Showboating or why we go ?

pickarooney

I have to say I love that craic as it will always end up with either some opposition player having a girly strop or the player making an utter twat of himself (e.g. Pires' penalty a couple of years back).

Mr. Presentable

eirebhoy wrote: »

I don't think Nani did it for the fun of it though. He controlled the ball the best way possible. He was trying to head the ball down but was getting chased from behind so had to up his pace and therefore run into the ball again with his head. Maybe the last 1 or 2 volleys were unnecessary.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dm4unXaoih0

that's it???
I don't see what the big deal is.

LuckyLloyd

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

How about when NFL players dance on their way into the endzone?

How about when certain players do the spin-o-rama in an NHL shootout?

What about when Dekembe Mutumbo used to say "NOT IN MY HOUSE" when he blocked a dunk?

LuckyLloyd your saying there would be uproar in the US, but the equivilent is there every single game.

Elaborate or inflammatory celebrations after touchdowns in the NFL carry a cash fine.

All this year the Patriots received intense criticism for continuing to try and score touchdowns in the final four minutes of the game where the contest was decided beyond doubt.

A few seasons ago in the NFL there was a 49 - 0 victory (essentially 7 - 0 in football). The final touchdown was scored half way through the 4th quarter and broke a record for the biggest franchise home defeat for the losing team. The winning coach began his press conference by apologising to the losing team.

Unearthly

wtf

What a crap attitude they have towards the sport they play/watch

Do you want to put a cap on how many goals a team are allowed to score now before it is frowned upon?

fortuneg

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

All this year the Patriots received intense criticism for continuing to try and score touchdowns in the final four minutes of the game where the contest was decided beyond doubt.

A few seasons ago in the NFL there was a 49 - 0 victory (essentially 7 - 0 in football). The final touchdown was scored half way through the 4th quarter and broke a record for the biggest franchise home defeat for the losing team. The winning coach began his press conference by apologising to the losing team.

I'm having a very hard time understanding why any team would recieve criticism for continuing to try to score when a match is effectively over.
Italian teams (& the national team) have been crticised for years for scoring a goal & killing the game off, surely fans want as many goals/points scored as possible.

& why would a winning manager apologise for a heavy defeat of an opponent, is that not what they're hired to do?

Maybe i'm missing something here but I want my sport to be as entertaining as possible & that means as many goals/points as possible & lots of skill on show, this includes moderate showboating (eg. C.Ronaldo).

What Nani did was moderate showboating (at worst! & thats only because of the volleys at the end), nothing to get your knickers in a knot about, & anyone who thinks it was more than that needs to pull the Gunner specks off. Surely Wenger has far more serious things to concentrate on than a bit of opposition "showboating" after that performance.

scruff321

theres nothing wrong with show boating although the players that do it pretty much have to expect for the opposition to react with fire and extra determination to win the ball because at the end of the day weather you agree with it or not if your playing against a player doing that you feel there being cocky and taking the piss

LuckyLloyd

Close competitive sport is entertaining. Ridiculously one sided no contests or meaningless final periods to matches where the score is ran up is dull and boring imo.

Helix

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Close competitive sport is entertaining. Ridiculously one sided no contests or meaningless final periods to matches where the score is ran up is dull and boring imo.

yeah but in footie where goal difference can be a deciding factor, teams owe it to fans to keep going and trying to score as many as possible

Sqaull20

I love it and wenger has some nerve bringing this up, Henry and his lot did it to Spurs for years

Unearthly

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Close competitive sport is entertaining. Ridiculously one sided no contests or meaningless final periods to matches where the score is ran up is dull and boring imo.

It would be even more dull and boring if the team winning just decided to not play anymore and played out the remaining part of the game doing nothing.

There should be no sympathy towards other teams, if they aren't up to it then tough sh-it

PHB

Sqaull20 wrote: »

I love it and wenger has some nerve bringing this up, Henry and his lot did it to Spurs for years

Wenger knows he is being hypocritical, he's just doing it to deflect from United utterly hammering them

Peyton Manning

Xavi6 wrote: »

And nutmegs....

Im sure Fabregas would be delighted seeing as Anderson made a fool of him with one yesterday

Ridiculous the way people are condemning this. Its one thing to do it when youre on your own, you have space and no one is tackling you - Nani had Gallas (I think?) running after him the whole time and Flamini coming in to tackle him. It was great to see, and a whole lot of these noises are most likely coming from sore losers and people who want to appear polite to the press (looking at you Fergie).

LuckyLloyd

Helix wrote: »

yeah but in footie where goal difference can be a deciding factor, teams owe it to fans to keep going and trying to score as many as possible

Oh, my bad. I obv forgot that goal difference is important in the FA Cup.

