Looking for a decent digital camera and feel hopelessly lost

John

Hey guys, I think this is my first foray into this forum so nice to see you all. As you've probably garnered from my thread title, I need a new camera. I've a few requirements but no real idea how these translate into any particular camera models. Budget-wise I'm looking at up to €400 for a camera and I can buy any additional lenses, memory cards and other paraphernalia at a later date.

There are a few things I'm interested in:
1. Taking photos at gigs:
My old camera (an old Fuji FinePix 40i) was hopeless at gigs except if I was at the front and the lights were above a certain intensity as I couldn't adjust any settings whatsoever on it. I'm interested in a camera that either allows more freedom in terms of exposure time control, focussing, etc.

2. Taking photos in the lab:
I work in a research lab with tissue samples that need to be photographed. In the lab we have a digital camera that sits in the eyepiece of a microscope but at the lowest magnification we can't get the full tissue slice in view (and this digital camera needs to be in the microscope to work). I need to able to get pictures along the lines of this (obviously at a higher resolution and image size, this is just an idea of what will be photographed):

where the slice of tissue (brain) is about 2x1cm. I'm guessing some sort of macro lens is needed to get a good image.

I don't want something too bulky (and obviously this depends on the lenses but I wouldn't be bringing a macro lens to a gig!) but I'm not focussed on getting something tiny either. I've no real idea where to start looking or where to buy as I'm a n00b to serious photography. Any suggestions, advice or help would be very much appreciated as obviously I don't want to just throw my money away on the first model that a shop assistant says is great.

Thanks!

elven

Welcome to the forum

This might help for the gig stuff?

And this refers mostly to macros of flowers and insects rather than brain slices (nice diagram!) but it may be of use, too.

John

Thanks for those pages, the tips are very useful. Some explanations as to why some of my gig photos are terrible!

As for a camera though, does anyone have any suggestions? Any particular make/model I should look at?

Stephen

Heh, don't mention the war

I find the biggest thing to consider when choosing a camera system is vendor lock-in. If you go with Nikon now you'll be pretty much locked in as all of your gear will only work with Nikon bodies. Same deal with Canon etc. If you want to change from one to another down the line you'd have to start from scratch.

I don't think there's any DSLR you can buy new for €400 yet. That price is getting close to Canon 400D and Nikon D40 territory though.

Calina

350D might be in the ball park to be honest and it's a very, very good camera even allowing for the existence of the 400D.

John, welcome to boards.ie/photography.

I'm a bit intrigued by your microscope photography. Do you think an SLR would fit into it? Because if so I am thinking - and elven can correct me - that the idea set up for that would be a DSLR with a nice 50mm 1.8 lense...

I'm just not clear on whether you want a DSLR or not. I think elven had the impression you wanted a compact and unfortunately I'm not that expert in them.

isadub

I don't think you're going to be able to get one camera to fit both goals.

For the photo-microscopy, you'll need a camera with a specialised adaptor (that your research budget should pay for). Unless you're in an I.T., I'm surprised your Uni doesn't have a camera available (check your anatomy/medicine dept?). Even if you're in an IT, maybe your local hospital has a camera in it's histopathology dept?

For gig photo's, check out what Nicola T gets on a P&S or look up reviews on the Canon G9 - everyone seems to be raving about it...

This is a 400x magnification of a breast cancer biopsy (using a microscope & camera):

ThOnda

You can also "create" super-macro lens by adding one reversed prime to your lens.

It is simple, cheap and very good, if you can shoot macro from tripod.

elven

Hmm I read it looking at the budget and the bit where you said you didn't want it to be bulky and had it in mind you were after a compact... oops!

Will struggle on the €400 for a DSLR though, unless you can get your paws on something 2nd hand.

John

Stephen wrote: »

Heh, don't mention the war

I find the biggest thing to consider when choosing a camera system is vendor lock-in. If you go with Nikon now you'll be pretty much locked in as all of your gear will only work with Nikon bodies. Same deal with Canon etc. If you want to change from one to another down the line you'd have to start from scratch.

I don't think there's any DSLR you can buy new for €400 yet. That price is getting close to Canon 400D and Nikon D40 territory though.

Well €400 is just what I've got from Christmas, if I'm going to buy a decent camera I don't have any qualms about putting more money to it and having something that will last and serve me well.

Calina wrote: »

I'm a bit intrigued by your microscope photography. Do you think an SLR would fit into it? Because if so I am thinking - and elven can correct me - that the idea set up for that would be a DSLR with a nice 50mm 1.8 lense...

The problem with using a microscope is that the lowest magnification objective lens you can get for the one we use is 4x which is still too much. I don't want to be able to take pictures of individual cells (I can do that with the digital camera we have and the microscope). I want to able to take a picture of a slice of rat brain as a whole (so it looks like the above picture I posted) and using the microscope I can only get about a quarter of the slice into any field of view, it won't zoom out far enough to capture the full slice.

