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I think I'm getting worse ...

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13

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    #62
    Pompey Magnus
    Registered Users Posts: 5,406 ✭✭✭Pompey Magnus


    Spyral wrote: »
    contraception is available at your chemist so again a non issue.

    I would think a bigger issue is the way that the Catholic Church opposes the use of contaceptives in Africa. They have pretty much given up campaigning in the west because they realise people don't buy their bullsh1t anymore but they can still peddle their lies in Africa where people generally are poorly educated. HIV is rampant in Africa, a policy of promoting abstention clearly doesn't work, yet the Church keep telling their followers that death by AIDS may be bad, but wearing a condom is worse.

    It is a disgusting tactic for a number of reasons, firstly that they are causing the deaths of uneducated people who believe what their priest tells them (like that b@stard the Catholic Archbishop of Mozambique telling his followers that condoms are deliberatly infected with AIDS in an effort by Europeans to kill Africans link) and secondly the blatant double standards they employ in so doing. They don't really tell educated white people that they will go to Hell if they use a condom, why, because educated white people won't listen to them and could well stop going to their masses and giving them money. But poor black people, well that's another story.


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    #63
    Hivemind187
    Registered Users Posts: 5,021 ✭✭✭Hivemind187


    Beruthiel wrote: »



    Because they do not understand the frustration of seeing an otherwise intelligent person believe in such silliness.


    Beruthiel,

    I agree with pretty much everything you have said. I take a slightly more irritated view sometimes its true.

    But the quotd sentence above is probably the most succinct way I have heard the particular sentiment put.

    Thank you.



    TIM:

    I have a blog. I have posted a link serveral times. See if you can find it.


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    #64
    sdep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 194 ✭✭sdep


    Hivemind187 wrote: »

    List of things that theists inflict on others every ****ing day.
    ...
    3) Church bells

    Can we not keep the bells? I kind of miss them here, but you can get a weekly fix courtesy of Radio 4. For the all aficionados reading, this week it's 'Steadman Triples' from St Olave's, London. Enjoy.


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    #65
    Hivemind187
    Registered Users Posts: 5,021 ✭✭✭Hivemind187


    sdep wrote: »
    Can we not keep the bells? I kind of miss them here, but you can get a weekly fix courtesy of Radio 4. For the all aficionados reading, this week it's 'Steadman Triples' from St Olave's, London. Enjoy.

    Actually I wouldnt mind them so much if they werent ringing at such innapropriate times as early Sunday morning. I mean its like Pavlovs dogs bimbling in to feed really isnt it? The bells ring and Chrisitians either stop working and feel pius for a moment or they all congregate in a single building as if under post-hypnotic suggestion.

    A friend of mine, rather meanly, refers to this as the Catholic herding instinct.


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    #66
    sdep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 194 ✭✭sdep


    Hivemind187 wrote: »
    Actually I wouldnt mind them so much if they werent ringing at such innapropriate times as early Sunday morning. I mean its like Pavlovs dogs bimbling in to feed really isnt it? The bells ring and Chrisitians either stop working and feel pius for a moment or they all congregate in a single building as if under post-hypnotic suggestion.

    A friend of mine, rather meanly, refers to this as the Catholic herding instinct.

    Where I grew up we mostly had the Church of England, which was a very attenuated strain of religion; if you didn't opt in they left you in peace, which probably explains why I'm happy to leave them be too. I do get momentarily indignant at weddings when I have to repeat a lot of things in which I don't believe, but I prefer that to turning down the happy couple on point of principle.


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    #67
    Whispered
    Registered Users Posts: 14,772 ✭✭✭✭Whispered


    sdep wrote: »
    I do get momentarily indignant at weddings when I have to repeat a lot of things in which I don't believe, but I prefer that to turning down the happy couple on point of principle.
    I think this is a good way of looking at things - think of it as being like going to a party. You know the host loves 80's music, which you HATE but you like the host so you'll go and maybe even enjoy the night. I dont understand why anyone who doesn't beliee in god would get annoyed about kneeling to him, if he doesn't exist.


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    #68
    djpbarry
    Registered Users Posts: 13,104 ✭✭✭✭djpbarry


    helena.ryan wrote: »
    You know the host loves 80's music, which you HATE but you like the host so you'll go and maybe even enjoy the night.
    A reasonably good analogy, but how much of an influence is an individual's taste in music likely to have on their lives? I see what you're getting at in terms of respecting the beliefs and opinions of others, which I would agree with in principle, but religious indoctrination is a little more serious than a **** taste in music!
    helena.ryan wrote: »
    I dont understand why anyone who doesn't beliee in god would get annoyed about kneeling to him, if he doesn't exist.
    It's not so much the imaginary entity as the supposedly all-powerful church that bothers people, myself included.


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    #69
    stevejazzx
    Registered Users Posts: 3,247 ✭✭✭stevejazzx


    helena.ryan wrote: »
    I think this is a good way of looking at things - think of it as being like going to a party. You know the host loves 80's music, which you HATE but you like the host so you'll go and maybe even enjoy the night.

