NCT - RE TEST - VW, any mechanics here?

chucky1989

Hi, I recently posted on here about my VW bora that has to go in for NCT re-test soon. Okay, the car failed on emissions, everything else was fine, Lambda was 1.17 Limit is 1.03
High Idle RRPM - 310 , Limit is 200
Co2 was a little bit over too.

Someone said from previous threads, put in the clean fuel stuff with a full tank and drive it until tank is empty, Would this really work?, I asked me mechanic could he do anything with it and he said I might have to bring it to VW as he dosn't have the emissions testing equipment (apparently it's expensive). Now I really dont want to go down that route, I mean I got service off them a while ago and they are rip off's 480 for full service, Anyway please ANY HELP AT ALL., detailed answers. Please ? its like im running around in circles trying to get straight answer, and could you please suggest what price am I looking at ?!

Mr.Diagnostic

You dont need to go to a dealer, you need a VAG specialist or a diagnostic specialist.

The magic mechanic in a tin will not work for this.

As regards price, it is not possible to say simply because it is not possible to diagnose what is wrong online.

Captain Slow IRL

Lambda suggests lean mixture which means there is an excess of oxygen in the exhaust.
What are the exact figures for the results?

As Mr. Diagnostic said though, you're gonna have to go to someone with the correct equipment to handle the job

Mr.Diagnostic

land9 wrote: »

Lambda suggests lean mixture which means there is an excess of oxygen in the exhaust.
What are the exact figures for the results?

That is not quite true. There is not enough info regarding gasses on an NCT fail sheet to form an educated opinion.
You are quite right that a high lambda figure does mean a high O2 content in the sample but that does not always mean there is a lean mixture.

Captain Slow IRL

land9 wrote: »

Lambda SUGGESTS lean mixture which means there is an excess of oxygen in the exhaust.
What are the exact figures for the results?

Try reading it again....

Mr.Diagnostic

land9 wrote: »

Try reading it again....

dear oh dear.

I read it again. High Lambda does not "suggest" a lean mixture (no matter what colour you type it in).

Captain Slow IRL

Ah, for christ sake - i worded it wrong; COULD SUGGEST - how's that?

I also asked him to post up the full results - did you see that?

Go into politics, you'd be better suited there

Mr.Diagnostic

land9 wrote: »

Ah, for christ sake - i worded it wrong; COULD SUGGEST - how's that?

Thats ok, dont worry about it, we all make mistakes.

land9 wrote: »

I also asked him to post up the full results - did you see that?

Yes, that was why I responded to you. The full results are not available from the NCT sheet and it is not possible to diagnose anything without all the gasses.
There again thats what I posted before you got smart.

chucky1989

alright lads, thanks for all the replys, Im in work now, dont have the sheet with me, but co2 was like 1.3 and the limit is 0.3, something like that, Anyway lads, sat in the car for about 3 hours last night with a mate, however had the radio and heating on - Battery died - called AA - charged it up. However I asked the AA fella what he thought it would be and he said probably a Catalyc Converter (I don't know how to spell that), and that it would generally cost me about 800 from VW and 300-350 from some place in town (Now thats only a guess). It's not that much I suppose, But from VW - 800 - Don't think so,:(. So Do you guys know any Good mechanics, (southside), that have all the testing equipment and won't rub it in. Gonna ring up the NCT now and cancel it for March. Then Ill worry about it. - Garda never say anything anyway its just peace a mind and when I wanna sell it on, WAITING for the new Lancer to come out in diesel this July or Aug. So any ideas lads - and there is the CO2 there.

Captain Slow IRL

Do you mean CO as opposed to CO2?

A high co(%) and hc(ppm) reading could mean the cat is fooked - your car has poor quality spark plug leads, they deteriorate and cause a mis-fire which in turn damages the cat. Have you ever had the plug leads changed or is the engine running very rough now?

Original cat's are always expensive, the cheaper alternative the aa guy suggested is probably a universal cat - if you go to a decent garage or scrap yard, they will fit one for you and do an emission test when fitted. Make sure you bring your nct report along with you, they can advise you better.

chucky1989

land9 wrote: »

Do you mean CO as opposed to CO2?

A high co(%) and hc(ppm) reading could mean the cat is fooked - your car has poor quality spark plug leads, they deteriorate and cause a mis-fire which in turn damages the cat. Have you ever had the plug leads changed or is the engine running very rough now?

Original cat's are always expensive, the cheaper alternative the aa guy suggested is probably a universal cat - if you go to a decent garage or scrap yard, they will fit one for you and do an emission test when fitted. Make sure you bring your nct report along with you, they can advise you better.

