WIT University

invincibleirish · 23-05-2008 3:31pm

mad man wrote: »

It is remarkable the amount of time invincible irish spends on the Waterford forum attempting to undermine the arguement for a University for the SE and on other threads ranting about the M9 amongst other things.All supposedly on the grounds of parochialism.When we all know that nobody does parochialism like a Cork man.Anybody care to remenber when the IDA established Louisiana Pacific in Waterford?We had the Bishop and Lord Mayor of Cork with their mealy mouths and rosary beads lobbying the IDA and government to relocate it to Cork.When WRTC was upgraded to rectify the third level deficit who was foaming at the mouth only Cork RTC. Similarly who led the applications for uprade to University status to exploit the "me too" scenario in the Port Report.Cork did?Who most vehemently opposed UL?Cork did! They scoffed at UL's application not having a chance because of their political clout.There's parochialism for you! Who sopped to parochialism by granting all the other RTC's IT status (In name only mind) but showed preferential treatment to Cork IT.Mícheal Martin did.Nobody does parochialism,clientelism and resentment like a Corkman.

Yep im so parochial i went to UL:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

look we already had an argument on this thread over Cork get over it and focus on the issue, have a problem with Cork, start a thread on it.

invincibleirish · 23-05-2008 3:34pm

bwardrop wrote: »

invincibleirish - why don't you post something to back up your opinion. You knock the vast majority of what is said in this thread, but I haven't seen any effort to produce any real facts. Freddie59's comment is no more enlightening that yours...

And as I pointed out - there is no call for the sarcasm and arrogance in your posts.

Read back further on the thread, this poster already called me a disgrace to my county and various other insults, did you see the reply he gave to Maoleary? the guy just blusters on.

invincibleirish · 23-05-2008 3:42pm

mad man wrote: »

However this is more to do with protecting Carlow IT than anything else.

http://www.iro.ie/south_east_region.html

What is this attitude Waterford folks have?

Carlow is watching its back
Galway gets preferential treatment
Cork is out to get Waterford
Wexford is/isnt in the SE

this is all on this thread in the last few pages. Absolutely pathetic.

The IRO is just another toothless quango.

bwardrop · 23-05-2008 3:43pm

invincibleirish wrote: »

Read back further on the thread, this poster already called me a disgrace to my county and various other insults, did you see the reply he gave to Maoleary? the guy just blusters on.

This still does not justify your tone and manner in this thread IMO. You just shout down everything that is said in favour of WIT being upgraded, without providing anything concrete to back up your opinions (despite requests). You accused me (incorrectly) of selectively quoting stats - well you, my friend, are a dab hand at selectively quoting / responding to posts. You deftly sidestep any posts that contradict are valid, but contrary to your point of view...

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but if you are going to knock someone for theirs you should be able to back up your own.

I reckon that there is no point debating this with you any further. I'm therefore not going to respond to anymore of your posts / comments - I have more productive things to do with my time.

I will continue to participate in this thread with anyone who has a rational approach to debate - what ever their opinion is.

mad man · 23-05-2008 3:55pm

invincibleirish wrote: »

Yep im so parochial i went to UL:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

look we already had an argument on this thread over Cork get over it and focus on the issue, have a problem with Cork, start a thread on it.

Your the one needs to "get over it".Fact:Cork is in the Junior league of Irish cities.Cork might be the largest of them and Waterford might be the smallest but they both perform the same role in a National context:p

invincibleirish · 23-05-2008 4:11pm

bwardrop wrote: »

This still does not justify your tone and manner in this thread IMO. You just shout down everything that is said in favour of WIT being upgraded, without providing anything concrete to back up your opinions (despite requests). You accused me (incorrectly) of selectively quoting stats - well you, my friend, are a dab hand at selectively quoting / responding to posts. You deftly sidestep any posts that contradict are valid, but contrary to your point of view...

Yes im the one guilty of selective posting, have you seen my contribution to this thread? i've replied to more points then anyone? What concrete statistics are you looking for?, Time and time again i argue 2 points.

