New motor tax and VRT regime. Links + calculations

The_Conductor

grahambo wrote: »

Why is the tax not in the fuel. that is the fairest way to do it. the more you burn the more you pay. simple

A very good question.
Another one- is would it be possible to whack a couple of cent on a litre of fuel for universal third party insurance- such as in South Africa and a few other places? Kill two birds with the one stone- and have no more uninsured drivers on the road all in one foul swoop......

Chaz

smccarrick wrote: »

A very good question.
Another one- is would it be possible to whack a couple of cent on a litre of fuel for universal third party insurance- such as in South Africa and a few other places? Kill two birds with the one stone- and have no more uninsured drivers on the road all in one foul swoop......

In theory its a good idea (SA 3rd party road insurance), in practice it doesnt work.

The_Conductor

Chaz wrote: »

In theory its a good idea (SA 3rd party road insurance), in practice it doesnt work.

I'm curious as to the workings- what are the downsides? Its only 3rd party- so most people would most probably still opt for additional topup insurance, especially if they valued their car. If the car had to have a valid NCT for coverage- it would ensure that at least minimum standards were adhered to?

Chaz

smccarrick wrote: »

I'm curious as to the workings- what are the downsides? Its only 3rd party- so most people would most probably still opt for additional topup insurance, especially if they valued their car. If the car had to have a valid NCT for coverage- it would ensure that at least minimum standards were adhered to?

Insurance in SA is not forced. 90% of people have no insurance and rely on this 'government' 3rd party - which as far as Im aware, basically doesnt work. Never heard of anyone getting much out of it apart from maybe 2 cents and a packet of crisps in a personal injury claim kinda thing. Dont expect it to replace a car or anything like that.

E92

grahambo wrote: »

I have wanted a Lancer Evolution for as long as I can remember. I'm finally in a position where I can afford to buy one (25 this year and new job) and then this **** comes along and ****s it right up for me.

E2000 for tax, what a rip off!

Get one before July, and you will pay the standard VRT and road tax of a 2.0 litre, i.e. an Evo registered BEFORE July will be €590 to tax.

Even if the 2k system comes in on older cars in time, sell it on in the UK, the UK loves Evos so you'd easily sell one across the pond if you find that gormless Gormley decides that any pre July one also should cost €2k a year to tax.


EDIT: heard on the Morning Ireland this morning that ALL 08 cars will have their road tax done on emissions, it doesn't matter whether they're bought after July or not.

So to grahambo, if you can find any pre 08 Evo around the place,either buy any pre 08 Evo already in the country, or import any pre 08 Evo before July and you can still enjoy the lower road tax system(for now at least;))

Theta

How does this

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/breaking/2008/0227/breaking14.htm

effect the tax for buying petrol cars. Will they still qualify for the old tax rates? I hope this doesn't mean that they are ditching the old system and the deadline of the 1st of july early?? Of is he just letting people have the choice?

Beta Ray Bill

E92 wrote: »

EDIT: heard on the Morning Ireland this morning that ALL 08 cars will have their road tax done on emissions, it doesn't matter whether they're bought after July or not.

So to grahambo, if you can find any pre 08 Evo around the place,either buy any pre 08 Evo already in the country, or import any pre 08 Evo before July and you can still enjoy the lower road tax system(for now at least;))

Thanks for the input dude

I'm hoping this tax thing will play into my hand I wanted to buy 04 or 03 anyway. I'm hoping people with Evos wont be able to afford to run them and start reducing there prices in order to get rid of em, but i doubt it.

I still cannot believe this is happening. The only thing keeping me in Ireland is the fact that ive just gotten a new job that i really like. I'm so tempted to just pack up and leave

The problem is though that im 24 now and cannot get a quote for insurance until im 25 which isnt until sept

vectra

Last Updated: 27/02/2008 08:32
SIMI welcomes CO2 tax move

The Society of the Irish Motor Industry (Simi) today has welcomed moves by the Minister for Environment, John Gormley, to backdate a lower 'green' motor tax to January.

Under new plans to be introduced in the coming days by the Minister, motorists who have bought low CO2 emission cars from January 1st this year will be able to qualify for reduced motor taxes.

The plans follow on from the Budget decision when the Government proposed a new motor tax system to come into force from June 1st, where lower emission cars would pay less road tax than their high carbon dioxide-emitting counterparts.

Director general designate of SIMI, Alan Nolan, said he welcomed the move as it helped people make "good decisions".

Speaking on radio this morning Mr Nolan said: "I think people out there looking at buying cars would have been really focused on whether the road tax effect would not kick in until July and it would certainly have been causing problems."

"The fact that the minister has moved to say any advantage coming in July is available now is a huge plus," he added.

Am I reading this correctly?
Does this mean that my Feb reg'd 08 Cordoba 1.4tdi comes under the new system?
If so
Can i apply for a rebate?? :D

Theta

No he said that people will most likely not be able to claim back tax already paid!

