42% of new car buyers will wait until July to buy

DonJose

January won't be a busy month for car dealers!!!

"A new survey reveals that 42% of people who plan to buy a car this year will wait until the new vehicle registration tax (VRT) and motor tax regulations take effect in July.

The survey from National Irish Bank - and conducted by iReach - also shows that motorists are getting ready to move towards more energy efficient cars, such as those powered by diesel.

72% of those surveyed said that after the introduction of the new regulations, they are likely to, or will definitely consider buying a diesel car rather than a petrol car."

"It also reveals that 71% spend less than €20,000 on their purchase"

http://www.rte.ie/business/2008/0108/cars.html

mike65

If that holds the governments revenue stream will be hit hard for much of the year.

t also shows that engine size remains a factor for potential buyers with 82% stating that the largest engine size they would consider buying would be between 1,000cc and 1,900cc.

No change there then.

Mike.

E92

When people realise that larger engines actually only pollute a little more CO2 than a smaller one they might change their minds, and the person who thinks 70% of Germans buy diesel cars should be shot. The statistics on Auto, Motor und Sport for the period Jan-Sept 2007 show that 47% of German cars were bought as diesel in that period. (I also have a copy of the magazine that showed that 49% of new cars registered in Jan 07 there were diesel)

And 26% of new cars sold were oil burners in 2006, even in Ireland!

France and Italy are up to 70% diesel though. Germany is well behind them!

As for people not buying, I've never seen so many new reg cars this early in the year before!

RTÉ were saying only recently that sales were up by around 10% compared to the same time last year.

unkel

DonJose wrote: »

"It also reveals that 71% spend less than €20,000 on their purchase"

Oh dear, that's depressing! These are the only cars that have starting prices of under €20k:

CHEVROLET Aveo
CHEVROLET Kalos
CHEVROLET Lacetti
CHEVROLET Matiz
CHEVROLET Tacuma
CITROEN Berlingo
CITROEN C1
CITROEN C2
CITROEN C3
CITROEN C4
DAIHATSU Charade
DAIHATSU Copen
DAIHATSU Sirion
FIAT Bravo
FIAT Doblo
FIAT Panda
FIAT Grande Punto
FORD Fiesta
FORD Focus
FORD Fusion
FORD Ka
HONDA Jazz
HYUNDAI Accent
HYUNDAI Atos
HYUNDAI Getz
HYUNDAI i30
KIA cee'd
KIA Picanto
KIA Rio
MAZDA Mazda2
MAZDA Mazda3
MITSUBISHI Colt
NISSAN Micra
NISSAN Note
OPEL Corsa
OPEL Meriva
PEUGEOT 107
PEUGEOT 207
RENAULT Clio Campus
RENAULT Clio III
RENAULT KANGOO
RENAULT MODUS
RENAULT Twingo
SEAT Altea
SEAT Cordoba
SEAT Ibiza
SKODA Fabia
SKODA Octavia
SKODA Octavia Tour
SKODA Roomster
SUBARU Justy
SUZUKI Jimny
SUZUKI Swift
SUZUKI SX4
TOYOTA Aygo
TOYOTA Yaris
VOLKSWAGEN Polo

E92

I presume what they meant unkel is that including the money gotten for the part exchange, the total cost to change is less than €20k for 71% of buyers, and that is a frightening statistic, because it shows how much cars lose value here.

MarkN

I sort of figured cost of change to be that 20k myself too when I heard the report.

Quite an arrogant quote from dealers though; "there's no point in waiting until July really"...?

Tell that to the person who is going to save thousands on VRT and a good few hundred on road tax!

DublinDilbert

I heard on the radio that fiat are offering a discount comparable to the VRT reduction on the grande punto.... although in the ad they call it a VRT discount..

The mad thing is that the people who buy these now with the 'fiat' discount will end up paying the much higher road tax for the rest of the cars life, then again does your average motorist care??

unkel

Yeah, probably the cost of change. But indeed judging by the large numbers of people that change car every 1, 2 or 3 years, that is some depreciation

E92

DublinDilbert wrote: »

I heard on the radio that fiat are offering a discount comparable to the VRT reduction on the grande punto.... although in the ad they call it a VRT discount..

The mad thing is that the people who buy these now with the 'fiat' discount will end up paying the much higher road tax for the rest of the cars life, then again does your average motorist care??

Of course the "saving" Fiat are offering you is NOT the full saving that is available.

See the VRT sticky, on page 9(or 10) I have an Excel file, telling you what the cars should be costing under the new system.