1)cost
2)need

Neither have been refuted on this thread despite 30+ pages of 'debate'(county bashing). Its Irish Taxpayers money that will fund a WIT upgrade, unless there is a concrete argument for its upgrade then that money will be better spent elsewhere. and make no make mistake, that money will have to come from somewhere, Interesting how no one on this thread has countered me on the state of the public finances and the more pressing need for the primary schools programme to take priority for Education spending.

Instead of getting so touchy feely about things wise up, the questions i ask and the points i raise are valid ones, im a student with a particular interest in infrastructural spending and regional policy, thats why i continously cite other examples, the WIT campaign and the arguments used are similar to other regions arguments, IE based on vague ideas of costings & need, nothing substantial(substantial doesnt involve population statistics).

Do you wonder why i, a UCC student and Maoleary, a UCD post grad, question the need for WIT? these colleges, along with the rest of the Universities are struggling with their finances as they are. They have to compete already with each other for Infrastructure funding, into the mix comes WIT and its supporters expecting parity, unless a new Celtic tiger emerges i have serious reservations as to an upgrade of WIT without impacting on funding for the Universities.

mad man · 23-05-2008 4:16pm

We never here about infrastructure that is not needed from Leeside such as Cork airport.A sop to parocialism that would have been much more cost effective if business to Shannon airport and the rail links to it were developed.Then we would have two financially viable airports instead of just one.Why do get this type of resentment from Leeside? Probably because the reality of the situation is on a national level Cork is no more important than Waterford is. They have no real sphere of influence outside their own region and that is the rub.The economic generator of the country and only city of international standing is Dublin and Cork is the most remote city from it. The problem with Corkonians is that if Waterford develops to its potential then in their eyes it will be to their detriment.Bitterness? Look who is obsessing over the M9 and spending all his spare time on the Waterford forum:D

invincibleirish · 23-05-2008 4:24pm

mad man wrote: »

We never here about infrastructure that is not needed from Leeside such as Cork airport.A sop to parocialism that would have been much more cost effective if business to Shannon airport and the rail links to it were developed.Then we would have two financially viable airports instead of just one.Why do get this type of resentment from Leeside? Probably because the reality of the situation is on a national level Cork is no more important than Waterford is. They have no real sphere of influence outside their own region and that is the rub.The economic generator of the country and only city of international standing is Dublin and Cork is the most remote city from it. The problem with Corkonians is that if Waterford develops to its potential then in their eyes it will be to their detriment.Bitterness? Look who is obsessing over the M9 and spending all his spare time on the Waterford forum:D

Look your trying to rise me, i dont care, if you want to talk about Cork start a thread on it, if you want to insult me, PM me, just dont clutter up the thread with your last few posts.

bwardrop · 23-05-2008 4:26pm

Last reply to II unless something decent comes back...

invincibleirish wrote: »

Time and time again i argue 2 points.

1)cost
2)need

Neither have been refuted on this thread despite 30+ pages of 'debate'(county bashing). Its Irish Taxpayers money that will fund a WIT upgrade, unless there is a concrete argument for its upgrade then that money will be better spent elsewhere. and make no make mistake, that money will have to come from somewhere, Interesting how no one on this thread has countered me on the state of the public finances and the more pressing need for the primary schools programme to take priority for Education spending.

Show us something tangible. How will WIT's upgrade affect education spending? How much will it cost? Where could the money come from / where should it be better spent? What is the spending in other Universities? What funding are other Universities looking for? Is this a worthwhile investment? How much needs to be invested in primary education to improve it? Where will this money come from? How will WIT's upgrade affect this spending? Etc etc.

Speaking for myself on this thread - if I have made a point I have backed it up. Your arguments are based on grand ideas that you have not back up - saying that money should be spent on "ABC" is not a valid argument unless you can back it up with "XYZ" prove that WIT's upgrade will affect "ABC" in the following ways...

mad man · 23-05-2008 4:35pm

invincibleirish wrote: »

Do you wonder why i, a UCC student and Maoleary, a UCD post grad, question the need for WIT?