LuckyLloyd

Unearthly wrote: »

It would be even more dull and boring if the team winning just decided to not play anymore and played out the remaining part of the game doing nothing.

There should be no sympathy towards other teams, if they aren't up to it then tough sh-it

It's boring either way, that's the point. Why is it necessary to be unprofessional and stick the needle in at the end when it doesn't matter?

Helix

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Oh, my bad. I obv forgot that goal difference is important in the FA Cup.

where were we discussing the fa cup only? and what game did a team keep on scoring to disrespect their opponents when the result was in no doubt over fa cup weekend?

LuckyLloyd

Helix wrote: »

where were we discussing the fa cup only? and what game did a team keep on scoring to disrespect their opponents when the result was in no doubt over fa cup weekend?

This entire discussion was spawned from an incident at the end of a one sided FA Cup tie.

Helix

an incident where the player in question kept possession of the ball by the best means available to him bearing in mind the bounce the ball took, the height of it, and the first headed touch

would you rather a team who is leading stops trying and lets the other team get back in the game or something?

there was absolutely nothing wrong with what nani did

Nunu

LuckyLlyod, what in the world are you talking about? The hole you are digging is getting bigger and bigger....best to get the hell out of this thread!:D


Regarding Nani, I agree with the handful of posters who say it was a necessary piece of skill to retain possession and not showboating...i was very surprised to hewar Fergusons post match comment that he'd had a word with him about it

LuckyLloyd

Nunu wrote: »

LuckyLlyod, what in the world are you talking about? The hole you are digging is getting bigger and bigger....best to get the hell out of this thread!:D

what hole? to where?

LuckyLloyd

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

what hole? to where?

The hole you dug yourself by your tirade of ridiculous arguments on this thread. That hole. To somewhere where that kind of soft-lad rubbish would be tolerated, a place i hope i never have to go to. Honestly, do u even realise that if Nani were to try to back into Hoyte and let the ball drop rather than do the multiple head ups, then he would have increased the chance of being dispossessed. You're just bein ridiculous and outing yourself as a blatant ABU with that kind of talk.



Jesus lads seriously, and people wonder why footballers can be such sissies. Theres a lot worse things to be worrying about than showboating, If u cant handle it then maybe u should find a softer sport.

astrofool

In 1940, the Chicago Bears defeated the Washington Redskins 73 - 0, in the NFL Championship game....

The NFL is one of the most competitive leagues in the world, and when they win, they love to rub it in, as happens in most team sports, nay, any competitive sport. If you could hand Utd a 20-0 scoreline yesterday, they would have taken it. Playing to "keep the other team in it" is for girlie men.

Also, the NFL rule seemed to come in due to pre-planned celebrations, rather than out and out showboating.

But as others have said, dig away.

astrofool

astrofool wrote: »

In 1940, the Chicago Bears defeated the Washington Redskins 73 - 0, in the NFL Championship game....

The NFL is one of the most competitive leagues in the world, and when they win, they love to rub it in, as happens in most team sports, nay, any competitive sport. If you could hand Utd a 20-0 scoreline yesterday, they would have taken it. Playing to "keep the other team in it" is for girlie men.

Also, the NFL rule seemed to come in due to pre-planned celebrations, rather than out and out showboating.

But as others have said, dig away.

Agreed 100%.


The level people stoop to in order to moan is ridiculous at times.

Peyton Manning

Its Nani. Its Man Utd.

Its to be expected.

ROCKMAN

Think its was a great skill and I agree with alot of posts that are saying it was the only way to deal with the situation and kept control of the ball,
As for the mangers
I think Fergie was more concern about where he was doing it more so that that taking the piss out off opposition (no matter what he said in public )
As for Wenger sourgrapes yes, and also doing what he does best deflecting the spotlight of his players and their performance (which all good managers will and are expected to do)

A Dub in Glasgo

Absolutely nothing wrong with a player showing his skills to his peers. Those that complain just complain because it is not their team's player.

Kimbot

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Absolutely nothing wrong with a player showing his skills to his peers. Those that complain just complain because it is not their team's player.

Agreed, If I could do that I would. Simple as, he pulled it off and he gets greif.

I know when I'm out playing ball during the week if we are up by a large amount of goals we showboat to annoy the otherside (bear in mind we all work together ) and they would do the same to us. I remember ripping the piss out of a few of the lads with nutmegs and stepovers and they always go in for a hard challenge after but for that moment it was the only thing I could think of doing and it worked.

Skill is a big part of football and I say Fair play to Nani for pulling it of under pressure even if he meant it or not. All the lad done was control the ball.

Dave!