Of course, the cars are cheaper now than before, but Fiat are saying that they are passing on the VRT saving available now instead of in July with the Grande Punto.

JHMEG

mike65 wrote: »

If that holds the governments revenue stream will be hit hard for much of the year.

The govt has stated the new VRT system will be revenue neutral, meaning if it isn't bring in enough money they will up the rates enough to bring in more.

DonJose

JHMEG wrote: »

The govt has stated the new VRT system will be revenue neutral, meaning if it isn't bring in enough money they will up the rates enough to bring in more.

It wouldn't surprise if if those Green idiots also increased tax on fuel at a later date to compensate any revenue fall in VRT.

E92

JHMEG wrote: »

The govt has stated the new VRT system will be revenue neutral, meaning if it isn't bring in enough money they will up the rates enough to bring in more.

I'd say there will be an additional tax on diesels. There is no way the government are going to be happy about cars that use up to 30% less fuel, and accounting for an estimated 70% of sales starting from next year, so that instantly means a drop of 30% in fuel duty.

I actually am surprised they didn't do this in the first place tbh though.

I'd say something along the lines of the company car levy applied to diesels in the UK is a highly likely possibility.

E92

DonJose wrote: »

It wouldn't surprise if if those Green idiots also increased tax on fuel at a later date to compensate any revenue fall in VRT.

They are, thatys part of the Governments' plan for a Carbon tax.

But at the end of the day, most of us here would favour a fuel tax increase in return for a VRT decrease, not both of them obviously.

trellheim

Yep, upping fuel tax would have been the best way since it's a direct tax on consumption - i.e. you drive less, you pay less.

mike65

I was thinking about the VRT revenue not the fuel levy, though yes that will obviously fall if derv takes off.

Mike.

PGL

i am not up to speed with the changes to the VRT system - why will people wait until Jul to buy a car? will everyone not be affected regardless of when it kicks in? does VRT relate to buying a new car?

DonJose wrote: »

January won't be a busy month for car dealers!!!

"A new survey reveals that 42% of people who plan to buy a car this year will wait until the new vehicle registration tax (VRT) and motor tax regulations take effect in July.

The survey from National Irish Bank - and conducted by iReach - also shows that motorists are getting ready to move towards more energy efficient cars, such as those powered by diesel.

72% of those surveyed said that after the introduction of the new regulations, they are likely to, or will definitely consider buying a diesel car rather than a petrol car."

"It also reveals that 71% spend less than €20,000 on their purchase"

http://www.rte.ie/business/2008/0108/cars.html

E92

PGL wrote: »

i am not up to speed with the changes to the VRT system - why will people wait until Jul to buy a car? will everyone not be affected regardless of when it kicks in? does VRT relate to buying a new car?

Cause you can buy a diesel for much less then, and it will cost far less to tax, as well as doing as much as 30% more miles to a gallon than a petrol. And there are also plenty of low emissions petrols around the place too e.g. 1.4 Honda Civic, 139 g/km CO2, average fuel consumption of 47.9 mpg.

This only applies to anything registered(new and used) after July. Anything registered before July is the same as before.

leahcim

Quite an arrogant quote from dealers though; "there's no point in waiting until July really"...?

Tell that to the person who is going to save thousands on VRT and a good few hundred on road tax!

It may be arrogant, but he is probably correct. I would be very surprised if dealers pass on the VRT savings. Just wait, we will have a SIMI representative on the radio telling us how the the poor car dealers were selling cars at a near loss for the last few years, to compensate for Irish VRT. SIMI will probably use this as a justification for car dealers absorbing most of the VRT adjustment.

RedorDead

E92 wrote: »

RTÉ were saying only recently that sales were up by around 10% compared to the same time last year.

13.3% up on last January up until Saturday.

E92

leahcim wrote: »

It may be arrogant, but he is probably correct. I would be very surprised if dealers pass on the VRT savings. Just wait, we will have a SIMI representative on the radio telling us how the the poor car dealers were selling cars at a near loss for the last few years, to compensate for Irish VRT. SIMI will probably use this as a justification for car dealers absorbing most of the VRT adjustment.

Dealers have NOTHING to do with setting prices.

The importer decides what the price of the car will be.

The reasion why dealers want people to take their cars now is because having a car sitting there for 6 months is going to cost them money in terms of where to find space for it, insurance because there is more valuable stock there etc. And also getting a car going after 6 months lying idle is not just simply a case of charging the battery and the car now goes on it's merry way. The engine, brakes will all need to be tested to make sure they are working, and fluids etc may also need replacing after such a long period of a car doing nothing. That's the real reason why they want the cars to go now.

ninty9er

MarkN wrote: »

Quite an arrogant quote from dealers though; "there's no point in waiting until July really"...?

