Knowledge about BMW 523...

Ronan H

Hi I'm thinking of buying a 1997ish BMW 523 and was wondering if people could share any knowledge they have about them?

Cheers...

Ronan

richie_rvf

Apart from all the usual stuff to look at when buying a second hand car - check to see if the engine or 'short block' has been changed.

Those engines suffered from a problem to do with the material the block was made from, NIKASIL - do a search on google and you will find lots of info.

michaelanthony

I had one and it drank oil and it was slow aswell. I'd say the 528 is a lot better.

Fey!

KBannon is probably the best person on here to talk to; he has a '97 523 himself.

Tails142

Have a 528 myself - they can be prone to overheating so may have a warped cylinder head which would appear as losing coolant/oil possible a mayo residue on oil cap. If you take it off and it looks clean that would also ring alarm bells for me as it should have some sort of a residue on it.

I wouldnt imagine the 523 is 'slow' - 528 is quick alright but you never get to hear the lovely sound of the engine as once you rev it you're doing 60+ before you know it. Could be better to get a 520 as you'll get to hear the grunt more often. I'd imagine even the 520i is plenty fast.

You might be missing some pixels on the speedo display but this is a common fault - pricey to fix properly though but you can take the unit apart and fix it yourself (or so I've read).

Nothing much else that I know of which goes wrong on these cars commonly. Just watch for dodgy electrics I suppose as would expensive to fix.

bbability

Mate of mine bought a 1997 Bimer 528i police car from the UK. He's restoring it as we speak to its original spec. Vascar, lights the works... Its mechanically sound. Has a few extra's that your standard 528 wouldn't have. but enginewise wouldn't be far off a standard 528. He did have trouble with the starting motor. not sure if he got it sorted yet but other than that is driving beautifully...according to its owner (who has a special permit to drive it)

GB15

michaelanthony wrote: »

I had one and it was slow. I'd say the 528 is a lot better.

As far as I remember the older model 525 had 192 bhp but the 523 you're talking about reduced its output to 170 bhp even though its also a 2.5 litre. They obviously weren't considering the Irish tax system when they made that decision.

Fey!

Tails142 wrote: »

Could be better to get a 520 as you'll get to hear the grunt more often. I'd imagine even the 520i is plenty fast.

1998 520 = 150bhp 2.0 litre straight 6 http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=search&maxrows=100&MakeID=3&xMakeID=3&ModelID=23&xModelID=23&Year=1998&xYear=1998&submit=Find+cars+%3E%3E
1997 523 = 170bhp 2.5 litre straight 6 http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=search&maxrows=100&MakeID=3&xMakeID=3&ModelID=24&xModelID=24&Year=1997&xYear=1997&submit=Find+cars+%3E%3E
2001 525 = 192bhp 2.5 litre straight 6 http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=search&maxrows=100&MakeID=3&xMakeID=3&ModelID=25&xModelID=25&Year=2001&xYear=2001&submit=Find+cars+%3E%3E

I have a 520, and I drive a 525 regularly. The difference between them is night and day. I've also driven a 523, which falls fairly squarely between the 2. The 523 is quicker than the 520, and the 525 is far more economical than the 520 (tested this on a Galway/Antrim run, and a Galway/Ennis run, with the 2 cars in convoy at the speed limit. Difference was about 10%). The bigger engine is better able to cope with the weight of the car.

Nikasil affects straight 6 e39s (e39 is the product code for BMW 5 series from 1996 to 2003) with a build date prior to April 1998. Nikasil was an engine coating stripped away by excess sulphur in petrol, most commonly used in northern England. April 1998 onwards used alusil liners. However, I haven't heard of anyone having a nikasil problem in the last couple of years; I think that any engines with that problem have long since stopped running. This is, however, all open to correction.

I haven't had any serious issues with my 1998 520 in the 3 years I've owned it, with the exception of the MAF.

Something to watch, however, is clocking - these 5 series are notoriously easy to do. If you're buying, get a specialist to check it out; the mileage register in the car is kept in a couple of different places, so just make sure that they concur with each other. Also, if you get a dealer service, the key shows them the mileage; if it's clocked, the mileage shown by the key mightn't change between services.

If I was you, I'd look for a model with cruise control and other toys. However, these may not have been available until 1998, but I'm not sure.

HTH

MercMad

These are lovely motors, and all the above is correct !

They also have the following problems on a regular basis, the airbag light comes on, due to the passenger seat sensor going faulty. However replacement tends to only last a year or two. Alot of airbag problems are also caused by wiring under the passenger seat so check that first before buying anything.

The rear aluminium control arm bushes wear out after only low, mileages and the whole arm needs replacement, its an NCT failure, but they are available spurious at about €100 for both afaik.

