Should cannibas be legalised????

AARRRGH

Seachmall wrote: »

Although I haven't smoked for a couple of years I have pulled a whitey and once I threw up a few times I felt fine, relatively fine anyway. I'm not sure what your experiences are with marijuana but I've never heard of an overdose like this.

It happened to my friend a few times.

For example, he ate a few hash cakes. Nothing happened. So he ate a few more. Nothing happened. He went to bed. Six hours later he wakes up completely off his head unable to concentrate and walking around in circles for hours...

He probably could have made himself puke, but he didn't think of it at the time!

Perhaps if hash was legalised and better understood he would have been more relaxed and would have just puked... I dunno.

Seachmall

AARRRGH wrote: »

It happened to my friend a few times.

For example, he ate a few hash cakes. Nothing happened. So he ate a few more. Nothing happened. He went to bed. Six hours later he wakes up completely off his head unable to concentrate and walking around in circles for hours...

He probably could have made himself puke, but he didn't think of it at the time!

Perhaps if hash was legalised and better understood he would have been more relaxed and would have just puked... I dunno.

If marijuana were legalised hash would definetly be a no-no. Its extracted resin from the dried leaves and shoots of the plant and is generally considered the left-over ****. I always tried to keep away from it so I don't know too much about it except its THC concentration is generally lower then weed, especially in Ireland when it could be cooked with stuff like toothpaste and the like.

Weed is more expensive but generally safer (although I have heard of cases where fiberglass was added to buds to add weight, thats lethal).

Also, you should never make yourself puke. Ride it out, if it gets too bad your body will reject it itself. Forcing it out will only do more harm then good.

AARRRGH

Yep, he has never had any problems with grass, only with hash.

rubadub

AARRRGH wrote: »

The thing about eating hash cakes or whatever though, it's very easy to "overdose" on them, especially if you've just eaten a big meal....

For example, he ate a few hash cakes. Nothing happened. So he ate a few more. Nothing happened. He went to bed. Six hours later he wakes up completely off his head unable to concentrate and walking around in circles for hours...

This is a problem for any unregulated drug. If you were in a country where caffeine was illegal and you bought a bag of powder on the street, made cakes from it and just keep eating and eating until you got a "hit" you would run the exact same risks. In holland it is still totally unregulated, with cigarette packs here you can read on the side how much nicotine and tar are in them, with drink it has a % on it. If cannabis was legalised you would have the same portioned amounts, with the %THC/CBD on them, you would get to know your "brand" and how much to take. Of course people would still get whities, just like drinkers still get blackies, but you would have a lot more control over dosage, not to mention purity/contaminants etc.

Seachmall wrote: »

If marijuana were legalised hash would definetly be a no-no. Its extracted resin from the dried leaves and shoots of the plant and is generally considered the left-over ****. I always tried to keep away from it so I don't know too much about it except its THC concentration is generally lower then weed, especially in Ireland when it could be cooked with stuff like toothpaste and the like.

If it was legalised you would actually get real hashish. What you described above it certainly not real hashish!

Shulgin

Seachmall wrote: »

If marijuana were legalised hash would definetly be a no-no. Its extracted resin from the dried leaves and shoots of the plant and is generally considered the left-over ****. I always tried to keep away from it so I don't know too much about it except its THC concentration is generally lower then weed, especially in Ireland when it could be cooked with stuff like toothpaste and the like.

If cannabis was legalised then there wouldn`t be all that crap filler in the nice new legal hash, just like in holland where the hash is poles apart from the stuff here. It would be fine to cook with then.

About ODing with cooked cannabis, after legalisation I would assume users would be educated on how to use the great new legal product properly.

AARRRGH

I agree rubadub. :pac:

Shulgin

So if the obvious lung cancer dangers of smoking are left out of the argument (because it can be eaten or vapourised), then we are just left with the old "REEFER MADNESS" stuff vs all the positive cannabis effects.

So does reefer cause madness? Or does it bring the underlying madness out of you?

Prof.Badass

Quote:
Originally Posted by vinylmesh
No!!!

Drugs are illegal for the same reason condoms(1985), homosexuality(1993) and divorce (1997) were all illegal!