The_Conductor

Volvo have just given me an EU Certificate of Conformity for my 03 reg 1.9 Tdi V40. I paid EUR 590 a few weeks ago- wonder if I can argue for CO2 treatment next time round (which would be the EUR 290 level)- given that I have the documentation that they keep harping on about now (thankyou Volvo UK )

S.

vectra

irlmarc wrote: »

No he said that people will most likely not be able to claim back tax already paid!

I dont think he can get away with that when he specifically said

Under new plans to be introduced in the coming days by the Minister, motorists who have bought low CO2 emission cars from January 1st this year will be able to qualify for reduced motor taxes.

How can that be ??

Hold on a second..!! :eek:

"The fact that the minister has moved to say any advantage coming in July is available now is a huge plus," he added.

Does this also mean that I have lost out by two weeks on the lower vat/vrt whatever as well?

All in that means the screwed me for the best part of 2k and wont refund it..!! :mad:

smcgiff

vectra wrote: »

All in that means the screwed me for the best part of 2k and wont refund it..!! :mad:

I'm in the same boat. :eek:

Theta

Like everything in Irish politics they have managed to turn something simple into a mess and people don't know whats going on now! Can i get cheap tax for my petrol till 1st July ofris it on emmisions now?? Never make anything clear!

-Chris-

vectra wrote: »

Does this also mean that I have lost out by two weeks on the lower vat/vrt whatever as well?

Don't panic just yet, so far there's been no mention of VRT, only road tax.

Kevin Heenan

Hi S.,

smccarrick wrote: »

Volvo have just given me an EU Certificate of Conformity for my 03 reg 1.9 Tdi V40. I paid EUR 590 a few weeks ago- wonder if I can argue for CO2 treatment next time round (which would be the EUR 290 level)- given that I have the documentation that they keep harping on about now (thankyou Volvo UK )

S.

I see from your post that you got a COC from Volvo UK for your V40. I was wondering if you were able to make your request directly to them from here in the Republic and what info on the car you had to supply them with. The reason I am asking is that the Audi A4 1.9Tdi has a similar emmissions value to your car but the Audi UK website would not accept enquiries from outside the UK. Now that Gormley seems to be backtracking a bit on the new legislation, it could definitely make it worth my while shopping across the water but as the car needs to be registered here almost immediately, I would need to have the COC in my pocket. Anyone else out there that might have had dealings with Audi UK?

The_Conductor

Kevin Heenan wrote: »

I see from your post that you got a COC from Volvo UK for your V40. I was wondering if you were able to make your request directly to them from here in the Republic and what info on the car you had to supply them with. The reason I am asking is that the Audi A4 1.9Tdi has a similar emmissions value to your car but the Audi UK website would not accept enquiries from outside the UK. Now that Gormley seems to be backtracking a bit on the new legislation, it could definitely make it worth my while shopping across the water but as the car needs to be registered here almost immediately, I would need to have the COC in my pocket. Anyone else out there that might have had dealings with Audi UK?

The UK must be the car's first country of EU registration- thereafter all you require is the chasis number. A charge does apply (ST£70+ VAT)- but I got the cert in 2 days flat. Volvo indicated they only dealt with the UK too- but I gave them a quick call and they had no issues whatsoever in dealing with me here in Dublin. I require the cert as I want to have dual registration on the car (my parents live abroad)- and they required the cert. I did have to send a sterling bank draft to Volvo to cover the charges- but it was very straight forward and without any hassle whatsoever.

S.

-Chris-

I stuck this in the "floating" thread that's here at the moment, but I thought should be in the sticky too. Bear in mind that this was explained to me by someone who knows a lot about this, but I reserve the right to mis-interpret him , it's happened before...


OK lads, I've spoken to someone who's "very close" to this whole process and here's what he's explained to me:

Irish Cars
1) Changes to road tax only affect cars registered here after 1st Jan '08.
2) If you bought your new car since 1st January and you've taxed it already, you'll be allowed to avail of the lower road tax rates after 1st July.
I.e. if you taxed your car for a year in January, you'll get the lower rate next January. If you're buying a car off me tomorrow I'd advise you to tax it for 6 months and then when you renew your tax in August you'll get the lower rate.
3) If you're in a car that should be in the higher rate, you won't be forced into the higher rate.
Imports
1) Only cars that would qualify for a '08 plate as an import will qualify for the new road tax rate. If you bring in a '06 car from the UK it'll be taxed on the CC based road tax EVEN IF IT'S IMPORTED AFTER JULY.
2) The only exception to the above is if you import a car that is >225g/km, if you import and tax one of those then you'll automatically be put into the €2,000 road tax bracket from 1st July.

That's my understanding and it's from someone who knows...

Kevin Heenan

Thanks for that info S and AudiChris.

The info from AudiChris' "friend in the know" would be inclined to make me "hould tuff" for a while until Gorm the Green Goon and his cohorts publish something concrete on the whole thing. This info however unfortunately seems to make sense :rolleyes: in a disappointing kind of way .

-Chris-

Kevin Heenan wrote: »

Thanks for that info S and AudiChris.

