Renault Rubbish.

faceman

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Weight of evidence yet again points towards poor Renault quality.

If anyone has had a good experience with them, count your blessings. Play the lotto too.

Where is your weight of evidence? Bulletin boards?

i have a 03 laguna that has never had an ounce of trouble. Sorry i lie, actually one of the tyres had low tyre pressure and had to be pumped up one time.

Henry Ford III

No independent surveys. Would you like to google some?

p.s. Best of luck when it comes to trade in time. You'll be laughed at.

Henry Ford III

Top gear 2006......



Top Gear would like to propose a new addition to the great lexicon of similes. Since there seems to be no accepted standard for 'as reliable as...', we'd like to propose 'as reliable as a Japanese automobile'.

OK, it may be not be snappy, but at least it's accurate, with seven of our ten most reliable cars hailing from Japan. Three Hondas - the Jazz (3rd), S2000 (7th) and CR-V (8th), join the Toyota MR2 (2nd), Lexus RX3000, Suzuki Ignis (5th) and the Mazda 3 (10th) in the upper echelons of the customer satisfaction league.

But it was a car from the continent rather than the far East that topped the reliability chart. The BMW X3 chugs dependably into first place, with owners finding the SUV's engine and gearbox as sturdy as a rhinoceros bouncer.

It's not a great result overall for the German manufacturers though, with the most reliable Porsche (the 911) placing just 48th. Even bullet-proof Audi can only muster a best placing of 63rd with the old-style TT.

'Which cars are fighting a losing battle against reliability? You guessed it: they're French'

Which cars are fighting a losing battle against reliability? You guessed it: they're French. Eight out of the ten least reliable cars come from across the Channel, with the Peugeot 807 propping up the table.

The dismal people-ferrier is joined by two further Peugeots (the 307 and 407), a pair of Citroens (C3 and C8) and a trio of Renaults (the Megane, Espace and Scenic), with only the Range Rover and Ford S-MAX preventing a Gallic whitewash of the bottom ten.

In fact, the highest place Peugeot can manage is a miserable 134th for the now-defunct 206, while the highest-placing French car is the Renault Modus in, erm, 88th spot. As unreliable as une voiture Française? Malheureusement, oui.

Henry Ford III

Build quality....

Build a better mousetrap, said Ralph Waldo Emerson, and the world will beat a path to your door. Build a shoddy car, says our survey, and you're probably French.

Yes, the French are in trouble again. Sixteen of the 25 worst-built cars in our survey are the spawn of the unholy Peugeot-Citroen-Renault triumvurate, and it's no surprise to find the Peugeot 807 propping up the list again.

Owners of the ill-fated MPV were shocked by its shoddy electrics and dodgy transmission, as well as excessive road noise and grumbling engines.

To be fair, there's a fair British contingent in the badly-bolted basement too, with three Rovers - the MG TF, MG ZR and 25 - and Land Rover Defender all languishing in the bottom ten.

Henry Ford III

Manufacturer positions

1 Skoda (UP)
Once-humble Skoda pushes the Japanese from the top slot

2 Lexus (DOWN)
Masters of build quality forced to a still-good second place

3 Honda (-)
Top two places in the car list helped secure a third place overall

4 Mazda (-)
Fourth place for the second year running

5 Mini (UP)
Mini's strong following means it's up two places at five

6 Subaru (-)
Another non-mover - would have scored higher but for high ownership costs

7 Toyota (DOWN)
Down two places for Toyota against last year's survey

8 Porsche (-)
Consistent performer, but reliability score lower than you'd expect

9 Jaguar (-)
Strong performance from the XJ helped Jag hold on to ninth

10 Hyundai (UP)
Hyundai swaps places with BMW - thanks in part to good service

11 BMW (DOWN)
X3 is most reliable car in the survey, but BMW still slipped a place

12 Suzuki (UP)
Decent performance means Suzuki moves up three places

13 Seat (UP)
Seat's up too, but not so impressive next to Skoda's performance

14 Lotus (UP)
Build quality was the only thing holding Lotus back

15 Audi (DOWN)
We expected better than middle of the table from Audi

16 Volvo (DOWN)
Reasonable effort, but didn't score well for ownership costs

17 Kia (UP)
A promising improvement against last year - up from 23rd place

'Citroen, Renault and Peugeot bring up the rear, shrugging haplessly and disappointing buyers...'

