New motor tax and VRT regime. Links + calculations

ninty9er

gary the great wrote: »

Before i go in and VRT my motor, just want to clarify:

a 2001 Alfa 147 should be VRT'd before Tuesday (July 1st)? People have started telling me that the whole system has changed and just want to clarify!!

That would depend on what engine is in it.

It could be 20% or anywhere up to 36% next Tuesday or either 25% or 30% before that.

What's the CO2 rating?

gary the great

Its a 1.6 Tspark and apparently there quite high on CO2, its saying 1400quid to VRt on the calculator now, but if i leave it till after July to tax it looks like it would be way more expensive

gary the great

it emits 197g Co2, so its a before july job then ye?

ninty9er

gary the great wrote: »

it emits 197g Co2, so its a before july job then ye?

Yup get it done ASAP.

Ceb

im in a dillemma, i was told that my uk reg car bought last week would cost me 316 euro to register if i did it before monday but on a calculation site i was on it told me six odd grand, anyone be able to help me out on getting the cost on this, its a renault 19 16v 1764 convertible registered first in june 1993? im getting totally panicked over here

Esel

From www.ros.ie

VEHICLE REGISTRATION TAX (VRT) ENQUIRY
DATE: 27 June 2008 TIME: 00:41

STATISTICAL CODE: 41088519
MAKE: RENAULT
MODEL: 19 1.8
VERSION: 16V CABRIOLET 2DR / CONVERTIBLE / MANUAL / PETROL ONLY /
MILEAGE: 100000 MILES

The information requested in respect of the vehicle shown is indicated below.
DATE OF FIRST REGISTRATION: SEPTEMBER 1993
OPEN MARKET SELLING PRICE:
(applicable on enquiry date) €835
RATE OF TAX: 25.0%
VEHICLE REGISTRATION TAX:
(payable on enquiry date) €315


- if you register it today (Friday) or Monday. Get there very early, and don't expect to be in and out quickly. The office will be jammed, with large queues I'd say, depending on the office location.

The most you could expect to pay after Monday would by €720 (minimum amount on highest CO2 band).

Ceb

hey thanks esel, youre a life saver indeed, i may head early in the morning, hoping to do it wherever that office is in santry

jetfiremuck

Looking at the ROS website it looks ominous for the July1 start. They mention a VRT birth Cert!!!!!. My brother cleared a vehicle in Cork yesterday very busy. 2hrs in line. Tomorrow and Monday guaranteed mayhem. All over Monday at 6,00pm, Time to remember the good old days.
VRT Birth Certs

Currently, the CO2 emissions information is only required for vehicles with an EU Category of M1. From June 28th, the Birth Cert Offline form will require CO2 emissions to be completed for all vehicles. Birth Certs uploaded to ROS without this information will be rejected.

The_Conductor

jetfiremuck wrote: »

Looking at the ROS website it looks ominous for the July1 start. They mention a VRT birth Cert!!!!!. My brother cleared a vehicle in Cork yesterday very busy. 2hrs in line. Tomorrow and Monday guaranteed mayhem. All over Monday at 6,00pm, Time to remember the good old days.
VRT Birth Certs

Currently, the CO2 emissions information is only required for vehicles with an EU Category of M1. From June 28th, the Birth Cert Offline form will require CO2 emissions to be completed for all vehicles. Birth Certs uploaded to ROS without this information will be rejected.

Well it is readily available- and the vast majority of UK registered stuff coming in will have it either in its own registration docs, or via the Certificate of EU Conformity. They are very good at running of the certs- as most other EU countries importing from other countries require them (it took us almost 6 months to organise the documentation to put a Portuguese reg on an A6 )

shamboo

I eventually paid my vrt yesterday and what an experience. I have the car since the start of April but was waiting on the log book so only got to sort things out yesterday. I got a fully loaded BMW and was told that I would be fleeced due to all the extras i.e. 19' alloys, a/c, mfsw, leather seats. I was told I would even be charged for the breakdown triangle in the boot, which was the only thing I could physically take out. THEY DIDN'T EVEN LOOK AT THE CAR!!!!!
I was in and out in about 20 mins and I must say it was no hassle. I was even charged yesterdays vrt charge, which was over €150 less that it was when I imported the car in April. Even the form that he gave me for the tax office states that I only imported the car yesterday so I was let off with 2 months road tax as well.
I thought the vrt crowd were a shower of b****ds but if your lucky you'll get a fair enough deal. Seem's it's a true statement 'It pays to be nice'.

