Where do u wan the the Luas to run to the village or Southside?

Snake Plisken

I want the proposed Luas line to run down to Superquinn rather then through the village. as I think that most of the need is on the southside, but see in the Gazette, the businesses int the village are putting a push for it to run to the village which I think would be a waste. What do you think?

P.S. I thought I read about an online voting system for this anyone got the link?

r3nu4l

Here's a link to the proposed line and a link to the map of proposed options.

There are two main route options and a number of sub-options. The links detail them quite well, I won't repeat them.

Well obviously most people will be biased by where they live.
Here's how I see it. The village makes sense for local businesses, particularly shops and cafés. The village is also the centre of Lucan and a Luas line could boost 'day trip tourism' from the city centre.

However, having the Luas in the village doesn't make sense for the majority of Lucan's residents because getting to the village requires a long enough journey for those people living in Arthur Griffith Park, near Finnstown, Adamstown and even Dodsboro and for most people, this means using the car...and parking in the village is already a nightmare! That said, the village makes sense if an enterprising minibus company decided to set up a daily feeder run from local estates! to the village

The Superquinn terminus makes sense for a lot of people but again only if there is adequate parking provided. That terminus also means that again, a lot of residents have difficulty getting there without a car. As to the merits of each individual route...wellI haven't really formed an opinion yet.

So in Sumamry, both proposed terminii have advantages and disadvantages and neither is a clear winner for me. Of course, for anyone living in Hillcrest, either terminus is totally acceptable

mvpr

Would it not be possible to build both lines? Surely the population density of the greater Lucan area could justify both lines, or even a main line to Superquinn Lucan, with a branch off at Sub-option B to serve old Lucan village.

Think of the number of cars that would be taken off the road!!!

By what date do I have to cast my vote, and where?

When are the RPA likely to commence work on this project?

manc

mvpr wrote: »

Would it not be possible to build both lines? Surely the population density of the greater Lucan area could justify both lines, or even a main line to Superquinn Lucan, with a branch off at Sub-option B to serve old Lucan village.

I think this would probably be the best option but would never happen due to cost.

I would agree with r3nu4l that a feeder bus on a loop would be a good idea bringing people from various points in Lucan to Adamstown train station and a Luas station in the village.


With the 2 options we have my preference would be for the Luas to go too the village rather than Newcastle road as Adamstown already has a train link to town, it would also focus the Village as the main point in Lucan one again.

Snake Plisken

yeah but the Adamstown train is overcrowed in the mornings, its sardine city! Leave it go to Superquinn thats where its needed, have your feeder bus but just to bring people from the village up.

manc

was reading int he Liffey Champion last night that there was talk of an extension from the Newcatle road down into the village, this way keeps everyone happy.

I think the one of the main arguments against the village was that the line would have to go past the schools

Mellor

I think it would ruin the village.
I look that these things from an aesthetic point of view. it doesn't fit the old part of lucan well, it is much more suited to superview/paddocks area

robertdempsey

Has anyone gone to any of the meetings for the 'luas line F decision'?
Anyone know when the public will be told what option is been picked?

Robert

r3nu4l

I read a letter in the Lucan Newsletter where someone who had attended the last meeting said that it was heavily attended by Lucan Village traders and that their agenda was pushed forward over any other opinion due to the number of them there. The Superquinn terminus groups were apparently poorly represented according to that letter.

Personally, I feel that the village terminus would not be a good idea as it would be inconvenient for the majority of Lucan residents thanks to poor parking availability in the village. It should definitely terminate close to a Park and Ride facility.

Snake Plisken

Yeah typical of us over on the Superquinn side, no one really willing to put in the effort, although I did read in the Gazette, that the Superquinn Terminus is the one favoured by the council. Hopefully some compromise will be reached.

manc

Are they proposing anywhere in particular for a Luas provided Park and Ride in Lucan, as I think the only place I've heard of was Liffey Valley for a P&R. Remember there are none at other termini in Stephens Green, Connolly and Tallaght.

