Final build - thoughts?

joker77

Ok here is more or less my final build, I'm just waiting for some cash before I can actually buy it, so I'm hoping the 2 parts out of stock will come back in - they were both in stock until yesterday and hardwareversand seem to get stuff back in very regularly.

It's not a gaming PC, so I don't need a top-end graphics card.

requiem1

are you going to be overclocking? if so maybe look at getting some ram with tighter timings i.e CL 4 so that if you want to push out the overclock you can losen the timings. For the HD maybe change it to a samsung one as they have great reviews. You can get a passively cooled version of the graphics card which will reduce the noise level and make the soundcard an x-fi, i think the gamer one(the one thats 2/3 the size of a normal pcb) can connect to the headphone sockets on a case.

joker77

Cheers for the advice. I don't plan on overclocking it, I think I'll leave the memory the way it is.

I'll check out the Samsung hard drives, nice one for the heads up

TheThreeDegrees

You havent said which OS you plan to use?
If its Vista it doesnt matter whether this system is for gaming or not.I am concerned with that 8400!

Have a look at the new line-up from ATI,3650 etc.
They are super quite support directX 10.1 and have the nifty new feature of Displayport and work beautifully with HTPC systems.

the nvidias cost more cause they know that the gaming community are suckers for it:p

joker77

Yes it is for Vista.

The reason I went for that graphics card was because I had been recommended it in another thread! ha

Do you think there would be an issue with it? Any why?

requiem1

TheThreeDegrees wrote: »

You havent said which OS you plan to use?
If its Vista it doesnt matter whether this system is for gaming or not.I am concerned with that 8400!

Have a look at the new line-up from ATI,3650 etc.
They are super quite support directX 10.1 and have the nifty new feature of Displayport and work beautifully with HTPC systems.

the nvidias cost more cause they know that the gaming community are suckers for it:p

I use it for vista in another system and its fine sure my dad is using a 6600gt and there's no issues

TheThreeDegrees

TBH I have never tried the 8400 so I cannot comment on its capabilites.

That said however I do know that the entry level ATI cards are packed with features for those of us you are not hardcore gamers.

This is known to be noisey so if its an issue with you stay away.
The chipset is fairly common on laptops nowadays and Dell ships its low end budget pc's with these yokes in it.
Probably good value for money but its risky going for this one seeing as the GPU is very important to our computing experience nowadays.


The rest of your spec looks nice but I feel you are skimping on the GPU?

joker77

TheThreeDegrees wrote: »

TBH I have never tried the 8400 so I cannot comment on its capabilites.

That said however I do know that the entry level ATI cards are packed with features for those of us you are not hardcore gamers.

This is known to be noisey so if its an issue with you stay away.
The chipset is fairly common on laptops nowadays and Dell ships its low end budget pc's with these yokes in it.
Probably good value for money but its risky going for this one seeing as the GPU is very important to our computing experience nowadays.


The rest of your spec looks nice but I feel you are skimping on the GPU?

What ATI alternative would you recommend? Can you give me a couple of links? Thanks

TerrorFirmer

For a non-gamer virtually any card is fine. For the price, it's hard to fault the 8400GS. Actually, I wonder is that really a ddr3 model? Normally only see 64-bit ddr2 models. For what you're using it for, it doesn't make a difference really, but it would be a good find for 30 euro if it really was the 128-bit ddr3 model.

Anyway, Ati's new line up is pretty good. I think the 3450 is about the same price too, great card for the HTPC/Non-gaming general side of things. Getting excellent reviews so far....If you're not gaming I fail to see why you'd need more. Both cards are excellent for HD and the 3450 in particular has excellent native connectivity. Is the XFX card passively cooled? Definitely get a passively cooled card, if you can. No point having a fan going and thus making noise when its unnecessary.

joker77

Something like this?

TheThreeDegrees

Ok everyone has different requirements so I think the only way to satify the techno freaks amongst us is to benchmark.