The_Conductor

I guess they do get grief from every second customer- its a refreshing change to have someone whos easy to deal with......

shamboo

True point. He didn't even go out to look at the car.

There was a chap in front of me in the queue and he had a '08 ferrari parked outside and his vrt was €38,500. They then advised him that as the car was less than 6 months old he would have to pay the VAT as well. So I'm guessing that 21% vat on a €200,000+ car plus the VRT is a hell of a lot of money to be paying out.

galwaytt

so, to update my story.......it took 3 days to reg my 968........:rolleyes:

Day 1 - as mentioned, queues, VRO say VRT quote was +15 days old, so no good, so new one required, but too busy, call back tomorrow.........oh, and you can't use VRT4 downloaded of Revenue site on internet, either, as...........it doesn't have a carbon backed copy.......:rolleyes: :rolleyes: Why, pray tell, do they bother having on the site, then..........??

Day 2 - got call from VRO, VRT GONE UP, despite car now older, more miles.....anyhoo, only Eur +50, but that's not the point..... - again, another 1 hr+ in VRO (queues......). Then Herself (who I'd sent in to do it....) rings and tells me she forgot the V5, so I go to get it (20 miles.....), and then another call - 'I found it !, in bottom of my handbag !' :rolleyes::rolleyes:.......then another call - but I happened to be outside the VRO door, looking for my PPS no.............and I went in and gave it, no probs, cheque accepted, Laser card swiped for the extra Eur50..........and then I spot it - wrong reg no on the paper work. When I say wrong, what I mean is...........and I know, I know, I should have kept my beak shut, if only for a few days, for novelty value.............but they gave me 03 G XXXXX. :D Nothing wrong with that, you say..........except it's a 1993 car !! More confusion - have to get on to Rosslare to DeReg the car! - and that'll take take til tomorrow because..............yep, they're too busy !! Ha!
****e - I should have put the 03 plates on it for a few days. Lady in VRO - thought the car was 03, due to the condition ! Ha - even better ! :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Day 3 - phone call from VRO...........got my, sigh, 93 G xxxx number.


See - girls/forms/cars/tech..........you just can't do it Mind you, it'd have been nice to be able to tell people I have an 03 Porsche, or have a few pics of it.............

btw - did you know you can un-reg a car, within 7 days, no harm no foul? Bet you didn't.

gorrrr72

Ordered a Peugeot 308 1.6 Diesel HDI for July. Dealer told me it was going down in price by around 2 grand so I was happy enough with that. Just got a call today, it's gone down by another € 1500 and only € 100 a year road tax so happy days, thank you Mr Gormely :D:D

R.O.R

Below is an urgent notice from Revenue regarding changes to the ROS system, please note the dates and times ROS will be unavailable.

PUBLIC NOTICE

VEHICLE REGISTRATION TAX

CHANGEOVER TO THE NEW SYSTEM ON 1 JULY 2008

_____________________

New CO2 based VRT system – 1 July 2008

From 1 July 2008, vehicle registration tax (VRT) payable on passenger cars (category A vehicles) will no longer be based on engine size but rather on the level of CO2 emissions from the car. Further information, including the new VRT rates, is available on www.revenue.ie

Arrangements for ROS (Revenue-on-line service) users

In order to facilitate the introduction of the new registration system on 1 July 2008, the ROS VRT registration facility will not be available on Saturday 28 June 2008 from 1.00pm to 6.00pm. The ROS VRT facility will close at 6.00pm on Monday 30 June. Any registrations submitted after 6.00pm will be registered under the new CO2 based charging system on 1 July. The new registration system will be available from 8.00am on 1 July.

