Paypal Europe - can I take to small claims ?

mirwillbeback

Hi all,
I am having a nightmare with paypal, the company that manages funds transactions on ebay.
My issue all stems from November when i set up an account. As I didnt have a credit card, I had to send identification to show who I was and bank account details I sent by registered post ( which they lost ) and had to resend five times by fax before they could locate. I've made about 70 phone calls and sent approx 25 emails and just keep getting fobbed off.
The issue is that by not upgraing my account to " verified " re ID, I have missed out on business opportunities and their lack of respect and assistance has been appalling. I rang the Financial Ombudsman but they advise they cannot get involved.
Is there any advice you can give me?
Thanks

Beano

Are you a business? Small Claims Court can only be used by individuals.

axer

mirwillbeback wrote: »

Hi all,
I am having a nightmare with paypal, the company that manages funds transactions on ebay.
My issue all stems from November when i set up an account. As I didnt have a credit card, I had to send identification to show who I was and bank account details I sent by registered post ( which they lost ) and had to resend five times by fax before they could locate. I've made about 70 phone calls and sent approx 25 emails and just keep getting fobbed off.
The issue is that by not upgraing my account to " verified " re ID, I have missed out on business opportunities and their lack of respect and assistance has been appalling. I rang the Financial Ombudsman but they advise they cannot get involved.
Is there any advice you can give me?
Thanks

on what grounds are you taking them to the small claims court. Maybe you should just work on getting a credit card instead.

jor el

mirwillbeback wrote: »

The issue is that by not upgraing my account to " verified " re ID, I have missed out on business opportunities and their lack of respect and assistance has been appalling. I rang the Financial Ombudsman but they advise they cannot get involved.
Is there any advice you can give me?
Thanks

You've potentially lost possible business opportunities, at the most. None of this is really Paypal's fault though, their security procedures are in place for good reasons. The financial ombudsman won't get involved as Paypal are not a financial institute. The Small Claims Court would be of no use to you, as you're not looking for your money back on something purchased.

Perhaps If you're setting up as an online retailer you should consider Google Checkout for payment processing, or one of the many others.

Cabaal

Good luck with this one, Paypal might have lost stuff but you certainly won't get anywhere with them in small cliams or otherwise....the fact your a mentioning business opportunitys puts small claims out the window as it suggests your a business.

Your looking for money on something you havn';t invested money into, good luck!

I'd suggest you get a credit card and move on,

eth0_

jor el wrote: »

The financial ombudsman won't get involved as Paypal are not a financial institute.

But I thought Paypal were now officially a bank? Surely they should be regulated as such in Ireland?


OP - get a credit card. Even try wirecard.com if you are worried about getting into debt.

miju

how do you know you lost business and furthermore how is it paypals fault? i ask because it's relevant to your complaint.

mirwillbeback

hi,
just to explain myself a bit better.
I've an ebay account, I'm not a business but was buying some products in normal shops and auctioning on ebay. On some I made a profit, on some a loss. But in genereal I was making a decent sized profit after selling them.
Anyways, the credit card I had originally assigned to the account was " disabled " as it expired in May 07. The new card was exactly the same number but with and expiry in 2010. Despite this being explained to paypal, they claimed there was nothing they could do.
It was suggested that to verify I was genuinely the holder of the bank account details listed, I send in photo id, utility bill, bank statement which I duly did, and by registered post. We proved it was received and signed for but the lost it ( which leaves me wide open to identity fraud in the wrong hands ).
We asked could we courier the docs to them, but they would ony give a PO Box, as " they couldnt reveal where their offices are ".
On and on it went, I sent a fax which they received 4 weeks ago and marked urgent to ensure a rapid response but all the while my money will not be released as limits apply to " unverified accounts ". I'm not rich, and 1,300 makes a big shortfall. Add to lost opportunities to purchase on ebay, I had to borrow money for xmas and just cannot get my money which I am entitled to.
If there's nothing I can do, but I would have imagined there is some regualtion of these firms - or do I just write off my account as being unattainable.
And yes, I know I could get another credit card, but that will take approx 1month to getm another to get the paypal code billed to, and all the while I am being told " this wil be sorted in 3-5 days by some idiot who is almost sneering back at me.
Any advice is appreciated.

leeroybrown

This sounds plain weird - when your credit card expires you should get an e-mail from Paypal about it (along with cancellation notices for any subscriptions) at which point you can re-add your new card online with the same number but a new expiry date. No drama, no hassle and about 5 minutes work. It's always worked for me.