Yes.Vested interests ans selfish ones at that. The whole National conext arguement you've been pushing is bluster:cool:

invincibleirish · 23-05-2008 4:46pm

bwardrop wrote: »

Last reply to II unless something decent comes back... ...

yawn..:rolleyes:

bwardrop wrote: »

Show us something tangible. How will WIT's upgrade affect education spending? How much will it cost? Where could the money come from / where should it be better spent? What is the spending in other Universities? What funding are other Universities looking for? Is this a worthwhile investment? How much needs to be invested in primary education to improve it? Where will this money come from? How will WIT's upgrade affect this spending? Etc etc.

Speaking for myself on this thread - if I have made a point I have backed it up. Your arguments are based on grand ideas that you have not back up - saying that money should be spent on "ABC" is not a valid argument unless you can back it up with "XYZ" prove that WIT's upgrade will affect "ABC" in the following ways...

Here is how an Irish University works to the best of my knowledge.

1)it receives money from the Irish government in 2 ways, fees per student & capital investment

2) the Universities argue the fees they recieve per student arent enough to cover costs, this relates back to the introduction of free fees by Niamh Bhreatnach in the last Rainbow Gov.

3) for capital investment Universities have to submit their proposals to the government for consideration. As there is a fixed amount of money available not all projects will recieve funding. Thus the Unis are already competing against each other.

Now after the massive spend on expanding third level education & improving the infrastructure since the mid 1990s education, which has been a huge success but led to the financial problems the Unis are now dealing with. priority for extra education spending has now shifted to capital spending on new Primary & secondary schools which went on the backburner as 3rd level was dealt with first.

Now for the public finances. Im sure you know we are now facing into a period of reduced Tax intake and thus reduced levels of Government funding.
This means that over the next few years education spending will remain, in all likely, at current or reduced levels.

How does this relate back to WIT? any upgrade will require an immediate large capital investment and increased yearly spending. This money will have to come from somewhere, tell me where? its not my job to justify WITs upgrade.

on Newstalk now there is a commentator referring to the crisis in University funding, tune in!

as an aside, if we are to follow WITs wishes then there is no reason why bigger, more prestigious ITs like DIT should not be allowed to achieve Uni status as well. But that doesnt go down well with some on here, but its the inevitable increasing costs which are the main worry.

mad man · 23-05-2008 4:53pm

The funding can be directed from other departments.As was done when Dempsey attempted to introduce fees.

The funding can be borrowed as a capital economic investment which would pay for itself long term.

When capital infrastructure projects such as the Inter Urbans are complete funding could and should be foucused on education.

Or fees could be introduced again.

Remember UL was funded when the country was on it's knees.

invincibleirish · 23-05-2008 5:26pm

mad man wrote: »

The funding can be directed from other departments.As was done when Dempsey attempted to introduce fees..

What departments? what gets cut? you tell me, WIT upgrade money will mean something goes somewhere else, tell me what gets cut?

mad man wrote: »

The funding can be borrowed as a capital economic investment which would pay for itself long term..

Can it now? 1977 was the last time that kind of logic was used and look what happened as a result...

mad man wrote: »

When capital infrastructure projects such as the Inter Urbans are complete funding could and should be foucused on education..

Transport 21, The interurbans are not the end of spending on Roads, only the beginning.

mad man wrote: »

Or fees could be introduced again. .

Introduce Fees for a WIT upgrade? are you crazy? why should all 3rd level students pay for one colleges upgrade?.

mad man wrote: »

Remember UL was funded when the country was on it's knees.

Yep, and received significant funding from the Feeney foundation. If im not mistaken they either matched or donated more then the Irish exchequer to UL,Has WIT even attempted to secure financing in this way?

bwardrop · 23-05-2008 5:26pm

invincibleirish wrote: »

yawn..:rolleyes:

Why do you persevere with this type of commentary - it is rude plain and simple, and not required. Show some respect - I have not insulted you in any way, so keep your sarcasm to yourself.

The rest of your post was a huge improvement on your previous efforts. Thank you.