18 Smart (-)
Smart holds onto its place just past the half way mark

19 Volkswagen (UP)
Modest improvement held back by surprisingly average scores

20 Nissan (DOWN)
Nissan slips one place from last year

21 Chrysler (DOWN)
And so does Chrysler...

22 Alfa Romeo (UP)
Predictably below-average performance from Alfa

23 Rover (DOWN)
Down one, but who really cares?

24 Ford (UP)
Up one place but not much to shout about

25 Mitsubishi (DOWN)
Lowest placed Japanese manufacturer

26 Saab (DOWN)
A huge drop from 14th place for the Swedes

27 Vauxhall (-)
No improvement for Vauxhall this year

28 Daewoo (UP)
A two-place jump for Daewoo. Chevy will be pleased...

29 Land Rover (UP)
Up by two places, but still a poor effort

30 Mercedes (UP)
Woeful performance from a so-called 'premium' brand

31 Fiat (UP)
Good score from the Panda helps lift Fiat a bit. But only a bit

32 Jeep (DOWN)
Jeep slides further down the table

33 Citroen (-)
Best of the French manufacturers, but that's no consolation

34 Renault (-)
Dismal

35 Peugeot (-)
Oh dear. Again

groupb

While I'm not defending Renault , the top gear surveys put a lot of emphasis on the ownership expeience , ie how good the dealers are , as well as the relability. If you look at surveys like warranty direct which have an section on relability and breakdowns and warranty claims ,Renault still come last but are closely followed by mercedes ,saab ,chrysler and audi. I think it depends who you listen to. If you new nothing about cars and went on this forum for the first time , nobody would buy a VW judging by the amount of problems their owners post in.

Stevie Dakota

I wonder is there 'Porsche are rubbish' thread somewhere?

Warranty Direct, which measures actual problems with each car...

75 Peugeot 306
76 Peugeot 406
77 Volvo S70
78 Rover 75
79 Daewoo Matiz
80 Peugeot 206
81 Mazda MX-3
82 Vauxhall Tigra
83 Seat Ibiza
84 Peugeot 106
85 Renault Megane
86 Peugeot 406
87 Saab 9-3
88 Audi A3
89 BMW X5
90 Mercedes S-class
91 Toyota Corolla
92 Seat Alhambra
93 BMW 5-series
94 Daewoo Nubira
95 Alfa Romeo 145
96 Saab 900
97 Mazda MX-6
98 Jaguar S-Type
99 Daewoo Leganza
100 Porsche Boxster

Henry Ford III

No fudging the issue

zilog_jones

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Renault electrics? This was taken this morning. Driver had reversing lights on full time

I saw the exact same thing happen on a brand new Audi A4 or A6 (I forget which). Not surprising he was driving back to the dealers...

Henry Ford III

I saw an 08 Laguna on a recovery truck the other week. It was dirty so I assume it wasn't new, just broken down.

plissken

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Build quality....

Build a better mousetrap, said Ralph Waldo Emerson, and the world will beat a path to your door. Build a shoddy car, says our survey, and you're probably French.

Yes, the French are in trouble again. Sixteen of the 25 worst-built cars in our survey are the spawn of the unholy Peugeot-Citroen-Renault triumvurate, and it's no surprise to find the Peugeot 807 propping up the list again.

Owners of the ill-fated MPV were shocked by its shoddy electrics and dodgy transmission, as well as excessive road noise and grumbling engines.

To be fair, there's a fair British contingent in the badly-bolted basement too, with three Rovers - the MG TF, MG ZR and 25 - and Land Rover Defender all languishing in the bottom ten.

