Bus Lanes

cyrusdvirus

I was gonna post this on the overtaking in the slow lane thread, but it's so completely off topic that i reckoned I'd catch an earful.

There's a bus lane in Lucan village that operates from 7.00am to 9.30 am, so strictly speaking traffic should be driving in it outside those times. I got pulled last week for being in it at 6.30 am, maintaining the speed limit, but undertaking. When I pointed out the time to the Garda, he said fair enough, but I shouldn't have been undertaking......I said that as far as I knew the law states that you have to keep left, therefore I wasn't in the wrong. he still gave me a warning to not let him catch me at it again. BTW, I will continue to use that lane, when it's not within those stated times.

So am I an ignorant sod who should be stripped of his licence, or am I a better driver because I'm following the rule of law, and paying full atention to the road markings/road times??

Saruman

I think you are in the right. Or left in this case

Now if you were in the right and moved into the left to undertake a slower car then you would be in the wrong.. if you were in that lane and happened to be going faster than traffic in the right, then you did nothing wrong.

TheBazman

I'd say that you are ok aswell. I must say I face the same dilemma each morning coming up the quays at around 6.30am if I am in the bus lane (which only operates from 7am) and I catch up with a slower moving car in the right lane

fletch

I used to use that lane every morning. It was great as all the eegits sat in the traffic and I just used to saunter up to the top of the traffic and merge before the lights. Got beeped at once or twice. Was tempted to stop and drag people out of their cars and show them the signs.
But yeh I think you were well within your rights. Although I didn't tend to do the speed limit just in case somebody decided to change lanes suddenly.

Mena

You've done nothing wrong here, at all.

I've also had people blowing horns at me in the mornings for driving in these lanes... takes a bit of willpower to not drag them out of their cars and show them the signs!

craichoe

One point to note though, you should only enter and exit a bus lane at the non continuous line, never across the solid white line.

chris85

OP, you are completely right. The law says that you can overtake on the left if the right lane is moving slower if in traffic.

Love being on the road and bus lanes are able to be used but noone else realises this.

pete4130

OP, you were in the right. You are allowed overtake in the left if the traffic in the right lane is moving slower or if the car in front of you has indicated that he intends to turn right and you intend to go straight ahead or turn left...thats what I remember from monday night when going thru the Q's with my gf for her test on Tuesday (which she passed).
Obviously obeying the solid white line and not crossing it of course.

Anan1

OP - You were in the right to be driving in the bus lane, but you were probably in the wrong to be overtaking traffic to the right of you. Unless, of course, the traffic was slow-moving or the car to your right was turning right. My advice is to keep using the bus lane (when it isn't) but to be careful. Quite apart from the issue of undertaking, people won't expect you to be there and often won't look before pulling in, turning left, etc.

Saruman

I asked this before... Technically every time a bus or taxi passes you in the bus lane, they are undertaking you!

On another note.. i was driving down Thomas street one afternoon, near St James's Gate.
A car moved into the bus lane for two reasons.. one it was perfectly legal at that time (not bus lane till 16:00 and secondly, as i found out later, he would be taking a left turn up ahead. Both legal. Out of nowhere, a big blue taxi minibus swerves from the right in front of him and slows down a little (taxi just marking what he thinks is his territory). When he beeped at the taxi, the taxi driver rolls down his window and points at his taxi sign on the roof.. as if to say, i have a right to be here and you do not... so im perfectly entitled to try and run you off the road.

Anan1

Saruman wrote: »

I asked this before... Technically every time a bus or taxi passes you in the bus lane, they are undertaking you!

I'm only guessing here, but might a bus lane (when it's in use) be classed as a separate roadway?

Saruman

possibly... after all... technically you are not allowed to leave it to overtake etc... as in.. a bus is not supposed to overtake into a normal lane of traffic as its a solid white line. As far as i know anyway.

cyrusdvirus

Anan1 wrote: »

OP - You were in the right to be driving in the bus lane, but you were probably in the wrong to be overtaking traffic to the right of you. Unless, of course, the traffic was slow-moving or the car to your right was turning right. My advice is to keep using the bus lane (when it isn't) but to be careful. Quite apart from the issue of undertaking, people won't expect you to be there and often won't look before pulling in, turning left, etc.

There are no left turns off this bus lane, aside from one into an old country house, so i was undertaking everyone who was plodding along slowly in the right hand lane, but this was purely because of their reduced speed by being in a line of traffic.

cashmni1

OP was dead right. Did nothing at all wrong and is perfectly entitled to pass slower moving traffic on his right if the outside lane moving slower.
If he did something wrong, the cop would issue a ticket.
I have to laugh at the cop though, a warning for what? knowing the rules of the road?