Tell that to the person who is going to save thousands on VRT and a good few hundred on road tax!

Road tax maybe, but dealers will surely adjust the trade in price of less desirable older models with higher road tax to compensate meaning the most you'll save in reality is the discount you can already hammer out of them.

Makes sense. They're not going to give you January's trade in price in July because the car may be cheaper new than what you could now sell it for!

rebel.ranter

I was sitting in traffic yesterday behind a 08-C-... 520d Sport. I was just thinking about how sick the owner must feel knowiung that his car is going to plummet in value once the post July '08 cars come on stream.

ninty9er

rebel.ranter wrote: »

I was sitting in traffic yesterday behind a 08-C-... 520d Sport. I was just thinking about how sick the owner must feel knowiung that his car is going to plummet in value once the post July '08 cars come on stream.

As in line with my above post, his car wil fall in value but the cost of change next year will differ only marginally = No financial loss unless it was a cash deal.

People buying for cash after July are the only people who are really going to save...and at that only if they have no car to begin with.

DonJose

rebel.ranter wrote: »

I was sitting in traffic yesterday behind a 08-C-... 520d Sport. I was just thinking about how sick the owner must feel knowiung that his car is going to plummet in value once the post July '08 cars come on stream.

If that BMW was an automatic it might actually be cheaper to buy now.

mike65

If he can afford 80 grand for such a car I won't shed any tears!

Mike.

leahcim

Dealers have NOTHING to do with setting prices.

The importer decides what the price of the car will be.

Dealers have everything to do with setting the prices.

I'm picking up a new car in two weeks and the dealer I bought it from was 600 euro cheaper than the next best, what is that other than setting the price.

The importer\distributor will get the car from the manufacturer and apply the VRT to whatever the value of the car is deemed to be. The dealer can then add whatever they want to this price as their margin.

In my opinion most of the VRT savings will be absorbed by the distributor and the dealer. The manufacturer may even take a little bit themselves.

I would speculate that the eventual purchaser of the car being the last person in the chain will get the smallest benefit from the VRT changes.

unkel

leahcim wrote: »

Dealers have everything to do with setting the prices.

I'm picking up a new car in two weeks and the dealer I bought it from was 600 euro cheaper than the next best, what is that other than setting the price

That's the discount off the price

leahcim wrote: »

I would speculate that the eventual purchaser of the car being the last person in the chain will get the smallest benefit from the VRT changes.

I would speculate the opposite. Where there are substantial savings to be had because of the new VRT regime, I expect these to be passed on to the consumer. In full.

Any brand that does not apply this, will be named and shamed on this forum...

leahcim

It was not a discount. It was the price I negotiated for the car.

If the price of milk in tesco is 5 cent less than the price in centra are tesco giving you a discount, no they are not, all they are doing is taking less of a profit from the product to make the sale.

It is the same with cars. When you ask for a new car price list from a main dealer this is just the opening price. They will have increased the price expecting the haggle. You are either haggling because you are doing an all cash deal or because you are trying to get a good deal on a trade in.

If what you were saying was true and all the dealers sell cars for the same price the motor industry would be operating a cartel, which is against the law. There is supposed to be competition between dealers.

Finally the list price of the car I bought was different (only by 25 euros) in both garages (volkswagen). I negotiated one down by 600 more than the other so I bought my car from them.

unkel

I don't disagree on the pricing. The distributor sets the RRP (recommended retail price) and the OMSP (open market selling price). The latter is lower and allows for discounts, and costs for getting the car on the road, etc. The latter is used for the VRT calculation

The consumer does the deal with the dealer. The actual price paid by the consumer could be whatever they agree, like you say.

I do disagree on where the saving goes in case of a lower VRT after 01/07/2008. You say little ends up with the consumer. I say most if not all ends up with the consumer.

leahcim

I hope you are right and the consumer gets most of the VRT change benefit.
The motorist has had nothing but increasing expenes, traffic congestion and continual road works for the last couple of years. We deserve a break.

Maybe I should have more faith in the of the car sales industry to play fair.

MarkN

leahcim whether you call it "the price you negotiated" or a discount, it's the same thing.

Main dealers go by list prices as in a BMW 520D will cost you the same in Joe Duffy in Dublin as in Capital Cars in Tullamore.

A Ford Focus will cost the same list price in Rialto Motors as it will across in South Dublin Ford.

Anything after that is the price you have managed to get for yourself!