That said, regardless of whose fault the problem was I don't think you'll get anywhere with this.

axer

Anyways, the credit card I had originally assigned to the account was " disabled " as it expired in May 07. The new card was exactly the same number but with and expiry in 2010. Despite this being explained to paypal, they claimed there was nothing they could do.

I have had credit cards disabled due to being out of date but I just updated the details and everything was fine.

mirwillbeback wrote: »

I'm not a business

mirwillbeback wrote: »

was buying some products in normal shops and auctioning on ebay

mirwillbeback wrote: »

On some I made a profit, on some a loss. But in genereal I was making a decent sized profit after selling them.

The first statement and the second two statements totally contradict each other.

Here is what Wikipedia considers to be a business:

In economics, a business is a legally recognized organizational entity existing within an economically free country designed to sell goods and/or services to consumers or other businesses, usually in an effort to generate profit.

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, I would call it a duck.

Your only option here is to either fix the problem yourself (by updating your details or getting a credit card) or attempt sue them via the courts which in my opinion would be the equivalent of lighting a cara match and placing it under a whole pile of euro notes (except the burning of euro notes is illegal of course). I would go with the former option.

miju

can you login in to your Paypal account as normal with your username as password?

Your account does not need to verified or have an active credit card in order for you to add a bank account and withdraw it that way

ztoical

mirwillbeback wrote: »

hi,
just to explain myself a bit better.
I've an ebay account, I'm not a business but was buying some products in normal shops and auctioning on ebay. On some I made a profit, on some a loss. But in genereal I was making a decent sized profit after selling them.
Anyways, the credit card I had originally assigned to the account was " disabled " as it expired in May 07. The new card was exactly the same number but with and expiry in 2010. Despite this being explained to paypal, they claimed there was nothing they could do.
It was suggested that to verify I was genuinely the holder of the bank account details listed, I send in photo id, utility bill, bank statement which I duly did, and by registered post. We proved it was received and signed for but the lost it ( which leaves me wide open to identity fraud in the wrong hands ).
We asked could we courier the docs to them, but they would ony give a PO Box, as " they couldnt reveal where their offices are ".
On and on it went, I sent a fax which they received 4 weeks ago and marked urgent to ensure a rapid response but all the while my money will not be released as limits apply to " unverified accounts ". I'm not rich, and 1,300 makes a big shortfall. Add to lost opportunities to purchase on ebay, I had to borrow money for xmas and just cannot get my money which I am entitled to.
If there's nothing I can do, but I would have imagined there is some regualtion of these firms - or do I just write off my account as being unattainable.
And yes, I know I could get another credit card, but that will take approx 1month to getm another to get the paypal code billed to, and all the while I am being told " this wil be sorted in 3-5 days by some idiot who is almost sneering back at me.
Any advice is appreciated.

some details don't add up - in your first post you said you went to set up the account in November and due to not having a credit card they asked for you to verify yourself via your bank a/c. Now your saying you already have an account with them and a credit card but its expired in May.

Isn't one Paypal's european office in Dublin?

If your using the internet so much why don't you have online banking? My paypal code showed up on my online statment within a day.

jor el

mirwillbeback wrote: »

hi,
just to explain myself a bit better.
I've an ebay account, I'm not a business but was buying some products in normal shops and auctioning on ebay. On some I made a profit, on some a loss. But in genereal I was making a decent sized profit after selling them.
Anyways, the credit card I had originally assigned to the account was " disabled " as it expired in May 07. The new card was exactly the same number but with and expiry in 2010.

I'm confused now. Is it a Paypal account or eBay account that you had set up with the original card that expired in May? You then got a new card, so why not use this card on your Paypal account and verify it in the normal way.

I'm guessing that you had an eBay account and were selling items and accepting payment to an unverified Paypal account. Now you want to get the money, but Paypal won't release the funds until the account is verified, which is fair enough. So, if you have a currently valid card, why can't you use this on your Paypal account?