The info from AudiChris' "friend in the know" would be inclined to make me "hould tuff" for a while until Gorm the Green Goon and his cohorts publish something concrete on the whole thing. This info however unfortunately seems to make sense :rolleyes: in a disappointing kind of way .

By "in the know", I mean this is what's proposed and it'll go through as-is unless there's some HUGE issue with it. We're pretty sure this is a done deal.

Flankerb

Hi Chris,
I had a plan to bring a 07 car in from the uk after july 1st. It would have been in the new band b tax bracket 150 euro's. Does this mean that the car will now fall into the current tax system and go up to 590euro as it is a 1.9tdi. I think SIMI have a new member. SimiGreen Party.

:mad: karl

-Chris-

As I understand it, yep!

galwaytt

AudiChris wrote: »

2) The only exception to the above is if you import a car that is >225g/km, if you import and tax one of those then you'll automatically be put into the €2,000 road tax bracket from 1st July.

.....ok, almost got it - just a quick question: if you import a car that has NO cert, pre 08, (e.g. 1993 one, like I bought yesterday.....), will I be taxed and vrt'd on the old system ?

The_Conductor

galwaytt wrote: »

.....ok, almost got it - just a quick question: if you import a car that has NO cert, pre 08, (e.g. 1993 one, like I bought yesterday.....), will I be taxed and vrt'd on the old system ?

According to the above- irrespective of whether you have a cert or not, any pre 2008 imports will be taxed and vrt'ed on the old system. So, yes.....

Nodnedlog

Imports
1) Only cars that would qualify for a '08 plate as an import will qualify for the new road tax rate. If you bring in a '06 car from the UK it'll be taxed on the CC based road tax EVEN IF IT'S IMPORTED AFTER JULY.

Hi there

Just listening in to this mind blowing news and the above quote is a completely different take on the new VRT and road tax system.

This scenario was not mentioned or alluded to in any government statement or on any forum before this.

In fact they lead the public to believe that any " new or second hand imported car registered after the 1st July" would have the new system so in fact they have decieved the public.

I know many of the details of the new system had to be ironed out but this was the only thing that was certain?

-Chris-

Nodnedlog wrote: »

Imports
1) Only cars that would qualify for a '08 plate as an import will qualify for the new road tax rate. If you bring in a '06 car from the UK it'll be taxed on the CC based road tax EVEN IF IT'S IMPORTED AFTER JULY.

Hi there

Just listening in to this mind blowing news and the above quote is a completely different take on the new VRT and road tax system.

This scenario was not mentioned or alluded to in any government statement or on any forum before this.

In fact they lead the public to believe that any " new or second hand imported car registered after the 1st July" would have the new system so in fact they have decieved the public.

I know many of the details of the new system had to be ironed out but this was the only thing that was certain?

I'm looking forward to the analysis in the press over the next few days/weeks. This is what I understand will happen, although I may have taken it up wrong (I've asked for a second opinion), and that's not to say that a further outcry won't cause a further flip-flop...

The_Conductor

AudiChris wrote: »

I'm looking forward to the analysis in the press over the next few days/weeks. This is what I understand will happen, although I may have taken it up wrong (I've asked for a second opinion), and that's not to say that a further outcry won't cause a further flip-flop...

What they originally said was that the reason they were unable to allow older cars avail of the new scheme was because there was no manner of accurately determining the CO2 emission levels. Most of us here now know that it no problem getting the certificates of EU Conformity that they were stating was the only accurate measure- so there is essentially no reason not to allow owners of older cars opt into the new system- which is what should be happening.

There are a few people here who have been hounding the Department- myself included, a concerted campaign really has to be made to try and bring pressure on the Minister's office over the matter.

Please- everyone- write to the Minister expressing your concern at the proposals as they currently stand, along with the conflicting information emminating from the Department- which is influencing people's decisions when its not valid information.

Nodnedlog

www.environ.ie/en/LocalGovernment/MotorTax/News/MainBody,16223,en.htm

If you read from this link it makes no mention of preowned '08 cars imported from the UK?

This is the info I went on when making a purchasing decision.

-Chris-

Just as an aside, and to maybe give a bit of perspective to the whole "tax is going up to €2,000, what a bleedin' rip-off!" have a look at page 2 of this document.

Less than 5% of the cars sold in '06 would have qualified in the max VRT/Road Tax bracket, and under 10% were in band F.

There's not as much gas-guzzling going on as people think...

http://www.budget.gov.ie/2008/downloads/AnnexD.pdf

_Kaiser_

I just spoke to the local tax office to query whether a new UK import I might be getting shortly would be taxed under the old or new system, and she said that it would be taxed under the old setup but that a decision on the whole thing is supposed to be made by March 5th. They're not sure what's going to happen yet either...

R.O.R

We've just more or less had the new car tax issue cleared up by our local tax office.

Their information is to tax any new cars now for 6 months (3 months from April) then take advantage of the lower tax rates from renewal onwards. Obviously I need to keep a look out for vehicles where tax will increase and tax for 12 months, but as most of the business is Diesel practically everything will be going down.

Now need to figure out how to apply this to quotes going forwards