First roads to be declared motorways without a motorway order

fricatus

Bards wrote: »

As usual the Irish Times left out Waterford even though the N9 will become the M9 (Carlow Bypass to be the first section) and it terminates at the Waterford City Bypass. Still it's good to see this commming into law on September 24th

Typical. Is it Irish Times policy or something? They're always doing that! Are they trying to save on ink or something? :mad:

Still though, that probably means that apart from the four remaining interurbans, there are probably some other stretches around the country currently under construction that will open as motorway from day 1.

The M20 and M17 are not yet underway, if I understand correctly, so the only one I can think of at the moment is the bypass to the north of Waterford, which includes that huge bridge upriver from the city centre - will this be the M25 then?

Bards

fricatus wrote: »

Typical. Is it Irish Times policy or something? They're always doing that! Are they trying to save on ink or something? :mad:

Still though, that probably means that apart from the four remaining interurbans, there are probably some other stretches around the country currently under construction that will open as motorway from day 1.

The M20 and M17 are not yet underway, if I understand correctly, so the only one I can think of at the moment is the bypass to the north of Waterford, which includes that huge bridge upriver from the city centre - will this be the M25 then?

Yes, it looks like the Waterord City Bypass will be redesignated the M25 once completed in September 2009 (Target date set by CRG)

Stark

Not happening until September 24th unfortunately:

In total, 10 sections of road stretching 292km are affected, four of which (125km) will be open to traffic on September 24th when the changes come into force.

Takes over 2 months to push a pen after all.

Bards

already being discussed here

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055228345&page=11

Amtmann

Stark wrote: »

Not happening until September 24th unfortunately:



Takes over 2 months to push a pen after all.

Confirmed by a Department of Transport official I just spoke to. Overnight, they'll all go 120 km/h. Green signage will be replaced with blue signage.

About time.

Amtmann

Chris_533976 wrote: »

Fantastic

I dont see why the Dunkettle - Watergrasshill part of the N8 isnt included though?

At least though they're finally getting off their arses and doing it.

Email sent, thanking them and imploring them to ignore the whingers and do this for the sake of the country.

It will be. Application for redesignation is imminent. Motorway then all the way to Dunkettle.

AugustusMaximus

Furet. I'm guessing that the Glanmire to Dunkettle Interchange section will have to have a 100kph as some of the bends are a bit tight for 120kph ?

Our man in Havana

Correct.

Irish and Proud

fricatus wrote: »

The M20 and M17 are not yet underway, if I understand correctly, so the only one I can think of at the moment is the bypass to the north of Waterford, which includes that huge bridge upriver from the city centre - will this be the M25 then?

Yes - AFAIK, this stretch will be motorway from day 1!

Regards!

Irish and Proud

Furet wrote: »

Confirmed by a Department of Transport official I just spoke to. Overnight, they'll all go 120 km/h. Green signage will be replaced with blue signage.

About time.

Any HQDC that has opened with green signs will probably need re-signing by Sept 24th. Some of these roads also have lay-bys, which will require either: (1) modification in order to allow the Hard Shoulder continue past them; or (2) complete removal altogether - as was the case with the Carlow By-pass. AFAIK, such lay-bys currently exist on the:

N6 Kinnegead to Kilbeggan HQDC;
N8 Cashel to Cahir HQDC...

...both of which are due to become motorways on the said date!

Funny enough, the N2 Finglas to Ashbourne HQDC has no lay-bys and as yet, is not one of the roads due to fall under motorway regulations on Sept 24th!

In any case, we’ll just have to wait and see!

Regards!

Stark

Irish and Proud wrote:

Funny enough, the N2 Finglas to Ashbourne HQDC has no lay-bys and as yet, is not one of the roads due to fall under motorway regulations on Sept 24th!

Some of the old N2 is unusable after the new N2 was built. Lack of alternative route means they can't redesignate the road as a motorway.

Similar situation with the N1 from Dundalk to Newry.

Amtmann

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

Furet. I'm guessing that the Glanmire to Dunkettle Interchange section will have to have a 100kph as some of the bends are a bit tight for 120kph ?

I knew I had one question that I forgot to ask

I'd imagine you're quite correct, however.

Mayo Exile

Originally posted by Stark: Similar situation with the N1 from Dundalk to Newry.

Doesn't really matter. N1 Dundalk to Border already has a 120km/h speed limit.

Stark

As does the new N2...

D.L.R.

Interesting about Dunkettle, wonder what that means for the likes of the N4 Lucan Bypass, N2 Ashbourne, N3 Clonee, N11 Arklow-Gorey, Limerick and Cork Rings, etc.

AugustusMaximus

D.L.R. wrote: »

Interesting about Dunkettle, wonder what that means for the likes of the N4 Lucan Bypass, N2 Ashbourne, N3 Clonee, N11 Arklow-Gorey, Limerick and Cork Rings, etc.