Gearboxes, manuals, can give trouble. Its a known fault and later cars were modified, after 2000 I think. A gearbox rebuild is about €700 exchange, plus labour ! Check it goes into and out of seconds gear perfectly, and walk if it doesn't, or preferably buy an auto' !

The aircon can fail due to a blown resistor. Its a DIY job and the parts costs about €50.

Dealers will multiply all the above charges by, so find a good independent liken AC cars and avoid the dealers unless you like to spend €100 getting 2 wiper blades fitted !!

Thieves !

Lex Luthor

where do you start?

you can get a good one or a bad one...

I ran one for 3yrs....had more problems on it that I expected but when I sold it on last year I thought it was in better condition now than when I got it

look for someone who took care of it....there are still leather ones out there so don't be afraid to wait for one

definitely get climate control

do you have a link to one you are specifically looking at?

Ronan H

Lex Luthor wrote: »

do you have a link to one you are specifically looking at?

http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=870209
http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=905159
http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=785876 Some nice features on this one, including leather, but im suspicious about the milage...

I must say im very fond of that minty jadey green colour...

Fey! wrote: »

Something to watch, however, is clocking - these 5 series are notoriously easy to do. If you're buying, get a specialist to check it out; the mileage register in the car is kept in a couple of different places, so just make sure that they concur with each other. Also, if you get a dealer service, the key shows them the mileage; if it's clocked, the mileage shown by the key mightn't change between services.

Of all the ones ive linked above they all have milage less than 90K which im wary of with a car that age... If you look at the page below the milage ranges from 80+K to 164K so its hard to know which is accurate... Double the milage is a lot of a discrepancy between cars within the 1996-1999 bracket...

http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=search&sortby=MileageAsc&maxrows=50&MakeID=3&ModelID=24&Price_Max=5000&GroupID=738

Im also fond of this one too but theres only one picture and it looks like a yellow plate so that might rule it out...

http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=668268

Thanks for all the replies lads (i mean that collactively if there are any female posters!)

Ronan

Fey!

I didn't get a chance to open your links, but wrt mileage, check for wear on the drivers seat and on the steering wheel, as well as the drivers footwell carpet. If the wear seems excessive, walk away.

The airbag light; I forgot to include this. Adjusting the drivers seat can jerk the cable and turn on the light. I'm 6'5", so whenever someone else drives the car, or I drive my mothers one, inevitably the airbag light turns on. It's €80 for the dealer to plug into a diagnostic and turn it off. The kit to turn it off is €75 on ebay, and diagnoses and resets both OBD1 and OBD2 systems (comes from a company in Dublin on ebay.ie, just like this one http://cgi.ebay.ie/BMW-Airbag-Light-Reset-Tool-E34-E36-E38-E39-E46-Z3-SRS_W0QQitemZ290201113358QQihZ019QQcategoryZ30921QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem); it's cheaper long term to buy the reset tool (you may have to gently rock the drivers seat for the reset to work).

As for arms and things, I haven't had any problems. I did replace front shocks for NCT due to imbalance, which I got from www.accarsales.com for a lot less than the dealer price (I use them for all of my parts now).

Ronan H

I dont really mind hanging on to get a model thats in good shape so do people reckon it would be better to get someone like AC to source the car I want or take my chances trawling the websites and going with a dealer? I know theres no black and white answer to these sort of questions and they probably bug people but i find the boards incredibly useful for this sort of thing. I found out a ton of info. about a 518 i had a while back through various boards so long may it last...

I would consider a 520 also, i know a few people mentioned them. My budget would be about 6K maximum, which suits me fine coz you cant beat the older BM's for style IMO... I fell in love with the front end of my 518... Mmmmm...

Head

Lex Luthor

Fey! wrote: »

I didn't get a chance to open your links, but wrt mileage, check for wear on the drivers seat and on the steering wheel, as well as the drivers footwell carpet. If the wear seems excessive, walk away.

The airbag light; I forgot to include this. Adjusting the drivers seat can jerk the cable and turn on the light. I'm 6'5", so whenever someone else drives the car, or I drive my mothers one, inevitably the airbag light turns on. It's €80 for the dealer to plug into a diagnostic and turn it off. The kit to turn it off is €75 on ebay, and diagnoses and resets both OBD1 and OBD2 systems (comes from a company in Dublin on ebay.ie, just like this one http://cgi.ebay.ie/BMW-Airbag-Light-Reset-Tool-E34-E36-E38-E39-E46-Z3-SRS_W0QQitemZ290201113358QQihZ019QQcategoryZ30921QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem); it's cheaper long term to buy the reset tool (you may have to gently rock the drivers seat for the reset to work).

As for arms and things, I haven't had any problems. I did replace front shocks for NCT due to imbalance, which I got from www.accarsales.com for a lot less than the dealer price (I use them for all of my parts now).