Senna

[QUOTE=miju;54825119
add a bank account and withdraw it that way[/QUOTE]

This would be an easy solution, you may lose a few €'s in charges, but you'd have your money in a couple of days. Have you tried this?

MOH

axer wrote: »

The first statement and the second two statements totally contradict each other.

Here is what Wikipedia considers to be a business:


If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, I would call it a duck.

.

Huh? He's not a business, he's a private individual trading on ebay. Even by your wikipedia definition, he's not a "legally recognized organizational entity".

@OP: I'm still a bit confused - are you saying paypal have 1300 quid belong to you which they won't release?!

mirwillbeback

MOH wrote: »

Huh? He's not a business, he's a private individual trading on ebay. Even by your wikipedia definition, he's not a "legally recognized organizational entity".

@OP: I'm still a bit confused - are you saying paypal have 1300 quid belong to you which they won't release?!

absolutely mate, as i have exceeded the amount allowed by an unverified customer.
what can i do?

ztoical

still confused by alot of details - were did you post stuff to? what coutry? sounds a bit odd that its a PO Box address, can you send a reg letter to a PO Box? Are you sure your not getting scammed by some one phishing?

miju

mirwillbeback wrote: »

absolutely mate, as i have exceeded the amount allowed by an unverified customer.
what can i do?

theres a very , very easy way to circumvent these limits use your imagination.

have to agree something sounds odd here the fact a company gives you a PO Box to send their details to especially when its easily found on their website

axer

MOH wrote: »

Huh? He's not a business, he's a private individual trading on ebay. Even by your wikipedia definition, he's not a "legally recognized organizational entity".

This guy is making money by reselling items - that is a business whichever way you look at it. The small claims court is for consumers thus it cannot be used by a business such as the OP's. I also see that the OP has used the word "we" a number of times (not that it matters as the OP would be still operating as a business) which also suggests its not just him involved.

miju: I think the OP is talking about paypal's address not ebay's.

miju

indeed he was momentary lapse there Paypals address seems to be a bit harder to track down alright

jor el

Go to www.cro.ie and search for Paypal Europe
You get the following:
Name: PAYPAL EUROPE SERVICES LIMITED

Address: UNIT 6 BLANCHARDSTOWN CORPORATE PARK DUBLIN 15

mirwillbeback

jor el wrote: »

Go to www.cro.ie and search for Paypal Europe
You get the following:
Name: PAYPAL EUROPE SERVICES LIMITED

Address: UNIT 6 BLANCHARDSTOWN CORPORATE PARK DUBLIN 15

thanks mate, might go out with flame thrower ( relax mods, i jest )

only address they can give you is a po box number. when we ( me and girlfriend, not some multinational ) offered to have docs couriered to them, the head of UK / ROI resolutions said that " i cant reveal where we work, i can only give you a po box number " - we explained that our documents had already been signed for at that po box number and that we wanted to be able to hand deliver. he couldnt though.

so basically, I have 1300 belonging to me I cannot get until they update my account with documents 1 ) they lost three times when sent by fax 2 ) the lost once when registered post was sent, delivered and signed for and 3) they confirm they have received since 17.12 and which will take 3-5 days to process.

surely they have some organisation to answer to in these circumstances. and as it is me and the gf, can we not take them to small claims court?

ztoical

mirwillbeback wrote: »

so basically, I have 1300 belonging to me I cannot get until they update my account with documents 1 ) they lost three times when sent by fax 2 ) the lost once when registered post was sent, delivered and signed for and 3) they confirm they have received since 17.12 and which will take 3-5 days to process.

surely they have some organisation to answer to in these circumstances. and as it is me and the gf, can we not take them to small claims court?

There's still alot of details that are unclear. Did they say why your new credit card hadn't updated thus making your account unverified? I've used paypal for years and always found them very helpful. WIth online banking I could check my credit card statement and had my paypal code in one day and I added my bank account by just filling it all in online, did they say why they needed hard copies of your details? Was there some reason to suspect it wasn't your account?

