What is it like? (App. Comp / Comp. Forensics)

jakedixon2004

I was expecting a job as something to do with computer/network security alright
Does anyone know if there is a work placement during the course
I would really love to learn how to programme in c or java but when i look at either of them it looks very hard .... I was able to learn python by myself but it is a very easy language to learn anyway

coadyj

dont worrie about c, nobody uses that anymore

If you can pick up python then java should be a breeze, But when you say you know it do you mean you have an understanding or could you tell me what a stack it?

I would think anyone who understood python should pick up java very quick.
p is a Object-Oriented language so is java. has all the same properties of java as in for, if, else, while

dlofnep

Programming looks tough at first glance because it's something new and the logic appears different to anything you've seen before.

But you'll be gradually edged in, so don't worry about it. You start with the complete basics and work your way up. Java is an easy language to learn and very intuitive. You just need to spend a little time with it. C is a little tougher.. the learning curve isn't that tougher, but you self manage memory and don't have OOB benefits. If you really want tough, wrap your head around ASM - but I'm sure assembly programmers will say the same thing to me

There are various areas of security that anyone can look at.

Network/System security. - As advertised.
Application security - requires strong programming ability.
Web security - Have an intricate understanding of various scripting languages and database flaws.

And so forth. IT sec is a broad field, but the best can cater to all fields. Freelance security experts can make a bomb. Network admins have secure jobs, with varying ranges of workloads. Web or Application testing is for the wicked! It's a tough field and you really have to be up to date with all common flaws and vulnerabilities and understand the intricacies of them.

Personally, I think Comp Forensics looks to be an amazing course and if I could turn back the clock, I'd probably do that instead of Multimedia. I think you'll enjoy it and the demand for those doing it is high. Go for it

stick-dan

appartently i asked some of them but they seem to be unaware largely of it at the moment probably because they are the first year class at the moment and the first to do the course since it was run independently.The comman concensus is that there is indeed work placement in computer forensics in third year but a quick look through the waterford it website will tell you exact what is entailed in the course.

jakedixon2004

What kind of stuff would u do in first year?
Also.. would there be people goin into this course not knowing how to turn on a computer:p and slowing up the show

Sully

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

What kind of stuff would u do in first year?

Which course? There both similar but have differences!

Also.. would there be people goin into this course not knowing how to turn on a computer:p and slowing up the show

I really would not recommend anybody with no experience of computers to go to this course - mainly the Applied Computing one. You will find it extremely difficult. The two courses are very similar as I said, and if you didn't know anything about PC (like turn it on) you would be holding yourself back and putting yourself under a lot of stress.

In such a case, I would do some sort of PC training course first to get you up to speed, and ask yourself is an IT Course really for you? Most people going to these courses have an interest in IT!

jakedixon2004

I was talkin about the Forensics course

stick-dan

Semester 1 of forensics as i know it but don't quote me consists of the following.

Physics - This module is ok if you like physics and consists of electromagnetism, energy,playing with lasers , sound physics.Vectors,scalars, distances and gravity.Was fun enough i enjoyed it and i don't like physics.

Programming - This is the introduction to the rest of your course,i.e java. Your enjoyment of this particular section depends on your lecturer. This years current crop of first years had a great lecturer whom i envy them because they had. This module requires alot of work so it does. Not to be put on the back burner till the last minute. If you find yourself struggling there are two helpful years of students above you so don't hesitate to ask us. You are required to complete at least one program construction project.

Maths - Again depends on the lecturer. Some people have their different opinions about the lecturers and it all depends on how well you want to do at maths. Mathematics is by no means hard and just completing the exercises on examples by the end of the week will go a great deal towards passing your exams.

Thinking and learning - Loved by most, hated by few. This is the subject that really has no significance in the course in my opinion but hey you gotta pass it! Basically is all about changing your way of thinking and all.Nothing at all to worry about by any means.Attendance would merit a pass.:)

Computer Essentials.- Brace yourself for this you learn all about how to use ms word, ms power point. You learn the difference between a mouse and a keyboard, etc. Is basically the basics of computers. Not hard.This is where you will get your "first" look into binary and how to add,subtract,divide it. Touts complement and all that. Not hard with basic study. This course this year coming will see the introduction of a new lecturer as the woman that was teaching it is gone to Canada on work experience. Structure may change.