I unlike yourself am a car lover first and foremost, I have owned renault laguna, megane, alfa romeo 155, 156, gtv and a fiat bravo hgt. None of these cars are known for there reliability but i wasnt stung from a single one I bought these cars because they were more stylish, better handling, better equiped than there japanese rivals, reliability is obviously important to me but unlike you it is not the sole requirement for me when buying a car and thankfully everyone isnt like you otherwise everyone would be driving around in grey japanese boxes not bothering to look under the bonnet once in a while for fear of getting there hands dirty.

Im sure your gonna come back with yet another smart ass comment you have come up with based on other peoples opinions of a car you've never owned. I like renaults you dont thats your opinion and your welcome to it but it is one i whole heartedly disagree with

sk8board

timemachine wrote: »

I have seen this Renault. So if they are all bad, should I leave it.

http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=732005

my advice would be to not go with the base model shown in the link. Go for the RXi model. The extra's list is excellent for that year (mine is a '00), and will help with any resale value on the other end.
things like: alloys, rear spoiler, sunroof, elec mirrors, windows, air-con, etc

Also, for a 1.4L 16v, its 96bhp, which is still much more than any modern 1.4, and feels like a Veyron compared to my wife's '07 1.6 Focus.

Never had any trouble, that said I only put about 1400 miles per year on mine, driving 1.5 miles to the train station, so it was the perfect very cheap but well-spec'ed car for that purpose

Thomas_S_Hunterson

Renault **** you in the ass for parts

Green Hornet

plissken wrote: »

I unlike yourself am a car lover first and foremost, I have owned renault laguna, megane, alfa romeo 155, 156, gtv and a fiat bravo hgt. None of these cars are known for there reliability but i wasnt stung from a single one I bought these cars because they were more stylish, better handling, better equiped than there japanese rivals, reliability is obviously important to me but unlike you it is not the sole requirement for me when buying a car and thankfully everyone isnt like you otherwise everyone would be driving around in grey japanese boxes not bothering to look under the bonnet once in a while for fear of getting there hands dirty.

Im sure your gonna come back with yet another smart ass comment you have come up with based on other peoples opinions of a car you've never owned. I like renaults you dont thats your opinion and your welcome to it but it is one i whole heartedly disagree with

In fairness, its not just about the fact that Renault are very unreliable. Surely the depreciation must also come into play? I can understand that people are happy with their cars even if they have some faults, but I cant understand why anybody pays a lot of money for a car that depreciates like a stone. Most dealers will not accept a Renault as a trade in and thats fact.

Henry Ford III

plissken wrote: »

I unlike yourself am a car lover first and foremost, I have owned renault laguna, megane, alfa romeo 155, 156, gtv and a fiat bravo hgt. None of these cars are known for there reliability but i wasnt stung from a single one I bought these cars because they were more stylish, better handling, better equiped than there japanese rivals, reliability is obviously important to me but unlike you it is not the sole requirement for me when buying a car and thankfully everyone isnt like you otherwise everyone would be driving around in grey japanese boxes not bothering to look under the bonnet once in a while for fear of getting there hands dirty.

Im sure your gonna come back with yet another smart ass comment you have come up with based on other peoples opinions of a car you've never owned. I like renaults you dont thats your opinion and your welcome to it but it is one i whole heartedly disagree with

I've driven many Alfa's. Ran one for 50k miles. Loved it.

Renault - more stylish, better handling, and better equipped? Ah come on for goodness sake.

The comment I posted, and on which you based your reply, was From Top Gear btw

I rest my case.

sk8board

Green Hornet wrote: »

In fairness, its not just about the fact that Renault are very unreliable. Surely the depreciation must also come into play? I can understand that people are happy with their cars even if they have some faults, but I cant understand why anybody pays a lot of money for a car that depreciates like a stone. Most dealers will not accept a Renault as a trade in and thats fact.

