7km of Israels wall blown up

bobbyjoe

Good, they should get to work on the rest of it.

12.30pm GMT update
Palestinians flood into Egypt after blowing up border wall

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,2245407,00.html

Tens of thousands of Palestinians today poured into Egypt from Gaza after militants blew up part of the wall between the two territories in protest at an Israeli blockade.

On foot, in cars or riding donkey carts, Gazans burst into the Egyptian border town of Rafah to buy cigarettes, plastic bottles of fuel and other supplies that have become scarce and expensive after months of economic isolation.

"I have bought everything I need for the house for months. I have bought food, cigarettes and even two gallons of diesel for my car," Mohammed Saeed told Reuters.

Many of the Palestinians, some travelling from the northern Gaza Strip, found transport towards the Egyptian coastal town of El Arish, about 40km away.

Others stayed on the Egyptian side of Rafah and clamoured to buy merchandise that has been in short supply in Gaza, even going as afar as emptying some shops.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

saw that on the news, awesome stuff.

NeverSayDie

I'm pretty sure this was Egypt's wall, not Israel's. You're probably thinking of the West Bank barrier:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_West_Bank_barrier

bobbyjoe

NeverSayDie wrote: »

I'm pretty sure this was Egypt's wall, not Israel's. You're probably thinking of the West Bank barrier:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_West_Bank_barrier

The wall was built and controlled by Israel.

Sesshoumaru

Oh its just like the Berlin wall coming down :rolleyes:

Seriously though we don't want those hamas terrorists escaping from Gaza, hopefully the IDF will sort this little problem out soon.

cabinteelytom

The collaborator egyptian regime hauled on the levers of power...and they broke in their hands.

bobbyjoe

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

Oh its just like the Berlin wall coming down :rolleyes:

Seriously though we don't want those hamas terrorists escaping from Gaza, hopefully the IDF will sort this little problem out soon.

Why is it a problem?
Why shouldn't Palestinians be allowed cross the border into Egypt.
Hopefully the IDF realise how stupid the policy of starving Gaza is.

Sesshoumaru

It's a problem because for year the terrorists dug tunnels under the wall to smuggle in weapons to be used against Israel. Now they don't even need tunnels. Just walk across the border with their weapons of mass terror.

bobbyjoe

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

It's a problem because for year the terrorists dug tunnels under the wall to smuggle in weapons to be used against Israel. Now they don't even need tunnels. Just walk across the border with their weapons of mass terror.

What about the problem of people cut off from food, water, electricity, medical supplies, their own land, family members, etc etc denied them by the state of Israel.

SeanW

They voted for Hamas, whos policy is to destroy Israel through terror, and drive the Jews into the sea. So tough ****.

bobbyjoe

SeanW wrote: »

They voted for Hamas, whos policy is to destroy Israel through terror, and drive the Jews into the sea. So tough ****.

By the collective punishment of Civilians women and children.

Ray777

SeanW wrote: »

They voted for Hamas, whos policy is to destroy Israel through terror, and drive the Jews into the sea. So tough ****.

To borrow your twisted logic, the people of Israel have for many years voted for parties dedicated to depriving Palestinians of human rights, and therefore deserve every act of terrorism committed against them.

Sesshoumaru

Israel has been willing to make peace with the Palestinians for a long time now. Its the Palestinians who think they can gain more through violence. I don't know how anyone can tell me the terrorist organisation hamas is serving the interests of their people by launching rockets at Israel on a daily basis.

bobbyjoe

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

Israel has been willing to make peace with the Palestinians for a long time now. Its the Palestinians who think they can gain more through violence. I don't know how anyone can tell me the terrorist organisation hamas is serving the interests of their people by launching rockets at Israel on a daily basis.

Hamas had a 16 month ceasefire. Israel offered nothing.
Israel has the right to defend itself but it does not have the right to collectively punish a population.

SeanW

Ray777 wrote: »

To borrow your twisted logic, the people of Israel have for many years voted for parties dedicated to depriving Palestinians of human rights, and therefore deserve every act of terrorism committed against them.

I'm suggesting that it's not all one sided. The Israelis have the right to respond appropriately to continuous rocket attacks by a neighbroing government that is committed to their destruction.