Vikings

The thing about this particular bus lane though is merging when it ends, as it ends there is almost an immediate left turn, and that junction itself does be crazy at times.

Anyone in the "normal" lane is always aggressive about defending their position in traffic, as the where the two lanes "merge" is basically just the bus lane ending and the two lanes are left to do what the please. Technically you should only be merging there after the traffic lights which causes others to become defensive of their position, I know I would if I had just sat in traffic to get their while somebody zipped up the bus lane.

If traffic is heavy and the bus lane is not in use there will be a number of cars using the bus lane which is grand, its when the bus lane is in use and a few cheeky feckers undertake all the traffic that gets on my nerves...and whats worse is the cars who have just sat in the traffic let them merge!

Anan1

gatecrash wrote: »

There are no left turns off this bus lane, aside from one into an old country house, so i was undertaking everyone who was plodding along slowly in the right hand lane, but this was purely because of their reduced speed by being in a line of traffic.

Well if the traffic in the right lane was slow-moving then you've no legal worries, IMO at least. Just be careful, no left turns does not necessarily mean nobody pulling out in front of you.

meathstevie

Why would you be pulled. A ticket for bad lane discipline could have been slapped on every plank in the right hand lane.

Esel

craichoe wrote: »

One point to note though, you should only enter and exit a bus lane at the non continuous line, never across the solid white line.

Not true, afaik. Think you posted this opinion before? Can you cite where this is stated as law?

Jrad

gatecrash wrote: »

I was gonna post this on the overtaking in the slow lane thread, but it's so completely off topic that i reckoned I'd catch an earful.

There's a bus lane in Lucan village that operates from 7.00am to 9.30 am, so strictly speaking traffic should be driving in it outside those times. I got pulled last week for being in it at 6.30 am, maintaining the speed limit, but undertaking. When I pointed out the time to the Garda, he said fair enough, but I shouldn't have been undertaking......I said that as far as I knew the law states that you have to keep left, therefore I wasn't in the wrong. he still gave me a warning to not let him catch me at it again. BTW, I will continue to use that lane, when it's not within those stated times.

So am I an ignorant sod who should be stripped of his licence, or am I a better driver because I'm following the rule of law, and paying full atention to the road markings/road times??

Yeah sometimes they get it wrong and are to pigheaded to admit it, i was one pulled over by a gaurd in an estate who told me that i was going the wrong way down a one way street even though there was absolutly no sign to say such and a while line in the middle of the road.
Needless to say i kicked the living **** outta him

OldmanMondeo

gatecrash wrote: »

I was gonna post this on the overtaking in the slow lane thread, but it's so completely off topic that i reckoned I'd catch an earful.

There's a bus lane in Lucan village that operates from 7.00am to 9.30 am, so strictly speaking traffic should be driving in it outside those times. I got pulled last week for being in it at 6.30 am, maintaining the speed limit, but undertaking. When I pointed out the time to the Garda, he said fair enough, but I shouldn't have been undertaking......I said that as far as I knew the law states that you have to keep left, therefore I wasn't in the wrong. he still gave me a warning to not let him catch me at it again. BTW, I will continue to use that lane, when it's not within those stated times.

So am I an ignorant sod who should be stripped of his licence, or am I a better driver because I'm following the rule of law, and paying full atention to the road markings/road times??

What you must remember as well, when you come to the end of the bus lane YOU must merge with traffic from the right, road is clearly marked that the bus lanes ends, this will also explain why they put traffic lights up, so Buses can merge quickley. What you are doing is legal, but a lot of other motorist may decide not to let you merge, if this happens what are you going to do? Blow you horn and call them gobsh***? All you are really doing is saving a couple of minutes. You are only going to get stuck in the village when traffic is heavy.

Anan1

OldmanMondeo wrote: »

What you are doing is legal, but a lot of other motorist may decide not to let you merge, if this happens what are you going to do? Blow you horn and call them gobsh***? All you are really doing is saving a couple of minutes. You are only going to get stuck in the village when traffic is heavy.

The other alternative, not driving in the bus lane, is illegal.

Stark

Saruman wrote:

and secondly, as i found out later, he would be taking a left turn up ahead. Both legal.

It's not legal to drive in the bus lane just because you're turning left ahead. (unless there's broken white line/arrow ahead, meaning you can enter the bus lane at that point). I've seen people pulled for this.

craichoe

esel wrote: »

Not true, afaik. Think you posted this opinion before? Can you cite where this is stated as law?

Im not a student of law,

Its in the rules of road and one of the first thinks your learn.

Why would they have spaced lines and the start and end of the bus lane otherwise ?

