[Eircom & Resellers..BT, UTV etc] ADSL Speed upgrade to 8MB discussion...ongoing

rc28

kamin99 wrote: »

Line State Up
Modulation DMT
Data Path Interleave



Downstream Upstream
Max Allowed Speed (kbps) 6144 512
SN Margin (dB) 11.00 12.00
Line Attenuation (dB) 40.50 27.00
CRC Errors 0 5

---

Thanks, that ping time is quite disappointing and your line isn't syncing at the 7.6mb. Have you tried improving your SN by removing all other filters and plugging the phone line from the router directly into the master socket? It could also be your router that is holding you back especially if you have a netopia 2247.

Gonzo

rc28 wrote: »

Thanks, that ping time is quite disappointing and your line isn't syncing at the 7.6mb. Have you tried improving your SN by removing all other filters and plugging the phone line from the router directly into the master socket? It could also be your router that is holding you back especially if you have a netopia 2247.

I heard one other report from a person upgraded that their pings of 20 are now over 100 with the new upgrade and the above poster seems to have the same, very worrying. If this really is true then its down to 3meg package i go. We should know for sure this weekend when half the country will be upgraded.

StickyMcGinty

Gonzo wrote: »

I heard one other report from a person upgraded that their pings of 20 are now over 100 with the new upgrade and the above poster seems to have the same, very worrying. If this really is true then its down to 3meg package i go. We should know for sure this weekend when half the country will be upgraded.

yea that would be very disappointing if high pings ended up being the status-quo

what do you reckon the problem is? Is it eircom cutting corners - i.e. upgrading speeds without upgrading the exchange capacity?

rc28

Gonzo wrote: »

I heard one other report from a person upgraded that their pings of 20 are now over 100 with the new upgrade and the above poster seems to have the same, very worrying. If this really is true then its down to 3meg package i go. We should know for sure this weekend when half the country will be upgraded.

Yes we'll see but if it is the case for everyone then Eircom will be in a lot of trouble with a good chunk of their customer base- loads of people use their BB for gaming. Is there anything that can be done on eircom's end to improve the pings?
They stand to lose a lot of money if people start switching down to the 3mb like you(the price difference between the current 3mb package and the 2mb is 18euro ffs!)

Gonzo

Cud it be that the pings are often reaching 100ms on lines that arent reaching the full 7.6meg speed? Maybe the inability of the connection to reach the max speed setting is making pings higher? Hope this isnt the case coz i'd imagine the majority of users wont get the full 7.6meg unless they are next door to the exchange on a very good line.

StickyMcGinty

rc28 wrote: »

Is there anything that can be done on eircom's end to improve the pings?

only thing that springs to mind is calling them up and requesting fastpath, but i cant see that bringing the pings down to as low as they were

kamin99, any chance you could do a tracert to ftp.heanet.ie ?

Sponge Bob

StickyMcGinty wrote: »

just looking at a neighbours network there, they live right next door to me so in theory the stats should be similar. kinda shows the difference between the two routers, we both have the routers hooked up to the master socket

[B]Netopia 3347NWG[/B] (my line, older all black eircom router)

                                    Downstream     Upstream
Max Allowed Speed (kbps)        3072          384
[B]SN Margin (dB)                        31.00        10.00[/B]
Line Attenuation (dB)                24.00        12.00

[B]Netopia 2247[/B] (silver model)

                                     Downstream     Upstream
Max Allowed Speed (kbps)         2048                 256
[B]SN Margin (dB)                         18.50               14.00[/B]
Line Attenuation (dB)                 20.50               11.00
CRC Errors                                 2195                 18

You know it strikes me that the silver eircom netopia WILL NOT see more than about 25db of Margin even if there may be more there .

The old black Netopia was able to see 31db of margin which is more than you need to go from 3mbits to 7.6mbits, can you please post again after the upgrade Sticky and possibly post the 2247 stats on teh neighbours line before and after, its a very useful comparator ??

I see the gnashing and wailing of teeth starting this weekend and requiring a new thread for the 3mbits and another one for the 2mbits people ( they only need to remove the filter in some cases ).

if i plug my router into his line, i get stats close enough to the ones i get at home. My SNR margin is actually better than his and i've a meg faster.

Can you clarify this, does he end up with 30db of margin too ??

Just an example on how your router can mess up your SNR.

Komplett will be very busy for the next few weeks.