Arrangements for personal callers to Vehicle Registration Offices (VROs)

The VROs will be open as normal on Monday 30 June. Applications for registration should be supported by the appropriate documentation and payment by cheque, postal order, or bank draft. If the appropriate documentation or payment is not available the registration will be refused. If the application is resubmitted on or after 1 July the vehicle will be registered under the new CO2 based charging system.

jozi

I'm trying to figure out what it will set me back registering a E30 bmw 318is after monday.

The way i see it is that it could be charged up to36% of the cars value?

It's value'd at 2050 on the vro site, it's a 1991 with 113k miles, 1.8 engine.

Esel

shamboo wrote: »

I got a fully loaded BMW and was told that I would be fleeced due to all the extras i.e. 19' alloys, a/c, mfsw, leather seats. ..... THEY DIDN'T EVEN LOOK AT THE CAR!!!!!

I'd say you got lucky because of the day that was in it. On a normal day, different story....

jetfiremuck

My brother was chatting to some of the lads in line. They are so busy at the vrt offices that anything a few years old they are not even going out to check just too busy and want to clear as much as they can. So anything old and loaded get it done before Monday close of business. I bet it will be a different ballgame Tues am. No panic then as you will be sent to get all necessary paperwork. The onus will be on you to prove the emission level or pay 36% VRT and it doesnt matter if its a 1.3 or 6.6 litre engine either.

shamwari

I've got a bit of a concern about this new emissions based VRT. As we all know, the current system charges a percentage of the cars open market selling price relative to the engine size of the vehicle. If the car I wish to import has an engine size of 1.6, and its OMSP is €10000, I pay 25% of its value meaning the VRT is €2500.

I have reason to believe that when the new emissions based system commences, even though the % charable reduces if the car has low CO2, the OMSP will actually increase thereby clawing back some, if not most, of the potential saving.

I'm going to import a car very shortly and I've printed off a quote I got from ROS showing the VRT payable on the current system and critically, the OMSP. The OMSP of the car is currently around €14,000 and I reckon come July 1st that this particular figure will actually climb :mad:. Basically second hand cars depreciate in value, and if as I expect we will have a situation where the revenue believes the cars OMSP will be more on the July 1st than the day before. If my suspicions are confirmed, I'll be making a complaint about it and asking them to explain this anomaly. In addition, the value of this particular car new will fall come July first, and that in itself should be impacting on the 2nd hand OMSP values and forcing them down. I reckon the Revenue are going to giveth with one hand (decreasing the VRT % bands) and take it back by inflating the OMSP.

The_Conductor

Depends- any second hand pre-2008 diesels are going to plummet in price. Why would you buy them when in the majority of cases they tend to be 1.9ltrs- which are almost EUR700 road tax under the current regime but new ones will be both lower in price and in most cases down almost EUR500 pa in road tax- its a bit of a no-brainer. The inverse may happen- possibly large diesels/petrols that will still be on the CC scheme- but would be jacked up on the CO2 scale?- in which case the pre-existing stock would climb in value versus 2008 stock, or imports. Madness- and with very little method in it.......

G-Money

That's very strange they wouldn't let you use the form from the website.

I paid my VRT recently and I just printed off the form from the website and used that and there were no problems at all with it.

eamon234

Guys - they don't check the car for extras if it's over 5 years old - nice lady at the VRO told me so.

jetfiremuck

Something to think about: If the total take to the revenue and councils in lower VRT and Road tax emission based cars are the norm,coupled with the increases in fuel economy where is the shortfall going to be made up. If all cars are tending smaller with CO2 ratings (road Tax)you can be sure the system is going to be tweaked to make up the short fall.

Esel

smccarrick wrote: »

Depends- any second hand pre-2008 diesels are going to plummet in price. Why would you buy them when in the majority of cases they tend to be 1.9ltrs- which are almost EUR700 road tax under the current regime

You've been off the ball a couple of times recently.

Engine c.c. .....Tax
1,801 to 1,900 €560
1,901 to 2,000 €590

Esel

jetfiremuck wrote: »

Something to think about: If the total take to the revenue and councils in lower VRT and Road tax emission based cars are the norm, coupled with the increases in fuel economy where is the shortfall going to be made up. If all cars are tending smaller with CO2 ratings (road Tax) you can be sure the system is going to be tweaked to make up the short fall.