Superquinn would not really allow its car park will be used so I presume if there is to be one in that area it will be some of the sports ground area that will be turned into a P&R?

As I said previously I think it will end up going to the Newcastle Road with a spur down to the village across the N4, hopefully such a decision will be made before the new junction is in place.

r3nu4l

I haven't seen anything about a P&R facility but to be honest, I feel that if you really want people out of their cars and off the N4 then it makes sense to have a P&R for this terminus whichever part of Lucan it terminates in.

Does anyone know what the point of a P&R at Liffey Valley is? As it stands this owuld be about one third or halfway along the proposed route(s) for the line and that seems strange to me!

manc

r3nu4l wrote: »

Does anyone know what the point of a P&R at Liffey Valley is? As it stands this owuld be about one third or halfway along the proposed route(s) for the line and that seems strange to me!

The P&R for the Connolly-Tallaght line is at the Red Cow, so it wouldn't be that strange to the planners

r3nu4l

manc wrote: »

The P&R for the Connolly-Tallaght line is at the Red Cow, so it wouldn't be that strange to the planners

Ah sure I suppose if the Lucan Line P&R was located in Lucan, people in Clondalkin would give out that it wasn't closer to the city The poor planners can never win, a bit like a tax inspector really

philologos

As was already said it's likely for people to be biased according to where they live. I'm happy with Route 1 as it stops near me. But then again that mightn't be the best way of thinking about it.

EmoMatt15

I cant picture how theyre going to integrate the line into the village(if they do) without causing even more traffic and congestion!

robertdempsey

I agree, The proposed 'Option 2' that would stop at Superquinn is the best route (but that's only my opinion)

The_Conductor

As someone who does live in the village- its being sold to locals as the solution to the virtually non-existant public transport for us, while those in Adamstown/Esker have their new train station. While I can see that there is a much greater population density in the Adamstown/Esker area- the village already sacrificed most of its bus service 12 years ago to "Lucan South" with the advent of the 25A route- and because of traffic congestion in the village- at peak times most of the 66/67 buses no longer go to the village (hell, even the 25, which originates in Dodsboro seems to ignore its actual route and take the upper road by Lucan Heights/St. Mary's- totally ignoring the bus stops in the village itself).

Banning through-traffic from the village itself and giving it a spur would be brilliant- and make sense- but will it happen? I certainly don't know?

There is a massive problem with public transport- and I really don't know whats going to happen. Regardless of what happens there are going to be unhappy people.

Jayage

tbh alot more busses run through the village and only 1 runs the other way 25A(not mentioning the CL2)
so it would be alot better if it did go towards super!
although more roadworks on wat has just finished recently on the new road by euro spar!

The_Conductor

Jayage wrote: »

tbh alot more busses run through the village and only 1 runs the other way 25A(not mentioning the CL2)
so it would be alot better if it did go towards super!
although more roadworks on wat has just finished recently on the new road by euro spar!

Not exactly what I was saying.
The frequency of the no. 25 was brought from one on average every 18 minutes to 16 buses over the course of the entire day- when the number 25A was launched- which means slightly less than a third as many as usual. This was agreed with businesses and locals in advance. What I am now saying is during peak times (aka 7.15AM to 9.45AM and in the evening from about 4.45pm to 6.30PM) that the number 25 bus has taken to deviating from its agreed route altogether as the traffic is too heavy through the village for it to navigate main street Lucan village. In addition, for exactly the same reason- the number of Leixlip/Maynooth/Celbridge buses, which used to service the village (though not main street) has in the past 18 months decreased by almost half during these time windows- for the same reason, with the addition of a much higher frequency of "X" routes which avoid Lucan altogether. So during busy times of the day Lucan village is presently, for all intensive purposes, without public transport. As for your only one bus that runs the other way- the 25A route completes almost 8 times more complete daily journeys than the 25- so its a bit of a moot point to be honest.

To the person who was querying the aesthetics of the new Luas- PM me and I'll try to digitise photos of when the tram to Lucan village was still there (old- but descriptive).