Fenster

It doesn't make sense that they wouldn't give out an address when it's easily found...

mirwillbeback

ztoical wrote: »

There's still alot of details that are unclear. Did they say why your new credit card hadn't updated thus making your account unverified? I've used paypal for years and always found them very helpful. WIth online banking I could check my credit card statement and had my paypal code in one day and I added my bank account by just filling it all in online, did they say why they needed hard copies of your details? Was there some reason to suspect it wasn't your account?

The thing is, I had a paypal account which i used for ONE purchase in 2006. The credit card attached to that account expired in May 07. Since then, I have tried to update / add the new credit card ( same number, diff expiry date ) but it keeps saying the card has been disabled. I can't even get to add the card to allow me get the four digit number to be verified!
The simple answer I know is to get a new credit card, but why should I?

Does anyone know who paypal report to?

axer

mirwillbeback wrote: »

The thing is, I had a paypal account which i used for ONE purchase in 2006. The credit card attached to that account expired in May 07. Since then, I have tried to update / add the new credit card ( same number, diff expiry date ) but it keeps saying the card has been disabled. I can't even get to add the card to allow me get the four digit number to be verified!
The simple answer I know is to get a new credit card, but why should I?

Does anyone know who paypal report to?

Have you tried removing the card and then adding it back again?

ztoical

mirwillbeback wrote: »

The thing is, I had a paypal account which i used for ONE purchase in 2006. The credit card attached to that account expired in May 07. Since then, I have tried to update / add the new credit card ( same number, diff expiry date ) but it keeps saying the card has been disabled. I can't even get to add the card to allow me get the four digit number to be verified!
The simple answer I know is to get a new credit card, but why should I?

Does anyone know who paypal report to?

From the sound of your post you've been selling a few items via ebay - how have you been accepting payment up until now?

You can add your bank account via the paypal website - i don't understand why they asked you to send them hardcopies. Paypal usually do everything via their website and its hard to email directly let alone call them - how long were you dealing with them via the website before they told you to post the information?

Also if you are told your credit card is disabled its usual something to do with the credit card comapny, have you contacted them to check if theres anything wrong with the account?

macboy

I'm fighting the same battle right now. I was told to get a new credit card number which is fine for them to ask but do they really expect me to call the insurance company, the utility company, the magazine subscription company, the health plan company, the doggie day care......you see where I'm going? I CANNOT disprupt my life like this just so I can use PayPal for instant Payments!

Oh, and the credit card was NEVER used to complete transactions - it was ONLY there to guarantee the account so I could send instant payments. I received an email from them prior to the expiration, did a quick Google and all reports said it was scam mail. Further, this credit card has gone through one expiry / re-enabling cycle since I started using PayPal.

I started this yesterday and received a form mail in response (as verified by others going through this issue). I know am waiting on hold for a person to answer......has anyone successfully fought this battle and got the old number back in use?

Savman

Is that you back with a different username then or what? This whole story sounds very wishy washy, I've been using Paypal for about 3-4yrs for instant payments, transferring to Irish bank accounts and I don't think the process could be any simpler.

You exceeded their limits for the type of account you have, it's not like they want to charge you money to upgrade your account, they just want information which shouldn't be too big an ask from anyone supposedly trading regularly on Ebay. Forget your Small Claims Court rubbish, get your own affairs in order and I assure you the Paypal mystery will unravel itself much easier.

koHd

Savman wrote: »

Is that you back with a different username then or what? This whole story sounds very wishy washy, I've been using Paypal for about 3-4yrs for instant payments, transferring to Irish bank accounts and I don't think the process could be any simpler.

You exceeded their limits for the type of account you have, it's not like they want to charge you money to upgrade your account, they just want information which shouldn't be too big an ask from anyone supposedly trading regularly on Ebay. Forget your Small Claims Court rubbish, get your own affairs in order and I assure you the Paypal mystery will unravel itself much easier.

You know nothing.

Mr. Presentable

The Small Claims Court is not for this kind of dispute and, if memory serves, is limited to €1000.00, not enough for your claim. Also, you are effectively operating a business and thus disqualified from the SCC.

Thing is, if you go to court be prepared to have your tax affairs examined. Are you paying VAT/income tax on your Ebay sales/earnings?

Persist with a conciliatory dialogue with Paypal and it will be sorted out.