    I personally don't don't believe 80's misic actually exists. I mean I've heard some stuff from the 80's but it just can't be real?
    I dont understand why anyone who doesn't beliee in god would get annoyed about kneeling to him, if he doesn't exist.
    [/quote]

    Emm there are many reasons...many reasons...but just to give you one:

    it's a flippin' barmy thing to have to do!'.


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    #70
    sdep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 194 ✭✭sdep


    stevejazzx wrote: »

    Emm there are many reasons...many reasons...but just to give you one:

    it's a flippin' barmy thing to have to do!'.

    And two:

    cartilage


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    #71
    Whispered
    Registered Users Posts: 14,772 ✭✭✭✭Whispered


    stevejazzx wrote: »
    I personally don't don't believe 80's misic actually exists. I mean I've heard some stuff from the 80's but it just can't be real? .
    How dare you disrespect my love for eighties music - doesn't exist my @rs3!


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    #72
    Whispered
    Registered Users Posts: 14,772 ✭✭✭✭Whispered


    djpbarry wrote: »
    , but religious indoctrination is a little more serious than a **** taste in music!
    .
    Yes I know what you mean but for the sake of a wedding, christening etc surely as a person it is just kinder to go along with something you don't necessarily agree with, and make the most out of what, for people you care about, is an important thing.


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    #73
    Tim Robbins
    Registered Users Posts: 9,000 ✭✭✭Tim Robbins


    helena.ryan wrote: »
    Yes I know what you mean but for the sake of a wedding, christening etc surely as a person it is just kinder to go along with something you don't necessarily agree with, and make the most out of what, for people you care about, is an important thing.
    My Sister who nevers goes to mass did the now standard hypocrisy thing and went for the Church wedding.
    She ask me to do a reading at it and I just said no, unless she really wanted me to do it and instead I helped her organise other things for her Wedding.

    I find it very disrespectful all these people who use the Church for show.


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    #74
    redfacedbear
    Registered Users Posts: 891 ✭✭✭redfacedbear


    Hivemind187 wrote: »
    Actually I wouldnt mind them so much if they werent ringing at such innapropriate times as early Sunday morning.
    sdep wrote: »
    Where I grew up we mostly had the Church of England, which was a very attenuated strain of religion; if you didn't opt in they left you in peace...

    You think the bells are bad? I've spent a few weekends staying in the suburbs of Leeds where you are awoken by the Salvation Army Brass Band striking up each Sunday morning! Now that's fun!


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    #75
    djpbarry
    Registered Users Posts: 13,104 ✭✭✭✭djpbarry


    Tim Robbins wrote: »
    My Sister who nevers goes to mass did the now standard hypocrisy thing and went for the Church wedding.
    She ask me to do a reading at it and I just said no, unless she really wanted me to do it and instead I helped her organise other things for her Wedding.
    I would probably have done the same. Yes, we should respect other people's wishes, particularly those who are close to us, but there is a limit.

    In fairness though, I don't think people always go for the church wedding for religious reasons. There are a lot of stunningly beautiful churches, cathedrals, mosques, synagogues, etc., in the world. It just fits in with the "perfect wedding" scenario.


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    #76
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,417 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    helena.ryan wrote: »
    I dont understand why anyone who doesn't believe in god would get annoyed about kneeling to him, if he doesn't exist.
    The feeling's a bit like being a vegetarian who's invited to a meal where the only thing on the table is raw steak.


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    #77
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,417 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    redfacedbear wrote: »
    You think the bells are bad? I've spent a few weekends staying in the suburbs of Leeds where you are awoken by the Salvation Army Brass Band striking up each Sunday morning! Now that's fun!
    Amateurs! Last October, I was in Jakarta over Idulfitri -- roughly, the Indonesian islamic equivalent of christmas. The local mosques cranked their amps up to eleven, and began a chant of the koran from beginning to end, from early Wednesday evening, finishing up on Saturday afternoon. Non-stop. I didn't bother trying to be polite about it after Friday lunchtime.

    Note I said 'mosques' too. There were many.


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    #78
    sdep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 194 ✭✭sdep


    Tim Robbins wrote: »
    My Sister who nevers goes to mass did the now standard hypocrisy thing and went for the Church wedding.
    She ask me to do a reading at it and I just said no, unless she really wanted me to do it and instead I helped her organise other things for her Wedding.

    I find it very disrespectful all these people who use the Church for show.

    I think the churches are complicit - they have a pretty good idea of how they're being used on these occasions.


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    #79
    redfacedbear
    Registered Users Posts: 891 ✭✭✭redfacedbear


    robindch wrote: »
    Amateurs! Last October, I was in Jakarta over Idulfitri -- roughly, the Indonesian islamic equivalent of christmas. The local mosques cranked their amps up to eleven, and began a chant of the koran from beginning to end, from early Wednesday evening, finishing up on Saturday afternoon. Non-stop. I didn't bother trying to be polite about it after Friday lunchtime.

    Note I said 'mosques' too. There were many.

    I'm surprised you managed to remain polite until Friday! I think I'd have gone postal before Wednesday was out.