I am no fan of Israel, I think most of their responses to terrorist activity are way too harsh. For example, when the current intifada started, it was mainly 10 year old boys throwing rocks at Israeli tanks, and the Israeli response was OTT and most likely contributed to the current mess. And in Lebanon, the campaign of infrastructural demolition masquerading as a war against Hezbollah was, to say the least, unwarranted.

But as far as I'm concerned, when the terrorism is being committed by a democratically elected neighboring government, all bets are off. Some people see a certain legitimacy in, for example, some of what the Provos did as a result of the treatment of Northern Nationalists up until about the 1970s.

But we didn't elect a Sinn Fein government when the IRA was terrorising England (or indeed ever). Nor did our government give them any support at that time.

Like with many modern conflicts, there are two sides to the story.

Sesshoumaru

bobbyjoe wrote: »

Hamas had a 16 month ceasefire. Israel offered nothing.
Israel has the right to defend itself but it does not have the right to collectively punish a population.

ceasefire? what's a hamas ceasefire? only 5 rockets a day? 10 rockets? That's the funniest thing I've read so far this year. The usual hamas "ceasefire" is they launch maybe 50% less attacks on Israel and all the usual suspects keep bleating on to Israel to "show restraint" while rockets keep raining down on their cities during these supposed "ceasefires".

Manic Moran

I'm trying to parse this. It's the Egyptian border with Gaza that they breached, which had been closed by Egypt for the last while. Sounds like an Egyptian problem.

NTM

bobbyjoe

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

ceasefire? what's a hamas ceasefire? only 5 rockets a day? 10 rockets? That's the funniest thing I've read so far this year. The usual hamas "ceasefire" is they launch maybe 50% less attacks on Israel and all the usual suspects keep bleating on to Israel to "show restraint" while rockets keep raining down on their cities during these supposed "ceasefires".

Sept 2005 to June 2006 Hamas were on ceasefire.

How many Israelis have been killed by this raining down of rockets?

Sesshoumaru

bobbyjoe wrote: »

Sept 2005 to June 2006 Hamas were on ceasefire.

How many Israelis have been killed by this raining down of rockets?

After some searching I found a site with a time line of attacks against Israel since the hamas "ceasefire".

http://www.vegsource.com/talk/pub/messages/6671.html

Some words of wisdom from khaled mashaal

http://www.albawaba.com/en/news/187697

khaled mashaal wrote:

Today Gaza and tomorrow the West Bank and later every inch of the land

I wonder what he means by "and later every inch of land" ? oh yes that would be their stated aim of driving the jews into the sea and taking all of Israel. Bad Israel! you should really be negotiating with these nice people.

The Hamas leader reiterated the movement’s commitment to the calm with Israel until the end of the current year

After searching through google for a bit it seems that hamas themselves refer to this period as a "lull in fighting". They're quite specific that they never agreed to a full blown ceasefire. I don't know why some people here defend hamas. They're nothing but a bunch of terrorist thugs. They certainly don't serve the interests of the Palestinian people, in fact they do more harm than good IMO. Israel should keep them locked up in their little prison city.

bobbyjoe

I'm not defending Hamas. But compare the responses.

12 Israelis have been killed by rockets in the last six years.
to
1.4 million Palestinians are living without access to clean water, food, sanitation, medical supplies, humanitarian aid has been blocked, malnutrition among children is equal to that of sub Saharan Africa, no power, light or heat.

skelliser

note how fags where number one on there list of supplies!

Tommy T

Congratulations to Hamas and the People of Palestine. You have shown once again you will never bow beofre your oppressors...

Akrasia

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

Oh its just like the Berlin wall coming down :rolleyes:

Seriously though we don't want those hamas terrorists escaping from Gaza, hopefully the IDF will sort this little problem out soon.

Is that an admission that you consider Gaza to be one big interment camp? (like the warsaw ghetto)

Opinions like yours are awfully depressing. The amount of hate in that statement, combined with a complete lack of understanding of the true nature of the situation is truly overwhelming

Hobbes

Manic Moran wrote: »

I'm trying to parse this. It's the Egyptian border with Gaza that they breached, which had been closed by Egypt for the last while. Sounds like an Egyptian problem.

NTM

Your incorrect. The wall was put up and monitored by Israel despite it being between Gaza and Egypt. If anything Egypt have said they welcome the open border and plan to do more trade.

It was also getting Critical in Gaza, based on Israels blockade they were planned to run out of food in Gaza mid this week.

Btw, collective punishment is a war crime.