So here is a very respectable site for such.
http://www23.tomshardware.com/graphics_2007.html

You will notice that the 8400 is pretty much in the bottom end of the table in almost all results.Even the 6600GT(which I have owned myself)beats it on certain tests.

As for my recommendations well as I said the new entry lineup from ATI will not dissapoint you.
For €89 the 3650 which I am using at the moment is faultless.Bought in town.

TerrorFirmer

Well aware of the lacklustre gaming capabilities but what difference does it make to this build? Like I said, passively cooled would be better, so maybe opt for something else, for a few extra euro. But the 8400 itself is more then adequate. HD playback, general day to day use, super card. Used one myself before. If you really felt the burning urge to play some games, it does play Half Life 2 at high settings and I got Call of Duty 2 running fine at 1680x1050 Dx7 mode...

For general day to day tasks, Hd playback etc the only difference you will notice between a 3450/3650 or 8400/8600 etc would be a higher power consumption. What's the point?

TheThreeDegrees

I am looking at the overall picture of his build.

He's spending over a grand on pretty much high quality components and the one component that really matters when its built "the GPU" he's going for a bottom of the range 8400.

Would you really go to all the hassle of ordering from hardwareversand 1000 euro worth of equipment to come home with an 8400?

Dell are cheaper and at least the warranty is local.

TheThreeDegrees

This is what I dont get:

Building a computer is rarely cheaper than buying one.

The advantage you may have is that you can pick and choose your components but who gains from this?Modders gamers enthusiasts?

Lots of people come on here looking for advice on building yet they are restricted by budget.Ive fallen into that category myself.It was one of my first posts here on boards.
And you know what 2 months later and I'm still nowhere near complete and have swapped out one motherboard a GPU and RAM since my first proposal.

If your gonna build your own PC do it right and dont do it on a budgetcause IMO you will only be dissapointed that is if your passionate about this as I am.

joker77

TheThreeDegrees wrote: »

This is what I dont get:

Building a computer is rarely cheaper than buying one.

I have to disagree - building is definitely cheaper for the equivalent spec machine. The machine I want from Dell would be costing me at least 1500

TheThreeDegrees

Well if you want to get into the nitty gritty:D

unless your using a 64Bit OS 4GIG of ram is a waste from what i'm hearing.

The arctic freezer whilst a good cooler is a noisely SOFB!

nuff said about the GPU.

The mobo is one of those that cant decide if its DDR2/DDR3.
What do they do to the chipset to make this work?
1 PCI Express X16 slot ?


Are you at least getting the G0 stepping on the quad.

joker77

TheThreeDegrees wrote: »

Well if you want to get into the nitty gritty:D

unless your using a 64Bit OS 4GIG of ram is a waste from what i'm hearing.

The arctic freezer whilst a good cooler is a noisely SOFB!

nuff said about the GPU.

The mobo is one of those that cant decide if its DDR2/DDR3.
What do they do to the chipset to make this work?
1 PCI Express X16 slot ?


Are you at least getting the G0 stepping on the quad.

On the memory side of things, yea I think 3Gb would have sufficed, but it wasn't much difference to go for the 2x2 rather than 3x1.

Didn't realise the cooler was so noisy, there is noise dampening foam in the case so it should be ok, but if it was you - what cooler would you recommend?

Regards the motherboard, hey - that's over my head - it supports the processor, and again was recommended - prob because it's cheap.

G0 stepping on the quad? huh?

