Fixed Charge Offense letter with incorrect details?

dmohalloran

Hi,
I hope this is the right place to post this. If not Sorry.

I received a letter today from the Garda Siochana. It alleges that I parked in a bus lane last December. The details that it provides are incorrect, I was not parked in the bus lane at the time stated, but I was some 4 hours later (which is still an offence). My question is, if the details of the offence are incorrect in the letter, is it possible for the charge to be dropped? Or should I just pay the 40 euro fine?

Thanks

craichoe

I think its less hassle to pay the 40 euro ... I don't think anyone on boards can give you a definitive answer.

dmohalloran

i agree, but my friend reckons I should challenge it. I'm more inclined to pay and just forget about it. If it was penalty points i would be more likely to challenge.

Thanks.

Ta me anseo

If you pay the 40 euro it will all be over in a few seconds.

If you want the charges dropped, my understanding is you will need a day in court which may take weeks to arrange. The judge on the day could tell you to feck off and pay the fine anyway.

I know which one I would choose!!:rolleyes:

cashmni1

craichoe wrote: »

I think its less hassle to pay the 40 euro ... I don't think anyone on boards can give you a definitive answer.

And why is that then? Are you speaking for everyone who looks at this web site?

Anyway, OP, by the time you finish with the guards, the time and money you would have spent trying to persuade a court (if it came to that), that you were there 4 hours later than stated on the ticket, it would have been easier to pay teh €40. IMHO.

craichoe

cashmni1 wrote: »

And why is that then? Are you speaking for everyone who looks at this web site?

Anyway, OP, by the time you finish with the guards, the time and money you would have spent trying to persuade a court (if it came to that), that you were there 4 hours later than stated on the ticket, it would have been easier to pay teh €40. IMHO.

Because its a legal matter that only a Judge could answer definitively, even then one of his colleagues might have a different view on the matter.

Judge Patwell ... is that you !!

Someone on boards could give an opinion, but theres no guarantee it would be right.

cashmni1

craichoe wrote: »

Because its a legal matter that only a Judge could answer definitively, even then one of his colleagues might have a different view on the matter.

Judge Patwell ... is that you !!

Someone on boards could give an opinion, but theres no guarantee it would be right.

Point taken, but this applies to all of the replies to all posts then, doesn't it?....

And no, sorry to dissapoint, not a judge.

GoneShootin

craichoe wrote: »

Judge Patwell ... is that you !!

I hear that! But last year he threw out loads of these kind of cases because of incorrect details such as this. Now if it was speeding which is a pet hate of his, I doubt any technicality would get you off lightly.

galwaytt

I dunno, I think you're making it too complicated, and it's important that us motorists don't get herded down the road the UK has gone, where people are badgered and harassed into paying for things that are blatantly incorrect.

If you can easily prove, by record of being somewhere else - work, etc, then all you have to do on the day is say, sorry, this ticket isn't for me, as I was clearly at 'x' instead, and here's the proof/record.

It's important you wouldn't allude to being there later, though.........;)

Esel

Is it possible that the Garda might actually have been off duty at the time which the offence is supposed to have occurred? What times are we talking about?

Ta me anseo

Just my own personal opinion. This country is turning into a carbon copy of so many other places like the UK and USA. The fact that someone committed an offence is irrelevant if they can find a legal method of invalidating the charge. They seem to somehow become a saint again once the charge is dropped.

To the OP:

You parked in a bus lane which is illegal. You know you shouldn't have done it. They want you to pay a nominal fine for doing so. In all fairness, you would spend more money on a night out than they're asking for.

If they wanted a few grand and 12 penalty points then I could understand your concerns, but for f***s sake will ya not just do the right thing and pay the 40 euro and not waste some courts time trying to argue that you are actually guilty but still above the law and shouldn't have to pay a fine because some admin girl in a Garda shop got the paperwork wrong?

