Bad Cocaine

SpAcEd OuT

Oh and I honestly don't get this everyone acts like a prick on cocaine thing, over the years I have seen so many people on cocaine and not once did they act like a prick. During that same time I have seen hundreds of people act like a prick on alcohol.

I love how people pretend they know what they're talking about when they chime in with ''YEAH EVERYONES A PRICK ON COKE'' when clearly they have just read the paper and are regurgetating common myths to look knowledgable

builttospill

whiskeyman wrote: »

let's embrace alcohol more.... that's legal and never killed anyone...

Are you taking the piss? Alcohol along with cigarettes is the biggest killer of all-way ahead of any other drug.

SpAcEd OuT

builttospill wrote: »

Are you taking the piss? Alcohol along with cigarettes is the biggest killer of all-way ahead of any other drug.

Dont be ridiculous

fits

builttospill wrote: »

Are you taking the piss? Alcohol along with cigarettes is the biggest killer of all-way ahead of any other drug.

I think you need to upgrade your sarcasm detector

zuchum

I constantly hear all this talk in the papers/tv about how young people in Dublin are shovelling coke into them like sugar. Maybe i'm just too young (19) but none of my friends or even people in my year would ever consider taking it, and neither have I ever really seen anyone taking it (apart from once,at a debs when my girlfriend met someone in her year,who had regretted taking it,and was trying to blow it out her nose...which was pretty funny).

But the use seems sporadic at best...otherwise I'm just hanging around with the wrong (right) people...


Is this a case of the 'african killer bees' where the media complete overestimate the cocaine 'epidemic'?

Lands Leaving

builttospill wrote: »

Are you taking the piss? Alcohol along with cigarettes is the biggest killer of all-way ahead of any other drug.

Thats because most people drink, half of people smoke and everybody dies.

SpAcEd OuT

Lands Leaving wrote: »

Thats because most people drink, half of people smoke and everybody dies.

actually per person alcohol and ciggarettes still kill more people than all other illegal drugs combined

Tha Gopher

zuchum wrote: »

I constantly hear all this talk in the papers/tv about how young people in Dublin are shovelling coke into them like sugar. Maybe i'm just too young (19) but none of my friends or even people in my year would ever consider taking it, and neither have I ever really seen anyone taking it (apart from once,at a debs when my girlfriend met someone in her year,who had regretted taking it,and was trying to blow it out her nose...which was pretty funny).

But the use seems sporadic at best...otherwise I'm just hanging around with the wrong (right) people...


Is this a case of the 'african killer bees' where the media complete overestimate the cocaine 'epidemic'?

Where are you from out of curiousity?

It had been epidemic in the likes of Blanch and Finglas. Have yet to see your typical D4 type girl taking any, and Ive been to quite a few parties in that end of town. Most D4 girls Ive met would be liable to throw you out if you took it at their house. Compare that to the northside, in 2005 a guy knee deep in the stuff could probably get alot of girls to do anything for a bit of it free. Any D4 heads I met who took it were into their dance music, rather than the pints of heino and horse riding set the media obsesses about.

Dave!

It's the TD's takin it! Do you never watch the live stream from the Dail chamber? It's almost as bad as the mods' forum for hookers and coke! :eek:

builttospill

fits wrote: »

I think you need to upgrade your sarcasm detector

I don't think that's the case. You'd be surprised at the amount of idiots that think alcohol is safe as houses. You just can't tell these days. You need to downgrade your smart arse meter

builttospill

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

actually per person alcohol and ciggarettes still kill more people than all other illegal drugs combined

Exactly...

fits

builttospill wrote: »

I don't think that's the case. You'd be surprised at the amount of idiots that think alcohol is safe as houses. You just can't tell these days. You need to downgrade your smart arse meter

zuchum

Tha Gopher wrote: »

Where are you from out of curiousity?

It had been epidemic in the likes of Blanch and Finglas. Have yet to see your typical D4 type girl taking any, and Ive been to quite a few parties in that end of town. Most D4 girls Ive met would be liable to throw you out if you took it at their house. Compare that to the northside, in 2005 a guy knee deep in the stuff could probably get alot of girls to do anything for a bit of it free. Any D4 heads I met who took it were into their dance music, rather than the pints of heino and horse riding set the media obsesses about.