AFAIK, you should never cross a solid white line to change lanes, you should enter and exit at the spaced lines, they are there for that very purpose.

Same goes for the motorways and roads in Europe, for example when you have a convergence of two motorways, you should only change when theres a spaced white line.

I remember driving out of dublin about 5 months ago after a big GAA quarter final. The traffic was terrible. There was a garda directing traffic down the quays near the train station. screaming.

USE THE BUS LANE!! ..

and waving his hand over at it.

Padraig Mor

craichoe wrote: »

you should never cross a solid white line to change lanes,.

The regulations were posted here before - the solid white line marking bus lanes is not a "legal" solid white line which you cannot cross (they are 100-150 mm wide).

L1011

Did you get the guards number? I'm the kind of beligerant sod that'd report him for that had it been me...

Breezer

Padraig Mor wrote: »

The regulations were posted here before - the solid white line marking bus lanes is not a "legal" solid white line which you cannot cross (they are 100-150 mm wide).

Been doing a lot of Googleing and can't find a definitive answer to this in the legislation. Decided to email the Department of Transport and see what they come up with, will report back here when I get a reply.

Padraig Mor

Breezer wrote: »

Been doing a lot of Googleing and can't find a definitive answer to this in the legislation. Decided to email the Department of Transport and see what they come up with, will report back here when I get a reply.

Wait no more!

SI 182/1997: Road Traffic (Traffic and Parking) Regulations, 1997 wrote:

Centre of Roadway Lines
25. (1) Where traffic sign number RRM 001 [continuous white line] has been provided on a roadway or where two such traffic signs are provided in parallel, a driver shall not cross that sign or signs.


Bus Lanes
32. (1) A bus lane shall be indicated by means of traffic sign number RUS 028 or traffic sign number RUS 029 used in association with traffic sign number RRM 024, and a contra flow bus lane shall be indicated by means of traffic sign number RUS 030 used in association with traffic sign number RRM 024.

SI 181/1997: Road Traffic (Signs) Regulations, 1997 wrote:

Centre of Roadway .
11. (1) The following traffic signs may be provided along the centre of a roadway:—

(a) traffic sign number RRM 001—a continuous white line approximately 100 or 150 millimetres wide and extending not less than 20 metres along the centre of the roadway, or
.
.
.
Bus Lane.
27. (1) Traffic sign number RRM 024 shall, in association with traffic sign number RUS 028, RUS 029 or RUS 030, indicate a bus lane.

(2) The sign to which sub-article (1) refers shall consist of—

(a) a continuous white line, or lines, 250 millimetres wide, save where one edge of the bus lane coincides with the centre line of a roadway between the bus lane and an adjoining traffic lane

Original Boards link
S.I. 181/1997
S.I. 182/1997

cyclopath2001

Padraig Mor wrote: »

The regulations were posted here before - the solid white line marking bus lanes is not a "legal" solid white line which you cannot cross (they are 100-150 mm wide).

In this case, the fact that it's a different kind of continuous white line to that that restricts overtaking is not important. What is important is this the second part of the regulation that you didn't quote.

(1) A bus lane shall be indicated by means of traffic sign number RUS 028 or traffic sign number RUS 029 used in association with traffic sign number RRM 024, and a contra flow bus lane shall be indicated by means of traffic sign number RUS 030 used in association with traffic sign number RRM 024.

(2) A person shall not enter a bus lane with a vehicle other than an omnibus or a pedal cycle during the period of operation of the bus lane which shall be indicated on an information plate.

Entering a bus lane to turn left is not permitted.

Padraig Mor

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

In this case, the fact that it's a different kind of continuous white line to that that restricts overtaking is not important. What is important is this the second part of the regulation that you didn't quote.



Entering a bus lane to turn left is not permitted.

Where did I mention anything about entering an 'active' bus lane to turn left??? I'm just pointing out that the solid white line indicating a bus lane can be crossed without penalty outside of the hours of operation of the lane.

Breezer

Seems fairly substantial, thanks Padraig Mor *resolves to look harder in future*

mildews

To the OP! you are totally correct to use this lane during the times stated, I wish there were more people like you using their head in Lucan instead of being a bunch of sheep following the car in front, not looking at the signs and afraid to enter the bus lane through pure ignorance!!

Now another point! the bus lane from woodies (Lucan) to the Penny hill pub. Would everyone stop driving in it 'cos its 24 hrs. Nearly involved in an accident today with a d*ck he*d in a 97 Civic (with the obligitory baseball cap of course!!!) who decided to try and undertake me when I was turning left to go to eurospar...
OK Rant over...................:mad::o:)