Thanks for reply , yeah that is CO2, The aa guy just guessed the Cat was fooked, but I won't really know until I pay some hot shot to tell me what it is exactly, Most likely be the cat id say at this stage, we'll I cancelled me Nct test until march until I come back from skiing, so thats march 18, so It'll be april before I get anything done with it, I really do not care though.

Earth Worm Jim

Try VAGdrivers.net - some one on there will know more

zolwien

I have 00 Bora too and failed in emissions 1.5 year ago.Since then i didn't bother to go to NCT and Garda doesn't tell me anything.I'm not going to sell my car as i will lose money anyway and Bora looks good so far as well.
But i was done a bit research if i have to do NCT i will do following.
1.Attempt buy Fuel Treatment fluid(1L) 14€ and go to NCT
if failed again
2.Change CAT (200€)+Lambda Sensor(140€)+fitting(go cheap russian garage in Fairview+50 MAX!!!(Both CAT and Sensors need to be replaced every 50K miles also if you drive often when your red light on FUEl indicator will fu*k your CAT also overfilling your oil- according to VW Book)
That should do...i think...
BUt first try the Fuel treatment as it should reduce the emissions.(pour half 2 weeks before and empty your 50L Fuel then pour another half and drive lot in order to empty another 50L before yo ugo to NCT)

Captain Slow IRL

zolwien wrote: »

I have 00 Bora too and failed in emissions 1.5 year ago.Since then i didn't bother to go to NCT and Garda doesn't tell me anything.I'm not going to sell my car as i will lose money anyway and Bora looks good so far as well.

As long as the car looks good, what the f*ck do you need an nct for?!
While you're staying in this country, you might abide by local laws - then maybe immigrants won't be painted in such a bad light.

chucky1989

zolwien wrote: »

I have 00 Bora too and failed in emissions 1.5 year ago.Since then i didn't bother to go to NCT and Garda doesn't tell me anything.I'm not going to sell my car as i will lose money anyway and Bora looks good so far as well.
But i was done a bit research if i have to do NCT i will do following.
1.Attempt buy Fuel Treatment fluid(1L) 14€ and go to NCT
if failed again
2.Change CAT (200€)+Lambda Sensor(140€)+fitting(go cheap russian garage in Fairview+50 MAX!!!(Both CAT and Sensors need to be replaced every 50K miles also if you drive often when your red light on FUEl indicator will fu*k your CAT also overfilling your oil- according to VW Book)
That should do...i think...
BUt first try the Fuel treatment as it should reduce the emissions.(pour half 2 weeks before and empty your 50L Fuel then pour another half and drive lot in order to empty another 50L before yo ugo to NCT)

Hey. Thank you for the help Zolwien, your the first person that has really helped me and gave me approx prices. I have tried fuel treatment but I do not think it will reduce them that much and I am not paying extra for NCT again. You said 200 + 140 + fitting. Do you mean I should buy the cat and lambda sensor myself and get them fitted in a garage then, or just go to the garage in Fairview and they do it all ? Thanks

zolwien

So you don't think Fuel treatment is good enough?
If you think so you need to buy the CAT and sensor yourself and pay the labour in cheap garage.
By the way CAT can be bought some place in D12(they can post it over to you)sensor from Mick's garage(internet shopping).
Once you change these 2 there is no way you will fail on emissions(don't listen what the irish garage says,they will say it can be anything and they will start charge you hell of lot of money.Last time i was at Red cow with irish mechanic and he ask me to pay 500 for CAT..bastard!!!!

Anyway,bora has injection system so there is no trottle body to clean as such.:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_volkswagen_engines#75_hp_1.4

Kepp me posted as you and me have same bloody problem.

zolwien

mm

zolwien

Land9 wrote:

As long as the car looks good, what the f*ck do you need an nct for?!
While you're staying in this country, you might abide by local laws - then maybe immigrants won't be painted in such a bad light.

*********************************************
I don't know what is your problem but all i can see is you are sad little man living in middle of nowhere.(village boy)--Oh yeah ,every irish person do respect their law and follow the rules.yeah right!is that incl your Bertie Ahern(isn't he in trouble,at the moment:-)

Mr.Diagnostic

zolwien wrote: »

So you don't think Fuel treatment is good enough?
If you think so you need to buy the CAT and sensor yourself and pay the labour in cheap garage.
By the way CAT can be bought some place in D12(they can post it over to you)sensor from Mick's garage(internet shopping).
Once you change these 2 there is no way you will fail on emissions(don't listen what the irish garage says,they will say it can be anything and they will start charge you hell of lot of money.Last time i was at Red cow with irish mechanic and he ask me to pay 500 for CAT..bastard!!!!