Sponge Bob

kamin99 wrote: »

Downstream Upstream
Max Allowed Speed (kbps) 6144 512
SN Margin (dB) 11.00 12.00
Line Attenuation (dB) 40.50 27.00

Dude , did you follow the 'steps' I posted 2 days back in this thread, you only need to get another (about) 8 db of margin out of somewhere, ideally 10db .

1. Unplugging Filter 2db
2. Removing surge protector 2db
3. Using main socket instead of extension socket in house, minimum 2db
4. Unplugging sky box, 2db
5. Unplugging phones 2db

etc etc

Tell us how the Db margin hunt goes for ya with step by step stats please.

Tweaky

Originally Posted by Sponge Bob

READ THIS EXPLANATION OF WHAT STATS TELL YOU !! especially if on a 3mbit line .

Anyone with margin of 25db+ and stable 3mbit should get the 7.6 upgrade or near enough.

You lose about 4db-5db per megabit of upgrade

25db margin now should be 5db at worst after the upgrade , tight that .
8db is the recommended floor and after that you may have problems.

In other words 3mbits to 7.6mbits will require that you have 18-24Db of margin to spare thereby leaving you with no less than 8Db after the upgrade so thats either 18+8 = 26Db or 24+8=32Db ....between 26db and 32Db NOW.

If you have 20db margin , or less, today on a 3mbit line you will NOT get 7.6Mbit stable on that line with THAT modem unless you do something .

My attenuation is 7db
My Sn Margin is 21db
My line is the 3mbit line

I was quiet happy with the stats and was sure I would be able to get the full 7.6mb being only 500m from the exchange. However after reading the post by Sponge Bob I see that I will be very marginal and will have an extremely low SN margin after the upgrade.
I have removed filters and plugged straight into the eircom box and still get the 21db . I'm not technical enough to rewire the box.

I currently have the Netgear DG834G V2 and did have stats of Attenuation 10db and SN Margin of 29db until I upgraded to the latest firmware and the stats dropped to the above.

My questions are
Do i have any hope of having a stable 7.6mb connection ?
Any idea why the stats dropped due to the firmware upgrade on the modem ?

Thanks.

rc28

Tweaky wrote: »

My attenuation is 7db
My Sn Margin is 21db
My line is the 3mbit line

I was quiet happy with the stats and was sure I would be able to get the full 7.6mb being only 500m from the exchange. However after reading the post by Sponge Bob I see that I will be very marginal and will have an extremely low SN margin after the upgrade.
I have removed filters and plugged straight into the eircom box and still get the 21db . I'm not technical enough to rewire the box.

I currently have the Netgear DG834G V2 and did have stats of Attenuation 10db and SN Margin of 29db until I upgraded to the latest firmware and the stats dropped to the above.

My questions are
Do i have any hope of having a stable 7.6mb connection ?
Any idea why the stats dropped due to the firmware upgrade on the modem ?

Thanks.

Yes, you're attenuation is excellent and your line is obviously capacble of 29 SN so all you need to do is get a different router or somehow change back the firmware- have you searched google or netgear support for people with a similar problem after the fw update?

Psygnosis

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Dude , did you follow the 'steps' I posted 2 days back in this thread, you only need to get another (about) 8 db of margin out of somewhere, ideally 10db .

1. Unplugging Filter 2db
2. Removing surge protector 2db
3. Using main socket instead of extension socket in house, minimum 2db
4. Unplugging sky box, 2db
5. Unplugging phones 2db

etc etc

Tell us how the Db margin hunt goes for ya with step by step stats please.

When you say unplug surge protector does this mean surge protectors anywhere in the house or if you are using one only on the modem

StickyMcGinty

Sponge Bob wrote: »

The old black Netopia was able to see 31db of margin which is more than you need to go from 3mbits to 7.6mbits, can you please post again after the upgrade Sticky and possibly post the 2247 stats on teh neighbours line before and after, its a very useful comparator ??

yea will do, i'm scheduled for upgrade over the 9th of August.

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Can you clarify this, does he end up with 30db of margin too ??

yea 30 spot on. i'll re-run the comparison when the upgrades done and see what the story is

Sponge Bob wrote: »

1. Unplugging Filter 2db
2. Removing surge protector 2db
3. Using main socket instead of extension socket in house, minimum 2db
4. Unplugging sky box, 2db
5. Unplugging phones 2db

good checklist. another thing to check is that your not using an extension phone cable from the router to your socket. its caused major hassle on some connections i've seen

kamin99

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Dude , did you follow the 'steps' I posted 2 days back in this thread, you only need to get another (about) 8 db of margin out of somewhere, ideally 10db .