Well that's just a really stupid arguement.


Quote:
Do you honestly believe there's a rational basis for prohibition?
Yes. Drugs mess you up. What part of that do you not understand?


Quote:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle1555582.ece
Well that's me convinced.
Got any more valuable nuggets?



By refusing to respond to my points in a rational manner, you admit defeat. :cool:

Kernel

Shulgin wrote: »

So if the obvious lung cancer dangers of smoking are left out of the argument (because it can be eaten or vapourised), then we are just left with the old "REEFER MADNESS" stuff vs all the positive cannabis effects.

So does reefer cause madness? Or does it bring the underlying madness out of you?

Studies have shown that there may be a link between cannabis and schizophrenia. I know if you go into St. Brendan's mental hospital there are many there who would agree.... Although I'm not aware of any studies carried out in Ireland examining the proportion of mental patients who have been regular cannabis users vs. normal percentage of population.

JC 2K3

There's a very strong case that it's a self medication or higher liklihood to use thing rather than a cause.

The strongest evidence for this is that in any country they've studied where cannabis use has increased over time, the level of mental illness has stayed the same.

Prof.Badass

Shulgin wrote: »

So does reefer cause madness? Or does it bring the underlying madness out of you?

People who are emotionally/mentally unstable are far more likely to become dependant on drugs than the general public http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_Park#The_Rat_Park_experiments

Also for your emotional well-being you should always spend most of your time sober...If you get drunk/stoned/anything every day, then yes your mental health is gonna suffer... ( this is common sense).

I think this alone is enough to explain the link between HEAVY USE of cannabis and schizophrenia. that's what the link is with (HEAVY USE, and with HEAVY USE only).

I'm sure there's a link between the heavy use of ANY drug and poor mental health in general.

.... 14% of schizophrennics are cannabis users.

75-90% of schizophrenics are tobacco users. hmmm.....

JC 2K3

The tobacco thing is a self medication thing. In fact, nicotine patches have been proposed to treat schizophrenia.

An example of how just because a high percentage of people with a certain condition do something, doesn't mean it caused it.

Prof.Badass

I'd say it's just an example of how mentally/emotionally unstable people are more drawn to drug use in general, be it alcohol, cannabis or tobacco or any of the countless other drugs out there.

JC 2K3

Well afaik, it's something to do with nicotine being a neuropoison, which somewhat alleviates the strain schizophrenia puts on the brain. But yeah, your point about drugs being abused by unstable people is pretty true.

Seachmall

vinylmesh wrote: »

People who are emotionally/mentally unstable are far more likely to become dependant on drugs than the general public http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_Park#The_Rat_Park_experiments

Cannabis is less adictive then caffine, don't they have coffee machines in physciatric wards? (I think they do in the one here anyway)

Also for your emotional well-being you should always spend most of your time sober...If you get drunk/stoned/anything every day, then yes your mental health is gonna suffer... ( this is common sense).

I guess thats true.

I think this alone is enough to explain the link between HEAVY USE of cannabis and schizophrenia. that's what the link is with (HEAVY USE, and with HEAVY USE only).

I'd like to know what they consider heavey use, is their anyway of finding that out? I know Dr. Tashkins studies count heavy use as 3+ joints a day which is quite alot.

I'm sure there's a link between the heavy use of ANY drug and poor mental health in general.

Well I'd say that depends more on the drug, I wouldn't say any drug. Caffiene is a drug, cocao could also be considered a drug. It'll make you fat but I'm not sure about mental illness :P

JC 2K3

I wouldn't be surpised if a lot of mentally unstable people consumed a lot of chocolate tbh....

Seachmall

JC 2K3 wrote: »

I wouldn't be surpised if a lot of mentally unstable people consumed a lot of chocolate tbh....

Yes but it won't cause mental illness, I assumed you that was your point. If not, sorry, I got the wrong end of the stick (...again...):rolleyes:

JC 2K3

Well vinylmesh said there was a link between any drug and poor mental health, but not that they were a cause.

Galvasean

No way should cannibals be legalized! They'll eat us all!