Relatively posh d4/d6 type area, so pretty much fits into your description there,in fact now that you said that I do remember a girl kicking someone out for allegedly taking cocaine at her party.

But it's funny then,how it seems to be misrepresented in the media, who would have you believe that its the young,wealthy d4 types who are the people who are taking it, and portraying it as some kind of 'wealth prover'....(for want of a better term,obviously)

Phew, I thought I was waaaaay out of touch :cool:

drdre

Mossy Monk wrote: »

Take drugs and you are only playing with fire. I have no sympathy for anyone ****ed up after drugs.

I would agree with you, Especially class A type drugs.

SpAcEd OuT

yeah I know loads of D4 type girls [I hate that phrase] and not one of them take it.

I honestly think the notion in the media that swarms of rich southsiders are taking it to be way off. obviously a few are but nowhere near what they are claiming

Lands Leaving

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

actually per person alcohol and ciggarettes still kill more people than all other illegal drugs combined

So if you had to pick one - heroin or beer?

Tha Gopher

zuchum wrote: »

Relatively posh d4/d6 type area, so pretty much fits into your description there,in fact now that you said that I do remember a girl kicking someone out for allegedly taking cocaine at her party.

But it's funny then,how it seems to be misrepresented in the media, who would have you believe that its the young,wealthy d4 types who are the people who are taking it, and portraying it as some kind of 'wealth prover'....(for want of a better term,obviously)

Phew, I thought I was waaaaay out of touch :cool:

For some reason, writing books about pilots, nuns, company CEOs, doctors, and, of course, beautiful young girls from rich southside families taking it is somehow more interesting/shocking than if they did some real research, and went to a house party in Ballyfermot where a bunch of lads in Celtic jerseys are getting off their face while blasting out some Tiesto. As this is (or was, given the Dublin coke use decline) the reality. I wouldnt doubt a large amount of D4 people have tried it, but as regards regular use, I cant imagine that outside of niche groups like models or whatever is it used regularly. High profile deaths/overdoses and a decline in quality will kill off demand in itself. Like a restaurant that develops a reputation for serving poor quality or downright dangerous food, the gangs are about to become a victim of their own greed and lack of quality control.

SpAcEd OuT

Lands Leaving wrote: »

So if you had to pick one - heroin or beer?

take away the addiction factor then I would probably go for heroin.

Lands Leaving

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

take away the addiction factor then I would probably go for heroin.

You can't just take away that factor, its part and parcel of the drug. Hence my point, most people can regulate their alcohol use successfully, yes there's a large majority who can't, but anyone who uses class A drugs regularly as people drink is fecked. Simple as that.

SpAcEd OuT

Lands Leaving wrote: »

You can't just take away that factor, its part and parcel of the drug. Hence my point, most people can regulate their alcohol use successfully, yes there's a large majority who can't, but anyone who uses class A drugs regularly as people drink is fecked. Simple as that.

Yes but alcohol is still more likely to kill you. You can use alcohol recreationally and it is still more likely to kill you than being addicted to heroin.

scary thought but true

Binomate

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

Yes but alcohol is still more likely to kill you. You can use alcohol recreationally and it is still more likely to kill you than being addicted to heroin.

scary thought but true

Lol.

If you're going to use factual information to win an argument, the facts actually need to be true.

connundrum

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

Yes but alcohol is still more likely to kill you. You can use alcohol recreationally and it is still more likely to kill you than being addicted to heroin.

scary thought but true

Lol indeed. Outlandish statement of the month.

SpAcEd OuT

the number of heroin related deaths is overhyped

http://www.ndc.hrb.ie/directory/news_detail.php?cat_id=&news_id=3761&pointer=0

in the second largest city in Ireland there has been a grand total of 6 heroin deaths in the last 12 years

fits

connundrum wrote: »

Lol indeed. Outlandish statement of the month.

Is it though? We think it is... but is it?

Is it the heroin that actually kills addicts, or the malnutrition and sharing needles and generally skanky living?

I dunno...

Binomate

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

the number of heroin related deaths is overhyped

http://www.ndc.hrb.ie/directory/news_detail.php?cat_id=&news_id=3761&pointer=0

in the second largest city in Ireland there has been a grand total of 6 heroin deaths in the last 12 years

The more you continue trying to back your argument, the more I laugh.