Surely, your time, effort and even pride are worth something to you? I would feel they should be worth more than 40 bleedin' quid!

niceirishfella

dmohalloran wrote: »

i agree, but my friend reckons I should challenge it. I'm more inclined to pay and just forget about it. If it was penalty points i would be more likely to challenge.

Thanks.

Challenge it..............you live in a democracy and its your right to challenge this fine if the details as incorrect. If you lose the challenge, pay the 40quid. Big Deal................

Ta me anseo

niceirishfella wrote: »

Challenge it..............you live in a democracy and its your right to challenge this fine if the details as incorrect. If you lose the challenge, pay the 40quid. Big Deal................

What's the democracy thing got to do with it? Jaysus lads, more and more like yanks every day! (I'm one by the way so don't take offence!)

JUDGE: So it says here you shot him dead?

DEFENDANT: No, I stabbed him with a kitchen knife.

JUDGE: Oh well, in that case, you're free to go.

40 bleedin euro! That's just 20 quick picks with Lotto Plus. 8 pints in town. Two thirds of the cheapest tyre you can put on your car. 33 litres of petrol. 4 haircuts for a bloke or a wash and blow dry for a girl. Not even one months VHI subscription. Ya couldn't even buy the Times for a month with 40 quid. It's nothing at all. Surely it can't be worth going to court for???

niceirishfella

Ta me anseo wrote: »

What's the democracy thing got to do with it? Jaysus lads, more and more like yanks every day! (I'm one by the way so don't take offence!)

JUDGE: So it says here you shot him dead?

DEFENDANT: No, I stabbed him with a kitchen knife.

JUDGE: Oh well, in that case, you're free to go.

40 bleedin euro! That's just 20 quick picks with Lotto Plus. 8 pints in town. Two thirds of the cheapest tyre you can put on your car. 33 litres of petrol. 4 haircuts for a bloke or a wash and blow dry for a girl. Not even one months VHI subscription. Ya couldn't even buy the Times for a month with 40 quid. It's nothing at all. Surely it can't be worth going to court for???

Living in a democracy is where you have freedom of speech and freedom to challenge stuff like incorrect parking tickets. I'm not out here to make a political stance and i'm not going to lock horns with you on your comment re;my comment.
ohhhhhhhhh, and in a democracy you also have free speech like on Boards.ie, which i value........and Am entitled to.

Ta me anseo

Ah sure I know. I'm only having a larf. No offence intended. It just that the freedom of speech and right to challenge argument always clouds the facts. He broke the law, admits he did, and got a teeny tiny slap on the wrist in the form of a 40 quid fine. Morally, he should just pay the fuppin thing and be done with it. However, the democratic argument removes the need for pride and strength of character.

If we were talking about a 5,000 euro fine, a month in prison or a revoked licence, even I would admit that my principles can take a back seat and I'll fight this all the way. But it's just 40 measly euro!

Ah sure, my soap box is ruined now that I've been standing on it for this long. I've got a sore neck from looking down along my nose at you also. I think I'll go take a break and regain some perspective.

See yis!

craichoe

See ... this is what i'm talking about ..

1. If you pay it .. Job done .. hassle over ..

2. If you follow the advise of someone to not pay it .. you may or may not get off with it.

Sure they don't really care anyway .. its not their problem

Blitzkrieger

If you got a fine for saying you were parked in a bus lane at 4pm, but you weren't parked in a bus lane at 4pm, would you pay it? The fact that you were parked there at 8pm is irrellevant.

That said if the fine doesn't come with penalty points for parking or if I couldn't easily prove I was somewhere else, I'd just pay the fine.

Dub6Kevin

If the fixed chatrge notice is incorrect it is invalid. You therefore, can challenge it. As others have said you might decide it is not worth it.

I would advise you to write to the Superintendent in charge of the station which issued the ticket and simply state that you were not parked in that place at that time on that date in that vehicle and that an error has been made. Ask them to investigate and send it off. Do this well before the time limit on the notice.

About a week before the fine is due to be paid call the Superintendent's office and ask what progress has been made. You'll probably find that they have cancelled the order (I have in the past). If not, you still have time to pay the fine without it escalating.