I'll get back to this when I return from holidays - no doubt it will be still raging...

invincibleirish · 23-05-2008 5:39pm

bwardrop wrote: »

Why do you persevere with this type of commentary - it is rude plain and simple, and not required. Show some respect - I have not insulted you in any way, so keep your sarcasm to yourself.

The rest of your post was a huge improvement on your previous efforts. Thank you.

I'll get back to this when I return from holidays - no doubt it will be still raging...

Excuse me but firstly you pre empted your last post with

Last reply to II unless something decent comes back... ...

You are inviting a smart arse reply upon yourself when you start a post like that.

Secondly you were grievously offended when i mentioned you selectively qouted statistics.

You qouted 2006/7 statistics on CAO numbers implying there was an increase in CAO numbers when i stated that there had been a decrease which i apoligised for making.

But had you qouted all the available statistics from the CAO in the period 2000-2008 then it would be apparent that the numbers have been averaged 60k for the whole period.

merlante · 23-05-2008 6:11pm

From todays Irish Times article, "Dramatic rise in numbers taking honours degrees":

THE NUMBER of students taking higher or honours degree programmes at third level has increased by a third in the past five years.

This is a staggering rate of increase, and shows that the emphasis is moving firmly towards honours degrees from ordinary degrees and certs. We need another university more than we need an IT. Waterford is the obvious candidate for a redesignation. Particularly since there are ITs in Carlow and Tipperary.

The number of Level 8 graduates from institutes of technology increased by almost 20 per cent since 2005, while the number of students taking higher or honours degree programmes at third level has increased by 32 per cent.

The report did not contain overall numbers taking the higher degrees. Overall, undergraduate enrolment at the universities has increased by 9 per cent since 2002 but the rate of increase is slowing, reflecting population trends.

The number of new students enrolling in the 14 institutes of technology dropped by 6.5 per cent in the last five years. In recent years, some institutes have struggled to fill places on many courses.

ITs are basically having to offer degree programmes for their survival.

The figures confirm how home location is a key factor in students’ choice of college. More than 80 per cent of DCU students are from Dublin, while 90 per cent of UCC students are from Munster.

The annual exodus of students from the south east to universities in other regions has a dramatic cultural and economic affect on the region, which is one reason why a university for the region is so ardently pursued by the stakeholders of the region, be they political or economic.

Arts and humanities remain the most popular course choices, accounting for 28 per cent of new entrants to third level in 2006.

There is no reason why these courses cannot be offered in the south east, when more expensive, more research intensive courses are already being offered. Not all families can afford the outlay of sending a child to college to study courses that may not offer a solid route to a high earning job after college. Those who do arts in universities outside the region are more likely to remain in the host cities where the cultural scene is more likely to be deepened by the proximity of students and graduates. It is ridiculous that there is no institute in the south east that is permitted to develop an Arts and Humanities faculty beyond a sheerly practical focus. Particularly when these subjects are so popular.

bwardrop · 23-05-2008 8:31pm

invincibleirish wrote: »

You are inviting a smart arse reply upon yourself when you start a post like that.

At least you admit that you are a smart arse

bwardrop · 23-05-2008 8:37pm

invincibleirish wrote: »

Secondly you were grievously offended when i mentioned you selectively qouted statistics.

You qouted 2006/7 statistics on CAO numbers implying there was an increase in CAO numbers when i stated that there had been a decrease which i apoligised for making.

But had you qouted all the available statistics from the CAO in the period 2000-2008 then it would be apparent that the numbers have been averaged 60k for the whole period.

I wasn't grievously offended - I was just right.

I also responded to you pointing out that the figures re: CAO applicants had remained buoyant in the period you mentioned, and agreed with you when that the number of students sitting the LC was in decline. I then went on to point out that this negated your argument re: the number of students sitting the LC had an affect on University places. If both LC numbers and CAO applications were falling then you might have a point - but you don't in this instance.

Marcus.Aurelius · 24-05-2008 12:36am

mad man wrote: »

Yes.Vested interests ans selfish ones at that. The whole National conext arguement you've been pushing is bluster:cool:

Excuse me?