TheThreeDegrees

331153 Samsung 19" LCD Syncmaster 931BW TCO03,- 2 ms, 222.00
338789 Asus P5KR, P35, Socket-775, DDR2,- ATX, Raid (ICH9R) 114.01
327715 Samsung SpinPoint T166 500GB SATA2- 16MB 7200RPM 84.00
338082 Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 2.67GHz 1333Mhz- Socket LGA775, 4MB, BOXED w/fan 1 165.00
312201 Creative SB Audigy SE- PCI, 7.1 Surround, 24-bit/96KHz, 39.80
341841 Antec Performance P182 Miditower,- Gun Metal Black Aluminum 119.00 119.00
327671 Corsair Powersupply 520W Black, ATX/EPS,- 120mm Fan, 4xSATA, SLI, 94.00 94.00
312054 Corsair TWIN2X 6400 DDR2, 2048MB CL5- Kit w/two matched 55.01
322308 Belkin PCI 54Mbps Wireless 802.11g- 32.00
339922 MSI GeForce 8600GT 256MB DDR2,- PCI-Express, DVI, HDCP/HDMI,85.99


now that lot comes to €1048 minus a keyboard and mouse but includes shipping.thats 16 euro cheaper than going to the motherland for it.

Point 1:
You dont need a quad the core 2 duo is sufficient and the stock cooler will work better than most.
Point 2.
This is all put together very quickly from komplett whom we have to say is a very reputable supplier.
If you shop around for some of the components you will find them cheaper.
Point 3.
you are getting a better mobo better graphic card and Awesome good case and better hard drive
for the same money?
I think i missed out on the dvd player and some other stuff written in German which I do not understand!a screw driver or something

TheThreeDegrees

Ive revised that a little for you.
the mobo comes with wifi on the board and I think the onboard sound is comparable to the sound card you suggested buying.
ive also changed the case and improved the ram.

324460 OCZ Platinum DDR2 PC6400 2048MB KIT, 57.00
335581 Asus P5K-E/WIFI-AP, P35, Socket-775, 143.00
338082 Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 2.67GHz 1333Mhz 165.00
331153 Samsung 19" LCD Syncmaster 931BW TCO03 222.00
327715 Samsung SpinPoint T166 500GB SATA2 84.00
339922 MSI GeForce 8600GT 256MB DDR2 85.99
337691 NZXT HUSH, Black Aluminum Front, 2X Blue 98.00
327671 Corsair Powersupply 520W Black, ATX/EPS 94.00

that comes to €948.99 delivered.

joker77

TheThreeDegrees wrote: »

now that lot comes to €1048 minus a keyboard and mouse but includes shipping.thats 16 euro cheaper than going to the motherland for it.

Point 1:
You dont need a quad the core 2 duo is sufficient and the stock cooler will work better than most.
Point 2.
This is all put together very quickly from komplett whom we have to say is a very reputable supplier.
If you shop around for some of the components you will find them cheaper.
Point 3.
you are getting a better mobo better graphic card and Awesome good case and better hard drive
for the same money?
I think i missed out on the dvd player and some other stuff written in German which I do not understand!a screw driver or something

Ok I have to say, at this stage I think you're being pedantic!

I haven't really said what I do, so to say I don't need the quad core?

Also, the hard drive you've listed is the same one in my build - but you say 'better hard drive'?

Why would I need to spend 85 Euro on a graphics card when I don't game?

TheThreeDegrees

joker77 wrote: »

Ok I have to say, at this stage I think you're being pedantic!

well if you come onto a forum/board and ask for peoples "thoughts" then saying that you "think" I am being pedantic is basically not respecting my opinion.

I haven't really said what I do, so to say I don't need the quad core?

Basically judging by your response as to the stepping feature on the quad it tells me that you know jack **** about them.
Therefore I am assuming that you were reccomended this along with all the other components that are out of place.

Also, the hard drive you've listed is the same one in my build - but you say 'better hard drive'?

You did not list the Samsung.It is known to be a better hard drive than the one you have listed.

Why would I need to spend 85 Euro on a graphics card when I don't game?

You want to spend over 200 euro's on a monitor yet your picking a low end GPU that isnt good enough even for Dell to put in their desktop machines?

why dont you go have a look at the custom builds from Komplett or even hardwareversand and tell me if your final build template even remotely looks the same?

joker77

Ok apologies, the hard drive I listed above is different from the Samsung. And apologies for asking about the stepping, you're right, I don't know a whole lot about them.

