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Should the Government ban fox-hunting?

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    #92
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    togster wrote: »

    Foxes are vermin and predators. I have seen the aftermath of a fox kill in a pheasant pin and they are indiscriminate killers.
    .

    So what were the pheasants doing in the pheasant pin then?

    lol @ people giving human attributes to animals, though I'd have imagined animals that kill "indiscriminately" for fun would be well recieved by the hunting community, birds of a feather and all that. :)


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    #93
    togster
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,931 ✭✭✭togster


    SDooM wrote: »
    Well see... tbh I listen to people who defend hunting and they sound exactly like the nazis you are describing.

    Same could be said of people who are shouting for a ban ;)


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    #94
    Degsy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,397 ✭✭✭✭Degsy


    SDooM wrote: »

    1) There are more effective and humane methods of vermin control.

    2) Enjoying scaring an animal to death is not a reason to do it.

    1)like what?gassing?Poison?Have you evers een it been done?Also it does not discriminate between young foxes and old foxes,it kills everything.
    2)Nothing gets scared to death.Most foxes escape,if they dont they're killed either by the dogs or they're shot by terrier men.You dont know hat you're talking about.


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    #95
    Genghiz Cohen
    Registered Users Posts: 7,182 ✭✭✭Genghiz Cohen


    Jeremiah 16:1 wrote: »
    LMAO!:D

    God, go back into Discworld man, looks like fantasy is where you belong...

    Yes and by your name, believing in things you have been told and can't prove for yourself, belittling other people when they disagree with you is right up your alley.


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    #96
    Doctor DooM
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    togster wrote: »
    Name the more effective methods? Have you witnessed a fox being gassed? Poisoned? Shot? Killed by hounds?

    I don't hunt because i enjoy scaring a fox to death. Have you ever witnessed a fox being pursued by a group of hounds? He doesn't run yelping and shaking with his tail between his legs. He runs to get away. That is his sole purpose.

    I have seen foxes leisurely trot across a field with hounds in it. And i have also seen one speeding away from baying hounds. Have you ever witnessed a fox being chased?

    I am not a vet. ACtually, I would like to see some vets opinions.

    Why not capture them and then put them to sleep quietly. Theres a thought.

    An animal running for their life wont yelp. They make noise to look for help.

    Yes I have seen a fox being chased.


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    #97
    togster
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,931 ✭✭✭togster


    SDooM wrote: »
    Try saying the word "vet" to my dog and you will see fear.

    Your dog is a domesticated animal. You have conditioned him to feel


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    #98
    Rossibaby
    Closed Accounts Posts: 421 ✭✭Rossibaby


    SDooM wrote: »
    Well see... tbh I listen to people who defend hunting and they sound exactly like the nazis you are describing. A point which you have hit on, and is interesting, is this: Our views are formed on the resources we have access to. Ultimately, you cannot know the ultimate truth: it is your responsibility to try and find out as much as you can about a subject and when you are happy. form an opinion.

    I have never seen one letter, programme,word or hunt ( and I have seen one, in passing) which convinces me that in all honestly, deep down, a hunt comes down to people enjoying animal cruelty. Any other fringe benefits are just that.

    are you saying that your findings have been that people do it for themselves first and throw in the fringe benefits as an excuse and added incentive though they just say it and pay it little regard.if thats your point i agree entirely


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    #99
    Red Hand
    Registered Users Posts: 4,986 ✭✭✭Red Hand


    Genghiz Cohen wrote: »
    Yes and by your name, believing in things you have been told and can't prove for yourself, belittling other people when they disagree with you is right up your alley.

    I'm an athiest, bud.;)


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    #100
    Genghiz Cohen
    Registered Users Posts: 7,182 ✭✭✭Genghiz Cohen


    SDooM wrote: »
    Why not capture them and then put them to sleep quietly. Theres a thought.

    That would be the best way, but think of how hard it would be to do.
    Jeremiah 16:1 wrote:
    I'm an athiest, bud.

    Yet you accept what you have been told with no solid evidence behind it!? *Focuses shame @ Jeremiah*


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    #101
    togster
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,931 ✭✭✭togster


    SDooM wrote: »
    Why not capture them and then put them to sleep quietly. Theres a thought.

    An animal running for their life wont yelp. They make noise to look for help.

    Yes I have seen a fox being chased.

    How do you suggest you trap them? How would you administer euthanasia? I mean come on!!
    And you don't think the fox would suffer due to stress?
    Have you ever seen a trapped fox?


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    #102
    pm.
    Registered Users Posts: 2,142 ✭✭✭pm.


    no, i love shooting and now coming into lambing season the farmers can have a battle on there hands, the country is over run with foxs just go to a few fields with a lamp and open your eyes.


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    #103
    It wasn't me!
    Registered Users Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    Hell no! A fox will go mental and destroy itself in any kind of captivity. That would be the most cruel, stupid thing imaginable.


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    #104
    Doctor DooM
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    togster wrote: »
    Your dog is a domesticated animal. You have conditioned him to feel

    I was asked if animals have the potential to fear. You obvisouly argee with me so, if I can make him feel.


