Tenancies Act or Contract?

dahamsta

The information on which takes precendence is very confusing. According to the Tenancies Act, we seem to have very little protection if we're in a house for less than 6 months, but how does this apply if you have a contract/lease for a year? Does the contract beat the Act? Can we be lobbed out on our ear if the landlord decides to sell?

adam

The_Conductor

dahamsta wrote: »

Can we be lobbed out on our ear if the landlord decides to sell?

adam

Yes.
There are a list of conditions under which the tenancies act, which does have precedent over a lease (which may have seperate legal standing), specifying when a tenancy may be broken early. One of the terms is if the landlord chooses to sell the property, another would be if he/she decided to live in it themselves.
The lease itself should mirror the terms of the tenancy act (though many people have DIY off-the-shelf leases that have been knocking around for years). In short- at best it would be a breach of your lease, however given that the action is not covered under the Tenancy Act, while you would technically be in the right- you would be unlikely to get very far were you to try to argue it in court.

Renting is still a nascent industry in Ireland, and the legalities concerning landlords and tenants do still need to be radically updated.

If you really like the property would purchasing it from the landlord be an option?

dahamsta

Nah, I'm just trying to figure out where I stand tbh. My last landlord put the house up for sale after 3 months, and we couldn't be arsed arguing with him. My current landlord revealed after we gave notice that she was putting this house up for sale, and my next landlord is clearly only letting because he can't sell. We might be willing to buy next year, but not now.

It's screwy that the lease doesn't stand up. What's the point of putting a term in it if that's the case FFS?

adam

Calina

yes, but if you as a tenant look to get out of your lease and ask for advice here, the response usually given is that unless there is a breakclause you may be liable for the balance of the rent covering the period you wouldn't be living there if you try to move out.

In other words, it's even more unfair than I thought.

Afuera

smccarrick wrote: »

In short- at best it would be a breach of your lease, however given that the action is not covered under the Tenancy Act, while you would technically be in the right- you would be unlikely to get very far were you to try to argue it in court.

As far as I know, fixed term leases are covered in the Tenancy Act and can not be broken using the standard excuses provided under a Part IV Tenancy (i.e. the landlord wants to sell). For a fixed term lease, explicit break out clauses would need to be specified to allow this.

smccarrick wrote: »

Renting is still a nascent industry in Ireland, and the legalities concerning landlords and tenants do still need to be radically updated.

I agree. There are some obvious failings with the current legislation as it does not really give enough protection to either tenants or landlords. Tenants problems mainly revolve around lack of security of tenure while landlords problems are related to what measures they can take with bad/non paying tenants and the fact that they are limited by having to charge a market rate for the service they provide (even if this market rate means they are making a loss).

antoinolachtnai

In general, the lease can only give you extra rights. Generally speaking it cannot take away your rights. There are very few exceptions.

If you have a lease and the landlord wants to sell, he will have to buy you out of the lease to get possession. (Although he could try to sell with you in situ and there is no particular difficulty with this.)

You don't have to argue it in court. It is up to the landlord to argue it in court. He cannot evict you without going to court or to the PRTB.

Of course if you are faced with an eviction order which you think may be somehow defective, you should seek legal advice.

Orual

In section 4 of the Terminating a tenancy leftlet on the PRTB website it says:

"Only 7 days notice need be given by a landlord to a tennant where the termination notice results from serious anti-social behavior by the tennant of behaviour that is threatening to the fabric of the dwelling or the property"

Only 7 days notice need be given by the tenant to the landlord where the reason for the termination is that the behaviour of the landlord poses an imminent danger of serious injury or death or danger to the fabric of the dwelling or the proerty containing the dwelling"

From what I have read in the citizens information website there are certain minimum standards a rented property must comply with. I doubt a fixed term agreement would take away a tenants right to leave a property that did not meet the minimum standard. A tenant should not loose a deposit because they had to leave a rented property that was not livable or if it was making them sick.

dahamsta

That doesn't apply in this case.

Thanks everyone for the answers. Sadly it's still clear as mud, I think perhaps the only way to get an authoritative answer is to take a case, and sure who can afford to do that on something as inconclusive as this?

Typical Oirish legislation. :rolleyes:

adam

Orual

Sorry I didn't read the thread property. Appologies. Must be the lack of sleep.

There might be some information on this website that can help you

Victor

Calina wrote: »

yes, but if you as a tenant look to get out of your lease and ask for advice here, the response usually given is that unless there is a breakclause you may be liable for the balance of the rent covering the period you wouldn't be living there if you try to move out.

No, you can substitute someone else.

antoinolachtnai

On the original issue, it's as clear as it can be, or at least as clear as anything in the Act.

If you have a lease as you described you can't be legally evicted during the period of the lease.

You don't have to take a case to stay.

The landlord has to take a case of some sort to get you out.

If you are faced with an eviction order you believe to be defective, see a solicitor.

A Random Walk

Antoin sets it out clearly. The Act tells you what your minimum rights are and a lease cannot reduce your rights. A lease can increase your rights however, so if your lease gives you security of tenure over and above the Act minimum that's what applies.