Really? What difference do you think tweaking OMSP on s/h cars would make to the total VRT amount in a year?

copacetic

esel wrote: »

Really? What difference do you think tweaking OMSP on s/h cars would make to the total VRT amount in a year?

pretty sure he meant that when/if tax take drops under new VRT/Road Tax scheme then the scheme will be adjusted until they are making same amount from it.

He never mentioned OMSP

jetfiremuck

Agreed. The omsp and stat number related to the old system is history now. Lets see what pops up on Tues am. The obvious revenue shortfall will have to be recouped somehow.

Bee

jetfiremuck wrote: »

Something to think about: If the total take to the revenue and councils in lower VRT and Road tax emission based cars are the norm,coupled with the increases in fuel economy where is the shortfall going to be made up. If all cars are tending smaller with CO2 ratings (road Tax)you can be sure the system is going to be tweaked to make up the short fall.

Take your choice

1.How about more new cars will be sold so the Gov will rake in extra VRT/VAT profits? :rolleyes:

2.Or how about I am the grow my own mueseli Puke Green Min Gormless and all i care about is saving planet Earth from bull$hit global warming so I don't give a .... about the shortfall;)

Expect massive increases in fuel tax,(including ESB/GAS) motor tax, road tolls, vrt, vat ad off course these idiots will want to bring in a "carbon tax"

Padraig Mor

shamwari wrote: »

I've got a bit of a concern about this new emissions based VRT. As we all know, the current system charges a percentage of the cars open market selling price relative to the engine size of the vehicle. If the car I wish to import has an engine size of 1.6, and its OMSP is €10000, I pay 25% of its value meaning the VRT is €2500.

I have reason to believe that when the new emissions based system commences, even though the % charable reduces if the car has low CO2, the OMSP will actually increase thereby clawing back some, if not most, of the potential saving.

I'm going to import a car very shortly and I've printed off a quote I got from ROS showing the VRT payable on the current system and critically, the OMSP. The OMSP of the car is currently around €14,000 and I reckon come July 1st that this particular figure will actually climb :mad:. Basically second hand cars depreciate in value, and if as I expect we will have a situation where the revenue believes the cars OMSP will be more on the July 1st than the day before. If my suspicions are confirmed, I'll be making a complaint about it and asking them to explain this anomaly. In addition, the value of this particular car new will fall come July first, and that in itself should be impacting on the 2nd hand OMSP values and forcing them down. I reckon the Revenue are going to giveth with one hand (decreasing the VRT % bands) and take it back by inflating the OMSP.

Revenue base their OMSPs on percentages of list price, e.g. a 'new' OMSP will usually be 92% of list price, a one yr old with avg mileage will be, say, 90% of the previous years value, etc. If the list goes down, the OMSP goes down for all years, unless they introduce an unworkably complex system. What they base their percentages on is anyone's guess, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was the infamous "book".

Padraig Mor

jetfiremuck wrote: »

Something to think about: If the total take to the revenue and councils in lower VRT and Road tax emission based cars are the norm,coupled with the increases in fuel economy where is the shortfall going to be made up. If all cars are tending smaller with CO2 ratings (road Tax)you can be sure the system is going to be tweaked to make up the short fall.

Jetfire hits on an important point here which I haven't really seen addressed. The govt have openly said that they expect the VRT changes to be revenue neutral, i.e. total tax take to be unaffected as VRT drops should be cancelled out by rises. As reported here, however, many manufacturers have slashed their list prices to remain competitive, even where models should have risen (eg. Mercedes). Even if sales continued at normal levels, this would lead to a decreased VRT take. Couple this with the massive drop in new car sales we've seen this year (due to economic circumstances IMO - not VRT confusion) and the government are facing a massive VRT (and VAT) shortfall below their projections.

They ain't gonna sit idly by while this happens!

I would strongly expect the VRT rates to be overhauled in December's budget - and not in favour of car purchasers. Naturally, a fig leaf of environmentalism will be used to disguise it. The 'bargains' that are currently available in the new car market may not be quite as attractive come January....