Garage selling car with finance owed.

rondeco

My neighbour bought a car off a dealer last year. It was a 01 Ford Mondeo and traded in his focus. He got a letter from AIB yesterday telling him that there is finance owed on the car and that they want it as the previous owner hadn't payed up.

IS the garage not obliged to check if there is finace owed on the car before they sell it? They are telling him they are not and its his problem. Any advice appreciated.

Henry Ford III

Ring a Solicitor.

cantdecide

Ummm... ring the dealer first surely. Could have bben a clerical error. The first question the solicitor will ask is what did the dealer say?

Anan1

cantdecide wrote: »

Ummm... ring the dealer first surely. Could have bben a clerical error. The first question the solicitor will ask is what did the dealer say?

According to the OP, the dealer said that they are not obliged to check and that it is his problem. As HF3 says, time to ring a solicitor.

cantdecide

Anan1 wrote: »

According to the OP, the dealer said that they are not obliged to check and that it is his problem. As HF3 says, time to ring a solicitor.

Sorry smudge in the glasses:D How did I miss that???



Solicitor time...

Anan1

cantdecide wrote: »

Sorry smudge in the glasses:D How did I miss that???



Solicitor time...

It's such an outlandish thing for a dealer to say, your brain probably refused to believe your eyes.

whippet

I think something similar happened with Park motors a few years ago and the customer got his money back from the dealer (albeit though legal means)

The reality is that the bank own the car and it wasn't ever the dealers to sell. The issue now lies with the dealer having to compensate the buyer. Depending on the dealer in question this could be easy or difficult.

As the rest say .. speak to a solicitor !

Mr.Diagnostic

whippet wrote: »

I think something similar happened with Park motors a few years ago and the customer got his money back from the dealer (albeit though legal means)

You "think" ,and you are prepared to name the garage!

Mr.Diagnostic

Solicitor, without a doubt.

Remember that AIB will be looking for the car back. Ask your solicitor asap what you should do about that. In my experience it would be to your benefit to have posession of the car and AIB cant take if they cant find it.

kluivert

I would ring solicitor asap.

I would ring the garage and give them a total bullocking, actually I would go down to the dealer and shout very very loudy so that other customers can hear what is happening.

I think your stung badly there am afriad. Normal case is that you have to give the car back to AIB.

HOWEVER, is the car down as security for the loan, this must be in writting. If not then the bank must take the previous owner to court for recovery of monies.

PauloMN

rondeco wrote: »

IS the garage not obliged to check if there is finace owed on the car before they sell it? They are telling him they are not and its his problem. Any advice appreciated.

I would imagine the garage is obliged to check it, just like they are obliged to ensure that the cars they sell are not clocked, or if they are that such is documented.

Personally, I'd write to the dealer regarding the matter cc'ing the bank before spending money on solicitors. Insist on a written reply from the dealer and take it from there.

I'd like to know the dealer, if you can't post you could PM it.

ejmaztec

Had the same AIB F&L situation a few years ago. The guy who previously owned the car actually worked at the garage (a main dealer). He traded it in to them and borrowed money to buy a new car from them. He then left the country.

A solicitor's letter sorted it out. I then received a letter from AIB F&L that they no longer had an interest in the vehicle, coincidentally also a Mondeo, albeit an older one than the OP's.

Stephen

I had a similar experience with a ford dealer a couple of years ago, although not with AIB. Roaring at the dealer eventually got them to sort it out, although they did insist for a week or so that they would never sell a car with outstanding finance :rolleyes: It was a 5-year old fiesta in my case.

maidhc

I would suggest ringing a solicitor (I would..)

Who owns the car depends on a number of factors, although the purchaser in this case may very well superceed the rights of the bank by virture of being what is known as a "purchaser for value without notice".

mr. Diagnostic is right, posession is indeed 9/10ths of the law in circumstances like this.

galwaytt

tbh, the car was, therefore, not the garage's, to sell. I'd go back to the dealer and demand either money & exp's back, or, if you want to keep the car, that they pay AIB & a sum to you.

ejmaztec

maidhc wrote: »

mr. Diagnostic is right, posession is indeed 9/10ths of the law in circumstances like this.

Unless the car is seized from the office car-park, miles away from home. That is what I was told would happen, so getting something done immediately is paramount.

rondeco

Thanks for all the input, folks. I'm not going to post the dealers name or pm it to anyone until it develops further for my neighbor or it is sorted. Good advice about putting the car offside. Are they entitled to come onto his property to take the car?

ejmaztec

rondeco wrote: »

Thanks for all the input, folks. I'm not going to post the dealers name or pm it to anyone until it develops further for my neighbor or it is sorted. Good advice about putting the car offside. Are they entitled to come onto his property to take the car?

I think that the repo people are experts and would imagine that they would show up with all of the necessary documentation so that they don't have a wasted journey. As far as they're concerned, the car belongs to AIB, until AIB tells them otherwise. The fact that it is on private property wouldn't work, I don't think.

stepbar

In fairness your neighbour "should" have checked out the history of the car first. Cartell would have shown this straight away. I wouldn't trust dealers anymore than private sellers. The car I bought had finance on it as well (ironically AIB as well). However, I found out before any cash was parted with. There's no way I would ever buy a car with finance on it.

ejmaztec

I suppose that these cases prove that you can't even trust the main dealers, so you've got to ask all traders to provide you with a report before you even start haggling.

Our man in Havana

Off to the legal forum we go.

old boy

oh my god we cannot trust the steelers any more, shock horror:eek:

Darando

I'm guessing its not an SIMI garage? When I bought my car in a SIMI garage (2nd hand) , a Nissan delaer in D14. I had to sign a big yellow SIMI form when purchasing, one of the boxes was concerning outstanding finance. It had a yes and no option - obviously it was ticked "no".

If the delaer sold it with this box ticked as no outstanding finance then you have even more of a case than before.

The dealer also has their own form which had a similar box to tick. Again ticked no.

phill106

call...Jooeeeeee duffy!
He would love this!

-Chris-

Darando wrote: »

I'm guessing its not an SIMI garage? When I bought my car in a SIMI garage (2nd hand) , a Nissan delaer in D14. I had to sign a big yellow SIMI form when purchasing, one of the boxes was concerning outstanding finance. It had a yes and no option - obviously it was ticked "no".

If the delaer sold it with this box ticked as no outstanding finance then you have even more of a case than before.

The dealer also has their own form which had a similar box to tick. Again ticked no.

Yep, the SIMI form asks the seller of the vehicle (the person trading in the car) whether there's any outstanding HP, finance or "other encumberance" on the car. The seller has to declare whether their car is clear of finance and sign to the order form (a legally binding contract ) to that effect.

Just like when you ask the previous owner whether there's any accident history, if they say "no", then when you're selling the car to the next owner you can tell them that, to your knowledge, there's been no accident history - this applies to private and trade sales.

Your neighbour can pursue the dealer through legal means, and I'm sure the dealer will pursue the original owner for mis-representing the car.

As with all these things, it would be prudent to do your own double-checking of any vehicle you're looking to buy. Presuming the dealer did all the required checks leaves you exposed to a lot of hassle (or worse).

Wish your neighbour luck, the solicitor will know the right channels through which to progress this.

Our man in Havana

Bond-007 wrote: »

Off to the legal forum we go.

Ok, according to the thread I started there, AIB cannot seize the car off of the innocent buyer without a court order and that they really need to be suing the original owner that took out the finance.

How did AIB discover that the OP had the car in his possession?

JHMEG

The repo man will take the car by any means necessary, sorta shoot first and ask questions later, but in this case I don't see how he could know where the car is.