It's up to you but I think it's worth the price of a stamp and ten minutes typing up a letter to save €40.

The Muppet

craichoe wrote: »

See ... this is what i'm talking about ..

1. If you pay it .. Job done .. hassle over ..

2. If you follow the advise of someone to not pay it .. you may or may not get off with it.

Sure they don't really care anyway .. its not their problem

But he is not guilty of the offence as charged, why should he pay it ? If he can pove he was elsewhere at the time of the offence he will get off.

That said It may cost him more that the fixed fine to turn up and prove his innocence but It's not his fault someone messed up.

DonJose

The Muppet wrote: »

But he is not guilty of the offence as charged, why should he pay it ? If he can pove he was elsewhere at the time of the offence he will get off.

The poster admitted he was parked in the bus lane, I'm sure thats where the ticket was issued. Sounds like the guard made a mistake with the time which he can correct in court.

jhegarty

Ta me anseo wrote: »

Just my own personal opinion. This country is turning into a carbon copy of so many other places like the UK and USA. The fact that someone committed an offence is irrelevant if they can find a legal method of invalidating the charge. They seem to somehow become a saint again once the charge is dropped.

To the OP:

You parked in a bus lane which is illegal. You know you shouldn't have done it. They want you to pay a nominal fine for doing so. In all fairness, you would spend more money on a night out than they're asking for.

If they wanted a few grand and 12 penalty points then I could understand your concerns, but for f***s sake will ya not just do the right thing and pay the 40 euro and not waste some courts time trying to argue that you are actually guilty but still above the law and shouldn't have to pay a fine because some admin girl in a Garda shop got the paperwork wrong?

Surely, your time, effort and even pride are worth something to you? I would feel they should be worth more than 40 bleedin' quid!

So if you got a speeding fine saying you were doing 110kph in kerry today (and you were not)... you would pay the fine because you did break the speed limit once 6 months ago ?

cantdecide

Dullest thread ever Could only manage half.

FFS OP, stay outta them buslanes unless you're a bus and don't start puckering just cos of an admin error:rolleyes:

Ta me anseo

jhegarty wrote: »

So if you got a speeding fine saying you were doing 110kph in kerry today (and you were not)... you would pay the fine because you did break the speed limit once 6 months ago ?

Ah sure that's hardly the same thing ya big eejit!!! :rolleyes: See, this is what I'm talking about. Take the argument to the edge of reason just so you can make yourself look less quilty.

If I was caught speeding and the guard took my details and then the fine came in the door with the wrong date on it, I would pay it. I shouldn't have done it but did anyway and he caught me fair and square. Just because some gob****e put it into the computer the wrong way round doesn't give me the right (morally, not legally) to pretend I'm actually innocent and shouldn't have to pay up.

Must agree with cantdecide though. This really is dull. OP just pay up and put us all out of our misery.

DonJose

jhegarty wrote: »

So if you got a speeding fine saying you were doing 110kph in kerry today (and you were not)... you would pay the fine because you did break the speed limit once 6 months ago ?

FFS the OP admitted he was in the bus lane, just the time on the fixed notice was different/wrong.

Blitzkrieger

Ta me anseo wrote: »

Take the argument to the edge of reason just so you can make yourself look less quilty.

I hate looking *quilty......
















* I know it's bad manners to point out typos but I'm really bored and I couldn't help myself.

Ta me anseo

Ah for f**ks sake! How did that happen?

I meant quilty, not guilty. You know, like all squashy and comfortable like a git with no conscience. Em.......

(Exit stage right......):cool:

mick.fr

Guys, because the time is wrong, the ticket is legally nil. End of story.
You won't be charged and the ticket will be canceled.
Up to you to look for the steps.

Ta me anseo

mick.fr wrote: »

Guys, because the time is wrong, the ticket is legally nil. End of story.
You won't be charged and the ticket will be canceled.
Up to you to look for the steps.

As long as you have decent proof that it is actually wrong.