Fey, I would suggest getting the connector removed on that air bag loom and replaced by hardwiring the wires together. Got it done myslef and no more problems after that

As for checking wear on seats, etc

I think the dark seats on these wear very well and its hard to tell the mileage

carpets can be changed and steering wheels might not get any worse after the first 80k miles

if the car has anything less than 12-15k per year, then it should be backed up by a service history, otherwise be suspicious

Lex Luthor

Head, that last one is sold anyway

You have to buy one of these cars with your head....trust me

They can look really good and a great deal but they can be expensive to fix if they go bad

If you do decide to test drive one, ask for it to be switched off for a while and be able to start it from cold

The temp needle should start moving after 2 miles and move nice and smoothly to the centre point and stay there and not move a mm once there. If it is a mm either side, then something is up. Also, try to have it idle after the test drive for about 5-10 min and it should not budge.

They have a viscous fan and it should operate without problem

The front control arms are also worth checking

Turn the steering wheel full left and expose the front tyre thread of the left front wheel and kick the thread hard. If the wheel rocks back and forward more than an inch, then you will need to think about replacing either upper and or both lower arms. Repeat for right side

Check the front lights. These had a problem with the LCM failing on one of the front lights keeping the full beam on. Make sure they all work and it hasn't been disconnected.

Throttle pedal should be smooth & free. Cheap to replace but should be done after 80k miles

If I think of anything else I'll let you know, but obviously the Nikasil issue is the most important.

E92

Fey! wrote: »

(e39 is the product code for BMW 5 series from 1996 to 2003)

No it's not. E39 is the product code for it;):D!

As others have said, the main problem with early E39s is indeed the Nikasil problem. Electrical and overheating problems aren't unknown either(especially overheating, a common fault on many BMWs, always check that). They do well in reliability surveys though apart from that. I know several people who have/had an E39 520i, and they had no problems at all, other than the high cost of genuine BMW parts of course!

If you get the M52TU engine, then it's a case of problem solved! BMW introduced the M52TU in Week 10 in 1998. Apart from changing from Nikasil to Iron Linings, the other change was that the engine gained double VANOS(it was VANOS before that).

If the non double VANOS ones have more than 100k miles on the clock, I wouldn't worry, the Nikasil issue rares it's ugly head between 60-100k miles, so if it made it past 100k then it's highly unlikely to surface(some also had the block replaced by BMW for a non Nikasil block).

mick.fr

Overheating on bimmers is occuring because people don't drain the cooling system at regular intervals.
Also it is recommended to change some parts when you reach 60k miles.
Like water pump and so.

Seth Brundle

The 523i is a great car. As said, its not as powerful as the 528i but it was never meant to be! It still gives a respectable burst of acceleration when needed. Mine is on about 112,000 miles now and badly in need of a service but still was quick on the M1 to and from Belfast today.
Economy varies depending on usual factors but on a long run I can get ~40mpg.
Go for one with:
* full verifiable service history.
* leather
* electronic dual climate control (not the normal knobs)
* 6 CD in boot
* sunroof
* cruise
* sports seats (pull out bit under knee)
* 17" wheels

Engines at this stage should either have got the nikasil bug or not and I wouldn't let that dictate your decision now. Anyhow, a quick check is to start the engine from cold and open the drivers door. If there is a lot of shaking then there could well be issues. A leak down test should reveal.

Make sure all electrical items work right through from the lights to the washer jets, etc. Anyhow, get a BMW specialist to check it over before you part with money.
Also remember that if you are really into it you may opt for to upgrade your front, side and rear lights and this can cost a about €500

Ronan H

What is it about BM's and overheating, it just seems to be part of the package these days! Theres such a lot of stuff to be looking out for that you would wonder how anyone logistically manages to buy a car with all the stuff that needs to be checked out. You would nearly need to spend half a day driving it and kicking it to see if its up to scratch!

Anyway, i will try not let that deter me. I have wanted to own a BM for years (not counting the 518, i only had that a short time due to - you guessed it - overheating problems :rolleyes:) so i dont want to buy one thats gonna crack up after a week. What a disappointment that would be. Ill have a list as long as my arm and a fleet of mobile mechanics with me when i go to look at some potential buys!

Thanks again for the info, keep it coming, ill get it all together in a smaller bundle at some stage...

Ronan

E92

Head wrote: »

What is it about BM's and overheating, it just seems to be part of the package these days!

I know. You'd think in this day and age they would have sorted out that problem. It's why I think removing the temperature gauge in them was a big mistake.

I can never understand why this problem occurs in them, because Germany is much more humid and hotter than here, and of course BMW is German, so you would have thought that BMW would design cars that work in the homeland and if they did that there would never be a problem here then either.

The other thing is most BMW owners tend to drive their cars a lot harder than most other car owners, so it's not like most of them will have had an easy life either, so that exacerbates any design flaws there!