I agree. In fact, I know a Renault garage that wouldn't take in the fully serviced Laguna II as a trade against a new Laguna II last year.

I would certainly think twice about a new one, I paid €8,500 private for a 4 yo one that cost €22,200 cash new (saw the invoice), and list was a bit more.
=> over 63% depreciation after 4 years.

plissken

Henry Ford III wrote: »

The comment I posted, and on which you based your reply, was From Top Gear btw

Meaning?

Henry Ford III

Meaning it was more than a personal opinion.

(CH3)2CHOH

00 Espace with 120,000 miles on it.

I do the servicing myself and we have never had a problem.


05 Megane with 12,000 miles on it. This is the father in law's car. Has been in the main dealers 7 time to get the passenger electric window sorted.



Guess there is 2 sides to every story:rolleyes:

Henry Ford III

Yep. Not all of them are utter pants. Just most of them

Saruman

I have had 2 clios from new. one in 01 and the other in 02. Only reason i got rid of them was because people kept crashing in to the rear
First one was perfect.
Second one had electrical issues. It was the dynamique version with all the extras. every now and again i would be driving, then it would for a second seem like i jammed on the brakes and lost power then go on as normal but the engine warning light came on. Every time i brought it back i was told the computer needed to be reset. Might have been BS.

After a bit with a lovely Primera and now have a Renault scenic Dynamique 02. not a bother unless you call stupidly locking yourself out a problem. Oh and there was the time it would not start but that was because i hit a puddle at 80km/h one night and the exhaust got a little loose. Once i got it started again and got it to an exhaust place, they banged it back in place and there was no charge... They just said give the mechanic the price of a pint so i gave him a 20.
Renault is grand, not as good as a toyota but better than most. Very safe cars too.

--amadeus--

TBH things like this thread are a magnet for the disgruntled. Anyone who ever had a problem with a Renault will come flooding in here with complaints, making it look like Renaults are awful. That said I doubt you could post any marque on here and not get a negative comment or two (assuming that there are Boards readers driving those cars, I doubt a significant number of us drive Ferrari's but you get my point).

I have had (going backwards from now), a Lotus, 2 BMW's, a Jaguar, a Porsche, a Mercedes, a Volvo, a pair of Renaults, a Vauxhall (bought in UK) and an Austin over the last ten years and of those marques only the Volvo and the Vauxhall didn't need an unscheduled repair. Does that mean that we should only drive cars that begin with a V since everything else is unreliable?

And while we are on the subject the single most unreliable cars my parents ever owned were Fords and I wouldn't touch one with a big stick!

Terrontress

My father has owned a Megane, 2 Laguna Is, 1 Laguna II, 2 21s an 11. My mother a Clio, 2 5s and a Savanna and never a peep out of any of them. With the exception of a stereo which packed in and was replaced under warranty.

They like them and have never had any issues. Renault have a bit of style to them. I'd love to buy a second hand Avantime for a bargain.

There are very few, if any, Japanese cars that I'd rather have over an equivalent size / spec Renault.

Guy:Incognito

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Try trading your Megane or Laguna in and tell us how you get on. D

Golfs hold their value really well dues to high demand and every 2nd person has one. Does that make them great?

At th eend of the day its a personal choice. All the Renaults in my family have been largely reliable. 1 light issue with the missus Scenic with the iffy break light flashing but I sorted that mysefl (very simple). I cant find the survey (cant remmebr which one it is) that lists the cars by faults per 100 but the jd power survey gives a 4% difference in satisfaction between Renault and VW, yet VW reputation is very good generally while Renault fairs poorly in the "man down the pub said" survey.

A lot of the time theres not a huge amount in actual numbers between so called good and bad makes.

It pretty much comes down to which cars are most resistant to abuse with the general public as they are seen as appliances that can just be replaced on a whim rather than something to actually look after.

funnily enough the only 2 cars I've ever had major problems with that eventually killed the cars were an Accord and a Rover 620 (same car). Both were 12 years old or so but my first Safrane was 2 years older again and was bang on.