1. Unplugging Filter 2db
2. Removing surge protector 2db
3. Using main socket instead of extension socket in house, minimum 2db
4. Unplugging sky box, 2db
5. Unplugging phones 2db

etc etc



Tell us how the Db margin hunt goes for ya with step by step stats please.

well followed the steps and here is the result ,is it any good ,my router Notopia 3347 still reads less than 7.6MB
Max Allowed Speed (kbps) 6144 512
SN Margin (dB) 8.50 12.00
Line Attenuation (dB) 40.50 27.00

kamin99

StickyMcGinty wrote: »

only thing that springs to mind is calling them up and requesting fastpath, but i cant see that bringing the pings down to as low as they were

kamin99, any chance you could do a tracert to ftp.heanet.ie ?

is that a ping i tried and came back 25% loss

StickyMcGinty

kamin99 wrote: »

is that a ping i tried and came back 25% loss

its kind of like a ping, but it shows you the servers/machines you pass through on the way to the destination server (ftp.heanet.ie)

To do a tracert..

1) Go to Start -> Run
2) Type "cmd" (no quotes) into the run box and hit enter
3) type "tracert ftp.heanet.ie" (no quotes) and hit enter.

it takes a bit longer than a ping icmp request but it gives a good breakdown of where the delay is.

when you get your result, just use print screen to get a screen grab and lob it up here (if you need help with this bit, PM me)

vectra

rc28 wrote: »

I wouldn't be much good for advice on other routers but others have been asking similar questions- look back over last few pages.
However, you have the router that doesn't have much of a probolem with SN so there is definitely something wrong with the wiring/dsl filters in your house- have you tried any of the steps in Spongebob's post that I quoted on page 100?

Havent tried any steps from there yet as my son is busy battling on Xbox Live :rolleyes:

Will try some later
Here is a speed test I just did.

Tony Broke

ElNino wrote: »

I am on the Newmarket-On-Fergus exchange and my line hasn't been upgraded. I am still getting 2mb. Also the BT checker says that my line won't be upgraded until post September?

I have emailed the Eircom press office but I haven't got a response yet.

Are you suprised?

People who think the exchanges due for the 26th are going to be upgraded by the that date are crazy and have way too much faith.

I would say not even half the exchanges due for the 26th will be upgraded and thats being kind.They are an absolute joke of a company with no word.They wont make it guaranteed.

Has the list of exchanges/dates of completion even been posted on the official site?

DECEiFER

Tony Broke wrote: »

Has the list of exchanges/dates of completion even been posted on the official site?

Indeed it has. Therefore, it's in their best interest if you are wrong. No offense.

zod

sallins is post september also .. a fcuk

Sqaull20

DECEiFER wrote: »

Indeed it has. Therefore, it's in their best interest if you are wrong. No offense.

We should have a poll, because I am convinced they wont make it too.

I just cant imagine downloading off rapidshare at 900KB/s on sunday evening.

Sqaull20

Eircom are never on time.

Gerard_Smith

Ok I am on the Priory Park exchange which apparently has been upgraded yet I am still only getting 2mb download speeds. What do I do here? Do I contact Eircom? Also how does this affect download limits if at all?

BArra

they were for their last upgrade, which was what 2 years ago?

im due to be upgraded this weekend

Downstream Upstream
Max Allowed Speed (kbps) 2048 256
SN Margin (dB) 30.00
Line Attenuation (dB) 39.50

im 2.5km from exchange, so 3meg ill get no probs and those websites prediciting what ur line is capable of tells me i can get 7.6meg no probs

rc28

BArra wrote: »

they were for their last upgrade, which was what 2 years ago?

im due to be upgraded this weekend

Downstream Upstream
Max Allowed Speed (kbps) 2048 256
SN Margin (dB) 30.00
Line Attenuation (dB) 39.50

im 2.5km from exchange, so 3meg ill get no probs and those websites prediciting what ur line is capable of tells me i can get 7.6meg no probs

Yes your SN margin is particularly excellent. What router are you using out of interest?

Psygnosis

Just got a newer version of the netgear 2247 was waiting for eircom to deliver so was using a mates who had his spare I was just going to give him back the new but tried it for sh!t's n giggles now SNR has gone from a rocky 13-18 was all over the place to stable 19.80 so now I am going to get one of the reccomended ones the lads were talking about think I may be able to get the 3mb yet

BArra

the generic netopia 3347NWG

thund3rbird_

Hi,

currently have a Zyxel P660RU-T1 connected to a WGR614v6 Netgear.
The modem is reporting a very high margin, attenuation not too bad.