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    #105
    togster
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,931 ✭✭✭togster


    Exactly but trying to get someone who has no experience with foxes to understand is very difficult!:)


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    #106
    Doctor DooM
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    togster wrote: »
    How do you suggest you trap them? How would you administer euthanasia? I mean come on!!
    And you don't think the fox would suffer due to stress?
    Have you ever seen a trapped fox?

    As I pointed out- Im not a vet.

    How are they trapped? Tempted with food?

    Put an anaesthetic in the food. Sleepy fox.


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    #107
    togster
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,931 ✭✭✭togster


    You don't need to be a vet to understand the logistics of trapping a fox. You came up with this idea so please....

    How would you trap the fox... Anaesthetic? really? How often are you going to check the trap?
    AGAIN HAVE YOU EVER SEEN A TRAPPED FOX?

    This is the real world?


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    #108
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    Genghiz Cohen wrote: »
    That would be the best way, but think of how hard it would be to do.

    It would also cost money rather than generate revenue. If animal libbers want to offer the service for free to farmers then I am sure some farmers will go for it if its economical and efficient.

    It looks to me like it would be massively inefficient use of effort though.

    You are basically going to all the bother of a hunt while making it more difficult on yourself by taking extra care not to actually harm it so that you can kill it intact instead.

    Its going to be psychologically stressed in any event when you get it back to the holding/execution place anyway - at least it will be once it realises whats in store.

    I dont see your way as being particularly more humane to be honest. We have been hunting them for thousands of years - I dont see anything wrong with giving them a sporting chance if anything its more fair on the animal that way. They are not in any way endangered they are vermin and a pest to wherever they breed.

    You have to thin out their numbers (ned!) anyway on horseback with hounds across the country side seems more fair than either shotguns or boltguns/injections.


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    #109
    togster
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,931 ✭✭✭togster


    SDooM wrote: »
    I was asked if animals have the potential to fear. You obvisouly argee with me so, if I can make him feel.

    Are you seriously equating what your dog feels with how a wild animal interacts in its natural environment.


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    #110
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    Degsy wrote: »
    1)like what?gassing?Poison?Have you evers een it been done?Also it does not discriminate between young foxes and old foxes,it kills everything.

    True, at least the hounds and the various lickspittles who attend them on behalf of his lordship check the foxes for ID before having a go. Oh wait...


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    #111
    pm.
    Registered Users Posts: 2,142 ✭✭✭pm.


    how many people have actually seen a fox being shot, i use a .243 its kills instantly a lot quicker than a needle.


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    #112
    Degsy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,397 ✭✭✭✭Degsy


    SDooM wrote: »
    Put an anaesthetic in the food. Sleepy fox.

    Sweet jesus.This is a wild predator not a tame guinea pig.


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    #113
    Degsy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,397 ✭✭✭✭Degsy


    Bambi wrote: »
    True, at least the hounds and the various lickspittles who attend them on behalf of his lordship check the foxes for ID before having a go. Oh wait...

    I meant the differenec between adult foxes and fox cubs.gas and poison kills cubs too.Cubs dont flee from hounds ergo they are not chased.See?


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    #114
    Genghiz Cohen
    Registered Users Posts: 7,182 ✭✭✭Genghiz Cohen


    pm. wrote: »
    how many people have actually seen a fox being shot, i use a .243 its kills instantly a lot quicker than a needle.

    Hornet here, they never hear the shot.


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    #115
    togster
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,931 ✭✭✭togster


    Bambi wrote: »
    True, at least the hounds and the various lickspittles who attend them on behalf of his lordship check the foxes for ID before having a go. Oh wait...

    We don't have lords in Ireland. And foxes don't have ID's

    Note: Please inform yourself of theses basic facts.


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    #116
    Genghiz Cohen
    Registered Users Posts: 7,182 ✭✭✭Genghiz Cohen


    togster wrote: »
    We don't have lords in Ireland. And foxes don't have ID's

    Note: Please inform yourself of theses basic facts.

    :confused::confused:


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    #117
    togster
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,931 ✭✭✭togster


    Genghiz Cohen wrote: »
    :confused::confused:

    Sorry!
    Was trying to be sarcastic.....:(


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    #118
    Doctor DooM
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    togster wrote: »
    You don't need to be a vet to understand the logistics of trapping a fox. You came up with this idea so please....

    How would you trap the fox... Anaesthetic? really? How often are you going to check the trap?
    AGAIN HAVE YOU EVER SEEN A TRAPPED FOX?

    This is the real world?

    No I haven't seen a trapped one.

    How are the other 99% of foxes killed so?


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    #119
    Doctor DooM
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    Degsy wrote: »
    Sweet jesus.This is a wild predator not a tame guinea pig.

    Anaesthetic doesn't work on wild animals?


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    #120
    Genghiz Cohen
    Registered Users Posts: 7,182 ✭✭✭Genghiz Cohen


    SDooM wrote: »
    Anaesthetic doesn't work on wild animals?

    I think he means that wild animals will be mistrusting of anything with the scent of human on it. That or he can't picture a fox eating out of a bowl with 'Rex' written on it.


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    #121
    Doctor DooM
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    Genghiz Cohen wrote: »
    I think he means that wild animals will be mistrusting of anything with the scent of human on it. That or he can't picture a fox eating out of a bowl with 'Rex' written on it.

    I can see why. Rex would be a stupid name for a fox. :)


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