Introduction to forensics.- If it is anything like i am doing now you will be looking at encryption in small detail, maintaining a site of current breakthroughs in forensics,yup make your own site for this, looking at CSI surveys, etc. But this may be second semester for you as the current first years only started most of that this semester. looking into the history of the forensics will be the most likely curriculum.

_______________________________________________________________

As for will there be basic people in the class holding you back you'll always find that there is and that about two weeks of every semester at the start is dedicated to a common grounding in the subject so as to speak.You may have to watch out for people who think they know it all but no nothing at all except for a few nifty keyboard short-cuts that temporarily WOW you.

_______________________________________________________________

Hope that helps, Don't take it as gospel though.

jakedixon2004

Thanks a million man ..this is loads of help
I cant wait to get the leaving over and done with so i can get crackin on this course.
Is there a computer club or Society in the college

stick-dan

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

Thanks a million man ..this is loads of help
I cant wait to get the leaving over and done with so i can get crackin on this course.
Is there a computer club or Society in the college

Not really any society there this year lad.There was a gaming society in the college up to last year but it for some reason was not continued this year although two lads in our class were going to restart it but one of them quit the course . There is definitely interest from some of this years first years and some second years so odds are it will be up and running again next year.It was the Wit gamers society or something like that and i think they organised lans and the like or so i believe. Trust me there are plenty of people in the course who like to do that stuff in their spare time unlike us normal students who have work to do. pm me if you have any questions.

Sully

Can we keep questions to the public forum, as they may be of use to others with similar questions. More private questions, or something you would prefer not to discuss - feel free to PM Dan.

But for this type of convo, lets stick to the thread as much as possible.

stick-dan

haha noted sully

although i dn't like what you're hinting at...

Sully

Well if you guys want to swap numbers, I wont object

jakedixon2004

ha ha very funny lads
Thanks for all the info and i hope that the gamer soc. starts up again

stick-dan

A wee bit off topic there now sully wasn't that not to mention HIGHLY INAPPROPRIATE....lol..Stay on topic from now on mr.moderator.:P

Yeah there should be no problem getting the society to start again, The lads there this year will probably start it up. OH and if you are big into gaming and programming you will be given the opportunity to represent the college in a contest called robocode where you preogram a robot to be a killing machine. It's a fun contest. This years and last years lads seem to have enjoyed it.Good prizes too. Lots of money and a laptop(top class one too.). Not trying to sell the course to you or anything lol

jakedixon2004

I really just want to get started on this course i cant wait

stick-dan

Haha Steady on there

If you're this excited about the course, You'll fit in no bother!

Sully

Iv updated the topic title to reflect the discussion. Iv asked one of the 1st year Forensic Students to give me an idea of their course. Should know later what they think, and what material they are planning on covering.

Swindon

Lads do ye think there will be jobs in computer forensics for ye in ireland when ye finish the course?Would they not be mainly uk based...

Sully

Not as much, but I would assume the Guards and Banks would be interested

Swindon

not likely the guards think they only train up there own,banks prob...

blue-army

Sully wrote: »

Iv asked one of the 1st year Forensic Students to give me an idea of their course. Should know later what they think, and what material they are planning on covering.

any chance you could do the same with an Applied Computing student?

Sully

blue-army wrote: »

any chance you could do the same with an Applied Computing student?

You already have at least three.. me,stick-dan,coadyj.. ec18 does part of the course but not all. This thread should have lots of information, and I think there are other topics about the course.

Have you any questions?

Sully

Swindon wrote: »

not likely the guards think they only train up there own,banks prob...

We are living in Ireland, no public service has anything like that never mind a decent IT system! As far as I am aware, the jobs go up and you apply. They do that with photographers anyway.

jakedixon2004

I was thinking more along the line of a job with google maybe .... maybe not even in Ireland

Sully

Google have job placements in Ireland. I think they have a big office here..

stick-dan

Most of us here are people who are from the course and replying. so if you want information whoever was asking for the applied computing one, drop in more questions. Google have a massive office over here.Their European head quarters is in dublin.

And there are planty of jobs available in the sector what with...anti virus companies located in cork and limerick, names escape me now, dell,google themselves do security, Cisco in galway.

coadyj

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

I was thinking more along the line of a job with google maybe .... maybe not even in Ireland

You can do internship with google threw the college. I got one but didnt take it as it was more of a deskside support job then a programming role.