So a microscope isn't ideal, but I was thinking that I could use a camera with a macro lens I could get the entire slice in frame as I wouldn't be restricted to the views/magnification of a microscope.

I'm just not clear on whether you want a DSLR or not. I think elven had the impression you wanted a compact and unfortunately I'm not that expert in them.

I want a DSLR as I find the compacts too restrictive.

isadub wrote: »

I don't think you're going to be able to get one camera to fit both goals.

For the photo-microscopy, you'll need a camera with a specialised adaptor (that your research budget should pay for). Unless you're in an I.T., I'm surprised your Uni doesn't have a camera available (check your anatomy/medicine dept?). Even if you're in an IT, maybe your local hospital has a camera in it's histopathology dept?

My equipment budget is well gone at this stage, this is all going to be out of my own pocket, hence me wanting one I can use for fun and business

There's no biology department in my uni that does any photography along the lines of what we want it for. I could take my samples into TCD into one of the labs there but I really don't want to be carrying them around outside of our lab and putting trust in other people to get the work I want done.

As I mentioned above, I want pictures of sections through an entire brain, not detailed shots of tissue or cells. When I publish our data, we have to give sample pictures of brain co-ordinates as to where we're working so other labs can check out our work using an anatomical atlas.

elven wrote: »

Hmm I read it looking at the budget and the bit where you said you didn't want it to be bulky and had it in mind you were after a compact... oops!

I've no idea what prices these things are, I'm a total noob. I just didn't want some massive piece of equipment, not necessarily something pocket-sized. Basically if anyone has any suggestions at all, disregard price and I'll work from there.

The Canon 350D was mentioned by Calina, I've a funny feeling my uncle has recently bought this (or another model from that range) so I'll check his out and see how it weighs up.

Thanks a million for the help guys, I know when someone is asking fairly vague questions it is difficult to come up with suggestions so all the help is very much appreciated.

Calina

The current entry level Canon DSLR is a 400D and you are probably looking at around six or seven hundred euro for that. You *might* be able to get your hands on a 350D but I've had a quick look around pixmania and technikdirekt just to get an idea and neither of them are selling it at the moment.

Might be worth calling Conns, Gunns and Camera Exchange to see if they have any in stock. It will most likely come with a 18-55mm lens.

John

Cool, thanks for the info.

whyulittle

400D body only is on www.ac-foto.com for €519 with €70 cash back.

isadub

As I mentioned above, I want pictures of sections through an entire brain, not detailed shots of tissue or cells. When I publish our data, we have to give sample pictures of brain co-ordinates as to where we're working so other labs can check out our work using an anatomical atlas.

If it's mouse tissue, maybe you could use a slide-scanner (from a local photo club/member)?

Maybe others could comment but if you're just looking to reference the major landmarks in the brain, maybe the 'macro' setting on a point&shoot+small tripod would work??

mathias

What you are looking for in terms of a microscope camera does not come cheap , in almost all cases you will need a specialised microscope adaptor , which is going to cost ,

Have a look at this site for an idea , dedicated microscope cameras come in at anything from 2K to 10K , and even the options for handheld digital ( canon S5 IS bridge camera ...which can be had for about 300 ) baloon up in price when you add in the adaptor for the scope.

http://www.martinmicroscope.com/Digital&Video.htm

I can see no cheap way of getting quality consistent results here without spending the cash.

John

Well as I said the microscope is a no go as it is too much of a close up, you can't get the entire slice in frame (and we've got a camera for our microscope) and as a slice of rat brain is around the size of a bee or a flower I thought a macro lens on a regular camera with tripod would be the better option. I like looking at macro photography anyway so I don't think buying a lens and experimenting would be a waste of money as I'll probably find plenty of extra-curricular activities for it!

John

I ended up with a Canon EOS 400D in the end. Thanks for all the help guys, as soon as I start taking decent shots (rather than random things in my house!) I'll post them up.

elven

Yay! Can't wait to see. Not the rodent brains, though, mind...

Have you checked out what you can do with a 50mm f1.8 and a set of extension tubes? That's my original macro setup, before i got the 100mm canon f2.8.

5uspect

Hi John. Best of luck with the 400D! Regarding the juicy rat brains (yum) couldn't you just use a standard flatbed scanner? Isadub mentined a slide scanner but a bog standard flatbed should do it too. Also what kind of camera are you using on the microscpe?

We use a few small cameras with our microscopes in our lab. They all have C-mount fittings and you can get standard lenses (and microscope mounts) for them. I'd imagine you're using something similar. (C mount is threaded and about in inch in diameter).

Have a look on Edmund Optics etc for a few lenses if indeed your camera is indeed a C-mount.

Add a Manfrottto Superclamp and you're away!