Seachmall

JC 2K3 wrote: »

Well vinylmesh said there was a link between any drug and poor mental health, but not that they were a cause.

Fair enough.:cool:

Prof.Badass

vinylmesh wrote: »

I'm sure there's a link between the heavy use of ANY drug and poor mental health in general.

exactly, Saying there's a link between them doesn't mean the heavy drug-use caused the illness.

And yes, i'm sure there's a link between heavy chocolate eating and poor mental health.

I'd classify any daily toker a heavy user.

Wertz

JC 2K3 wrote: »

I wouldn't be surpised if a lot of mentally unstable people consumed a lot of chocolate tbh....

Yeah....like any given female? :pac:

more tea vicar

Good thing about it being legal, would be companies sorting out consistent quality and price, pre-rolled with filters, packs of twenty, easy to pop down the shop and treat yerself to a wee toke.

Bad thing is for the uninitiated or addictive types, if they are rolled mixed with baccy, then addiction to the baccy and a smoking habit could develop, far worse for the health of the lungs and heart if not a smoker in the first place.

Law should be for over 25 years only and maybe limited to numbers of sale?

Wertz

more tea vicar wrote: »

Law should be for over 25 years only and maybe limited to numbers of sale?

You start limiting sale and supply too harshly and you're just recreating the problmes you tried to solve by decriminalising it. I can see the merits of trying to keep younger people away from it, but you only create a black market for illegal re-sellers. I'm not ure how you would even work selling by limited amounts...some sort of licensing system perhaps?

Seachmall

more tea vicar wrote: »

Law should be for over 25 years only and maybe limited to numbers of sale?

They'll send you on peacekeeping missions to some of the most dangerous places in the world at 17 but won't sel you weed at 24 because you're not mature enough to make that desicion?

I'd say 25 is too high. 18.
Max. purchase per person = Ounce.
Max. amount to carry per person = Ounce, or be arrested on suspicion of possession with intent to supply (dealers will want to get rid of their crap gear immediatly so get them while they're at it).
And the only place you should be allowed to smoke it is in private residence (or medical facilities if its for medical use)

hereNqueer

+1

Prof.Badass

more tea vicar wrote: »

Good thing about it being legal, would be companies sorting out consistent quality and price, pre-rolled with filters, packs of twenty, easy to pop down the shop and treat yerself to a wee toke.

Bad thing is for the uninitiated or addictive types, if they are rolled mixed with baccy, then addiction to the baccy and a smoking habit could develop, far worse for the health of the lungs and heart if not a smoker in the first place.

Law should be for over 25 years only and maybe limited to numbers of sale?

That's way too harsh.

18+
Make every coffeeshop have vaporisers for the customers to use.

Also synthetic cannabinoids and FAAH inhibitors will mean you can just pop a pill and get baked (By far the healthiest option)!

Seachmall

vinylmesh wrote: »

Also synthetic cannabinoids and FAAH inhibitors will mean you can just pop a pill and get baked (By far the healthiest option)!

Ingesting takes a bit longer then smoking and if you're going to ingest you might aswell go natural as it'd be cheaper without any added health risks.

Prof.Badass

Seachmall wrote: »

Ingesting takes a bit longer then smoking and if you're going to ingest you might aswell go natural as it'd be cheaper without any added health risks.

What added health risks?

Isolated chemicals in a pill are ALWAYS safer than plant material containing those chemicals.

Almost every plant that produces pharmacological chemicals has other chemicals in it aswell (most of these are unstudied, some are quite toxic).

I've never actually orally ingested cannabis before but from what i hear it gives you a hangover. If you get a hangover (not to be confused with comedown or withdrawal) it means toxicity has occured.

In short, there's a very sensible reason as to why you get you aspirin in a pill instead of being told to drink some willow-bark tea.

Seachmall

vinylmesh wrote: »

What added health risks?

When compared to inhaling carcinogens when smoking.

If we just produced artifical THC why bother legalising cannabis (apart from the other economic/production reasons)? As far as I'm aware the artifical THC is nowhere as strong as the natural one, I could be wrong though. I you have a link I'd be interested in reading it