Serious traffic management is as much an issue at the moment, as is lack of public transport. Lucan village is being used as a ratrun by people avoiding the N4 and ducking down the Strawberry beds (though this has reduced somewhat since they put those 26 speedbumps in). Adamstown- for all its advertised rail link- simply doesn't have the capacity to cater for everyone who might be genuinely interested in using it- adding further volume to the N4 at peak times (the remedial works at Junction 7 have simply moved the bottleneck elsewhere- ala St. Johns Road mess).

A combination of 3 seperate councils being involved in the general area- SDCC, DCC and Fingal- are only contributing to the overall mess- ala Fingal changing light sequences at the bridge in the village without consulting anyone in advance (other than the then very happy residents in Laraghcon- who managed to seriously inconvenience several thousand others).

What really needs to happen is the residents from Esker/Adamstown and the village sit down together and between knock together a coherent policy for the area- as our elected officials certainly aren't listening to any of us.......

r3nu4l

Some very good points there Shane and something I agree with almost entirely. Although a point of information regarding the 25A would be appropriate. When you talk about the 25A being launched, I assume you mean the 'new' 25A service that terminates at Superquinn?

The original 25A service has been around for about 30 years now. It used to terminate in Arthur Griffith Park.

Does anyone have any links on Tom Newtons thoughts on the Luas for Lucan? Tom Newton is/was a Dublin Bus driver who campaigned for years for a better service for Lucan. Over the years some of what he has said makes sense although some seems unfeasible to me.

As for the Strawberry beds being a rat-run, with the new estate on the North of the Liffey, opposite the bridge at the weir, there was always going to be an increase in the number of cars using the beds...but of course, nothing was done to make the beds easier/more comfortable/safer to drive on. Forward planning for commuting in Lucan has never been great!

As for Adamstown and the people on that side of Lucan, I can also understand why they want Luas, as Shane said, the train station is there but it still doesn't cater for everyone in the area and there just aren't enough trains on the line. The 25A service is great to have but despite the frequency of buses, again there aren't enough at the necessary times.

lord lucan

the village option for me but i'm biased as the line would run down lomans road across the top of my estate.:D

god help us if they go for the s/quinn option,they've spent 8 months just widening the road to put a couple of bus lanes in,between that and the n4 roadworks we'd have years more feckin' digging going on around there.:eek:

r3nu4l

lord lucan wrote: »

god help us if they go for the s/quinn option,they've spent 8 months just widening the road to put a couple of bus lanes in,between that and the n4 roadworks we'd have years more feckin' digging going on around there.:eek:

I think whatever option they eventually go with is going to cause major traffic problems That said, yes, anyone living near SuperQuinn will have to put up with yet more construction traffic if Luas does end up terminating there.

af_thefragile

This sounds brilliant.
But any idea if we'll actually be able to see this happening during out lifetimes???

ctrl-alt-delete

lord lucan wrote: »

they've spent 8 months just widening the road to put a couple of bus lanes in,between that and the n4 roadworks we'd have years more feckin' digging going on around there.:eek:

maybe they've already decided which way it is going

The_Conductor

ctrl-alt-delete wrote:

maybe they've already decided which way it is going

Nope- they're still wading their way through the deluge of submissions they got. They were totally unprepared for the 14,000 odd submissions.

ctrl-alt-delete

smccarrick wrote: »

Nope- they're still wading their way through the deluge of submissions they got. They were totally unprepared for the 14,000 odd submissions.

Well i meant in terms of they decided before they got any submissions or anything, they have to be seen to be giving a choice

ctrl-alt-delete

the emerging preffered route has been announced,

http://www.rpa.ie/cms/download.asp?id=857

The_Conductor

ctrl-alt-delete wrote: »

the emerging preffered route has been announced,

http://www.rpa.ie/cms/download.asp?id=857

Pretty much as expected.
It doesn't help that it was announced that more of the 66X and 67X routes will avoid the village as well last week. The village itself is fast becoming a public transport desert.......

With government finances the way they are- while they will never admit that the project has been cancelled, its very probable that it will "be put on the long finger". At least the airport line is going ahead I suppose......