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    #80
    Hivemind187
    Registered Users Posts: 5,021 ✭✭✭Hivemind187


    robindch wrote: »
    The feeling's a bit like being a vegetarian who's invited to a meal where the only thing on the table is raw steak.

    Very much so.

    I find the concept of supplicating oneself like that before something you find intellectually abhorrent distasteful.

    What I find even more distasteful was the speed of my aquiessence and startling recall of certain bits of the grotesque ritual.

    Quick question: Did one priest always stand off to one side and hold out a hand as if he were casting spells on the wine or is that a new thing?


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    #81
    estebancambias
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,103 ✭✭✭estebancambias


    robindch wrote: »
    Amateurs! Last October, I was in Jakarta over Idulfitri -- roughly, the Indonesian islamic equivalent of christmas. The local mosques cranked their amps up to eleven, and began a chant of the koran from beginning to end, from early Wednesday evening, finishing up on Saturday afternoon. Non-stop. I didn't bother trying to be polite about it after Friday lunchtime.

    Note I said 'mosques' too. There were many.


    Me thinks if you have a problem with someones culture, you should do your best to avoid that particular country.


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    #82
    Hivemind187
    Registered Users Posts: 5,021 ✭✭✭Hivemind187


    estebancambias wrote: »
    Me thinks if you have a problem with someones culture, you should do your best to avoid that particular country.

    Ha! Hah ha! HAHAHHAAAHAHAAAHHAA!!!


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    #83
    estebancambias
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,103 ✭✭✭estebancambias


    Nothing funny about it my friend, unless of course Robin was on a business trip.


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    #84
    Dades
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,558 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dades


    He may deny it, but we all know Robin works for the CIA.

    And they mean nothing, if not business...


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    #85
    Hivemind187
    Registered Users Posts: 5,021 ✭✭✭Hivemind187


    estebancambias wrote: »
    Me thinks if you have a problem with someones culture, you should do your best to avoid that particular country.

    estebancambias wrote: »
    Nothing funny about it my friend, unless of course Robin was on a business trip.

    You are honestly going to tell me you dont see why your first statement is funny? Have you heard the term "double standard" before?


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    #86
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,417 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    estebancambias wrote: »
    Nothing funny about it my friend, unless of course Robin was on a business trip.
    Which it happened to be of course. And the moaning minarets aside, Jakarta's got the best restaurants I've ever eaten in -- and all of it on somebody else's account too. Life is good.

    But that's not to say that misery's a bad thing:

    http://www.unclepasha.com/misery_russian.htm

    Must be the repressed catholic in me.


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    #87
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,417 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Dades wrote: »
    He may deny it, but we all know Robin works for the CIA.
    Not for the CIA, but for the shadowy jewish cabal which controls it from a secret underground bunker in Cabinteely.


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    #88
    Gizmodeon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 594 ✭✭✭Gizmodeon


    Hive I completely agree with you over the original post

    I went to my great aunts funeral in a church, and it was painful listening to the priest spout on about how she was a great person.
    1. My great aunt hadn't been to church in years because she was an atheist
    2. The guy never met her
    3. She often joked about how her funeral would be because she was an archaeologist and she studied them!
    So this made the whole ceremony a joke!
    The family members who chose to have a Christian funeral for her were in the wrong in the end though. She wanted to have her ashes scattered over the Wicklow mountains but it was never put in her will:(

    But to hear a priest make statements that "She is now with god in his loving embrace yada yada... was incredibly uncomfortable and insulting because this man claimed to know this wonderful caring woman (who if there was an atheists version of a saint, she would be one)

    I'd much prefer that if at my death, even if my family decided to have it in a church that a family member would be up there saying something from the heart, someone who genuinely knew me. Not this pre-written vague testament given to every person at their funeral, but something that celebrates the person themselves, not the persons beliefs


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    #89
    Dades
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,558 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dades


    Gizmodeon, that sounds particularly frustrating.

    Whatever about burying a believer, but to have some robed-stranger spout off about a self-admitted non-believer and then not scattering her ashes?

    That's sounds just selfish on the part of the people left behind.


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    #90
    Hivemind187
    Registered Users Posts: 5,021 ✭✭✭Hivemind187


    Dades wrote: »
    Gizmodeon, that sounds particularly frustrating.

    Whatever about burying a believer, but to have some robed-stranger spout off about a self-admitted non-believer and then not scattering her ashes?

    That's sounds just selfish on the part of the people left behind.

    Unfortunately it appears to happen more often than not.


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    #91
    karen3212
    Closed Accounts Posts: 668 ✭✭✭karen3212


    I felt a bit like you a few years ago, because I started working with some Southern US evangelicals - constantly bringing God(at the begining) into the lunch conversation. I was going crazy until I saw this A&A site, and have become more relaxed about it all.

    I don't mind at all going into chruches with friends and family, the preaching I hate but apart from that I like the bells, the singing etc. I also really like the muslim call to prayer, loved hearing it when I was over that way.

    I must say I like your way of saying things -that may be shocking straight out too - but all I want to say is, the way we say things depends on what we want to do: that is, get people thinking about the laws of the country and changing some of them, or offending them so much that they stop listening.


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