LuckyLloyd do you think there's anything wrong with nutmegs?

What's the difference between them and what Nani did?

gosplan

Nutmegs uaually serve a purpose, i.e. beating a man.

If anyone thinks that what Nani did made more sense than simply heading the ball down once and passing back to VDS then they've got serious blinkers on.

I don't have that much of a problem with it and I really thinkthat people are making far too much of it but all this 'only way to dal with situation' is a load of balls.

Way one: professional - boot it out for an Arsenal throw

Way two: accomplished - head it once to feet and pass it back

Way three: showboat

As regards Fergie, I think he complained about it because it was a bit unprofessional. Simply because he attempted something difficult and unnecessary when he was the last man back.

Dave!

gosplan wrote: »

Nutmegs uaually serve a purpose, i.e. beating a man.

If anyone thinks that what Nani did made more sense than simply heading the ball down once and passing back to VDS then they've got serious blinkers on.

I don't have that much of a problem with it and I really thinkthat people are making far too much of it but all this 'only way to dal with situation' is a load of balls.

Way one: professional - boot it out for an Arsenal throw

Way two: accomplished - head it once to feet and pass it back

Way three: showboat

As regards Fergie, I think he complained about it because it was a bit unprofessional. Simply because he attempted something difficult and unnecessary when he was the last man back.

What Nani did served a purpose too -- he beat the Arsenal player. He could have done any of those options you posted but he didn't, he chose a perfectly legitimate (IMO) way to deal with the ball and did so successfully.

If there's an alternative option to nutmegging the opposing player, should that always be taken for fear of hurting their feelings? Say a 1-2 pass, or maybe just take a completely different approach if you can't simply outrun the defender.

gosplan

DaveMcG wrote: »

he beat the Arsenal player.

No he didn't, he just ran back toward his own goal.

DaveMcG wrote: »

He could have done any of those options you posted but he didn't, he chose a perfectly legitimate (IMO) way to deal with the ball and did so successfully.

I never said it wasn't legimitate, just unprofessional. He tried a high risk move with an opposing player right behind him and nothing between him and the goal.

DaveMcG wrote: »

If there's an alternative option to nutmegging the opposing player, should that always be taken for fear of hurting their feelings? Say a 1-2 pass, or maybe just take a completely different approach if you can't simply outrun the defender.

I really don't know what your point is here. I think you're just assuming I'm taking a different line than I am. I didn't mention feelings. What do they have to do with anything?

As regards nutmeg or 1-2, whichever has the best chance of success would obviously be the best choice.

gosplan

I've got it!!!!!

When I see Nani doing something like that I think of Higuta conceeding that goal. Hopefully that helps you all to see it from my perspective.

Unearthly

gosplan wrote: »

No he didn't, he just ran back toward his own goal.

Watch it again, he beats him when he takes it down, before Flamini came thundering in

Xavi6

gosplan wrote: »

I've got it!!!!!

When I see Nani doing something like that I think of Higuta conceeding that goal. Hopefully that helps you all to see it from my perspective.

But sure that's part of the risk. Higuita wasn't skillful enough to pull it off so got done. Good enough for him. People would be saying the same of Nani if the ball had of been nicked off him.

Mitch Connor

Pah - this is such a crock of poop.

"OH NOES, NANI DID SOME SKILZ"

Football is SUPPOSED to be entertraining - it is supposed to be about skill and style.

I actually find it DISGUSTING that so many people find it bad enough to moan about, with mentioning the horribly dirty tackles that were put in on him, and other United players by arsenal.

Arsenal were acting like a bunch of petulent little kids and got the mugging they deserved. Hopefully the FA take retrospective action against Gallas at least. Eduardo should also have seen red, but the ref bottled it so there isn't that can be there.

Nunu

Tauren wrote: »

Pah - this is such a crock of poop.



Hopefully the FA take retrospective action against Gallas at least.

Not a chance because Ferguson brought it up in his post match interview and the FA hate him:D

jank

Sqaull20 wrote: »

Such nice fans arent they?:D

.

Fans are stupid for the most part, what they want or consider acceptable is kinda irrelevant.

LuckyLloyd you hit the nail on the head. Sure it was only a week after the Munich anniversery where sport became a lesser issue for life and death but that point has been totally missed by most.

event

ive no real problem with it

however, you must be prepared to take some big tackles for doing that. Like it or not, if he plays in the next game someone will take him out IMO, no footballer likes to lose 4-0 and then have the piss taken of them.

if he is going to play like that, he has to be able to take the kicking he's gonna get

_blank_

event wrote: »

if he is going to play like that, he has to be able to take the kicking he's gonna get

imo. he was doing that because he was getting kicked.