Anyway,bora has injection system so there is no trottle body to clean as such.:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_volkswagen_engines#75_hp_1.4

Kepp me posted as you and me have same bloody problem.

zolwien wrote: »

I have 00 Bora too and failed in emissions 1.5 year ago.Since then i didn't bother to go to NCT and Garda doesn't tell me anything.I'm not going to sell my car as i will lose money anyway and Bora looks good so far as well.
But i was done a bit research if i have to do NCT i will do following.
1.Attempt buy Fuel Treatment fluid(1L) 14€ and go to NCT
if failed again
2.Change CAT (200€)+Lambda Sensor(140€)+fitting(go cheap russian garage in Fairview+50 MAX!!!(Both CAT and Sensors need to be replaced every 50K miles also if you drive often when your red light on FUEl indicator will fu*k your CAT also overfilling your oil- according to VW Book)
That should do...i think...
BUt first try the Fuel treatment as it should reduce the emissions.(pour half 2 weeks before and empty your 50L Fuel then pour another half and drive lot in order to empty another 50L before yo ugo to NCT)

Clueless...............

How can it be a good idea to spend money on new parts that may not be faulty?

Would it not make sense to spend half that getting someone who knows what they are doing to look at it?

zolwien

So what is your suggestion Mr Diagnostic?
To spend half of the cost of the actual parts just to tell you to change these 2 parts?Anyway,if the car has reached over 50K this is more likely to get it replaced as they have their own time lmit.You understand,it' s black and white ..I'm not a mechanic but i have a brain and i do use internet and other technical information materials.(by the way i've done the service for more car for no labour cost,where VW garage quoted it would cost 400 or someting)

Mr.Diagnostic

zolwien wrote: »

So what is your suggestion Mr Diagnostic?
To spend half of the cost of the actual parts just to tell you to change these 2 parts?Anyway,if the car has reached over 50K this is more likely to get it replaced as they have their own time lmit.You understand,it' s black and white ..I'm not a mechanic but i have a brain and i do use internet and other technical information materials.(by the way i've done the service for more car for no labour cost,where VW garage quoted it would cost 400 or someting)

My suggestion, as I already stated, is to spend a little getting it diagnosed.
It makes no sense to replace parts that do not need to be replaced. Why risk paying someone to NOT fix it so as to save the minor cost of a diagnosis.

You are not a mechanic..........it shows.

zolwien

So what is your suggestion Mr Diagnostic?
To spend half of the cost of the actual parts just to tell you to change these 2 parts?Anyway,if the car has reached over 50K this is more likely to get it replaced as they have their own time limit.You understand, it' s black and white and written all over on internet sites.
http://www.autozone.com/in_our_stores/features/spring/oxygen_sensor.htm

Q: How do I know if my Cat is working?
A: Only in extreme cases of cat meltdown will a total blockage occur, you will know that something has gone wrong because the car will not run! But mostly, you will only find out when the car fails the emission test at the annual MoT.
http://www.chesterautos.co.uk/files/catalytic_converters.html

zolwien

My suggestion, as I already stated, is to spend a little getting it diagnosed.
It makes no sense to replace parts that do not need to be replaced. Why risk paying someone to NOT fix it so as to save the minor cost of a diagnosis.

You are not a mechanic..........it shows
*********************************************
diagnose means nothing here!
with or without diagnose there is only one way to fix the emission.So what else do you need to know now?

Mr.Diagnostic

zolwien wrote: »

My suggestion, as I already stated, is to spend a little getting it diagnosed.
It makes no sense to replace parts that do not need to be replaced. Why risk paying someone to NOT fix it so as to save the minor cost of a diagnosis.

You are not a mechanic..........it shows
*********************************************
diagnose means nothing here!
with or without diagnose there is only one way to fix the emission.So what else do you need to know now?