In relation to having a look at the Komplett custom builds - that was where I started - the Intel Core 2 one. And yes, I think my build looked quite similar...

TheThreeDegrees

listen I really hate to see people throwing good money away and not getting the best of whats out there for their buck and also being protected with their purchase.
ive been through this experience very recently so I am just offering what ive come accross in the past two months.

most of what I am telling you know comes from the knowledge ive gained from the other players on boards.

the quad is the future and no doubht if you want to slot it into your build then by all means do so.

hope it works out for you.

joker77

Cheers for the advice, I'll definitely take it on board about the Quad core and look for a higher speed Dual core for the same money. Nice one.

TerrorFirmer

Look, this has gotten out of hand. TheThreeDegrees, consider this a warning. You are being overly aggressive in analyzing someone else's build without the first clue as to their intended uses. In fact, the only thing we know is that he is NOT gaming, yet you consistently criticize the 8400GS for being a weak point of the build, without offering any rational as to why you thought this. The 8400GS received great reviews in relation to what it was built for - HD playback, passive running, etc. So unless you know something that everyone else, including the critics, don't? I say, again, that the only thing Joker77 will get from the 'better' card you've recommended is increased power consumption at 0% gain. Oh, and not knowing the stepping of a processor does not equate to knowing 'jack ****' about the merits of those respective processors in relation to their intended uses.

As for the quad core, well, considering you're aren't gaming, I can assume that maybe you'll be doing encoding, ripping, etc. The future of which lies in multi-core, the more, the better. Sure, a dual core is probably sufficient on a technical basis, but if you want to take that route sure isn't a 50 euro 2160 sufficient for gamers once over clocked?

Also, the restrictions of the OS on ram is often brought up but if you can get a decent 4gb kit for a reasonable price, no reason not to - you will still see 3gb's of that memory, which is a considerable boost over the 2gb and you can still run the memory in pairs rather then having to mix with 3x1gb sticks etc.

TheThreeDegrees

what do you mean its gotten out of hand?

from the last two posts myself and joker seemed to have finished this off amicably.

think your the one over analysing here.

and as far as your warning goes you know where you can go with it.

TerrorFirmer

Pity you felt you had to add that last line. Banned for a week.

joker77

Do I need the Artic Cooler for this build, considering I'm not overclocking?

TerrorFirmer

The Arctic cooler is generally not recommended as the best choice for a Quad around here but then again, your idea of tolerable temperatures would probably be vastly different then some of the enthusiasts. If you're not overclocking, at 13 euro it's a good purchase, as regardless of the overclocking potential it's still much better then the stock Intel cooler. I'd wait it out a short while and see what anyone else has to say, but at stock speeds the Arctic will definitely be more then sufficient.

Shiminay

I'd say you'd be grand with the stock, just make sure you fit it properly! They're a bit of a pain in the arse, made a mess of my own earlier last year and nearly messed up my brothers build at Christmas

Oh, just noticed, you went for the "tray" option on the CPU which means it's just the chip and no cooler. The Artic Freezer is a big looking cooler, have never used one myself, so can't comment on it personally, but here's a handy review

Edit:
The summary from that review:
Pros

* Superb cooling straight out of the box
* Easy to install
* Soft-mounted fan
* Very quiet at low speeds
* Long Warranty

Cons

* Too noisy at full speed
* Variable turbulence noise at full speed
* Doesn't cool that well with low airflow
* No fan speed controller

joker77

Thanks for the info Kharn

Kharn wrote: »

Oh, just noticed, you went for the "tray" option on the CPU which means it's just the chip and no cooler.

Seeing I'm not into overclocking it, would you recommend I get the boxed version instead of the tray and ditch the Artic cooler?

If not, what other fan could I get that would be super quiet? Cheers