I think it all comes down to wether these roads have alternative routes.

As it stands, Watergrasshill to Dunkettle does.

invincibleirish

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

I think it all comes down to wether these roads have alternative routes.

As it stands, Watergrasshill to Dunkettle does.

In light of the downturn i dont know if its going ahead but the N22 NRR plans envision having a roundabout somehere on the N8 between WGH & DK, so there'll be no 120 speed limits there then!

mackerski

invincibleirish wrote: »

In light of the downturn i dont know if its going ahead but the N22 NRR plans envision having a roundabout somehere on the N8 between WGH & DK, so there'll be no 120 speed limits there then!

I don't think that roundabout is due to be at grade on the N(M)8.

Stark

D.L.R. wrote: »

Interesting about Dunkettle, wonder what that means for the likes of the N4 Lucan Bypass, N2 Ashbourne, N3 Clonee, N11 Arklow-Gorey, Limerick and Cork Rings, etc.

The N11 Arklow-Gorey should be a good candidate imo as it's a new HQDC, so it should be up to spec and the alternative route through Gorey still exists. The N3 Clonee wouldn't be suitable as the Damastown road is a private road, and there are a number of private accesses onto the dual carriageway itself, which means it can't be motorway or have a 120km/hr limit. I think the Lucan bypass has some dodgy junctions/accesses as well.

The N2 to Ashbourne obliterated part of the old N2 when it was built, so it can't be motorway due to the lack of alternative route.

mackerski

Stark wrote: »

and there are a number of private accesses onto the dual carriageway itself, which means it can't be motorway or have a 120km/hr limit.

Is there any specific reason why private accesses are incompatible with a 120 limit? The UK seems to allow them at 70mph.

AugustusMaximus

invincibleirish wrote: »

In light of the downturn i dont know if its going ahead but the N22 NRR plans envision having a roundabout somehere on the N8 between WGH & DK, so there'll be no 120 speed limits there then!

There is no way on gods green earth that there will be an at level roundabout smack in the middle of the soon to be M8. Are our engineers really that stupid ?

Surely a free flow junction like that of the N25 - N28 will be done. It wouldn't even cost that much more. Surely lessons have been learned from the Dunkettle interchange and Red Cow that these need to be free flow.

E92

So they really will be all classified to Motorway on the 24th of September:D?

At times progress was so slow I thought it was never going to happen. It's funny that they should announce it today when I was having a good old whinge on Wednesday night over on Motors about the fact they still haven't gotten it done.

Fantastic news, roll on September 24 and the chance to legally travel at 20 km/h faster(or 20% faster) than before on a significant amount of roads.

This of course means there will be useful time savings available on these long stretches of road thanks to the fact that from September 24 we can go 20% faster than before.

E92

E92 wrote: »

So they really will be all classified to Motorway on the 24th of September:D?

Fantastic news, roll on September 24 and the chance to legally travel at 20 km/h faster(or 20% faster) than before on a significant amount of roads.

This of course means there will be useful time savings available on these long stretches of road thanks to the fact that from September 24 we can go 20% faster than before.

Great to hear at last.
[cynic]
It does of course mean that the boys in blue will be out in force in mid September with their hairdriers for some easy pickings

[/cynic]

AugustusMaximus

Anyone know what the story is now with the Ballincollig and Glounthaune bypasses.

Both had been applied for 120kph speed limits but were turned down due to the impending motorways order.


I can see the N22 to Killarney getting it if it is Motorway as far as Macroom but not the N25 as its only HQDC as far at Carrigtohill.

mackerski

mackerski wrote: »

Is there any specific reason why private accesses are incompatible with a 120 limit? The UK seems to allow them at 70mph.

Historical reasons really, many dual carriageways in the UK are upgraded single carriageway roads that already had private accesses on to them.

UK speed limits are mainly by road type (single/dual darriageway, urban/rural etc) rather than whether it's a regional or national route.

icdg

D.L.R. wrote: »

Interesting about Dunkettle, wonder what that means for the likes of the N4 Lucan Bypass, N2 Ashbourne, N3 Clonee, N11 Arklow-Gorey, Limerick and Cork Rings, etc.

The Lucan bypass is out for a number of reasons, mainly to do with private accesses (although there will be feeder roads built to serve these accesses, the only access to these roads will be via the N4). There's also the fact that the old road was obliterated in several instances and there's no other easier way for traffic to get from Lucan to Leixlip (unless one counts the R121/R149 combo, which isn't a great road...). As its going to have a permanent 80 km/h limit and already has private accesses there's no real gain to be made by making it motorway anyway.

The N2 Ashbourne bypass could be made motorway, but for the bit between J1-J2 where the old road was closed and the dodgey Killshane Cross exit built instead. There wouldn't be a lot of effort involved in rectifying this though if the will was there.