SpAcEd OuT

fits wrote: »

Is it though? We think it is... but is it?

Is it the heroin that actually kills addicts, or the malnutrition and sharing needles and generally skanky living?

I dunno...

Exactly

I remember reading an article about doctors in London who had been addicted to heroin for over 40 years. As they could afford to buy clean heroin and needles and live well they never had a problem no one even knew they were addicts.

Now apply the same to a rich alcoholic who could still afford to live well and buy good booze, more than likely the drink will kill him/her.

Dudess

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

the number of heroin related deaths is overhyped

http://www.ndc.hrb.ie/directory/news_detail.php?cat_id=&news_id=3761&pointer=0

in the second largest city in Ireland there has been a grand total of 6 heroin deaths in the last 12 years

That's because there's sod-all heroin in Cork. I'm from Cork and I lived in Dublin for two years - junkies are fairly commonplace in Dublin, junkies are pretty much non-existent in Cork. I'm surprised there even were six heroin-related deaths in Cork last year.

A-Trak

Santa Claus wrote: »

People die all the time from cocaine. Not necessarily from the drug itself but from all the crap that it's cut with etc !

Nonsense. People do die all the time from the drug it's self but most definitely not from what it's cut with.
Cocaine is usually cut with all sorts of common items such as lactose, baby milk powder, corn starch etc.

Think about it, the main point of cutting cocaine with another substance is to bulk it out therefore making more profit for the dealer. Why would it be cut with a harmful substance which may hurt potential buyers when the above substances are so cheap to add? Possibly the most harmful substance that would be added would be a local anesthetic to mimic cocaines numbing properties.

As for bad cocaine, no such thing really (relatively.) It's just various degrees of purity. Overdosing on cocaine can be done but is fairly rare and again is dependant on purity. Taking it orally, (As reported the party in Cork did, increases the risk of "OD"ing on it, snorting it much less so.

The main danger of overdosing on it is it hugely increses your blood pressure. Also mixing it with alcohol creates a compund called cocaethylene which puts extra pressure on the heart. Combine this with already high blood pressure from the cocaine it's self, well you get the idea, cocaine is not your hearts freind.

So "Bad Sh1t" cut with coke or bad coke it's self on the whole is more of a myth. Again just purity and volume.

But you pay your money, you take your chances.

Dudess

A-Trak wrote: »

Nonsense. People do die all the time from the drug it's self but most definitely not from what it's cut with.
Cocaine is usually cut with all sorts of common items such as lactose, baby milk powder, corn starch etc.

Think about it, the main point of cutting cocaine with another substance is to bulk it out therefore making more profit for the dealer. Why would it be cut with a harmful substance which may hurt potential buyers when the above substances are so cheap to add?

Yeah, there was some speculation in the national media that the reason those lads in Waterford became so ill was because they may have taken pure cocaine.

Lands Leaving

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

Exactly

I remember reading an article about doctors in London who had been addicted to heroin for over 40 years. As they could afford to buy clean heroin and needles and live well they never had a problem no one even knew they were addicts.

Now apply the same to a rich alcoholic who could still afford to live well and buy good booze, more than likely the drink will kill him/her.

I think I'll take my chances on the pints rather than the needles thanks, even if I had a safe supply. Heroin does terrible things to your body, alcohol doesn't compare at all. Nor does it compare to cocaine.

Dudess

Lands Leaving wrote: »

Heroin does terrible things to your body, alcohol doesn't compare at all. Nor does it compare to cocaine.

But you only think that because alcohol is legal and socially acceptable.

Lands Leaving

Dudess wrote: »

But you only think that because alcohol is legal and socially acceptable.

No I think that because its true. If alcohol was as dangerous as class A drugs it would be considered one. I'm fully aware that its not good for you either, but not on that level, and it can be regulated, its social, unlike those drugs, and most people can drink without getting addicted.

Binomate

Lands Leaving wrote: »

No I think that because its true. If alcohol was as dangerous as class A drugs it would be considered one. I'm fully aware that its not good for you either, but not on that level, and it can be regulated, its social, unlike those drugs, and most people can drink without getting addicted.

