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Getting samples in key in Acid Pro

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  • 06-01-2008 5:04pm
    #1
    Da Funky Munky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 186 ✭✭


    Hi all

    Does anyone know if there's a simple technique of getting samples in key in Acid Pro?

    The tune Im currently working on is in the root key of F and Im trying to get anything I add to it to be the same. The problem arises when I try to put a sample thats not in key up or down an octave - doing it by ear is tricky at best!

    So if I have a sample I know is in the key of G, say, do I "plus 2" it to get it sounding like an F? At the moment this "G" sounds like an F at plus 2 octaves.

    I suppose what Im looking for ideally is a chart of some sort where you're told what needs to be plussed or minused on a note to get it sounding like another.

    Any help or links would be great.

    Ta!


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    #2
    Thomas_S_Hunterson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,151 ✭✭✭Thomas_S_Hunterson


    Well the standard chromatic scale is:

    C--C#--D--D#--E--F--F#--G--G#--A--A#--B--C

    and it goes around in circles like that. I haven't used Acid Pro, but I assume each "plus one" is like increasing a full scale.

    So to move one semitone to the right you should add 0.0833333333 and likewise to move a semitone to the left you should subtract 0.0833333333.

    I could very possibly be wrong here, as I'm just guessing!


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    #3
    sei046
    Registered Users Posts: 2,110 ✭✭✭sei046


    I presume +1 is a semitone. So using the scale you were given by the last poster, If th sample is in G and you want it in F, You put it to "-2", which would be G-F#-F. Understand. Octaves should not really be an issue. An octave up would be +12.


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    #4
    cornbb
    Registered Users Posts: 6,790 ✭✭✭cornbb


    + or - 1 per semitone is the convention in Sound Forge so I'd agree with sei046, I imagine it'd be the same in Acid.


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    #5
    Thomas_S_Hunterson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,151 ✭✭✭Thomas_S_Hunterson


    sei046 wrote: »
    I presume +1 is a semitone. So using the scale you were given by the last poster, If th sample is in G and you want it in F, You put it to "-2", which would be G-F#-F. Understand. Octaves should not really be an issue. An octave up would be +12.

    Sorry yea I misread the OP, each semitone should be plus or minus one.


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    #6
    Da Funky Munky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 186 ✭✭Da Funky Munky


    sei046 wrote: »
    I presume +1 is a semitone. So using the scale you were given by the last poster, If th sample is in G and you want it in F, You put it to "-2", which would be G-F#-F. Understand. Octaves should not really be an issue. An octave up would be +12.


    This should help greatly. Thanks ;)

    MMmmmmmmm ........... in key samples


    drooling_homer.gif


    :)


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    #7
    Da Funky Munky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 186 ✭✭Da Funky Munky


    I have a sample here tagged "GM" as the note which Im presuming stands for G Minor.

    Is this the same as a G sharp?

    In which case I should push any samples that are just "G" plus one to match the GM samples?

    My ears are hearing this as in key but key-matching isnt my strongest point in production :)


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    #8
    Thomas_S_Hunterson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,151 ✭✭✭Thomas_S_Hunterson


    No!

    My musical theory is a bit ropey so this could be wrong but if you want to move a G (major) sample to match a G (minor) you should move the G (major) sample into the key of A# (major) as this is the relative major of G minor.

    Otherwise if you want to move the G (minor) samples to match with G (major), you should move them from G (minor) to E (minor) as this is the relative minor.

    (That's assuming that GM does actually stand for G Minor, usually a lower case m is used for minor though)


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    #9
    cornbb
    Registered Users Posts: 6,790 ✭✭✭cornbb


    Da Funky Munky wrote: »
    I have a sample here tagged "GM" as the note which Im presuming stands for G Minor.
    No! A single note cannot be "minor". Only series of notes (scales) can be major/minor.
    Is this the same as a G sharp?
    No. G sharp is one semitone above G, or one semitone below A (G sharp is the same as A flat)

    Sean_K wrote: »
    My musical theory is a bit ropey so this could be wrong but if you want to move a G (major) sample to match a G (minor) you should move the G (major) sample into the key of A# (major) as this is the relative major of G minor.

    Otherwise if you want to move the G (minor) samples to match with G (major), you should move them from G (minor) to E (minor) as this is the relative minor.

    My music theory is pretty sketchy too but I don't think this is accurate. Individual samples cannot be major/minor, only natural, flat or sharp. Once your individual samples are in tune relative to each other, i.e. once you have the full chromatic scale, then arranging them in a certain key and mode (major/minor etc) is a task to be undertaken when you're composing with a keyboard/piano roll, not loading them into your sampler.
    (That's assuming that GM does actually stand for G Minor, usually a lower case m is used for minor though)
    G would mean G major, Gm would be G minor. But as individual samples* are tagged this way it can't be the case (as a single note/sample cannot be in a certain mode/scale). I'm guessing it stands for something completely different, General Midi perhaps?

    *I'm assuming you are talking about individual note samples here, not whole bars/phrases, correct me if I'm wrong.


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    #10
    Da Funky Munky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 186 ✭✭Da Funky Munky


    cornbb wrote: »

    *I'm assuming you are talking about individual note samples here, not whole bars/phrases, correct me if I'm wrong.

    I should have clarified - its a sample loop, an 8 bar riff.

    Hmmmm, this is a bit mind melting but thanks for the replies :) Is there software out there that puts samples in key for you?


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    #11
    cornbb
    Registered Users Posts: 6,790 ✭✭✭cornbb


    Ah ok, my bad.

    Yes, music theory is a bit head melting unfortunately. My own isn't the best. Its good to get a grasp on the basics though.

    As your sample contains multiple notes, you will be able to transpose the whole thing but you will not be able to shift the notes relative to each other (at least not without resorting to drastic editing). Lets say it is G minor (although we are not sure it is - listen to it alongside a tune/scale you know to be in G minor to see if it sounds like it "fits") - in that case it will always be in a minor key as you cannot change the intervals between the notes. You can however transpose the whole thing, so it could be in Fm, Am or whatever. I'm fairly sure I'm correct here, but if I'm wrong someone feel free to correct me...

    You can use software to change the pitch but what you use depends on what you want it to do. I'm not familiar with Acid Pro, if it has a pitch-shifting feature then it might give the option to transpose by semitones rather than by a percentage, so you would change by -2 to get to F minor or +2 to get to A minor. Or possibly it might ask you to define the "root" of the sample (the original key - in this case G) and allow you to transpose from there. What you do will depend on your needs and on the software you have access to. If this sample forms the basis of the piece of music you are writing you may be as well off leaving it be and writing the rest of the tune to fit around it.


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