Line stats from the modem are as follows:

System Name: P660RU-T1
Standard:ADSL_G.dmt

WAN Port Statistics:
Link Status: Up
Upstream Speed: 384 kbps
Downstream Speed: 3072 kbps

noise margin downstream: 40 db
output power upstream: 19 db 
attenuation downstream: 11 db

noise margin upstream: 14 db
output power downstream: 2 db 
attenuation upstream: 8 db

from http://212.23.23.177/adsl/default.aspx I get:

Your maximum line connection speed using an ADSL (up to 8Mbps) service is: 8128Kbps
If you are on a Max product, that uses the IP Profile system (sometimes called BRAS Data Rate) if you maintain the above line speed for 3 days or more your IP Profile would be set to: 7.15Mbps
If your service provider uses ADSL2+ the maximum line speed likely is: 20700Kbps
With ADSL2+ the maximum IP throughput is likely to be around: 18319
The range of ADSL speeds expected at this attenuation are 8060Kbps to 8128Kbps
Your ADSL2+ speeds are likely to be in the range 20700Kbps to 20700Kbps.

================================

Ideally I'd rather have one device rather than the modem > router > several 'puters setup.

However when I connect the Netgear DG834G v2, enable debug & telnet (to check interleaving as well) I get the following stats.
Noise margin is less than half what the modem reported !!!

# cat /proc/avalanche/avsar_modem_stats

AR7 DSL Modem Statistics:
--------------------------------
[DSL Modem Stats]
        US Connection Rate:     384     DS Connection Rate:     3072
        DS Line Attenuation:    7       DS Margin:              17
        US Line Attenuation:    6       US Margin:              17
        US Transmit Power :     0       DS Transmit Power:      0
        Showtime Count:         1       DS Max Attainable Bit Rate: 10080 kbps
        BitSwap:                1       US Max Attainable Bit Rate:     n/a
        
        [Upstream (TX) Interleave path]
        CRC:    2       FEC:    0       NCD:    0
        LCD:    0       HEC:    68

        [Downstream (RX) Interleave path]
        CRC:    0       FEC:    0       NCD:    0
        LCD:    0       HEC:    0

        [Upstream (TX) Fast path]
        CRC:    0       FEC:    0       NCD:    1
        LCD:    0       HEC:    0

        [Downstream (RX) Fast path]
        CRC:    0       FEC:    0       NCD:    0
        LCD:    0       HEC:    0

================================


Your maximum line connection speed using an ADSL (up to 8Mbps) service is: 6239Kbps
If you are on a Max product, that uses the IP Profile system (sometimes called BRAS Data Rate) if you maintain the above line speed for 3 days or more your IP Profile would be set to: 5Mbps
If your service provider uses ADSL2+ the maximum line speed likely is: 21000Kbps
With ADSL2+ the maximum IP throughput is likely to be around: 18584
It would appear your line is under performing with regard to ADSL, this may be due to issues like the ring wire, unfiltered equipment and other factors. Ideally you would expect to see connection speeds of 8128Kbps or higher at your attenuation
Your ADSL2+ speeds are likely to be in the range 21000Kbps to 21000Kbps.

================================

all I have one with the cables is remove the modem & connect the router.
Cables / filters etc are the same

have the modem / router connected to the main socket ...

socket > filter >
dsl on filter > modem [router] (using a sheathed RJ11)
phone on filter > adapter > phone & sky

2 other sockets in the house. neither in use.

surely using the router should not drop the noise margin by this much??

==================================

regardless of which device is on the line my ping times to boards.ie are ~ 20ms

Calebmcd

Did a tracert to ftp.heanet.ie got avg 15ms

Line Attenuation 48.0 db 28.0 db
Noise Margin 14.9 db 12.0 db

Can't wait for my speed increase from 3mb to 4mb

Hank Scorpio

i see people complaing about pings

i told eircon i dont want the upgrade to 7.6 meg

im a gamer and more than 40 dos ping anywhere is terrible , let alone 100;)

Gonzo

yeah its not looking good, high 100ms pings and packet loss by the look of things, what good is that? A faster connection is nice but if it means dialup pings than its a total waste of time for alot of people. Hopefully after this weekend we'll have a proper set of peoples dos pings, packet loss results and speedtests to properly judge this upgrade on. 512k with a 30 ping is much better than a 7.6meg with 100 ping for me.