Our next Renault is being collected tomorow, we're trading the missus' 00 Scenic for an 05 Grand Scenic.:D

Terrontress

These surveys are not really representative of ownership. With a car such as a Laguna, you will not get anyone praising it unduly. Someone who buys a mid-range car at a mid-range price will be happy if his car does everything it is supposed to do. Not ecstatic. He won't bother to send the survey off. But the car has met his expectations.

People who write into these surveys about Lagunas are those with a chip on their shoulder.

People with Skoda send in because they want to show that their eastern bloc car is great and they are not being cheap. They big their cars up.

People with Japanese cars write in with positive experiences to justify driving such boring cars. "My Avensis is great because..."

I'd have more respect for someone keeping quiet about a satisfactory experience with a standard family car than someone extolling its positives!

GERMAN ROCKS

i must say i like renaults im more into peugeots now though. i had a 95 and 99 laguna never had any trouble with them besides putting batterys and new tyres etc. i would happily get a new laguna but i think id rather the new c5 or 407 first.

Guy:Incognito

GERMAN ROCKS wrote: »

i must say i like renaults im more into peugeots now though. i had a 95 and 99 laguna never had any trouble with them besides putting batterys and new tyres etc. i would happily get a new laguna but i think id rather the new c5 or 407 first.

C6 ftw. Bit pricey tho. If I had the money I'd definately buy one.

faceman

Henry Ford III wrote: »

No independent surveys. Would you like to google some?

p.s. Best of luck when it comes to trade in time. You'll be laughed at.

i bought the car with low mileage last year for €6,500. Was offered €9,000 for it at the weekend.

deemy

Of the 5 cars I've had 4 of them have been renaults. It just happened that way. First was a clio. No problem wit that. gave it to my sis in law and she learned to drive it and made sh*t of it so it went to scrap. Next was an old 93 white 19 liked it so much bought the nxt model up with all the extras, bucket seats, sun roof, electrics ect and it was a great car until it went on fire outside the front door one evening :rolleyes:. Insurance guys said it was probably electrics but it was 10yo at time and I probably did give it too much of a hard drive. Next was a Rover. Pure heap of crap. The ass fell out of it ( or thats wat it sounded like)on a drive from dublin to cork one sunday night.
I now have a 99 megane and wouldn't swap it for anything. And as for people saying that renaults don't hold their value last year when I as thinking of changing I was offered between €3000 and €3500 for it in garages and that was as a trade in price before it had passed the nct. I think that was a very good price for an 8 yo car. Its well comfortable too. after xmas i drove my sisters 07 volvo estate to dublin and thought it was the most uncomfortable car I have ever driven

Damien360

My 2 cents.

Having just sold a 05 Renault Scenic with 30Km on clock last Friday in a trade for a Avensis , I can tell you it was damn near impossible to get rid of it. Dealers will not touch them. I lost £9000 in 2 years on the car.

Depreciation is a major problem.

Reliabilty. This is a tough one as the engine was reliable after a repair, but the electrics were failing. Windows, dash lighting (all fixed). I will never buy another Renault again, not just for the reliabilty stories/experience but also the treatment by the dealer.

Let me explain. When we had engine problems after 2 weeks of having the car I went to the dealer (cannot name as post will be pulled) and pointed out we were getting 10mpg from the car. He said "what do you want me to do about it". No joke !!! After a long drawn out argument over weeks we finallly got it fixed.

Contrast that with the Toyota dealer in Kildare. My wife felt the car (bought Friday last) had an odd feel to the brakes, like you felt metal on metal. He immediately handed the car to the service people who took it for a drive and explained all was normal. He did not try to hide when he saw me. Salesman asked me to continue to drive it and if I was still unhappy, we should return and they will check it over. They may never do this but is'nt that approach to customers so much better than the Renault one.

Apologies for the long post but I am now a Toyota convert. Do not touch Renault. Your sanity and your bank balance are at risk.