Opps, I better close down so, the secret is out

Mr.Diagnostic

zolwien wrote: »

So what is your suggestion Mr Diagnostic?
To spend half of the cost of the actual parts just to tell you to change these 2 parts?Anyway,if the car has reached over 50K this is more likely to get it replaced as they have their own time limit.You understand, it' s black and white and written all over on internet sites.
http://www.autozone.com/in_our_stores/features/spring/oxygen_sensor.htm

Q: How do I know if my Cat is working?
A: Only in extreme cases of cat meltdown will a total blockage occur, you will know that something has gone wrong because the car will not run! But mostly, you will only find out when the car fails the emission test at the annual MoT.
http://www.chesterautos.co.uk/files/catalytic_converters.html

Why not read the link you posted. it says this --

A catalytic converter is an expensive item, so you don't want to change it unless it is absolutely necessary. We have the right tools and expertise to assure you of the condition of your catalytic converter.

It says to check it, not change it

The people who make lambda sensors say to change them, I wonder why!
There is no need to change them if they are working.


Can you explain to me the logic of changing parts that have not been tested as being faulty?

zolwien

There is no mechanic in ireland to test the sensors and CATs at reasonable price!!!that's the whole point my firend.The labour cost is min 100€ per hour and CATs cost just over €200!!!So instead of wasting time and money to go to mechanic ,you just buy the parts and replace it yourself.
Capito?and with new CAT and Sensor you will pass the NCT anyway!!!

chucky1989

zolwien wrote: »

There is no mechanic in ireland to test the sensors and CATs at reasonable price!!!that's the whole point my firend.The labour cost is min 100€ per hour and CATs cost just over €200!!!So instead of wasting time and money to go to mechanic ,you just buy the parts and replace it yourself.
Capito?and with new CAT and Sensor you will pass the NCT anyway!!!

Zolwien, you have been a great great help, I am glad I have finally got advice from someone who knows what they are talking about. I will take your advice and act on it, Sure I work for a well known auction site, Ill do some research tomorrow in work to see what sellers will sell me a CAT converter cheaply for the cost of Negative feedback being removed - only joking, Lol. Thanks again for your help Zolwien, just one other and final question, how much do you think my local mechanic will charge me for fitting the CAT converter and Lambda Sensor. ?:):):)

VeVeX

From my interpretation of the information given by the OP there has been no definitive reason why the CAT or O2 Sensor needs to be replaced other the AA guy and Zolwien say so.

Chucky1989 you would be foolish to listen to the advice of either tbh. Mr Diagnostic has offered his professional advice at no cost and will probably not waste his breath the next time a subject like this arises.Does it not make sense to pay a diagnostic specialist to confirm which part, the O2 sensor or the cat is causing the problem? If the advice you had received from MR AA and Zolwien was credible you'd already know that there can be other contributing factors to emission failure bar the O2 and Cat.

Example-

Lean readings can also be the result of vacuum leaks at hard/cracked/broken hoses, leaking gaskets and boots around MAF, and partially clogged fuel injectors.



Chucky1989 dont waste your money on the O2 or Cat take your car to a Diagnostic specialist.

Slidey

I think chucky should be left to his own devices, let him piss away money for the sake of somesound advice. sure wikipedia has never been wrong and why would ya need to spend 4 years doing an apprenceship when all ya have to do is get a complete fix over the net. aint broadband mighty... aaaaggghhhhhh

chucky1989

slideways wrote: »

I think chucky should be left to his own devices, let him piss away money for the sake of somesound advice. sure wikipedia has never been wrong and why would ya need to spend 4 years doing an apprenceship when all ya have to do is get a complete fix over the net. aint broadband mighty... aaaaggghhhhhh

Sure thing Sideways, the internet is Mighty. And without it I wouldn't have a job. Apart from that I like what Zolwien told me, he's a sound Man. He gave a breakdown of prices confirming what I already thought. The o2 Sensor (Lambda) and Cat (Exhaust Emissions) were well over on the NCT sheet. I know I need these two replaced to pass it. Don't get me wrong mechanics are alright, they have always just annoyed me though. I mean you could ask them something simple like roughly how much would it be to fix me break light (already knowing the problem was the switch)? They always turn around and say '' I'll have to have a look at it). So I think with mechanics attitudes to things like that, no wonder Wikipedia is taking over, and it will mate - it Will.

hefty_langer

chucky1989 wrote: »

Apart from that I like what Zolwien told me, he's a sound Man. He gave a breakdown of prices confirming what I already thought. The o2 Sensor (Lambda) and Cat (Exhaust Emissions) were well over on the NCT sheet.

OK, case closed, you have heard what you wanted to hear... Off you go to replace some expensive parts.

chucky1989 wrote: »

no wonder Wikipedia is taking over, and it will mate - it Will.

Wikipedia to replace car mechanics and potentially take over the world, ummm ok.

In Soviet Russia, the car, it NCT you!