It was a bit of a fúck you to the arsenal players who had spent the game kicking lumps out of him. What better way to pay them back than to make them look a bit foolish. The bonus was that they couldn't handle it and started acting like Under 12's. They were only short of crying tbh.

LuckyLloyd

Deleted User wrote: »

The hole you dug yourself by your tirade of ridiculous arguments on this thread. That hole. To somewhere where that kind of soft-lad rubbish would be tolerated, a place i hope i never have to go to. Honestly, do u even realise that if Nani were to try to back into Hoyte and let the ball drop rather than do the multiple head ups, then he would have increased the chance of being dispossessed. You're just bein ridiculous and outing yourself as a blatant ABU with that kind of talk.



Jesus lads seriously, and people wonder why footballers can be such sissies. Theres a lot worse things to be worrying about than showboating, If u cant handle it then maybe u should find a softer sport.

LOL at this post.

Ridiculous arguments? Essentially I have argued that:

- Deliberately showboating or taunting fellow professional players is unprofessional behaviour which should not be condoned within football;
- That non - competetive, one - sided contests are dull and boring and this sort of carry on at the end doesn't change that fact;

Personally, I don't care whether that is "soft - lad rubbish" (lol!). Grandstanding doesn't make you "hard"; much as arguing a minority view on an internet forum doesn't make you "hard" or "soft".

Mitch Connor

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

LOL at this post.

Ridiculous arguments? Essentially I have argued that:

- Deliberately showboating or taunting fellow professional players is unprofessional behaviour which should not be condoned within football;
- That non - competetive, one - sided contests are dull and boring and this sort of carry on at the end doesn't change that fact;

Personally, I don't care whether that is "soft - lad rubbish" (lol!). Grandstanding doesn't make you "hard"; much as arguing a minority view on an internet forum doesn't make you "hard" or "soft".

This must make your blood boil so: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=t31IhsvFXlg

LOVE IT!

Xavi6

Tauren wrote: »

This must make your blood boil so: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=t31IhsvFXlg

LOVE IT!

F*cking love that Djalminha goal in the first minute there. Perfection.

Qs

I don't know what people are complaining about. Fair enough Fergie can complain to him for not being professional but nobody outside of United can complain. He had the ball and he showed some of his skill, fair enough it was a little pointless but he entertained the crowd.

Qs

Tauren wrote: »

Hopefully the FA take retrospective action against Gallas at least.

Well if they do they're going to have to ban Nani for a headbutt as well.

Mitch Connor

Qs wrote: »

Well if they do they're going to have to ban Nani for a headbutt as well.

What headbutt - I saw two player 'touch' heads and no more - i wouldn't want to see EITHER player get done for something like that. I want to see Gallas get done for the petulent and needless kick at Nani.

Qs

Tauren wrote: »

What headbutt - I saw two player 'touch' heads and no more - i wouldn't want to see EITHER player get done for something like that. I want to see Gallas get done for the petulent and needless kick at Nani.

No you want to see Gallas get done because you're desperately searching for anything to weaken Arsenal.

Doesn't matter how hard the headbutt was it was still a headbutt. Retaliation. Red card offence, certainly worse than a petulant trip.

event

DesF wrote: »

imo. he was doing that because he was getting kicked.

i agree with that

its a vicious circle, hes doing it cos he was kicked, but will get kicked cos he's doing it

Loomis

United won a cup tie 4-0 against their biggest rivals with some great football, Arsenal's discipline was terrible once again and the biggest talking point is someone doing a 5 second piece of skill. That's fairly pathetic

Xavi6

Mr. Anderson wrote: »

United won a cup tie 4-0 against their biggest rivals with some great football, Arsenal's discipline was terrible once again and the biggest talking point is someone doing a 5 second piece of skill. That's fairly pathetic

Agreed. We should really be discussing how awful it was that Arsenal didn't show up. That's the real story

Mitch Connor

Qs wrote: »

No you want to see Gallas get done because you're desperately searching for anything to weaken Arsenal.

Doesn't matter how hard the headbutt was it was still a headbutt. Retaliation. Red card offence, certainly worse than a petulant trip.

Pathetic. You don't know me at all so you can't claim to know my motives at all.

It was never a headbutt. NEVER. From EITHER PLAYER. at the very worst, yellow cards for both players in those circumstances. It was two players squaring up to each other.

You are just desperately looking for a way to deflect attention from the petulent behavior of Arsenal.

See how i can make sweeping statements regarding your motives without know you at all too.

kaimera

Tauren wrote: »

This must make your blood boil so: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=t31IhsvFXlg

LOVE IT!

Hardly showboating tbh.

They weren't taking the piss.