Google were intrested in my forensics stuff but not much. Although on of the questions i got was on RAID, which is covered in forensics although i dont know why. It was a queation on the paper this year.

coadyj

stick-dan wrote: »

Most of us here are people who are from the course and replying. so if you want information whoever was asking for the applied computing one, drop in more questions. Google have a massive office over here.Their European head quarters is in dublin.

And there are planty of jobs available in the sector what with...anti virus companies located in cork and limerick, names escape me now, dell,google themselves do security, Cisco in galway.

Ive heard its full to the brim of sexy Polish girls.

ec18

coadyj wrote: »

Ive heard its full to the brim of sexy Polish girls.

What is?

stick-dan

coadyj wrote: »

Ive heard its full to the brim of sexy Polish girls.

what?

coadyj

ec18 wrote: »

What is?

Poland,
jk google.

Sully

Right.. one of the girls in the course kindly provided me with some information.

This semester we are studying operating systems and introduction to computer forensics. Most of the lecturers are grand, I think that <paraphrase>two lecturers in particular in the course</paraphrase> are the most popular among us all. I think this is because they are not uptight and know how to have a laugh with us in class. I don't think anyone dreads going into their classes.

So far everyone seems to be enjoying the course,as the time moves, the course gets more interesting.

Here's a list of all the subjects studied during the course:

- Programming Fundamentals, (App Comp Forensics)
- Software Development Lifecycle, (App Comp Forensics)
- Computer Essentials, (App Comp Forensics)
- History & Ethics of Computer Forensics,
- Thinking and Learning Skills, (App Comp Forensics)
- Discrete Maths, (App Comp Forensics)
- Introduction to Computer Forensics,
- Computer Architecture, (App Comp Forensics)
- Operating Systems, (Applied Computing Students will do this, but not with Forensics and not until second year)
- Algorithms, (App Comp Forensics)
- Applied Calculus, (App Comp Forensics)
- Project Management & Communications, (App Comp Forensics)
- File System Forensics,
- Biological Authentication Systems,
- Legal Principles,
- Networks,
- Data Structures & Modelling,
- Mathematical Methods,
- Media Forensics,
- Forensic Accounting & Fraud Audit,
- Wireless Communications,
- Internet Application Development, (App Comp Forensics)
- Virtual Execution Environments,
- Statistics & Probability, (App Comp Forensics)
- Cryptography,
- Network Security,
- Mathematical Modelling,
- Internet Technologies, (App Comp Forensics)
- Distributed Systems (elective)
- Management Psychology (elective)
- Data Mining (elective)
- Network Forensics,
- Formal Specification,
- Artificial Intelligence,
- Criminal Evidence (elective)
- Intercultural Communications (elective)
- Network Management (elective)

Hope that helps.

Note 1: (App Comp Forensics) = Two courses sit the same subject together. To the best of my knowledge, thats most of them marked!

coadyj

who said that?

ec18

coadyj wrote: »

who said that?

I'm going to guess one of the emma's

Sully

Lets keep second names out, neither are Boards members and I dont know if they want to be named and shamed all over the net :P

jakedixon2004

Thanks for the info
What is discrete maths and Mathematical Modelling?

Sully

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

Thanks for the info
What is discrete maths and Mathematical Modelling?

Discrete Maths is a 1st year Semester 1 subject. stick-dan already gave an outline of this, as Forensic students sit in with Applied Computing students.

stick-dan wrote:

Maths in first year is ok. It is about differentiation, integration, complex numbers,sets,functions,enumeration,simpsons rule,logic,etc. Basically first year maths is like leaving certificate applied maths.Not too bad.It all depends on your lecturer. Some people have different view on the lecturers.

Cant recall Mathematical Modelling but ill try find it out.