Kev_ps3

I think it great that they broke down this 'wall of hate' built by the opressors. The People of Palestine could starve to death and the jews wouldnt bat an eyelid, or the west for that matter. Long live the People of Palestine, may they someday return to the land of their fore-fathers.

wes

SeanW wrote: »

They voted for Hamas, whos policy is to destroy Israel through terror, and drive the Jews into the sea. So tough ****.

Israel actually drove Palestinians out of the country in 1948, for the crime of being the wrong race. This actually happened. There are millions of Palestinians living in refugee camps to this day, due to the ethnic cleansing committed by Israel. Also, they can't return to there homes again for the crime of being the wrong race.

Of course these crimes in no way excuse terrorism committed by Hamas. Just needs to be pointed out that Israel had no real issues getting rid of Palestinians when they had the chance themselves.

Kev_ps3

wes wrote: »

Of course these crimes in no way excuse terrorism committed by Hamas. Just needs to be pointed out that Israel had no real issues getting rid of Palestinians when they had the chance themselves.

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter. One could say that some of Isreals actions are acts of terror.

Sesshoumaru

Akrasia wrote: »

Is that an admission that you consider Gaza to be one big interment camp? (like the warsaw ghetto)

Opinions like yours are awfully depressing. The amount of hate in that statement, combined with a complete lack of understanding of the true nature of the situation is truly overwhelming

I don't hate the Palestinians. I just think a large proportion of them are terrorists and the rest of the population support those terrorists. As seen in the election where they voted in hamas. What kind of reaction did they expect electing hamas whose stated aim is to drive the Jews back into the sea? They don't deserve all the sympathy that the mainstream media whips up for them, nor all the international aid they get. I wonder what's the point in giving them a state then? We'll just be creating another terrorist sponsoring state overnight.

Sesshoumaru

bobbyjoe wrote: »

I'm not defending Hamas. But compare the responses.

12 Israelis have been killed by rockets in the last six years.
to
1.4 million Palestinians are living without access to clean water, food, sanitation, medical supplies, humanitarian aid has been blocked, malnutrition among children is equal to that of sub Saharan Africa, no power, light or heat.

You're forgetting the living in terror part. I know I wouldn't like to even visit that part of Israel knowing that rockets could land at any time. How do you think the residents there feel?

Anyway Israel has consistently said the border crossings would reopen as soon as the rockets stop. But like some spoilt child insisting it has its way hamas keeps launching rockets at Israel day after day. I just have to say WOW! I wish we had politicians who cared for their people like hamas do :rolleyes:

Hobbes

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

I don't hate the Palestinians. I just think a large proportion of them are terrorists and the rest of the population support those terrorists.

Just like Irish people.

As seen in the election where they voted in hamas.

You need to read up more on what Hamas actually is. It is not just a terrorist organisation. They have various wings. For example that Hamas built most of the Hospitals and schools in Gaza. It spends $70 million a year on social based programs. For example, schools, orphanages, mosques, clinics, soup kitchens, free medical. In fact something like 90% of all Hamas activities are based in those areas.

So if you wonder why the people are supporting them, there you go. Some level of this is proproganda (and some I don't agree with), but it is hard to call them bad when the other side is happily starving you to death and bombing you.

If Israel wants Hamas to stop attacking they need to change their tactics so that the military wing is no longer an issue. Imagine the UK took the same stance as Israel with the IRA. Do you think the country we are living in would be the same?

Playboy

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

I don't hate the Palestinians. I just think a large proportion of them are terrorists and the rest of the population support those terrorists. As seen in the election where they voted in hamas. What kind of reaction did they expect electing hamas whose stated aim is to drive the Jews back into the sea? They don't deserve all the sympathy that the mainstream media whips up for them, nor all the international aid they get. I wonder what's the point in giving them a state then? We'll just be creating another terrorist sponsoring state overnight.

And tell me .. why shouldnt they drive them back into the sea? Israel drove them off their land .. why should the Palestinians not have every right to reclaim that land and drive what is essentially an occupying apartheid regime bent on genocide into the sea. Why are the Palestinians called terrorists? Israel is a terrorist state and you are blind if you cant see that. Israel also gets billions of dollars in aid every year from the US .. tell me why they deserve international aid while they live in a first world country while the Palestinians who live in abject poverty deserve none. Get you head screwed on m8 .. dont buy all that propogandist bull that comes out of Israel and the US.