Selfish???? I went to WIT for my undergrad.

Freddie59 · 24-05-2008 9:48am

invincibleirish wrote: »

BS! why dont you educate us all on 'economic reality and prosperity' and how WIT is a part of it, go on, i'd love to hear your take on it....

BS, my 'friend', is what you've been posting for the past few weeks here. A blinkered, head-in-the-sand vision of 'your' Ireland and a lesson in discriminatory policies and politics. A sad reflection of how you view an entire region of your own country.

Instead of fostering education and inclusion, you merely want to stifle it. Very sad really. I sincerely hope that your statements and 'opinion' (and I use the term loosely) are not reflective of how Waterford is viewed from the outside.

We are all Irish. My children are Irish. Are they to be denied the opportunities and facilities granted to yours, because of your desire (and those of your ilk) to hoard the aforemention facilities in select areas only?

When WIT is upgraded (and it will be - it's inevitable) it will bring the prosperity that University status breeds. There were figures quoted somewhere recently that for every €10m sepnt on a University a futher €20m is generated in the adjacent region.

Marcus.Aurelius · 24-05-2008 1:10pm

Freddie59 wrote: »

When WIT is upgraded (and it will be - it's inevitable) it will bring the prosperity that University status breeds. There were figures quoted somewhere recently that for every €10m sepnt on a University a futher €20m is generated in the adjacent region.

Status is all you guys really want. You don't want the extra work of a university or the demands it puts on housing, infrastructure and local politics. Waterford is a terrible city for traffic and roads, yet you think a University attracting 2 x the number of students will be just fine.

As regards your point, look at Maynooth, its still a sh*thole, university or not. The same could be said of the area around DCU and the inner city DIT campuses. The reason we don't want a UW is because UCD etc., are already research leaders, I don't want to see UCD/UCC/NUIG/NUIM having to re-introduce fees cause their money dried up.

And don't quote me numbers by a pro group. The cost is always 5 -10 x the real cost cos FF can't help themselves.
And I'm a culchie who went from Wexford to WIT for 4 years.

invincibleirish · 24-05-2008 3:04pm

Freddie59 wrote: »

BS, my 'friend', is what you've been posting for the past few weeks here. A blinkered, head-in-the-sand vision of 'your' Ireland and a lesson in discriminatory policies and politics. A sad reflection of how you view an entire region of your own country.

Yes my head is in the sand because i dare not accept your received 'wisdom', im discriminating am i? What the funk are you on about? because i dont agree with ye? can you say drama queen?

Freddie59 wrote: »

Instead of fostering education and inclusion, you merely want to stifle it. Very sad really. I sincerely hope that your statements and 'opinion' (and I use the term loosely) are not reflective of how Waterford is viewed from the outside.

:rolleyes:

Freddie59 wrote: »

We are all Irish. My children are Irish. Are they to be denied the opportunities and facilities granted to yours, because of your desire (and those of your ilk) to hoard the aforemention facilities in select areas only?.

oh great more hyperbole, do you realise what you are typing? at least you've stopped calling me a disgrace to my county. No one is denying anyone anything, you just have a bee in your bonnet because you're not getting what you want.

Freddie59 wrote: »

When WIT is upgraded (and it will be - it's inevitable) it will bring the prosperity that University status breeds. There were figures quoted somewhere recently that for every €10m sepnt on a University a futher €20m is generated in the adjacent region.

What figures?, and sure WIT will definitely be upgraded, why its the most pressing national issue right now:p:rolleyes::D, thats why its always in the news and everyone is talking about it......

invincibleirish · 24-05-2008 3:10pm

bwardrop wrote: »

I wasn't grievously offended - I was just right.

I also responded to you pointing out that the figures re: CAO applicants had remained buoyant in the period you mentioned, and agreed with you when that the number of students sitting the LC was in decline. I then went on to point out that this negated your argument re: the number of students sitting the LC had an affect on University places. If both LC numbers and CAO applications were falling then you might have a point - but you don't in this instance.