N3 Clonee bypass is mostly okay, but the Blanchardstown bypass is not, some LILOs and roundabouts and at least one private access.

N11 is grand for the strech you mention (save one LILO which could probably be removed) but only has a design speed of 100 km/h. Both the Cashel and Nenagh bypasses will have 100 km/h limits even when made motorway so this isn't such a problem, it could still become a motorway. Between Bray and Wicklow is a lot more difficult since the old road is subsumed and there are various speed restrictions due to the protests when the road was being built.

Lennoxschips

A motorway to Macroom...

my goodness

Skyhater

Stark wrote: »

As does the new N2...

I know I said this before, but I still can't understand why the N2 isn't designated Motorway. Apart from access issues between M50 and J2 (where they could keep it N status), beyond J2 should be M2.

AugustusMaximus

I'm also guessing that Limerick to Galway will be redesignate as Motorway when the full stretch of HQDC is completed.

I think we've got to the stage now where the government realises that building motorways is a much better idea than HQDC.

Chris_533976

Can only sensibly be done from Shannon northwards. Limerick to Shannon isnt HQDC and has a ton of bad junctions and local house access

Driving west on the N/M6 tonight, I see that they have started erecting the new blue signs.

There is a new "exit" sign on junction 2 "Kinnegad" and a blue distances sign after it.

I didn't notice if any other signs at that junction or whether the M4 exit signs had ben updated as I wasn't expecting it to happen so soon.

I wonder if there will be gantries like on the new section of motorway or not, they are installing new posts for the exit signs rather than re-using the existing ones (only a couple of metres behind them).

Irish and Proud

Deleted User wrote: »

Driving west on the N/M6 tonight, I see that they have started erecting the new blue signs.

There is a new "exit" sign on junction 2 "Kinnegad" and a blue distances sign after it.

I didn't notice if any other signs at that junction or whether the M4 exit signs had ben updated as I wasn't expecting it to happen so soon.

I wonder if there will be gantries like on the new section of motorway or not, they are installing new posts for the exit signs rather than re-using the existing ones (only a couple of metres behind them).

Wonder if they'll start tearing up the parking bays and continue the hard shoulder through instead?

Also, will they start erecting emergency phones and extra lighting - features that are usually associated with motorways?

Suppose we'll just have to wait and see!

Regards!

cyclopath2001

Irish and Proud wrote: »

Also, will they start erecting emergency phones and extra lighting - features that are usually associated with motorways?

What next? Service areas where tired drivers can pull over for a break?

There are no emergency phones along the new Kilbeggan - Athlone section, doesn't look like they will bother with them at all. Also I see that the phomes on the M4 east of Kilcock have been covered in black plastic.

As for service stations, I think we are expected to leave at the next exit and hunt one down!

L1011

Deleted User wrote: »

There are no emergency phones along the new Kilbeggan - Athlone section, doesn't look like they will bother with them at all. Also I see that the phomes on the M4 east of Kilcock have been covered in black plastic.

As for service stations, I think we are expected to leave at the next exit and hunt one down!

The phones on the L/M/K bypass bit of the M4 are being replaced; the ones covered in black plastic are brand new units.

As goes the service stations, I'm tempted to knock together a page with details of where the the nearest s/station to every motorway/HQDC junction is and put it on the net somewhere. I know where the M4/M1 ones are at this stage but wouldn't know the N7/N6/N8/N11 ones - and tourists, etc, are completely lost.

1huge1

Chris_533976 wrote: »

Can only sensibly be done from Shannon northwards. Limerick to Shannon isnt HQDC and has a ton of bad junctions and local house access

Ya I just took note of that the other day actually, its a shame but understandable.

Shows that it was one of the early dual carriageways in the country.

icdg

Deleted User wrote: »

Driving west on the N/M6 tonight, I see that they have started erecting the new blue signs.

There is a new "exit" sign on junction 2 "Kinnegad" and a blue distances sign after it.

I didn't notice if any other signs at that junction or whether the M4 exit signs had ben updated as I wasn't expecting it to happen so soon.

I wonder if there will be gantries like on the new section of motorway or not, they are installing new posts for the exit signs rather than re-using the existing ones (only a couple of metres behind them).

Don't think there will be gantries, there may be cantilevers though (or half-gantries).

Using gantries as a matter of course on a D2M was only done on one scheme, the M50 South Eastern Motorway and seems to have been abandoned. Cantilevers on the other look like they will be around on every new motorway scheme from now on though.

Having said that, I took a trip up the M1 today and noticed that while Next Exit signs and "Exit" (J No) gore signs have gone up, they haven't bothered with cantilvers - instead they've moved the flag signs originally at the gore to 100m back where the cantilever would be under the new signing scheme normally.

icdg

icdg wrote: »

there may be cantilevers though (or half-gantries).

.

Yep that's what I meant by gantries