 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    First, welcome to boards.ie. Second, learn to use paragraphs, its polite! :)

    You can lick on the 'edit' button to fix it.


  • Options
    #3
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,284 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Strictly speaking- as its the rent-a-room scheme, its not a tenancy in the normal understanding of a tenancy, and the guy does not have the rights which would normally be associated with a tenancy. A deposit is normally for the purpose of insuring against damage/unpaid bills, not something that you would hold against timewasters etc. I do think its reasonable to agree that a weeks rent be forfeit- but if you are in disagreement with each other options are probably limited to taking legal action. The course of least resistance is to give him his money back, use it as a learning experience and move on. Be a lot more careful next time!


  • Options
    #4
    mikemac
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,986 ✭✭✭✭mikemac


    Hmmmm, I don't often have sympathy for landlords but it this case..:)

    Asking for a lease was reasonable as he needs it to get a PPS number so don't think that he was just creating work for you

    Keep all the money.
    You could have a good tenant in there right now if it wasn't for him.
    It might take another week or two to get another tenant and you are losing money every week.
    What, is he going to sue you? lol (This is true, but I'm not advising to screw the guy over if he has no knowledge of his rights)

    Offtopic, you take a foreign guy into your home and you have no alternative address, no work address and he has no PPS number to even get a job.
    He could have cleaned out your house when you weren't there.
    What were you thinking? Especially when you had other potential tenants available.


  • Options
    #5
    mastermind2005
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 339 ✭✭mastermind2005


    i worked for a company that hired a chap from turkey. it was a small IT related role and this guy had a few certs and that... all seemed fine..

    monday he arrives for work i was the first to show up.... this guy is outside with his bags and done upto the nines in a big fancy suit...

    so we went on trough the day i was showing him the ropes he seemed fine accept for the pong

    so the day is comming to an end and he announces he wants to sleep at his desk! before he could get a responce from the now silent room he starts off with... i will be very tidy and be ready for work early in the morning ......

    he ended up staying there for the night...

    next evening he asks again! i was renting an appartment around the corner and said he could stay there for the night as i would be away....

    so finially we tought he got sorted the next day only to get a knock on the door about 9pm with him offering money to use my shower!

    this lad just had no sence of embarassment and id say he was similar to your lodger (possibly the same person)


  • Options
    #6
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,360 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    How much is a night in a hotel and how much have you lost in rent from someone else?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #7
    leroy_brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭leroy_brown


    Victor wrote: »
    How much is a night in a hotel and how much have you lost in rent from someone else?

    Thanks Victor, but i pasted it from somewhere else i had written. Jeez, 33,000 post wow..

    Anyway, the hotel is normally 80-90 euro in the area, the rent was 550 pm

    but before you do the math, the story gets a lot longer than this...ill explain..


  • Options
    #8
    leroy_brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭leroy_brown


    At this stage its about a year and a half after this has happened.

    The tenant has taken me to the small claims court today, which he didnt show up, his girlfriend was there on his behalf and apologised forhim, but the judge didnt strike out, but ajourned instead.


    A series of letters have transferred back and forth (three in total)

    Initially from the tenant explaining his side, which was a gross exageration of what actually happened. So ihad no choice but to respond to the registrar with the factual information. Initially he had gone for all bells and whisltes, loss of work, taxis, etc etc, but on consulting the small claims, he was not entitled to any of this. However on responding with my detailed letter, he again replied, striking out his iitial claim and just asking for the money instead.

    I didnt reply and just waited for the hearing.

    He had rang PRTB, Threshold, Free legal advice, the Garda the lot. So he had really painted a pretty bad picture of me. Now everybody who reads this is totally entitled to there own view, or opinion of me. But i assure you, i am and have played this very very fair from the outset.

    I have consulted with threshold and they were totally on my side for with-holding, but now that there is a hearing, there keeping tightlipped all the way. I have had some strong calls from the PRTB, stong in that they initially come down hot and heavy about not being registered...your in big big trouble etc etc, but after explaing the entire situation PRTB has thefollowing to say.

    1. You seem in the right.
    2. No need to be registered with us as this is whats called a licensee situation, i.e. renting a room.
    3. There has been no criminal offence been commited here.