I hate being pedantic but here i go:

I said CAO application numbers were in decline, your post implied they were on the up, they werent they've remained static thats the crux of the matter.

invincibleirish · 24-05-2008 3:15pm

merlante wrote: »

From todays Irish Times article, "Dramatic rise in numbers taking honours degrees":

This is a staggering rate of increase, and shows that the emphasis is moving firmly towards honours degrees from ordinary degrees and certs. We need another university more than we need an IT. Waterford is the obvious candidate for a redesignation. Particularly since there are ITs in Carlow and Tipperary.

ITs are basically having to offer degree programmes for their survival.

The annual exodus of students from the south east to universities in other regions has a dramatic cultural and economic affect on the region, which is one reason why a university for the region is so ardently pursued by the stakeholders of the region, be they political or economic.

There is no reason why these courses cannot be offered in the south east, when more expensive, more research intensive courses are already being offered. Not all families can afford the outlay of sending a child to college to study courses that may not offer a solid route to a high earning job after college. Those who do arts in universities outside the region are more likely to remain in the host cities where the cultural scene is more likely to be deepened by the proximity of students and graduates. It is ridiculous that there is no institute in the south east that is permitted to develop an Arts and Humanities faculty beyond a sheerly practical focus. Particularly when these subjects are so popular.

Hilarious:D! never have i seen an article so blissfully 're-interpreted' to suit another end, give it up Merlante, you'll be reading tea leaves next for an WIT upgrade if this is how you view things.

mad man · 24-05-2008 4:11pm

invincibleirish wrote: »

What departments? what gets cut? you tell me, WIT upgrade money will mean something goes somewhere else, tell me what gets cut?

Well I elect a government for those decisions and if I don't like them I punish them at the ballot box.Wonderful thing democracy...Although it does have it's drawbacks;)

invincibleirish wrote: »

Can it now? 1977 was the last time that kind of logic was used and look what happened as a result...

Don't try and say a WIT upgrade would require the type of drastic fiscal measure that was indulged in in 1977 by who again?...Let's see...Who was it again?...Oh Yeah that's right Jack Lynch:DWhat is it with Cork politicians? Your lot certainly leads the way when it comes to cute hoorism:p

The 1977 manifesto was the most infamous piece of stroke politics in the history of the state which broke the country for almost two decades.The economy was less than one third the size it is now in real terms.The effect of an WIT upgrade which would probably span over five years would be a drop in the ocean comparitively

invincibleirish wrote: »

Transport 21, The interurbans are not the end of spending on Roads, only the beginning.

Woohoo:rolleyes: The point still stands.

invincibleirish wrote: »

Introduce Fees for a WIT upgrade? are you crazy? why should all 3rd level students pay for one colleges upgrade?.

Why not?Where is it written in stone that they shouldn't be.Well the Universities have pushing this themselves and Universities like TCD have claimed that this is the root of their funding problem before. So if this is "crazy" then the University governers are crazy.Which I suppose puts there oppostion to other universities into the context it deserves. We had fees before 1994 and the sky didn't fall in.Dempsey threatened to do it a few years back and Guess what? He didn't need to because the the money was found.Where there's a will there's a way and that's all it boils down to at the end of the day.

invincibleirish wrote: »

Yep, and received significant funding from the Feeney foundation. If im not mistaken they either matched or donated more then the Irish exchequer to UL,Has WIT even attempted to secure financing in this way?

If I'm not mistaken WIT has:D UL is funded by the taxpayer like every other institution so whatever the feeney foundation did it was by no means the catalyst for designation.

Freddie59 · 24-05-2008 5:27pm

maoleary wrote: »

Status is all you guys really want. You don't want the extra work of a university or the demands it puts on housing, infrastructure and local politics. Waterford is a terrible city for traffic and roads, yet you think a University attracting 2 x the number of students will be just fine.

As regards your point, look at Maynooth, its still a sh*thole, university or not. The same could be said of the area around DCU and the inner city DIT campuses. The reason we don't want a UW is because UCD etc., are already research leaders, I don't want to see UCD/UCC/NUIG/NUIM having to re-introduce fees cause their money dried up.

