Legality question

GerryRyan

Ok, this is a serious thread, before someone jumps down my neck


Pic 2

I have access to a workshop, and a LOT of wood and other materials, over the summer, and thinking of building one of these babys (with the help of a friend).

We're not planning on launching some missiles at an un-suspecting public by the way. Just out of pure curiosity - 'could we make it?' sort of thing.

We have all the schematics, materials, prices, and angles and measurements etc etc - and are confident we can have a stab at it?

Just a question on the legality of building or owning such a device. Worse comes to worse we have to dismantle it, but would it be a cause for concern keeping it in a garage or field.

maglite

i would think legaly you would need a crossbow licence,
onless the projectlile force is <1jpoule, which would mean it prob would't get off the rest

but on a practicle a letter to you super telling him hat you are doing asking if he wants you to apply for a licence should sufice

foxhunter

If it was me i would just build it .Its not exactly something you could conceal on your person to rob a bank or anything

rrpc

foxhunter wrote: »

If it was me i would just build it .Its not exactly something you could conceal on your person to rob a bank or anything

On the other hand if the bank was in the next county....... :D

johngalway

foxhunter wrote: »

If it was me i would just build it .Its not exactly something you could conceal on your person to rob a bank or anything

I would tend to agree.

IRLConor

maglite wrote: »

i would think legally you would need a crossbow licence

Wouldn't that require the ballista to be defined as a crossbow?

As far as I can see in the Firearms Acts there's no definition of a crossbow at all.

Honest Judge, it's not a crossbow, it's a ballista!

GerryRyan

Thanks for that lads - might check with one of the lads anyway - handy to know a Garda in training

Sure, when I get it started - I'll keep an update with pics and stuff ...

revan23

this reminds me of that eccentric english lord who built himself a full sized trebuchet to fire old cars and stuff round a field. (was on topgear or something) its not a firearm, my guess is medieval seige weapons are probably not covered by law. (unless you're planning on using it for hunting )

GerryRyan

Ha, wouldn't be to that scale. I did my time in the army reserve (artillery) and have always had a weird fascination with siege weapons aswell. Now I'm a design course, and there are loads of resources there to actually build one - library, woodwork skills, workshop to practise etc

meathstevie

Don't bother with the super..see the centurion

GerryRyan

revan23 wrote: »

this reminds me of that eccentric english lord who built himself a full sized trebuchet to fire old cars and stuff round a field. (was on topgear or something) its not a firearm, my guess is medieval seige weapons are probably not covered by law. (unless you're planning on using it for hunting )

Yeah - here he is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wVADKznOhY&feature=related.

It was a trebuchet tho, the one I'm making is different (and a hell of a lot smaller)

cavan shooter

I wouldn't worry about it. The short answer is experimental archaeology, you have a keen interest in it. To prove it have numerous copies of Time team on DVD. My young lad is forever making cross bows and the sort (they work too) he chose metalwork so he could make a gun. I asked him not to share that with anyone else:(

Out of interest are you living in meath, between a certain super and a certain judge you could be in trouble.

Sparks

Of course, if you fire it and the bolt goes over the backstop and hits someone a few hundred yards away, it won't be quite so trivial...

kowloon

Its not a crossbow by any definition.
There is no continuous bow fixed across a stock, it has two arms and uses torsion, hence it's a different beast altogether.
They might get you on something else but it's no crossbow, a dictionary will clear that.

IRLConor

kowloon wrote: »

Its not a crossbow by any definition.
There is no continuous bow fixed across a stock, it has two arms and uses torsion, hence it's a different beast altogether.
They might get you on something else but it's no crossbow, a dictionary will clear that.

As far as I saw, there's no definition of crossbow in the Firearms Act(s). I'm no lawyer, but I don't know if they use dictionary definitions for disambiguating law. If a Garda says it's a crossbow, you'll end up in court. If a judge says it's a crossbow, you'll end up with a conviction.

Now I agree with you, it isn't a crossbow. ThatGuy just needs to be careful that it isn't considered to be a "killing machine".

kowloon

It's a dodgy one alright.
If they really wanted to do you for it they would, law or no law.

Build a trebuchet FTW!

IRLConor

kowloon wrote: »

Build a trebuchet FTW!

IIRC a guy I went to school with built one as his final year project in college.

Mellor

how is a trebuchet powerd?
I know the device in the OP uses a torsion spring,
I have seen the trebuchet video, but it wasn't very clear

IRLConor

Usually by a counterweight AFAIK. I think there are sprung variants as well.

Mellor

I thought looking at the video it was counter weight,
but the car took off with so much force I thought the counter weight would of been too heavy to pull down

IRLConor

"Give me a place to stand on, and I will move the earth."

Law of the lever FTW!

kowloon

Pulleys can be used to take down the weight on the large trebuchets.
I think a small trebuchet would be more fun than a ballista, without the right materials a ballista will perform very poorly anyway.
Trebuchet will be easier to build with cheap wood whereas the ballista will need more finishing, a bit of fabrication for the firing mechanism and of you want it to work properly you can't use regular rope.

Mellor

kowloon wrote: »

Pulleys can be used to take down the weight on the large trebuchets.
I think a small trebuchet would be more fun than a ballista, without the right materials a ballista will perform very poorly anyway.
Trebuchet will be easier to build with cheap wood whereas the ballista will need more finishing, a bit of fabrication for the firing mechanism and of you want it to work properly you can't use regular rope.

The Devil's in the detail

kowloon

Mellor wrote: »

The Devil's in the detail

Indeed

GerryRyan

Just a quick update. We're still going ahead with it - but on a limited 'when we can spare a few minutes' basis. Worked out the measurements and we've a rough template and time-frame set out. There's a load of detail re: the mechanisms and loading etc - but going to pick a few more brains in the college here when I get a chance. So yeah - I'll try my best to keep an update here and upload pics when we start the build