The only reason heroin is considered a dangerous drug is because it is considered a gate way drug to harder drugs. Heroin is PERFECTLY safe and has probably never harmed anyone.

SpAcEd OuT

Lands Leaving wrote: »

Heroin does terrible things to your body, alcohol doesn't compare at all. Nor does it compare to cocaine.

Em no it doesn't thats the point clean heroin barely affects your physical health at all.


And are you serious about alcohol not comparing to cocaine as far as physical damage because that is a seriously laughable of all the drugs both illegal and legal alcohol is probably the worst for physical health

The physical health effects associated with alcohol consumption may include cirrhosis of the liver, cancer, pancreatitis, epilepsy, polyneuropathy, alcoholic dementia, heart disease, increased chance of cancer, nutritional deficiencies, sexual dysfunction,Gastrointestinal diseases and death from many sources. Roughly one in four people who consume more than three units per day during a period of 10–15 years will experience some level of alcoholic hepatitis.

Consuming large amounts of alcohol over a period of time can impair normal brain development in humans.Deficits in retrieval of verbal and nonverbal information and in visuospatial functioning were evident in youths with histories of heavy drinking during early and middle adolescence


Oh and the fact that heroin isn't neurotoxic while alcohol is

SpAcEd OuT

Lands Leaving wrote: »

No I think that because its true. If alcohol was as dangerous as class A drugs it would be considered one. I'm fully aware that its not good for you either, but not on that level, and it can be regulated, its social, unlike those drugs, and most people can drink without getting addicted.

so why is nicotine legal

its not social, it cant be regulated, and its more addictive than heroin.

Oh and kills more

SpAcEd OuT

Binomate wrote: »

The only reason heroin is considered a dangerous drug is because it is considered a gate way drug to harder drugs. Heroin is PERFECTLY safe and has probably never harmed anyone.

I'm not saying that I am merely pointing out that alcohol is as dangerous as heroin in terms of number of deaths per users and physical health.

Heroin is a working class drug, 99pc of it's users are pretty much in poverty anyways, the case of the doctors in London showed what happened when heroin was used to people who could afford it

Lands Leaving

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

so why is nicotine legal

its not social, it cant be regulated, and its more addictive than heroin.

Oh and kills more

Given up on alcohol then! Nicotine is legal because it doesn't cause anti-social behaviour and the market for cigarettes is huge and too profitable in terms of taxes to remove. the economy would suffer. If it was legal there would also be a massive increase in crime - a la prohibition era America.

Lands Leaving

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

I'm not saying that I am merely pointing out that alcohol is as dangerous as heroin in terms of number of deaths per users and physical health.

Heroin is a working class drug, 99pc of it's users are pretty much in poverty anyways, the case of the doctors in London showed what happened when heroin was used to people who could afford it

Right, so if we're all rich then we can go on the gear and be totally normal. I see. If only I was a doctor, I'm sure my patients wouldn't mind me shooting up to handle surgery.

Sully

ghostdancer wrote: »

eh, the lads in waterford ate loads of it for some mad reason. of course that was going to make them seriously ill.

That was originally reported by the press and discussed over on the Waterford forum. However, a number of witnesses have rejected the statement (along with others) that it was due to an overdose.

SpAcEd OuT

Lands Leaving wrote: »

Right, so if we're all rich then we can go on the gear and be totally normal. I see. If only I was a doctor, I'm sure my patients wouldn't mind me shooting up to handle surgery.

well just like you wouldn't have a bottle of wine before surgery you wouldn't shoot up

SpAcEd OuT

Lands Leaving wrote: »

Given up on alcohol then! Nicotine is legal because it doesn't cause anti-social behaviour and the market for cigarettes is huge and too profitable in terms of taxes to remove. the economy would suffer. If it was legal there would also be a massive increase in crime - a la prohibition era America.

like nicotine heroin itself doesn't cause anti-social behaviour quite the opposite actually what does cause anti social behaviour is junkies stealing and mugging to try get the money to pay for their ridiculously priced heroin.

now say heroin was controlled by the state and cost as little as a pack of ciggarettes do you honestly think there would be as much crime