And don't quote me numbers by a pro group. The cost is always 5 -10 x the real cost cos FF can't help themselves.
And I'm a culchie who went from Wexford to WIT for 4 years.

More cynicism. My priority is WIT. What the others get up - and require - is their own problem. You were damn glad to use WIT when it suited you.

Freddie59 · 24-05-2008 5:30pm

invincibleirish wrote: »

Yes my head is in the sand because i dare not accept your received 'wisdom', im discriminating am i? What the funk are you on about? because i dont agree with ye? can you say drama queen?

:rolleyes:

oh great more hyperbole, do you realise what you are typing? at least you've stopped calling me a disgrace to my county. No one is denying anyone anything, you just have a bee in your bonnet because you're not getting what you want.

What figures?, and sure WIT will definitely be upgraded, why its the most pressing national issue right now:p:rolleyes::D, thats why its always in the news and everyone is talking about it......

Boy did I touch several nerves their. The animosity displayed by you twoards Waterford City defies belief. Butty, WIT will be upgraded - make no mistake. And all the distortion of facts, begrudgery, and parish pump politics (in which you seem to hold a degree) will not change that fact. Get over it.

Bee in our bonnet. Gee, isn't that what CIT had when WIT was upgraded? A display of petulant, petty, begrudgery if ever there was one. You seem to have carried it over into this thread.

invincibleirish · 24-05-2008 7:53pm

mad man wrote: »

Well I elect a government for those decisions and if I don't like them I punish them at the ballot box.Wonderful thing democracy...Although it does have it's drawbacks;)

Don't try and say a WIT upgrade would require the type of drastic fiscal measure that was indulged in in 1977 by who again?...Let's see...Who was it again?...Oh Yeah that's right Jack Lynch:DWhat is it with Cork politicians? Your lot certainly leads the way when it comes to cute hoorism:p

The 1977 manifesto was the most infamous piece of stroke politics in the history of the state which broke the country for almost two decades.The economy was less than one third the size it is now in real terms.The effect of an WIT upgrade which would probably span over five years would be a drop in the ocean comparitively

Woohoo:rolleyes: The point still stands.

Why not?Where is it written in stone that they shouldn't be.Well the Universities have pushing this themselves and Universities like TCD have claimed that this is the root of their funding problem before. So if this is "crazy" then the University governers are crazy.Which I suppose puts there oppostion to other universities into the context it deserves. We had fees before 1994 and the sky didn't fall in.Dempsey threatened to do it a few years back and Guess what? He didn't need to because the the money was found.Where there's a will there's a way and that's all it boils down to at the end of the day.

If I'm not mistaken WIT has:D UL is funded by the taxpayer like every other institution so whatever the feeney foundation did it was by no means the catalyst for designation.

Yup indeed, thanks for proving my point on parochial mindsets taking precedent;).

invincibleirish · 24-05-2008 7:57pm

Freddie59 wrote: »

Boy did I touch several nerves their. The animosity displayed by you twoards Waterford City defies belief. Butty, WIT will be upgraded - make no mistake. And all the distortion of facts, begrudgery, and parish pump politics (in which you seem to hold a degree) will not change that fact. Get over it.

Bee in our bonnet. Gee, isn't that what CIT had when WIT was upgraded? A display of petulant, petty, begrudgery if ever there was one. You seem to have carried it over into this thread.

This is what you're reduced to? simple insults and pettiness? lol, im just a student passing my time whilst studying, you're the one alleging im a 'disgrace' to my county and getting worked up and spewing nonsense like what i qouted, chill out pops!.

Bards · 25-05-2008 4:20pm

invincibleirish wrote: »

This is what you're reduced to? simple insults and pettiness? lol, im just a student passing my time whilst studying, you're the one alleging im a 'disgrace' to my county and getting worked up and spewing nonsense like what i qouted, chill out pops!.

Insults & pettiness?? have you looked in a mirror lately

WIT University

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