Iv updated the list to show what topics are covered with App. Comp students to the best of my knowledge.

stick-dan

Sully wrote: »

Lets keep second names out, neither are Boards members and I dont know if they want to be named and shamed all over the net :P

I find your provided quote by one of the "girls" in the class in first year a little hard to believe and it is obvious which one it is by the quote aswell and the side of the course that it is coming from but i think it is a little misleading. In the quote the unuptightness of certain lecturers is mentioned in your provided quote but in my experience of the course and you know me sully i get on with most lecturers but the quote you provided is totally unsupported in that element. That is one persons point of view. In 2nd year opinions are vastly different of lecturers and also i know of students in first year who i have spoke to that would not support that girls quote. I just think it would be better to provide a quote that supports most of the classes point of view as a whole rather than a single opinion. Also of one of those lecturers mentioned which they really should not be by name on an open forum like this for obvious reasons one of them is newly positioned and subject to a job change most likely as that particular course he is teaching has rarely kept a stable lecturer. I just think it is false promoting the course by it's lecturers. Apologies for any offence caused. Just i feel a more hunaminous opinionated view would be better.:)

ec18

stick-dan wrote: »

In 2nd year opinions are vastly different of lecturers

That's cause lecturers seem to take a dislike to ye

Sully

stick-dan wrote: »

I find your provided quote by one of the "girls" in the class in first year a little hard to believe and it is obvious which one it is by the quote aswell and the side of the course that it is coming from but i think it is a little misleading.

I don't want to name names. You can guess amongst yourselves, but im not naming them on a public forum. Simple. What relevance does it have anyway?

In the quote the unuptightness of certain lecturers is mentioned in your provided quote but in my experience of the course and you know me sully i get on with most lecturers but the quote you provided is totally unsupported in that element. That is one persons point of view. In 2nd year opinions are vastly different of lecturers and also i know of students in first year who i have spoke to that would not support that girls quote. I just think it would be better to provide a quote that supports most of the classes point of view as a whole rather than a single opinion.

You never even had some of the named lecturers in that quote and neither did I. The girl is giving the opinion based on what her class feels, as per the quote. She mentioned a few good lecturers, not all. She never said the rest were ****e and nor did she say who was ****e. The comments were given as the class as a wholes opinion. I think your misunderstanding the quote completely.

Also of one of those lecturers mentioned which they really should not be by name on an open forum like this for obvious reasons one of them is newly positioned and subject to a job change most likely as that particular course he is teaching has rarely kept a stable lecturer. I just think it is false promoting the course by it's lecturers. Apologies for any offence caused. Just i feel a more hunaminous opinionated view would be better.:)

My year liked that lecturer you are referring to, and also the Physics course with ec18. The first years like him also. If you feel that your class doesn't, fair enough. Not everyone is going to like every lecturer! The large majority of people we know don't agree with your statement. Your more then welcome to give reasons why you don't like lecturers but probably not best to name them as it can lead to dangerous roads.

She gave a course subject list and a brief summary of how she felt about the course. Just named a few lectures they all agreed to like, and said why. I know plenty of people in years ahead and behind us that agree. I'm sure people in your course also agree. Ill remove their names to make it more balanced for you.

jakedixon2004

So as ye have said before the difficulty of maths is down to the ability of the lecturer we get

Sully

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

So as ye have said before the difficulty of maths is down to the ability of the lecturer we get

I, amongst many others, would agree with that statement.

jakedixon2004

I would love to learn how to encrypt files without that free software crap like real hardcore encryption .. any websites or tutorials?

maximumleo

Bit late in the day, but relevent nonetheless. You will do ANSI C as part of the Embedded Systems stream in Semester 4. Nothing too hectic, but moving things in and out of areas of memory.

(Just felt I had to contribute dan :cool:)

stick-dan

Sully wrote: »

I, amongst many others, would agree with that statement.

definitely agree with that it is down to the lecturer. You might get the lecturer we had and find that he teaches you a harder degree of maths but it is worth it in the long run as you get a better grounding for the maths in second year. Then again there are other lecturers who teach in a more abstract form i.e. they teach an easier way but if they weren't your lecturer in second year then you could find progressing through maths harder. It is hard to say because they all have such different styles it is impossible to determine which is the best.

coadyj

jakedixon2004 wrote: »

I would love to learn how to encrypt files without that free software crap like real hardcore encryption .. any websites or tutorials?

http://www.pgpi.org/

download pgp.
Make a public and private key for yourself.
encrypt with your public key.
decrypt with your private key.

you can give you public key to your friends, they can encrypt something with it and you can decrypt with your private key

this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rsa
explains how it works, and if your after hardcore, you wont find harder then this.

its quote the biggest advance in cryptography in 3000 years.

Hope this helps.
j

jakedixon2004

Where on the website can i get the free version because it is only allowing me to get a 30 day trial

Sully

Topic Cleaned on Request.

stick-dan

Sully wrote: »

Topic Cleaned on Request.

sound out, thanks a lot!