    Believe me, at some point i feel like handing over the money, but theres another side screaming inside saying, stick to your guns, and do te right thing. Go all the way and maintain your rights. However my rights seem pretty transparent, as the bodies involved give a very vague representation of the law in this case, and how to apply it. Things seem very general, such as the words 'reasonable' notice...i ean, how long is a piece of string.

    Not sure whether i sound like im wandering on here, and im guessing it difficult for anyone to get a true representation here as i dont have the letters loaded up here, i cannot do this, and im trying to explain.

    Really appreciate all opinions, suggestion however small, for or against they may be.


    For the record, ive been renting rooms for years, always legit, always been described as a laid back coolest landlord ever and never had problems, not trying to be and egomaniac here, but mycharacter is not tht of the stereotypical 'landlord' type most people are familiar with.


    I have left some irelevant info out, obviously names, occupations, location etc simply as im not sure of the whole lgality of doing so.



    Some other points:

    1. I had arranged with him to meet and return the portion of the rent agreed a few days after he moved out, i waited for 35 minutes, he didnt show, no calls/texts so i left.

    2. In his first letter i claimed that i 'demanded and took away the keys from me',however he had actually handed them back to me.

    3. He claimed that i wanted a written explanation that he would not claim against me...this was not the case.

    4. At no point was i negatie, and i kept my cool at all times as i began to know i might have a problem on my hands even from that early stage so it was important t do so.

    5. Threshold had explaied that although i had provided him with a contract/lease that it would apply even thought it wasnt signed, the intent was there. Howevr Threshold have come back on this on consulting with them yesterda and wont say whether it would or would not.



    Arrrrrrgh!

    Help!


    Good Night


  • Options
    #9
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,299 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    We don't provide legal advice here, and if you ask, the thread will probably get locked. Also, if he reads this thread, he may use the facts against you.

    I would.


  • Options
    #10
    radioactiveman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 324 ✭✭radioactiveman


    Correct me if I'm wrong but don't you usually lose your entire deposit (not just half) if you give no notice? And he didn't give you any notice at all. He actually left while you weren't home....
    that's all I can say without getting into legalities:D


  • Options
    #11
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,360 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    radioactiveman wrote: »
    Correct me if I'm wrong but don't you usually lose your entire deposit (not just half) if you give no notice?
    In a situation like this, a service provider should use a deposit to offset losses, not to make a profit. That is, only the actual loss incurred shoul dbe taken from the deposit and the balance returned.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #12
    leroy_brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭leroy_brown


    radioactiveman wrote: »
    Correct me if I'm wrong but don't you usually lose your entire deposit (not just half) if you give no notice? And he didn't give you any notice at all. He actually left while you weren't home....
    that's all I can say without getting into legalities:D

    Thanks radioactiveman, thats what i would have thought to, but i did compromise with him and agree to give back a portion, now he U-turned and went the whole small claims route and acted like the compromis never existed.


  • Options
    #13
    radioactiveman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 324 ✭✭radioactiveman


    Hi Victor - I agree completely. It's just that you could easily run into a landlord that would keep the entire deposit and just say that it's 'the done thing'. In this case though I'd be surprised if the court was in favour of the tenant. he's just chancing his arm - the bottom line is he wasn't cheated and left of his own accord..


  • Options
    #14
    leroy_brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭leroy_brown


    Jeeez, its been a looong time since i logged in here...however, the end result with my dilema, the District Court awarded in favour of the tenant, however the tenant wasnt allowed to claim for the taxi and hotel expenses which he had claimed for.

    Yes i was piXXed off bigtime, and still doesnt seem fair, but im over it.



    ;-)


  • Options
    #15
    EKRIUQ
    Registered Users Posts: 4,386 ✭✭✭EKRIUQ


    leroy_brown wrote: »
    Jeeez, its been a looong time since i logged in here...however, the end result with my dilema, the District Court awarded in favour of the tenant, however the tenant wasnt allowed to claim for the taxi and hotel expenses which he had claimed for.

    Yes i was piXXed off bigtime, and still doesnt seem fair, but im over it.



    ;-)

    from experience courts always find in favour of the tenant, but well done for fighting it


Advertisement