Lands Leaving

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

like nicotine heroin itself doesn't cause anti-social behaviour quite the opposite actually what does cause anti social behaviour is junkies stealing and mugging to try get the money to pay for their ridiculously priced heroin.

now say heroin was controlled by the state and cost as little as a pack of ciggarettes do you honestly think there would be as much crime

No, but it doesn't make nicotine as bad as heroin now does it. All drugs should be legalised and regulated by the government, huge profits for the country, addicts/users regulated, no drug lords, etc, etc. Thats not really the argument here though, heroin, as things stand, causes anti-social behaviour, and is one of the worst possible things to get addicted to. You want to see the difference between a smoker and a heroin user, look at any smoker you know. Now look at a picture of Christy Dignam.

chump

SpAcEd OuT wrote: »

like nicotine heroin itself doesn't cause anti-social behaviour quite the opposite actually what does cause anti social behaviour is junkies stealing and mugging to try get the money to pay for their ridiculously priced heroin.

now say heroin was controlled by the state and cost as little as a pack of ciggarettes do you honestly think there would be as much crime

Spaced Out give it a break - you're on to a loser

Dudess

Look at a picture of George Best on his deathbed. I've actually never touched any illegal substance in my life apart from doob but I'm playing devil's advocate here. There is a lot of exaggeration of the dangers surrounding drugs - deaths are the overwhelming exception rather than the rule.

Pighead

Lands Leaving wrote: »

You want to see the difference between a smoker and a heroin user, look at any smoker you know. Now look at a picture of Christy Dignam.

Brilliant argument tactics there by LL. Lets use an example of one person to tar all with the same brush. In fact the argument tactic is so good, Pigheads gonna have a go.

Picture of a smoker:
http://www.quitsa.org.au/cms_resources/images/campaign_mouth.JPG

Picture of renowned heroin user Robert Downey Jr:
http://moviesmedia.ign.com/movies/image/article/736/736497/goodnight_goodluck_downeyjr1_1159510588.jpg

SpAcEd OuT

Lands Leaving wrote: »

No, but it doesn't make nicotine as bad as heroin now does it.

Why, nicotine is worse for your health and more addictive.

The reason heroin is dangerous is firstly it's price in the likely event you get addicted and secondly the **** thats put in it thanks to it being illegal

Now if heroin was clean and cost 3euro for a hit how would it be worse than nicotine

Lands Leaving wrote: »

All drugs should be legalised and regulated by the government, huge profits for the country, addicts/users regulated, no drug lords, etc, etc. Thats not really the argument here though,

It kind of is because look at your next statement

Lands Leaving wrote: »

heroin, as things stand, causes anti-social behaviour, and is one of the worst possible things to get addicted to.

see.

Lands Leaving wrote: »

You want to see the difference between a smoker and a heroin user, look at any smoker you know. Now look at a picture of Christy Dignam.

Oh I'm sure your average heroin user will look like ****e because they are generally sleeping rough and can't afford to eat properly but if heroin was regulated and cost 3 euro then they wouldn't have to sleep rough and could afford to eat properly and probably look a hell of a lot better.

And if you want to quote rock star heroin addicts who have money etc. that look like ****e they are generally on not just heroin but every other drug under the sun and are drinking every day.

m83

F*ck cocaine, heroin kills. My cousin will be dead within a year

SpAcEd OuT

chump wrote: »

Spaced Out give it a break - you're on to a loser

devils advocate.

Lands Leaving

Dudess wrote: »

Look at a picture of George Best on his deathbed. I've actually never touched any illegal substance in my life apart from doob but I'm playing devil's advocate here. There is a lot of exaggeration of the dangers surrounding drugs - deaths are the overwhelming exception rather than the rule.

Same goes for alcohol, but drugs are far more addictive and the effects manifest themselves far quicker. My point is that a person can regulate their alcohol intake for the most part, as alcoholism is more of a mental than a physical addiction, whereas class A drugs affect your body in a way that makes the dosage need to be higher and higher and the withdrawl worse. A normal person taking class A drugs in the same way as most people drink would become addicted very very quickly.

Lands Leaving

Screw it, lets simplify, I'll be drinking a few pints a couple of nights at the weekend, max 4 a night. Would I be better of having a hit of heroin each night in your opinion?